Giving Joe Calzaghe Credit For Beating This Version Of RJJ.....

[ICB]

You forgot the rest of my sentence

because PLENTY of people picked him to lose. Including PLENTY of "EXPERTS."

Yes but why do you give him credit Fenster

Thats other peoples opinions what about yours.

Jeez i need a cup of tea this is doing my head in mate

I never said i gave him credit... but i'll entertain you if you really want..

So my opinion is - Calzaghe bashed the shit out of a past his best legend EXACTLY how he should have.

Judging by the amount of so called "experts" that thought Roy would win it would be very unfair to give Calzaghe NO credit.

At the very least his showboating was quite impressive, no? Who else could have showbaoted Roy like that?

Thats a fair comment no problem with that what so ever, atleast your not going over board with this win like other Joe Calzaghe fans.

[Pugilistic]

I don't give joe much credit at all for the win.

It is completely obvious those that picked Jones to win were Jones fans.

Calzaghe winning a decision was the only option imo considering Jones has been past it for 4 years.

[Conrad]

Is just being a fan boy IMO and totally being biased. I'll copy and paste what i said in the other thread which is a fair comment IMO.

Well im not a Joe Calzaghe hater but if you give Joe Calzaghe any real credit. For beating RJJ i think your seriously being biased, RJJ last stoppage win was in 2002 against Clinton Woods, and in his last comeback fights he didn't show stamina or a killer instinct. And he only showed flashes of his old self, "flashes" being the key word here.

Give him credit for beating Chris Eubank although he was weight drained which does take away from Joe Calzaghe's win somewhat. It was still a good performance and Chris Eubank still had quite alot left in the tank, which showed in his great performance's against Carl Thompson.

Give him credit for beating Mikkel Kessler, who was the number 2 man in the division at that time. Who was a very dangerous opponent who has very good skills, and can punch.

Give him credit for beating Bernard Hopkins, although disputable Bernard Hopkins still has alot left in the tank. Which showed against Antonio Tarver, Kelly Pavlik.

But i will give him no credit for beating a shot RJJ, or beating the overhyped Jeff Lacy. Who was struggling against mediocre opposition even before he got embarrassed against Joe Calzaghe.

Oh man, this is becoming tiresome.

The irony of this thread is that you're complaining about the very thing that you yourself are doing.

This thread, the Robin Reid thread and the 'disgraceful' thread all point to you being a hater. A hater is the exact same thing as a fanboy, letting your heart rule your head.

Members here, members on other boards, pro boxers, trainers and a lot of writers were picking RJJ to win. As Fenster rightly points out, if these people were still predicting the RJJ win then how can Joe's victory be worthless?

All im doing is voicing my opinion what exactly have i done wrong ? i said before the fight i would give Joe Calzaghe no credit for beating a fighter 7 years past his prime and i didn't.

I gave Joe Calzaghe credit for beating Mikkel Kessler, Bernard Hopkins, Chris Eubank. But how exactly can you give Joe Calzaghe credit for beating RJJ based on the last few years ?

You call me a hater yet you still haven't proved me wrong, and all you did in that post is skirt over the issue and once again use an argument based on other peoples opinions.

What about your opinion ? IMO i don't think Joe Calzaghe deserves any real credit for beating RJJ, RJJ hasn't been impressive in any of his fights since moving back down in weight.

Especially in his comeback fights he showed no killer instinct, when he had Anthony Hanshaw, Felix Trinidad. In huge trouble the fact that RJJ hasn't had a stoppage win since 2002 speaks volumes.

You're missing my point entirely.

I'm not doubting what you said before the fight or since. Nor am I agreeing with or against your opinion. I'm just pointing out that the three threads you've started since the fight have been created to slag Calzaghe off in some way. That's something haters/fanboys do....

The point me and Fenster was trying to make was that a lot of people thought RJJ would win. Lennox Lewis, Malinaggi, Hopkins, Winky Wright, Dan Rafael etc etc

Now if you were to ask those very same people if Joe deserves absolutely no credit whatsoever what do you think they will say?

In case you were wondering, here's what Dan Rafael had to say sfter he predicted wrong:

ESPN - Joe Calzaghe dominates Roy Jones over 12 rounds to stay undefeated

[JT Rock]

Fenster is right IMO, I was hoping and searched the clash in styles for reasons why Jones could beat Joe, and I stand by that.. I will not take the hindsight high road on this one.

