Will the stock market hold...or is the bubble ready to burst?

[Kirkland Laing]

And so it came to pass that hours after The Infallible One announced the Kirkland Laing Global Financial System Rescue Plan would be adopted by global leaders within a few days, U.S. Treasury chief Hank Paulson held a press conference and announced that he was implementing the KLGFSRP and details would be announced "in a few days" and European and other world leaders followed over the weekend.

And lo! The Dow has gone up 1000 points and it looks like credit markets are starting to thaw. If they continue to unfreeze it will be no exaggeration to claim that Kirkland Laing, The Infallible One, has single-handedly saved the world from global economic collapse. But you just know people like Bush, Bernanke, Paulson, Gordon Brown and other world leaders will claim the credit. Those arrogant bastards.

[killersheep]

How come these stupid rallies always happen right before I'm ready to buy more securities

[Gandalf]

How come these stupid rallies always happen right before I'm ready to buy more securities

You must have the miles touch!!

[killersheep]

How come these stupid rallies always happen right before I'm ready to buy more securities

You must have the miles touch!!

Touche my good friend. Speakin of which, are you gonna jump in on the book again?

[pacfan]

How come these stupid rallies always happen right before I'm ready to buy more securities

That's because you're keeping your eyes, and picking the odds, on boxers. Just keep your eyes on the stocks and you'll be fine.

[killersheep]

How come these stupid rallies always happen right before I'm ready to buy more securities

That's because you're keeping your eyes, and picking the odds, on boxers. Just keep your eyes on the stocks and you'll be fine.

I'm doin fine right now, I just don't have the futureman timing.

[pacfan]

And so it came to pass that hours after The Infallible One announced the Kirkland Laing Global Financial System Rescue Plan would be adopted by global leaders within a few days, U.S. Treasury chief Hank Paulson held a press conference and announced that he was implementing the KLGFSRP and details would be announced "in a few days" and European and other world leaders followed over the weekend.

And lo! The Dow has gone up 1000 points and it looks like credit markets are starting to thaw. If they continue to unfreeze it will be no exaggeration to claim that Kirkland Laing, The Infallible One, has single-handedly saved the world from global economic collapse. But you just know people like Bush, Bernanke, Paulson, Gordon Brown and other world leaders will claim the credit. Those arrogant bastards.

Would, by any chance, an acknowledgement and a citation from a poor fisherman mean anything to you?

[Kirkland Laing]

And so it came to pass that hours after The Infallible One announced the Kirkland Laing Global Financial System Rescue Plan would be adopted by global leaders within a few days, U.S. Treasury chief Hank Paulson held a press conference and announced that he was implementing the KLGFSRP and details would be announced "in a few days" and European and other world leaders followed over the weekend.

And lo! The Dow has gone up 1000 points and it looks like credit markets are starting to thaw. If they continue to unfreeze it will be no exaggeration to claim that Kirkland Laing, The Infallible One, has single-handedly saved the world from global economic collapse. But you just know people like Bush, Bernanke, Paulson, Gordon Brown and other world leaders will claim the credit. Those arrogant bastards.

Would, by any chance, an acknowledgement and a citation from a poor fisherman mean anything to you?

It means more than any praise from the arrogant Bush or Bernanke.

I've been inundated with emails from the SEC and the British equivalent telling me exactly what I can and can't say in public, public forums etc. Both organisations are expecting a massive public backlash against the financial industry after this crisis (KLGFSRP willing) settles down and bankers will make lawyers and estate agents look popular when people see what we've wrought. But it turns out I now know exactly what I can say re. investments. I can definitely tell you not to invest in something, so right now I'd say not to invest in any kind of paper or equities, stocks etc. There's going to be an unpleasant recession and they're kryptonite to stock markets. We could easily see Dow 7000 this time next year. Long term if you've taken a haircut on your stocks over the past year hang onto them as in three or four years they'll return to their previous value.

