Celestino "THE TOWERING INFERNO" Caballero cracks Ring Mag's P4P List

[ICB]

I personally would have Dawson at 10.

Dawson got pasy johnson by the skin of his teeth, and beat Tarver, that's it. Man the guy looks like he has skills but has done nothing at all to be spoken about as a top 10 p4p fighter in the world right now... not even close.

What about Tomasz Adamek ? Eric Harding ?

[killersheep]

I personally would have Dawson at 10.

Dawson got pasy johnson by the skin of his teeth, and beat Tarver, that's it. Man the guy looks like he has skills but has done nothing at all to be spoken about as a top 10 p4p fighter in the world right now... not even close.

What about Tomasz Adamek ? Eric Harding ?

Eric Harding didn't mean shit at that point of Harding's career. Adamek on the other hand is a huge win. Still, Point in fact Caballero is a unified strap holder in one of, if not the deepest division in boxing. His wins over an undefeated DPDL and Molitor are a huge acheivement.

[ICB]

Dawson got pasy johnson by the skin of his teeth, and beat Tarver, that's it. Man the guy looks like he has skills but has done nothing at all to be spoken about as a top 10 p4p fighter in the world right now... not even close.

What about Tomasz Adamek ? Eric Harding ?

Eric Harding didn't mean shit at that point of Harding's career. Adamek on the other hand is a huge win. Still, Point in fact Caballero is a unified strap holder in one of, if not the deepest division in boxing. His wins over an undefeated DPDL and Molitor are a huge acheivement.

It still was a good win regardless yes Eric Harding wasn't in his prime, but he was still a good fighter who was atleast top 6 in the division if my memory serves me right.

[killersheep]

What about Tomasz Adamek ? Eric Harding ?

Eric Harding didn't mean shit at that point of Harding's career. Adamek on the other hand is a huge win. Still, Point in fact Caballero is a unified strap holder in one of, if not the deepest division in boxing. His wins over an undefeated DPDL and Molitor are a huge acheivement.

It still was a good win regardless yes Eric Harding wasn't in his prime, but he was still a good fighter who was atleast top 6 in the division if my memory serves me right.

At the end of the day, Dawson's time is coming, Caballero's time is now.

[Rantcatrat]

Eric Harding didn't mean shit at that point of Harding's career. Adamek on the other hand is a huge win. Still, Point in fact Caballero is a unified strap holder in one of, if not the deepest division in boxing. His wins over an undefeated DPDL and Molitor are a huge acheivement.

It still was a good win regardless yes Eric Harding wasn't in his prime, but he was still a good fighter who was atleast top 6 in the division if my memory serves me right.

At the end of the day, Dawson's time is coming, Caballero's time is now.

Sheep is right. Dawson deserves to be near the top ten, but not quite there.

Speaking of Adamek, if he beats Banks, in the last year and a half he has beat three top ten cruiserweights in Banks, Bell, and Cunningham.

If Pwill beats Winkie, he too has an argument for the top ten.

[Kev]

Dawson got pasy johnson by the skin of his teeth, and beat Tarver, that's it. Man the guy looks like he has skills but has done nothing at all to be spoken about as a top 10 p4p fighter in the world right now... not even close.

What about Tomasz Adamek ? Eric Harding ?

Eric Harding didn't mean shit at that point of Harding's career. Adamek on the other hand is a huge win. Still, Point in fact Caballero is a unified strap holder in one of, if not the deepest division in boxing. His wins over an undefeated DPDL and Molitor are a huge acheivement.

I think Adamek and Tarver are bigger wins than Molitor and De Leon personally, Adamek is now the Ring Champion at cruiserweight and Tarver has been the Ring Champ at light heavyweight and looked great in regaining his title over Clinton Woods in the fight prior.

I like Molitor but let's be real he was a paper champ, hadn't fought anyone remotely world class. De Leon, well I think he's been exposed a bit now.