I mean for the reasons I stated, albeit a little wrist got in there, Jones dropped and hurt Joe really bad and should have finished him off, that would have been something remarkable and Roy had greatness in the palm of his hand and he pissed it away, shame on him,, Joe did what he had to do, would the win be shinier if it was Roy of 2002?? Of course it would have but it stil has some gloss on it.. Roy fought tough and battled and despite him letting Joe clown him around he still was game.. Jones at that stage is still a pretty good fighter, just not as good as Joe is at this stage... Joe deserves his credit

I only wish he fought Hopkins and Jones sooner, as I feel a bit like I do when I think of Lennox's fights against Holyfield and Tyson. Just a few years to late.. But again Joe deserves his credit

[richard (mossley)]

I said two weeks ago that for Jones Jr to win it would be the upset of the decade. Jones Jr is finished, was bewfore and is now.
Calzaghe has shown nothing, he was leagues ahead of Jones Jr before the fight and if I am tottally honest the fight was a mismatch.

[Gandalf]

Fenster is right IMO, I was hoping and searched the clash in styles for reasons why Jones could beat Joe, and I stand by that.. I will not take the hindsight high road on this one.

I mean for the reasons I stated, albeit a little wrist got in there, Jones dropped and hurt Joe really bad and should have finished him off, that would have been something remarkable and Roy had greatness in the palm of his hand and he pissed it away, shame on him,, Joe did what he had to do, would the win be shinier if it was Roy of 2002?? Of course it would have but it stil has some gloss on it.. Roy fought tough and battled and despite him letting Joe clown him around he still was game.. Jones at that stage is still a pretty good fighter, just not as good as Joe is at this stage... Joe deserves his credit

I only wish he fought Hopkins and Jones sooner, as I feel a bit like I do when I think of Lennox's fights against Holyfield and Tyson. Just a few years to late.. But again Joe deserves his credit

This fight is just the icing on the cake and a scalp to nail on to the end of the resume. Calzaghe was clear favourite to win this fight and he did what was expected. Couldnt ask for anything more really. Eleven rounds taken and a shocker to open proceedings with. All cracking fun.

And Ice, its just getting boring hearing you go on about Calzaghe all the time. Fenster and Conrad made some good points. You do sure talk a lot about Calzaghe, considering he's a fighter you dont have all that much time for.

[ono]

Im not moaning or crying im asking you to give me a legit, argument why RJJ deserved to fight Joe Calzaghe ? and what he had done in the past few years to suggest he deserved the fight ?

I asked you this last time and you avoided the question, your saying i should call it a great win for Joe Calzaghe and praise him. Yet you cannot give me a legit argument why i should ?

I already gave you the reason's why i thought RJJ was shot, and why i don't think he deserved the fight. And you have yet to counter any of my arguments which i listed above.

And your last comment makes no sense i thought RJJ was shot, then why should that mean because Joe Calzaghe beat him. That i should now think Joe Calzaghe is a better fighter than i thought ? that makes no sense.

You're making no sense.

YOU picked Roy.. not me. Why do I have to justify Roy's shot at Calzaghe? I thought Calzaghe would win. I was right. Whether i thought Roy was past his best or not is irrelevant.

The question you need to answer is - for yourself not for me - WHY did you BELIEVE a "shot" fighter would beat Calzaghe?

You love to point out how good or crap certain fighters are yet you picked a "shot" fighter to beat Calzaghe.

If you find the answer to that you'll understand why you are making threads denigrating people for giving Calzaghe credit for beating a legend.

Uhh have you not read what i said ? i said i was rooting for RJJ but i had Joe Calzaghe as the favorite, just like when i rooted for MAB against Manny Pacquiao i had Manny Pacquiao as the favorite.

Rooting for a fighter because there one of your favorites, then saying you have the other fighter as the favorite, is hardly picking RJJ is it ?

And stop avoiding the question this is 4 times now you have avoided it, what has Roy Jones done in the past few years. That should warrant me giving Joe Calzaghe alot of praise for beating RJJ ?

Forgetting past achievements because thats nothing to do with it, were talking the last few years. After the brutal loss to Glen Johnson, what performance from RJJ. Or what good name has RJJ beat that warranted him deserving a shot against Joe Calzaghe. Or warrants me giving Joe Calzaghe credit for beating RJJ, based on the last few years ?