We're not out of the woods yet though. There's lots of things could go wrong. There could easily be another Iceland before the end of the year. The new Iceland could even be England. There's massive banking debt everywhere and Britain is basically a massive bank. A third of the UK economy is financial services and all the dodgy/risky stuff got booted out of the US by Clinton and moved to London (which is why I'm not working in the States anymore.) An example. Banks used to work on a 10:1 debt to assets ration. If you walked into the bank and deposited £1. They'd keep the pound in the safe and lend ten pounds out on the strength of it. That was considered a safe capital reserve. Barclays bank, Britain's biggest, has a 57:1 ratio and owns over three trillion pounds' worth of things called Credit Default Swaps, which are insurance on various kinds of securities, including the very kind of securities that are causing the current crisis. To put that in perspective UK GDP is less than thst. And nobody outside the bank knows how much they owe because there's no oversight or regulation of the global CDS market. And the global CDS market is worth $60 trillion. To put that in perspective the US stock market is worth about $11 trillion.


And a bank like that somewhere going bust and taking a country down with it like Iceland already (hopefully not the US or things will get really bad) is just one of the problems we might see in the next year or so.

And we've also got the possibility of hundreds of hedge funds going bust and triggering CDS carnage on the world, lots of big insurance companies in trouble, the ongoing process of asset selling by banks to deleverage that's forcing all asset prices down (which makes their :1 all the more worthless) and could turninto a cascade, and of course house prices still falling which would make all those bad securities even more worthless.

Governments are going to have to start a lot of spending on public works to stimulate the economy too or a nasty multiyear recession (which we're guaranteed) will turn into a deacade-long slump. There's no point in the KLGFSRP being successful as a slumping real economy will just make the banks go bust all over again and then this cunting crisis would last years on and off. I've had enough already.

[killersheep]

And so it came to pass that hours after The Infallible One announced the Kirkland Laing Global Financial System Rescue Plan would be adopted by global leaders within a few days, U.S. Treasury chief Hank Paulson held a press conference and announced that he was implementing the KLGFSRP and details would be announced "in a few days" and European and other world leaders followed over the weekend.

And lo! The Dow has gone up 1000 points and it looks like credit markets are starting to thaw. If they continue to unfreeze it will be no exaggeration to claim that Kirkland Laing, The Infallible One, has single-handedly saved the world from global economic collapse. But you just know people like Bush, Bernanke, Paulson, Gordon Brown and other world leaders will claim the credit. Those arrogant bastards.

Would, by any chance, an acknowledgement and a citation from a poor fisherman mean anything to you?

It means more than any praise from the arrogant Bush or Bernanke.

I've been inundated with emails from the SEC and the British equivalent telling me exactly what I can and can't say in public, public forums etc. Both organisations are expecting a massive public backlash against the financial industry after this crisis (KLGFSRP willing) settles down and bankers will make lawyers and estate agents look popular when people see what we've wrought. But it turns out I now know exactly what I can say re. investments. I can definitely tell you not to invest in something, so right now I'd say not to invest in any kind of paper or equities, stocks etc. There's going to be an unpleasant recession and they're kryptonite to stock markets. We could easily see Dow 7000 this time next year. Long term if you've taken a haircut on your stocks over the past year hang onto them as in three or four years they'll return to their previous value.

We're not out of the woods yet though. There's lots of things could go wrong. There could easily be another Iceland before the end of the year. The new Iceland could even be England. There's massive banking debt everywhere and Britain is basically a massive bank. A third of the UK economy is financial services and all the dodgy/risky stuff got booted out of the US by Clinton and moved to London (which is why I'm not working in the States anymore.) An example. Banks used to work on a 10:1 debt to assets ration. If you walked into the bank and deposited £1. They'd keep the pound in the safe and lend ten pounds out on the strength of it. That was considered a safe capital reserve. Barclays bank, Britain's biggest, has a 57:1 ratio and owns over three trillion pounds' worth of things called Credit Default Swaps, which are insurance on various kinds of securities, including the very kind of securities that are causing the current crisis. To put that in perspective UK GDP is less than thst. And nobody outside the bank knows how much they owe because there's no oversight or regulation of the global CDS market. And the global CDS market is worth $60 trillion. To put that in perspective the US stock market is worth about $11 trillion.