Cabellero is definitely fighting in the strongest division, but he's not faced any of the best in that division yet, Vazquez, Marquez, Lopez are still fights that need to be made.

But I don't really object to him being there, he certainly looked great in taking Molitor apart and he'll spell trouble for anyone in that division.

[killersheep]

What about Tomasz Adamek ? Eric Harding ?

Eric Harding didn't mean shit at that point of Harding's career. Adamek on the other hand is a huge win. Still, Point in fact Caballero is a unified strap holder in one of, if not the deepest division in boxing. His wins over an undefeated DPDL and Molitor are a huge acheivement.

I think Adamek and Tarver are bigger wins than Molitor and De Leon personally, Adamek is now the Ring Champion at cruiserweight and Tarver has been the Ring Champ at light heavyweight and looked great in regaining his title over Clinton Woods in the fight prior.

I like Molitor but let's be real he was a paper champ, hadn't fought anyone remotely world class. De Leon, well I think he's been exposed a bit now.

Cabellero is definitely fighting in the strongest division, but he's not faced any of the best in that division yet, Vazquez, Marquez, Lopez are still fights that need to be made.

But I don't really object to him being there, he certainly looked great in taking Molitor apart and he'll spell trouble for anyone in that division.

Well first off Vazquez and Marquez have spent the last two years fighting only each other and rumors point to the next match being against each other as well, so it's hard to hold that against anyone else at 122. Second Lopez is just coming up in the ranks Caballero called out all three of the guys you listed. Lopez's big win was an impressed KO over DPDL, but Caballero was the first man to beat DPDL. Lopez is already in talks with Penalosa too. Caballero is fighting the best fighters that are available to him.

[Kev]

Eric Harding didn't mean shit at that point of Harding's career. Adamek on the other hand is a huge win. Still, Point in fact Caballero is a unified strap holder in one of, if not the deepest division in boxing. His wins over an undefeated DPDL and Molitor are a huge acheivement.

I think Adamek and Tarver are bigger wins than Molitor and De Leon personally, Adamek is now the Ring Champion at cruiserweight and Tarver has been the Ring Champ at light heavyweight and looked great in regaining his title over Clinton Woods in the fight prior.

I like Molitor but let's be real he was a paper champ, hadn't fought anyone remotely world class. De Leon, well I think he's been exposed a bit now.

Cabellero is definitely fighting in the strongest division, but he's not faced any of the best in that division yet, Vazquez, Marquez, Lopez are still fights that need to be made.

But I don't really object to him being there, he certainly looked great in taking Molitor apart and he'll spell trouble for anyone in that division.

Well first off Vazquez and Marquez have spent the last two years fighting only each other and rumors point to the next match being against each other as well, so it's hard to hold that against anyone else at 122. Second Lopez is just coming up in the ranks Caballero called out all three of the guys you listed. Lopez's big win was an impressed KO over DPDL, but Caballero was the first man to beat DPDL. Lopez is already in talks with Penalosa too. Caballero is fighting the best fighters that are available to him.

Yeah I agree completely and know he'd fght those other guys in a heartbeat. I'm just saying I don't personally think wins over Molitor and De Leon equate to Tarver and Adamek imo.

Tarver has been to the very top of this sport, a Ring champ and many times world champ with wins over the best lightheavies in the world, Adamek is a two weight world champ and the current ring champ at cruiser.

Compare with De Leon who wasn't even a world champ when Cab fought him and Molitor who has fought nobody whatsoever they just don't equate to being Ring champs or former Ring champs.

I personally would have Dawson above Cab along with Paul Williams, maybe still Kelly Pavlik.

Cab just strikes me as a Christian Mijares type placement, not really done enough to justify a place in the top 10 as he's never unified a division or been number 1 in that division.

Juan Diaz before the campbell loss had done more at lightweight and wasn't on the p4p rankings that's all I'm saying.

