does this fight cement joe c's legacy?

[ClubberLang]

cant decide myself, but i certainly thought hopkins was on a decline, but to beat pavlik like that i was wrong, thoughts on if this fight has further put joe up in the p4p and legacy rankings

I don't think so because I thought Hopkins deserved a clear 115-112 win against Calzaghe. Landed easily the more effective shots. I am tired of more activity wins. What the hell about defense? OK, a guy throws more punches; if you block or duck them, isn't that more a credit to you than the guy throwing punches? Why does activity trump defense these days? It's crap.

[Kev]

Just proves that Kelly was overhyped and I include myself in doing that.

Bernard took him to school and showed that Kelly only has one real way of fighting. People like Hopkins and Calzaghe are versatile and can adjust which is why they have been at the top so long.

It makes Jack Loew look like the mouthy clown he is, I bet Enzo Calzaghe is laughing his head off - They said Kelly wasn't upto it and Bernard proved them right.

For the record Joe beat Bernard by imposing his fight on Hopkins and clawed his way back from the early set back of a knockdown - thats proof of Greatness and Bhop schooling Pavlik, who couldn't impose his fight game on Hopkins, just emphasizes that Bhop and Joe are Great fighters.

You can moan and complain but you can't change the result.

Ah come on Rob yesterday you said this was an easy pointless fight Pavlik just to get a name on his record and when Hopkins defies father time with a truly great performance you dimiss it as just Pavlik being overratted?

Hopkins was simply superb last night.

I still don't think he'd beat Calzaghe because Calzaghe is the second best fighter on the planet imo and has the beating of everyone from 160 -175 (with Dawson being the danger man) but this was a stellar performance from Hopkins.

[Fenster]

Pavlik was a bit overhyped but no-one expected a thrashing like that.

And YES it does highlight how good Calzaghe is.

Although Hopkins thinks he won the Calzaghe fight.. last night, he himself admitted he could have lost to Calzaghe by telling Ron Borges - styles make fights, Calzaghe throws a ton of punches

[Tysonbruno]

Hopkins didn't fight anything like when he fought Calzaghe he was much better last night and it wasn't a case of Pavlik making him look better than he was Hopkins owned this young mans ASS!. Calzaghe only won by SD12 and many thought Hopkins won when Hopkins fought Calzaghe he fought very flat and didn't seem nowhere near as motivated as he did for this had he turned up for Calzaghe as he did for Pavlik calzaghe would have had problems.

[Kev]

Hopkins didn't fight anything like when he fought Calzaghe he was much better last night and it wasn't a case of Pavlik making him look better than he was Hopkins owned this young mans ASS!. Calzaghe only won by SD12 and many thought Hopkins won when Hopkins fought Calzaghe he fought very flat and didn't seem nowhere near as motivated as he did for this had he turned up for Calzaghe as he did for Pavlik calzaghe would have had problems.

You can't tell me that Calzaghe didn't also fight a whole lot better than Pavlik did.

Pavlik barely landed a meaningful punch in the whole fight, Calzaghe clearly thre more and outlanded Hopkins down the stretch. It was a very close fight but Calzaghe did far better against Hopkins than Pavlik did and it was nothing to do with Hopkins being out of sorts against Calzaghe.

Calzaghe fought much better against Hopkins than Pavlik did.

Just look at the punch stats. Pavlik threw 463 punches and landed 108 against Hopkins, Calzaghe threw 707 landing 232 literally more than double.

I think that has a lot to do with why Hopkins did better against Kelly than Joe

[Tysonbruno]

Hopkins didn't fight anything like when he fought Calzaghe he was much better last night and it wasn't a case of Pavlik making him look better than he was Hopkins owned this young mans ASS!. Calzaghe only won by SD12 and many thought Hopkins won when Hopkins fought Calzaghe he fought very flat and didn't seem nowhere near as motivated as he did for this had he turned up for Calzaghe as he did for Pavlik calzaghe would have had problems.

You can't tell me that Calzaghe didn't also fight a whole lot better than Pavlik did.

Pavlik barely landed a meaningful punch in the whole fight, Calzaghe clearly thre more and outlanded Hopkins down the stretch. It was a very close fight but Calzaghe did far better against Hopkins than Pavlik did and it was nothing to do with Hopkins being out of sorts against Calzaghe.

Calzaghe fought much better against Hopkins than Pavlik did.

Yes Calzaghe fought better than Pavlik did vs Hopkins but Hopkins fought 10 times better than he did vs Calzaghe his whole attitude towards the job in hand was loads better than when he fought Calzaghe he looked loads fitter if had fought in this way vs Calzaghe after dropping him in the 1st round he would have beaten Calzaghe.

[BIG H]

Please tell me you are being sarcastic?

Why's that?

You think having somebody throwing punches at the rate that Calzaghe was and with his general workrate, wouldn't affect Hopkins ability to be more offensive he was able to be in the Pavlick fight

Ah I know what happened. Calzaghe fought an Old Hopkins, but suddenly Hopkins has be rejuvenated in between fights and lost 5 years of his age

[BIG H]

Hopkins didn't fight anything like when he fought Calzaghe he was much better last night and it wasn't a case of Pavlik making him look better than he was Hopkins owned this young mans ASS!. Calzaghe only won by SD12 and many thought Hopkins won when Hopkins fought Calzaghe he fought very flat and didn't seem nowhere near as motivated as he did for this had he turned up for Calzaghe as he did for Pavlik calzaghe would have had problems.