And a bank like that somewhere going bust and taking a country down with it like Iceland already (hopefully not the US or things will get really bad) is just one of the problems we might see in the next year or so.

And we've also got the possibility of hundreds of hedge funds going bust and triggering CDS carnage on the world, lots of big insurance companies in trouble, the ongoing process of asset selling by banks to deleverage that's forcing all asset prices down (which makes their :1 all the more worthless) and could turninto a cascade, and of course house prices still falling which would make all those bad securities even more worthless.

Governments are going to have to start a lot of spending on public works to stimulate the economy too or a nasty multiyear recession (which we're guaranteed) will turn into a deacade-long slump. There's no point in the KLGFSRP being successful as a slumping real economy will just make the banks go bust all over again and then this cunting crisis would last years on and off. I've had enough already.

This is precisely why I'm trying to learn how to grow vegetables, I believe that I have enough land to grow enough food for me and the missus to live off of for quite some time. At the rate I'm going currently though, 10 tomatoes a year will be hard to ration. I don't see why you wouldn't want people to invest now, not in short term things, but investing for the long term (more than 10 years). From what I understand (keep in mind I'm a simpleton) the issue is that there is not enough capital in the system. I would think that in addition to the government's contribution, that long term investment in the financial sector should be encouraged. I am very leary of government control of America's financial sector, even though the intention right now is to sell it back to the public, a new administration is coming soon and everything could change. Let capitalism bail itself out, if the government needs to be involved, they could offer a tax incentive program for those willing to invest in these ailing companies, I know more than a few millionaires that would jump at the opportunity to shelter more funds.

[Kirkland Laing]

Would, by any chance, an acknowledgement and a citation from a poor fisherman mean anything to you?

It means more than any praise from the arrogant Bush or Bernanke.

I've been inundated with emails from the SEC and the British equivalent telling me exactly what I can and can't say in public, public forums etc. Both organisations are expecting a massive public backlash against the financial industry after this crisis (KLGFSRP willing) settles down and bankers will make lawyers and estate agents look popular when people see what we've wrought. But it turns out I now know exactly what I can say re. investments. I can definitely tell you not to invest in something, so right now I'd say not to invest in any kind of paper or equities, stocks etc. There's going to be an unpleasant recession and they're kryptonite to stock markets. We could easily see Dow 7000 this time next year. Long term if you've taken a haircut on your stocks over the past year hang onto them as in three or four years they'll return to their previous value.

We're not out of the woods yet though. There's lots of things could go wrong. There could easily be another Iceland before the end of the year. The new Iceland could even be England. There's massive banking debt everywhere and Britain is basically a massive bank. A third of the UK economy is financial services and all the dodgy/risky stuff got booted out of the US by Clinton and moved to London (which is why I'm not working in the States anymore.) An example. Banks used to work on a 10:1 debt to assets ration. If you walked into the bank and deposited £1. They'd keep the pound in the safe and lend ten pounds out on the strength of it. That was considered a safe capital reserve. Barclays bank, Britain's biggest, has a 57:1 ratio and owns over three trillion pounds' worth of things called Credit Default Swaps, which are insurance on various kinds of securities, including the very kind of securities that are causing the current crisis. To put that in perspective UK GDP is less than thst. And nobody outside the bank knows how much they owe because there's no oversight or regulation of the global CDS market. And the global CDS market is worth $60 trillion. To put that in perspective the US stock market is worth about $11 trillion.


And a bank like that somewhere going bust and taking a country down with it like Iceland already (hopefully not the US or things will get really bad) is just one of the problems we might see in the next year or so.

And we've also got the possibility of hundreds of hedge funds going bust and triggering CDS carnage on the world, lots of big insurance companies in trouble, the ongoing process of asset selling by banks to deleverage that's forcing all asset prices down (which makes their :1 all the more worthless) and could turninto a cascade, and of course house prices still falling which would make all those bad securities even more worthless.