Juan Guzman as well possibly deserves ranking higher, a bona fida two weight world champ, unbeaten with big wins over Soto and Barrios although weight shame obviously went against him. Even David Haye did a better job of unifying the cruiserweight division knocking out both the number 1 and 2 opponents, all I'm saying Cab hasn't done that, sure he hasn't had the opportunity to yet but still let's wait until we see what he does in those fights before we place him amongst the world's elite.

I can't think of any other fighter on the rankings list who got there by beating the kind of opposition Cab has, all the rest have beaten the men and been at the top of their divisions to earn their spots, Cab is number 3 in his weight class.

Still he's a tough and awkward fighter though and considering the damage both Rafa and Israel have inflicted upon each other in recent years he could be primed to take over.

[killersheep]

I think Adamek and Tarver are bigger wins than Molitor and De Leon personally, Adamek is now the Ring Champion at cruiserweight and Tarver has been the Ring Champ at light heavyweight and looked great in regaining his title over Clinton Woods in the fight prior.

I like Molitor but let's be real he was a paper champ, hadn't fought anyone remotely world class. De Leon, well I think he's been exposed a bit now.

Cabellero is definitely fighting in the strongest division, but he's not faced any of the best in that division yet, Vazquez, Marquez, Lopez are still fights that need to be made.

But I don't really object to him being there, he certainly looked great in taking Molitor apart and he'll spell trouble for anyone in that division.

Well first off Vazquez and Marquez have spent the last two years fighting only each other and rumors point to the next match being against each other as well, so it's hard to hold that against anyone else at 122. Second Lopez is just coming up in the ranks Caballero called out all three of the guys you listed. Lopez's big win was an impressed KO over DPDL, but Caballero was the first man to beat DPDL. Lopez is already in talks with Penalosa too. Caballero is fighting the best fighters that are available to him.

Yeah I agree completely and know he'd fght those other guys in a heartbeat. I'm just saying I don't personally think wins over Molitor and De Leon equate to Tarver and Adamek imo.

Tarver has been to the very top of this sport, a Ring champ and many times world champ with wins over the best lightheavies in the world, Adamek is a two weight world champ and the current ring champ at cruiser.

Compare with De Leon who wasn't even a world champ when Cab fought him and Molitor who has fought nobody whatsoever they just don't equate to being Ring champs or former Ring champs.

I personally would have Dawson above Cab along with Paul Williams, maybe still Kelly Pavlik.

Cab just strikes me as a Christian Mijares type placement, not really done enough to justify a place in the top 10 as he's never unified a division or been number 1 in that division.

Juan Diaz before the campbell loss had done more at lightweight and wasn't on the p4p rankings that's all I'm saying.

Juan Guzman as well possibly deserves ranking higher, a bona fida two weight world champ, unbeaten with big wins over Soto and Barrios although weight shame obviously went against him. Even David Haye did a better job of unifying the cruiserweight division knocking out both the number 1 and 2 opponents, all I'm saying Cab hasn't done that, sure he hasn't had the opportunity to yet but still let's wait until we see what he does in those fights before we place him amongst the world's elite.

I can't think of any other fighter on the rankings list who got there by beating the kind of opposition Cab has, all the rest have beaten the men and been at the top of their divisions to earn their spots, Cab is number 3 in his weight class.

Still he's a tough and awkward fighter though and considering the damage both Rafa and Israel have inflicted upon each other in recent years he could be primed to take over.

I personally would have Dawson ahead in my own p4p rankings, but like I said earlier, I think the outrage is blown out of proportion. I don't think having Caballero is that crazy to have there, in fact I don't have a problem with it, that is the fundamental point I've been trying to make this whole time. Dawson really isn't helping his case by rematching Tarver either, that would be like Calzaghe giving an immediate rematch to Lacy. Cab DOES have wins over the current #5 and #6 Ring rated super bantams and at the time of beating DPDL and Molitor they were both ranked higher.