You can't tell me that Calzaghe didn't also fight a whole lot better than Pavlik did.

Pavlik barely landed a meaningful punch in the whole fight, Calzaghe clearly thre more and outlanded Hopkins down the stretch. It was a very close fight but Calzaghe did far better against Hopkins than Pavlik did and it was nothing to do with Hopkins being out of sorts against Calzaghe.

Calzaghe fought much better against Hopkins than Pavlik did.

Yes Calzaghe fought better than Pavlik did vs Hopkins but Hopkins fought 10 times better than he did vs Calzaghe his whole attitude towards the job in hand was loads better than when he fought Calzaghe he looked loads fitter if had fought in this way vs Calzaghe after dropping him in the 1st round he would have beaten Calzaghe.

If Hopkins fought how he did in the first 5 rounds against Calzaghe then he would've beaten Calzaghe! Don't you think the fact that he couldn't may have a little bit to do with the way Calzaghe fought from round 6 onwards rather than Hopkins suddenly 'gassing' in a way that he never did against Taylor (in fact Hopkins didn't start until round 9) Tarver, Wright etc etc etc.

[Markusdarkus]

no, he barley won a split decision. and many people think he still lost. just cause he won a very close decision against bhop and hopkins beat the crap outta pavlik doesnt mean it cements joes legacy at all. but bhop beating a young undefeated champion does more for his legacy which has already been accomplished.

Of course it doers you muppet!

Pavlik did not win one round and was exposed as a middling champion with power.

[Markusdarkus]

Hopkins didn't fight anything like when he fought Calzaghe he was much better last night and it wasn't a case of Pavlik making him look better than he was Hopkins owned this young mans ASS!. Calzaghe only won by SD12 and many thought Hopkins won when Hopkins fought Calzaghe he fought very flat and didn't seem nowhere near as motivated as he did for this had he turned up for Calzaghe as he did for Pavlik calzaghe would have had problems.

Hopkins fought the same against Calzaghe and Pavlik. He was bouncing looking to hit the hold. Thing is Calzaghe has superb footwork and has ring smarts Pavlik just looked like a 169lb dummy tbh.

[ross]

I thought this was a dangerous fight for Hopkins, not because of Pavliks size or power (although he looked to be lacking in both departments at this higher weight) but the age, I though Hopkins would be a sitting duck when he trired late against someone like Pavlik.

Hopkins was able to avoid all Pavliks slow shots and land on his open mug at will, Calzaghe would have loved that kind of opponent.

Could you imagine Joe in there last night, he may not have Hopkins one shot power but he would have landed so many, I see the fight being stopped around the 6th, Kellys head was being ripped back time and again.

Shame American promoters have to build up what lean world hopes they have only for such spectacular falls, Lacy and Taylor being 2 other prime examples.

Calzaghe has the beating of anybody, Hopkins couldnt work the way he would have liked against Joe because Joe was putting a glove in his face when he tried opening up.

I thought Kelly may be wrong for Joe but I bet Joe is p*ssed off he didnt get there first now!!

[Bomp]

You can't tell me that Calzaghe didn't also fight a whole lot better than Pavlik did.

Pavlik barely landed a meaningful punch in the whole fight, Calzaghe clearly thre more and outlanded Hopkins down the stretch. It was a very close fight but Calzaghe did far better against Hopkins than Pavlik did and it was nothing to do with Hopkins being out of sorts against Calzaghe.

Calzaghe fought much better against Hopkins than Pavlik did.

Yes Calzaghe fought better than Pavlik did vs Hopkins but Hopkins fought 10 times better than he did vs Calzaghe his whole attitude towards the job in hand was loads better than when he fought Calzaghe he looked loads fitter if had fought in this way vs Calzaghe after dropping him in the 1st round he would have beaten Calzaghe.

If Hopkins fought how he did in the first 5 rounds against Calzaghe then he would've beaten Calzaghe! Don't you think the fact that he couldn't may have a little bit to do with the way Calzaghe fought from round 6 onwards rather than Hopkins suddenly 'gassing' in a way that he never did against Taylor (in fact Hopkins didn't start until round 9) Tarver, Wright etc etc etc.

You can NOT argue with these morons, Joe could knock out Vitali and there'd still be a but. Last nights fight DID improve Joe's legacy since it proved that it wasn't Hop's age that made him gas so badly late on but Joe's unorthodox boxing.

Hopkins is a fucking legend, if he really was old and Kelly got lucky these same people would open threads today saying Kelly could've kicked the shit out of Monzon and Hagler and SRR (some were saying it last week)

[El Kabong]

Pavlik was a bit overhyped but no-one expected a thrashing like that.

And YES it does highlight how good Calzaghe is.

Although Hopkins thinks he won the Calzaghe fight.. last night, he himself admitted he could have lost to Calzaghe by telling Ron Borges - styles make fights, Calzaghe throws a ton of punches

I think the bigger question is what does it say about Jermain Taylor

[littlebif]

I think why Hopkin's was more agressive is because he saw Pavlik had alot more flaws than many thought,and he could read what Pavlik was going to do.It was a master class from the old dude.

[Drago]

if calzaghe was american! well he would be the greatest of all time.

lennox lewis did everything in the americans backyard but it wasnt enuff, never is! why beacuse he aint american.

simple as!!!!!!