Governments are going to have to start a lot of spending on public works to stimulate the economy too or a nasty multiyear recession (which we're guaranteed) will turn into a deacade-long slump. There's no point in the KLGFSRP being successful as a slumping real economy will just make the banks go bust all over again and then this cunting crisis would last years on and off. I've had enough already.

This is precisely why I'm trying to learn how to grow vegetables, I believe that I have enough land to grow enough food for me and the missus to live off of for quite some time. At the rate I'm going currently though, 10 tomatoes a year will be hard to ration. I don't see why you wouldn't want people to invest now, not in short term things, but investing for the long term (more than 10 years). From what I understand (keep in mind I'm a simpleton) the issue is that there is not enough capital in the system. I would think that in addition to the government's contribution, that long term investment in the financial sector should be encouraged. I am very leary of government control of America's financial sector, even though the intention right now is to sell it back to the public, a new administration is coming soon and everything could change. Let capitalism bail itself out, if the government needs to be involved, they could offer a tax incentive program for those willing to invest in these ailing companies, I know more than a few millionaires that would jump at the opportunity to shelter more funds.

They let capitalism bail itself out in 1929 and it caused the Great Depression. Capitalism isn't capable of bailing itself out without government involvement, QED. If the governments hadn't got involved at all there'd already have been over a million people laid off and millions more to come and a ten year plus Depression to face. Hopefully the banks can be weaned off government support in the future but I wouldn't hold my breath on that one. We may yet see total government ownership of the global financial system.

[killersheep]

It means more than any praise from the arrogant Bush or Bernanke.

I've been inundated with emails from the SEC and the British equivalent telling me exactly what I can and can't say in public, public forums etc. Both organisations are expecting a massive public backlash against the financial industry after this crisis (KLGFSRP willing) settles down and bankers will make lawyers and estate agents look popular when people see what we've wrought. But it turns out I now know exactly what I can say re. investments. I can definitely tell you not to invest in something, so right now I'd say not to invest in any kind of paper or equities, stocks etc. There's going to be an unpleasant recession and they're kryptonite to stock markets. We could easily see Dow 7000 this time next year. Long term if you've taken a haircut on your stocks over the past year hang onto them as in three or four years they'll return to their previous value.

We're not out of the woods yet though. There's lots of things could go wrong. There could easily be another Iceland before the end of the year. The new Iceland could even be England. There's massive banking debt everywhere and Britain is basically a massive bank. A third of the UK economy is financial services and all the dodgy/risky stuff got booted out of the US by Clinton and moved to London (which is why I'm not working in the States anymore.) An example. Banks used to work on a 10:1 debt to assets ration. If you walked into the bank and deposited £1. They'd keep the pound in the safe and lend ten pounds out on the strength of it. That was considered a safe capital reserve. Barclays bank, Britain's biggest, has a 57:1 ratio and owns over three trillion pounds' worth of things called Credit Default Swaps, which are insurance on various kinds of securities, including the very kind of securities that are causing the current crisis. To put that in perspective UK GDP is less than thst. And nobody outside the bank knows how much they owe because there's no oversight or regulation of the global CDS market. And the global CDS market is worth $60 trillion. To put that in perspective the US stock market is worth about $11 trillion.


And a bank like that somewhere going bust and taking a country down with it like Iceland already (hopefully not the US or things will get really bad) is just one of the problems we might see in the next year or so.

And we've also got the possibility of hundreds of hedge funds going bust and triggering CDS carnage on the world, lots of big insurance companies in trouble, the ongoing process of asset selling by banks to deleverage that's forcing all asset prices down (which makes their :1 all the more worthless) and could turninto a cascade, and of course house prices still falling which would make all those bad securities even more worthless.

