Is Juan Manuel Marquez Over Rated?

[Spicoli]

It just seems everybody is raving on about this guy like hes the next best thing since sliced bread. Dont get me wrong hes a good fighter but no way hes an ATG, every time hes stepped up hes lost and to be honest hasnt beat a top 10 p4p at his peak ever. It seems like the fans/mexican fans are clinging on to that last hope, after most of the mexican greats have retired or fallen. I dont know if its just me but his record isnt all that either:

Lost to F Norwood
Drew with Pac (should have lost)
Lost to C John
Beat an old Barrera
Lost to Pac
Beat an old Casamayor
Beat Diaz (not a top p4pder either)

People that have him at current p4p no1 must be crazy. Should be Pac 1, then hopkins 2 (arguble personel choice). Dam hokins at 44yrs old beat the living hell out of Pavlic which should be held in higher regard to Marques's win over Diaz. Even pacs record demolishes marques's

Destroyed Barrera (prime)
Lost UD Morales
Destroyed Morales (Prime)
Destroyed Morales
Beat Barrera
Beat Marquez 2wice
Beat Diaz (not all that)
Destroyed dela Hoya ( Massive underdog, tiny compared to Hoya)
Next Hatton (Again 6 months ago people were saying no chance)

If Pacquiao didn't exist, Marquez would be another boxer that got ignored. He is visible when he's in the ring against a brawler. This is when his fights are exciting. He is only overrated by his groupies, and commentators that don't like Pacquiao because they think he is overrated otherwise Marquez gets his just due.

And exactly what would constitute being ignored ??You mean being ranked within the top 6 by The Ring by his 17th professional fight.....and within the top ten consistantly for the last 13 + years......Or possibly that both made they're respected HBO debuts within months of one another.....Albeit Pac as a 2 week last minute substitute and fill in for...cough...Enrique Sanchez?

You guys really need to let go of it...Marquez is an equal to Pacquiao,both are supreme fighters with different respected styles and skillsets........and last I checked Manny is set to fight Ricky Hatton,Good luck with that!

[Andre]

The gist of this thread seems the the same as the other threads; all attempting to pump up Pacs fans by putting down his closest rival.

Attempted Result: People who have followed fight styles for their whole lives cant hold a candle to anyone who follows only Pac man.

Marquez is the technically the better boxer.think about what he came back from and what he did against PAC that was pure skill and pure balls and chin.

Pac is naturally the stronger person and can take more risks because of it.

So Pac wins against Marquez..

big deal you dont need to put Marquez down to make Pac bigger than he already is (even in our eyes). WE KNOW ALREADY

If you need to put Marquez down or others down who follow his great boxing style so as to make yourselves all feel bigger,then that is very sad for you at this stage in your life , (if you cant generate it for yourself I mean).

[fan johnny]

If Pacquiao didn't exist, Marquez would be another boxer that got ignored. He is visible when he's in the ring against a brawler. This is when his fights are exciting. He is only overrated by his groupies, and commentators that don't like Pacquiao because they think he is overrated otherwise Marquez gets his just due.

And exactly what would constitute being ignored ??You mean being ranked within the top 6 by The Ring by his 17th professional fight.....and within the top ten consistantly for the last 13 + years......Or possibly that both made they're respected HBO debuts within months of one another.....Albeit Pac as a 2 week last minute substitute and fill in for...cough...Enrique Sanchez?

You guys really need to let go of it...Marquez is an equal to Pacquiao,both are supreme fighters with different respected styles and skillsets........and last I checked Manny is set to fight Ricky Hatton,Good luck with that!

You are misconstruing my statements about Marquez's popularity to a that of his ability.

Do a little google search and look at the career of Marquez. It tanked, twice. By himself he doesn't have the appeal. Marquez is a great fighter and I'm one of the first to say he proved that when he beat Diaz.

I'LL BE LOUD AND CLEAR. MARQUEZ IS NOT OVERRATED BY THE BOXING COMMUNITY, HE DESERVES HIS P4P #2 RATING.

[Taeth]

I think some people on here overrate him, but overall he is a great fighter, I don't think he is as good as he once was, and I think because he matches up so well with Pacquiao that some are inclined to think he is better than he actually is, but he is on the same level or Morales and Barrera which is the highest compliment any boxer could be given, especially mexican fighters.

[JT Rock]

I think some people on here overrate him, but overall he is a great fighter, I don't think he is as good as he once was, and I think because he matches up so well with Pacquiao that some are inclined to think he is better than he actually is, but he is on the same level or Morales and Barrera which is the highest compliment any boxer could be given, especially mexican fighters.

JMM deserves every last bit of his accolades.. He isint as physically gifted as Pac or some of your so called dynamic fighters... He is technically sound with GREAT in ring intelligence and ability to adapt. He just isint some obscure fighter who happens to be Pac's achilles heal, He is a 1st ballot hall of famer.. Last time I checked those guys arent usually considered ovverated...