[Kev]

Well first off Vazquez and Marquez have spent the last two years fighting only each other and rumors point to the next match being against each other as well, so it's hard to hold that against anyone else at 122. Second Lopez is just coming up in the ranks Caballero called out all three of the guys you listed. Lopez's big win was an impressed KO over DPDL, but Caballero was the first man to beat DPDL. Lopez is already in talks with Penalosa too. Caballero is fighting the best fighters that are available to him.

Yeah I agree completely and know he'd fght those other guys in a heartbeat. I'm just saying I don't personally think wins over Molitor and De Leon equate to Tarver and Adamek imo.

Tarver has been to the very top of this sport, a Ring champ and many times world champ with wins over the best lightheavies in the world, Adamek is a two weight world champ and the current ring champ at cruiser.

Compare with De Leon who wasn't even a world champ when Cab fought him and Molitor who has fought nobody whatsoever they just don't equate to being Ring champs or former Ring champs.

I personally would have Dawson above Cab along with Paul Williams, maybe still Kelly Pavlik.

Cab just strikes me as a Christian Mijares type placement, not really done enough to justify a place in the top 10 as he's never unified a division or been number 1 in that division.

Juan Diaz before the campbell loss had done more at lightweight and wasn't on the p4p rankings that's all I'm saying.

Juan Guzman as well possibly deserves ranking higher, a bona fida two weight world champ, unbeaten with big wins over Soto and Barrios although weight shame obviously went against him. Even David Haye did a better job of unifying the cruiserweight division knocking out both the number 1 and 2 opponents, all I'm saying Cab hasn't done that, sure he hasn't had the opportunity to yet but still let's wait until we see what he does in those fights before we place him amongst the world's elite.

I can't think of any other fighter on the rankings list who got there by beating the kind of opposition Cab has, all the rest have beaten the men and been at the top of their divisions to earn their spots, Cab is number 3 in his weight class.

Still he's a tough and awkward fighter though and considering the damage both Rafa and Israel have inflicted upon each other in recent years he could be primed to take over.

I personally would have Dawson ahead in my own p4p rankings, but like I said earlier, I think the outrage is blown out of proportion. I don't think having Caballero is that crazy to have there, in fact I don't have a problem with it, that is the fundamental point I've been trying to make this whole time. Dawson really isn't helping his case by rematching Tarver either, that would be like Calzaghe giving an immediate rematch to Lacy. Cab DOES have wins over the current #5 and #6 Ring rated super bantams and at the time of beating DPDL and Molitor they were both ranked higher.

Yeah I agree really not knocking his acomplishments. I do feel it's a bit premature as when you look at the rest of the list you are talking about either multiple weight champs or guys who have beaten the man in their division. Cab's acomplishments pale when you consider the rest on that list, he hasn't fought the top guys in his weight class yet and is no higher than 3 in his own weight class.

Pavlik lost to a genuine p4p legend last time out but he's still the man to beat and the Ring champ at middleweight and should be above Cabbelero imo who has so far just been picking up alphabet titles. And Paul Williams has proven himself with world title wins in two weight classes now. Dawson is unbeaten and beaten Ring champs not alphabet titlists.

I'd probably have Cab about 15 or so on my list.

[Kev]

I personally would have Dawson at 10.

Dawson got pasy johnson by the skin of his teeth, and beat Tarver, that's it. Man the guy looks like he has skills but has done nothing at all to be spoken about as a top 10 p4p fighter in the world right now... not even close.

What about Tomasz Adamek ? Eric Harding ?

It's not worth debating Preme the kid is a moron.

I agree with you Ice, suprised to see Caballero in the top 10. Dawson is definitely closing in, ignoring what Preme says wins over Johnson, Adamek and Tarver are all great performances, especially seeing as Tarver shutout Clinton Woods in the fight prior and Adamek has gone on to score two huge wins at cruiserweight against O'Neil Bell and Steve Cunningham.

I'd probably have Paul Williams above Cabellero too, big wins over Margartio, Quintana and Phillips.

Still it's good Cabellero is getting recognition at least, he has some impressive wins.