Governments are going to have to start a lot of spending on public works to stimulate the economy too or a nasty multiyear recession (which we're guaranteed) will turn into a deacade-long slump. There's no point in the KLGFSRP being successful as a slumping real economy will just make the banks go bust all over again and then this cunting crisis would last years on and off. I've had enough already.

This is precisely why I'm trying to learn how to grow vegetables, I believe that I have enough land to grow enough food for me and the missus to live off of for quite some time. At the rate I'm going currently though, 10 tomatoes a year will be hard to ration. I don't see why you wouldn't want people to invest now, not in short term things, but investing for the long term (more than 10 years). From what I understand (keep in mind I'm a simpleton) the issue is that there is not enough capital in the system. I would think that in addition to the government's contribution, that long term investment in the financial sector should be encouraged. I am very leary of government control of America's financial sector, even though the intention right now is to sell it back to the public, a new administration is coming soon and everything could change. Let capitalism bail itself out, if the government needs to be involved, they could offer a tax incentive program for those willing to invest in these ailing companies, I know more than a few millionaires that would jump at the opportunity to shelter more funds.

They let capitalism bail itself out in 1929 and it caused the Great Depression. Capitalism isn't capable of bailing itself out without government involvement, QED. If the governments hadn't got involved at all there'd already have been over a million people laid off and millions more to come and a ten year plus Depression to face. Hopefully the banks can be weaned off government support in the future but I wouldn't hold my breath on that one. We may yet see total government ownership of the global financial system.

I officially fear the NWO. I have many questions as to how this bail out works still, for example if I as an American tax payer will be getting prefered stock in the companies that are bailed out, how are dividends going to work? Why don't I have a say in that? What is being done to pay down the national debt? Why isn't the American public being told to reduce debt, and live within their means? Wouldn't you say that an equal part of the equation is that people borrow beyond what they are able to pay? In my estimation government could play a greater roll in not allowing loans that are unlikely to be paid back. If we simply pump more money into the system and eventually get back to where we were 5 years ago we will be heading back to the same place.

[Kirkland Laing]

This is precisely why I'm trying to learn how to grow vegetables, I believe that I have enough land to grow enough food for me and the missus to live off of for quite some time. At the rate I'm going currently though, 10 tomatoes a year will be hard to ration. I don't see why you wouldn't want people to invest now, not in short term things, but investing for the long term (more than 10 years). From what I understand (keep in mind I'm a simpleton) the issue is that there is not enough capital in the system. I would think that in addition to the government's contribution, that long term investment in the financial sector should be encouraged. I am very leary of government control of America's financial sector, even though the intention right now is to sell it back to the public, a new administration is coming soon and everything could change. Let capitalism bail itself out, if the government needs to be involved, they could offer a tax incentive program for those willing to invest in these ailing companies, I know more than a few millionaires that would jump at the opportunity to shelter more funds.

They let capitalism bail itself out in 1929 and it caused the Great Depression. Capitalism isn't capable of bailing itself out without government involvement, QED. If the governments hadn't got involved at all there'd already have been over a million people laid off and millions more to come and a ten year plus Depression to face. Hopefully the banks can be weaned off government support in the future but I wouldn't hold my breath on that one. We may yet see total government ownership of the global financial system.

I officially fear the NWO. I have many questions as to how this bail out works still, for example if I as an American tax payer will be getting prefered stock in the companies that are bailed out, how are dividends going to work? Why don't I have a say in that? What is being done to pay down the national debt? Why isn't the American public being told to reduce debt, and live within their means? Wouldn't you say that an equal part of the equation is that people borrow beyond what they are able to pay? In my estimation government could play a greater roll in not allowing loans that are unlikely to be paid back. If we simply pump more money into the system and eventually get back to where we were 5 years ago we will be heading back to the same place.

There'll have to be a big conference after the worst of this is over and governments will forge a new global economic structure to prevent this from happening again. Lots of regulation and oversight. So the NWO will look a lot better than the OWO.

Forget about getting your money back, you've just started paying for all this. It's going to cost trillions.

Forget about paying the national debt down anytime soon either.