IMO JMM after the Diaz fight is just a step ahead Morales and MAB... Especially if MAB loses to Kahn. which will probably happen

[Gandalf]

I think some people on here overrate him, but overall he is a great fighter, I don't think he is as good as he once was, and I think because he matches up so well with Pacquiao that some are inclined to think he is better than he actually is, but he is on the same level or Morales and Barrera which is the highest compliment any boxer could be given, especially mexican fighters.

JMM deserves every last bit of his accolades.. He isint as physically gifted as Pac or some of your so called dynamic fighters... He is technically sound with GREAT in ring intelligence and ability to adapt. He just isint some obscure fighter who happens to be Pac's achilles heal, He is a 1st ballot hall of famer.. Last time I checked those guys arent usually considered ovverated...

IMO JMM after the Diaz fight is just a step ahead Morales and MAB... Especially if MAB loses to Kahn. which will probably happen

That is not going to happen.

[Taeth]

I think some people on here overrate him, but overall he is a great fighter, I don't think he is as good as he once was, and I think because he matches up so well with Pacquiao that some are inclined to think he is better than he actually is, but he is on the same level or Morales and Barrera which is the highest compliment any boxer could be given, especially mexican fighters.

JMM deserve s every last bit of his accolades.. He isint as physically gifted as Pac or some of your so called dynamic fighters... He is technically sound with GREAT in ring intelligence and ability to adapt. He just isint some obscure fighter who happens to be Pac's achilles heal, He is a 1st ballot hall of famer.. Last time I checked those guys arent usually considered ovverated...

IMO JMM after the Diaz fight is just a step ahead Morales and MAB... Especially if MAB loses to Kahn. which will probably happen

Look at all the big name fighters Barrera and Morales fought earlier in their career, just because JMM is fighting the big names now doesn't negate what they did. I am not saying he is an obscure fighter, but he does have Manny's number stylistically. What I am saying is some people are treating him like a god, but he isn't, he is technically sound, but he is no Floyd Mayweather, no Bernard Hopkins. Sure he is fighting exciting fights against Joel Casamayor and Juan Diaz, but these are guys Floyd Mayweather would be beating handily, nearly every round. I am saying he is a really good fighter, but he isn't the best ever, and not the best of this generation just like MOrales, just like Barrera.

PS. Juan Manuel Marquez is tremendously gifted athlete, and though he isn't quite on Pacquiao's level, he is one of the faster fighters in boxing. He does have great ring intelligence, but he doesn't have good defensive skills which boggles my mind, he is really good at adapting, he has great determination and ring presence, but he still gets hit more than other guys who were revered with the same sort of intelligence Mayweather, Hopkins, Whitaker.

[ElTerribleMorales]

I think some people on here overrate him, but overall he is a great fighter, I don't think he is as good as he once was, and I think because he matches up so well with Pacquiao that some are inclined to think he is better than he actually is, but he is on the same level or Morales and Barrera which is the highest compliment any boxer could be given, especially mexican fighters.

JMM deserve s every last bit of his accolades.. He isint as physically gifted as Pac or some of your so called dynamic fighters... He is technically sound with GREAT in ring intelligence and ability to adapt. He just isint some obscure fighter who happens to be Pac's achilles heal, He is a 1st ballot hall of famer.. Last time I checked those guys arent usually considered ovverated...

IMO JMM after the Diaz fight is just a step ahead Morales and MAB... Especially if MAB loses to Kahn. which will probably happen

Look at all the big name fighters Barrera and Morales fought earlier in their career, just because JMM is fighting the big names now doesn't negate what they did. I am not saying he is an obscure fighter, but he does have Manny's number stylistically. What I am saying is some people are treating him like a god, but he isn't, he is technically sound, but he is no Floyd Mayweather, no Bernard Hopkins. Sure he is fighting exciting fights against Joel Casamayor and Juan Diaz, but these are guys Floyd Mayweather would be beating handily, nearly every round. I am saying he is a really good fighter, but he isn't the best ever, and not the best of this generation just like MOrales, just like Barrera.

PS. Juan Manuel Marquez is tremendously gifted athlete, and though he isn't quite on Pacquiao's level, he is one of the faster fighters in boxing. He does have great ring intelligence, but he doesn't have good defensive skills which boggles my mind, he is really good at adapting, he has great determination and ring presence, but he still gets hit more than other guys who were revered with the same sort of intelligence Mayweather, Hopkins, Whitaker.

unlike Mayweather he's 35, unlike all three mentioned above he is willing to turn things into a fight and not just play it safe, he does get hit, but his opponant pays for it as well, all i have to say is round 6 in JMM/Pac I

[Spicoli]

If Pacquiao didn't exist, Marquez would be another boxer that got ignored. He is visible when he's in the ring against a brawler. This is when his fights are exciting. He is only overrated by his groupies, and commentators that don't like Pacquiao because they think he is overrated otherwise Marquez gets his just due.

And exactly what would constitute being ignored ??You mean being ranked within the top 6 by The Ring by his 17th professional fight.....and within the top ten consistently for the last 13 + years......Or possibly that both made they're respected HBO debuts within months of one another.....Albeit Pac as a 2 week last minute substitute and fill in for...cough...Enrique Sanchez?