Eh didn't you pick Jones to win?

[ICB]

Fenster is right IMO, I was hoping and searched the clash in styles for reasons why Jones could beat Joe, and I stand by that.. I will not take the hindsight high road on this one.

I mean for the reasons I stated, albeit a little wrist got in there, Jones dropped and hurt Joe really bad and should have finished him off, that would have been something remarkable and Roy had greatness in the palm of his hand and he pissed it away, shame on him,, Joe did what he had to do, would the win be shinier if it was Roy of 2002?? Of course it would have but it stil has some gloss on it.. Roy fought tough and battled and despite him letting Joe clown him around he still was game.. Jones at that stage is still a pretty good fighter, just not as good as Joe is at this stage... Joe deserves his credit

I only wish he fought Hopkins and Jones sooner, as I feel a bit like I do when I think of Lennox's fights against Holyfield and Tyson. Just a few years to late.. But again Joe deserves his credit

This fight is just the icing on the cake and a scalp to nail on to the end of the resume. Calzaghe was clear favourite to win this fight and he did what was expected. Couldnt ask for anything more really. Eleven rounds taken and a shocker to open proceedings with. All cracking fun.

And Ice, its just getting boring hearing you go on about Calzaghe all the time. Fenster and Conrad made some good points. You do sure talk a lot about Calzaghe, considering he's a fighter you dont have all that much time for.

Uhh i've got nothing against Joe Calzaghe Miles, if i hated him that much as your saying i wouldn't have bought his career set would i ? all i have basically said is that im not giving him credit for beating a fighter 7 years past his prime.

And i don't care if people think im a hater i know im not, i just speak my mind thats it. I give Joe Calzaghe credit for beating Bernard Hopkins, because he clearly has alot left in the tank. But RJJ ever since the John Ruiz fight has showed no signs of being the fighter he was once. And has looked pretty bad in every single fight since the John Ruiz fight.

You say Conrad, Fenster, make some good points but all they've done is basically agree with me that RJJ is no longer the fighter he was once was. Nowhere even near it, and just because a few other people picked him to win, doesn't change the fact he is indeed shot.

[ICB]

You're making no sense.

YOU picked Roy.. not me. Why do I have to justify Roy's shot at Calzaghe? I thought Calzaghe would win. I was right. Whether i thought Roy was past his best or not is irrelevant.

The question you need to answer is - for yourself not for me - WHY did you BELIEVE a "shot" fighter would beat Calzaghe?

You love to point out how good or crap certain fighters are yet you picked a "shot" fighter to beat Calzaghe.

If you find the answer to that you'll understand why you are making threads denigrating people for giving Calzaghe credit for beating a legend.

Uhh have you not read what i said ? i said i was rooting for RJJ but i had Joe Calzaghe as the favorite, just like when i rooted for MAB against Manny Pacquiao i had Manny Pacquiao as the favorite.

Rooting for a fighter because there one of your favorites, then saying you have the other fighter as the favorite, is hardly picking RJJ is it ?

And stop avoiding the question this is 4 times now you have avoided it, what has Roy Jones done in the past few years. That should warrant me giving Joe Calzaghe alot of praise for beating RJJ ?

Forgetting past achievements because thats nothing to do with it, were talking the last few years. After the brutal loss to Glen Johnson, what performance from RJJ. Or what good name has RJJ beat that warranted him deserving a shot against Joe Calzaghe. Or warrants me giving Joe Calzaghe credit for beating RJJ, based on the last few years ?

Eh didn't you pick Jones to win?

Read through the thread.

[jack2121]

Calzaghe deserves credit because PLENTY of people picked him to lose. Including PLENTY of "EXPERTS."

If Roy had won would no-one be giving him credit? Nobody would be gloating over Calzaghe's loss?

Calzaghe would have been SLAUGHTERED.

If the fight was even remotely close Calzaghe would have been slagged-off something cronic.

Now people are moaning about him winning too EASILY.. that he showboated too much.

sorry fenster i am a big jc fan but its IMPOSIBLE to give jc credit for beating a washed up roy jones, hes not even half the man he was. like ive said so many times the fight would have meant so much more 8 years ago heck even 10 yrs ago!