71% of US GDP is consumer spending so nobody wants the US consumer to stop or the economy will tank. We can worry about how much debt they owe when the current crisis is over although we'll probably have problems there too.

[pacfan]

And so it came to pass that hours after The Infallible One announced the Kirkland Laing Global Financial System Rescue Plan would be adopted by global leaders within a few days, U.S. Treasury chief Hank Paulson held a press conference and announced that he was implementing the KLGFSRP and details would be announced "in a few days" and European and other world leaders followed over the weekend.

And lo! The Dow has gone up 1000 points and it looks like credit markets are starting to thaw. If they continue to unfreeze it will be no exaggeration to claim that Kirkland Laing, The Infallible One, has single-handedly saved the world from global economic collapse. But you just know people like Bush, Bernanke, Paulson, Gordon Brown and other world leaders will claim the credit. Those arrogant bastards.

Would, by any chance, an acknowledgement and a citation from a poor fisherman mean anything to you?

It means more than any praise from the arrogant Bush or Bernanke.

I gathered around some of our fishermen folks here to give you your due recognition and respect for your invaluable economic insight that the Whitehouse is so desperately trying to ignore:


...this of course comes with a special citation for which I have assigned Lyle to read and present to you. Okay, come on out here Lyle, whereever you are... ...just leave your gun at home...

[pacfan]

I've been inundated with emails from the SEC and the British equivalent telling me exactly what I can and can't say in public, public forums etc. Both organisations are expecting a massive public backlash against the financial industry after this crisis (KLGFSRP willing) settles down and bankers will make lawyers and estate agents look popular when people see what we've wrought. But it turns out I now know exactly what I can say re. investments. I can definitely tell you not to invest in something, so right now I'd say not to invest in any kind of paper or equities, stocks etc. There's going to be an unpleasant recession and they're kryptonite to stock markets. We could easily see Dow 7000 this time next year. Long term if you've taken a haircut on your stocks over the past year hang onto them as in three or four years they'll return to their previous value.

We're not out of the woods yet though. There's lots of things could go wrong. There could easily be another Iceland before the end of the year. The new Iceland could even be England. There's massive banking debt everywhere and Britain is basically a massive bank. A third of the UK economy is financial services and all the dodgy/risky stuff got booted out of the US by Clinton and moved to London (which is why I'm not working in the States anymore.) An example. Banks used to work on a 10:1 debt to assets ration. If you walked into the bank and deposited £1. They'd keep the pound in the safe and lend ten pounds out on the strength of it. That was considered a safe capital reserve. Barclays bank, Britain's biggest, has a 57:1 ratio and owns over three trillion pounds' worth of things called Credit Default Swaps, which are insurance on various kinds of securities, including the very kind of securities that are causing the current crisis. To put that in perspective UK GDP is less than thst. And nobody outside the bank knows how much they owe because there's no oversight or regulation of the global CDS market. And the global CDS market is worth $60 trillion. To put that in perspective the US stock market is worth about $11 trillion.


And a bank like that somewhere going bust and taking a country down with it like Iceland already (hopefully not the US or things will get really bad) is just one of the problems we might see in the next year or so.

And we've also got the possibility of hundreds of hedge funds going bust and triggering CDS carnage on the world, lots of big insurance companies in trouble, the ongoing process of asset selling by banks to deleverage that's forcing all asset prices down (which makes their :1 all the more worthless) and could turninto a cascade, and of course house prices still falling which would make all those bad securities even more worthless.

Governments are going to have to start a lot of spending on public works to stimulate the economy too or a nasty multiyear recession (which we're guaranteed) will turn into a deacade-long slump. There's no point in the KLGFSRP being successful as a slumping real economy will just make the banks go bust all over again and then this cunting crisis would last years on and off. I've had enough already.

I'm glad you're back unto your old self again, Kirk. I need a gloomy guy here to balance things out a bit. I was worried that you might have become a bit more optimistic when the plan of bank nationalization was anounced because that would have spoiled things a bit here.