You guys really need to let go of it...Marquez is an equal to Pacquiao,both are supreme fighters with different respected styles and skillsets........and last I checked Manny is set to fight Ricky Hatton,Good luck with that!

You are misconstruing my statements about Marquez's popularity to a that of his ability.

Do a little goggle search and look at the career of Marquez. It tanked, twice. By himself he doesn't have the appeal. Marquez is a great fighter and I'm one of the first to say he proved that when he beat Diaz.

I'LL BE LOUD AND CLEAR. MARQUEZ IS NOT OVERRATED BY THE BOXING COMMUNITY, HE DESERVES HIS P4P #2 RATING.

Aware that all this does is bump the thread but I'm really not misconstruing 'If Pacquiao did not exist,Marquez would be another boxer that got ignored' at all.I just disagree with the inference that Pacquiao is soley responsible for Marquez being known and greatly acknowledged in the boxing world as a major player.He needs no coat tails to cling too.Both Marquez and Pacquiao are very worthy Champions.That we can agree on.

Goggle away friend.It may tell you the numbers and statistics but I'll stick to goggling the tapes and messy notebooks on the shelves in my den .Anyone believing that the "L"s next to the Norwood and John fights are clear definative cases of "tanking" in a career is off the mark.

[fan johnny]

And exactly what would constitute being ignored ??You mean being ranked within the top 6 by The Ring by his 17th professional fight.....and within the top ten consistently for the last 13 + years......Or possibly that both made they're respected HBO debuts within months of one another.....Albeit Pac as a 2 week last minute substitute and fill in for...cough...Enrique Sanchez?

You guys really need to let go of it...Marquez is an equal to Pacquiao,both are supreme fighters with different respected styles and skillsets........and last I checked Manny is set to fight Ricky Hatton,Good luck with that!

You are misconstruing my statements about Marquez's popularity to a that of his ability.

Do a little goggle search and look at the career of Marquez. It tanked, twice. By himself he doesn't have the appeal. Marquez is a great fighter and I'm one of the first to say he proved that when he beat Diaz.

I'LL BE LOUD AND CLEAR. MARQUEZ IS NOT OVERRATED BY THE BOXING COMMUNITY, HE DESERVES HIS P4P #2 RATING.

Aware that all this does is bump the thread but I'm really not misconstruing 'If Pacquiao did not exist,Marquez would be another boxer that got ignored' at all.I just disagree with the inference that Pacquiao is soley responsible for Marquez being known and greatly acknowledged in the boxing world as a major player.He needs no coat tails to cling too.Both Marquez and Pacquiao are very worthy Champions.That we can agree on.

Goggle away friend.It may tell you the numbers and statistics but I'll stick to goggling the tapes and messy notebooks on the shelves in my den .Anyone believing that the "L"s next to the Norwood and John fights are clear definative cases of "tanking" in a career is off the mark.

I agree the thread is inappropriate for this debate and Your point is well taken that Pacquiao is not solely responsible for Marquez's popularity. I did not specifically intend to imply that he is. I was attempting to continue the tone set by Andre. Marquez earned and deserves the respect and gets it for being the fighter that he is.

Your arguments however is premise Marquez's ability as a fighter for which I have no dispute. You asked for clarification on what I meant and continue to draw conclusions that its about his ability rather than his popularity. Translate popularity into prize money earned if it makes it easier for you. My comments are not reflective of Marquez's W's & L's and I suggested to look them up for yourself. Marquez had to literally fight his way back into a boxing career. His earnings are dismal compared to the mega earnings of Pacquiao during the exact same time period.

Just so no mistake, this is not a response about Marquez being overrated because he is clearly not overrated.

[Pravus]

Why is it you Pacquiao fans are so damn intimidated with Marquez being ranked right up there with your man? Is the controversy surrounding their two fights that heavy on your mind? I suppose they should be, because in many people's eyes Marquez won those fights. The fact remains: JMM is one man Pacman couldn't 'destroy' no matter how hard he tried. It is also amusing as hell how you tone down Marquez vs Barerra and Marquez vs Casa by adding 'old' to their names while trying to push Pacman's win over DLH as if DLH walked into the ring in his prime. Gimme a break. Makes me doubt if you saw any of those fights. No man who ever stepped into the ring with MAB walked away thinking he fought an old man.

Personally, I love watching Pacquiao fight and think he's the shit. I also have been watching JMM fight for a decade now and have seen him prove time and time again why he's so highly ranked and consistently so. Both men are top pound for pound fighters and a fight between the two could easily go either way. Pacman tends to dominate the early rounds while Marquez dominates the mid-later rounds - a fight fan couldn't ask for a more exciting matchup. I'm just waiting on the rubbermatch....

Keep in mind: By trying to debunk Pacquiao's peers soley to put your man on a pedestal, you put your knowledge of the sport into question.

[CutMeMick]

For the record I respect Pac @ P4P#1.
However I don't respect commets like JMM is over rated.

[MIKAY]

Asrock PENRYN 1600 SLI-110DB

[killersheep]

Asrock PENRYN 1600 SLI-110DB

That is also overrated, overclocking is risky with it.

[Scott22]

i personally consider marquez an ATG