[jack2121]

I don't give joe much credit at all for the win.

It is completely obvious those that picked Jones to win were Jones fans.

Calzaghe winning a decision was the only option imo considering Jones has been past it for 4 years.

try 6 years (not tryn to be picky)

[Fenster]

Calzaghe deserves credit because PLENTY of people picked him to lose. Including PLENTY of "EXPERTS."

If Roy had won would no-one be giving him credit? Nobody would be gloating over Calzaghe's loss?

Calzaghe would have been SLAUGHTERED.

If the fight was even remotely close Calzaghe would have been slagged-off something cronic.

Now people are moaning about him winning too EASILY.. that he showboated too much.

sorry fenster i am a big jc fan but its IMPOSIBLE to give jc credit for beating a washed up roy jones, hes not even half the man he was. like ive said so many times the fight would have meant so much more 8 years ago heck even 10 yrs ago!

Yes, Roy was past his best, everyone can acknowledge that. But enough people thought Roy would win to make Calzaghe deserve SOME credit.

Anyone BEFORE the fight that said - "this is a pathetic shit mismatch, Roy is beyond SHOT, Calzaghe will humiliate and destroy him" .. then I don't expect them to give Calzaghe any credit.

[jack2121]

Uhh have you not read what i said ? i said i was rooting for RJJ but i had Joe Calzaghe as the favorite, just like when i rooted for MAB against Manny Pacquiao i had Manny Pacquiao as the favorite.

Rooting for a fighter because there one of your favorites, then saying you have the other fighter as the favorite, is hardly picking RJJ is it ?

And stop avoiding the question this is 4 times now you have avoided it, what has Roy Jones done in the past few years. That should warrant me giving Joe Calzaghe alot of praise for beating RJJ ?

Forgetting past achievements because thats nothing to do with it, were talking the last few years. After the brutal loss to Glen Johnson, what performance from RJJ. Or what good name has RJJ beat that warranted him deserving a shot against Joe Calzaghe. Or warrants me giving Joe Calzaghe credit for beating RJJ, based on the last few years ?

Eh didn't you pick Jones to win?

Read through the thread.

Lads calm down. First of wether your a jc or rjj fan i think most people knew joe would win on points even if you were rooting for jones deep down you knew rjj wouldnt pull it off. In saying that i am a huge calzaghe fan and through no fault of his own joe has beaten who ever they put in front of him, but its IMPOSIBLE to give him full credit for beating a washed up roy jones, hes not even half the man he was. like ive said so many times the fight would have meant so much more 8 years ago and once again not joes fault we have frank warren to thank for us having these arguments and no closure on the jones v calzaghe subject. thanks frank!

[CGM]

Nobody that picked Jones to win, can now say that Calzaghe doesn't deserve credit coz Jones is shot - Fact

I don't buy this . It's entirely reasonable to say that most of the people who picked Roy expected a lot more from him that what he showed. Or else they wouldn't have picked him in the first place.

[jack2121]

Calzaghe deserves credit because PLENTY of people picked him to lose. Including PLENTY of "EXPERTS."

If Roy had won would no-one be giving him credit? Nobody would be gloating over Calzaghe's loss?

Calzaghe would have been SLAUGHTERED.

If the fight was even remotely close Calzaghe would have been slagged-off something cronic.

Now people are moaning about him winning too EASILY.. that he showboated too much.

sorry fenster i am a big jc fan but its IMPOSIBLE to give jc credit for beating a washed up roy jones, hes not even half the man he was. like ive said so many times the fight would have meant so much more 8 years ago heck even 10 yrs ago!

Yes, Roy was past his best, everyone can acknowledge that. But enough people thought Roy would win to make Calzaghe deserve SOME credit.

Anyone BEFORE the fight that said - "this is a pathetic shit mismatch, Roy is beyond SHOT, Calzaghe will humiliate and destroy him" .. then I don't expect them to give Calzaghe any credit.

rjj fans and americans picked jones to win so they could stick it to us calzaghe fans if he did but they all knew deep down the outcome, and also after any fight everyone always looks for whom to give credit regardless, joe will not gain much from this fight, (apart from another notch on that amazing record) and its not joes fault he wont gain credit from it, he beats who ever they put in front of him its just the cicumstances unfortunatly.