Catch Weight - Title fight?

[CFH]

The option doesn't exist at Heavyweight..

As I have explained twice already there are 43 'options' to chose from for a Hypothetical catchweight that fall within the difference between Haye's 200 and Wlad's 245.
Pick one.

Let me get your opinion into focus, You're stating that Mosley having to shed 2-3 pounds more for Pacquiao than when he fought Margarito is going to weight drain Mosley? ah.. ok then, I get it. I think it a stretch but I get it....

Please don't try and put anything into focus for me unless you've studied as much Anatomy and Physiology as I have... you may be punching a bit above your weight.

It's not at all stretch, he walks around at 160+ pounds... the lower you get the more each pound counts. After a certain point every ounce you lose is fluid/glycogen stored in the blood and muscles that the body needs to have a certain level of to function correctly.

It can take a person who hasn't been drinking enough water in their diet SIX WEEKS to become properly hydrated... these guys have 24 hours to rehydrate and they haven't just became partially dehydrated from poor water intake... they have forced it all out.

ODLH struggled so much he had to rehydrate by injecting himself with an IV line and having fluids fed into his veins. Sound fun?

I don't think you understand how hard it can be to loose the last couple of pounds if it's too low for you, it's completely unatural.

You can't just keep on saying 'It's only a few more pounds' there has to be a cut off point and Roach is making out it's only a few pounds when really he's hoping that a few more pounds.

The majority of fighters are already fighting as low as they can healthy get to in an effort to be naturally stronger than everybody else at the weight so it REALLY doesn't take much for it to be a few pounds too far.

Why do you think that from Strawweight to Featherweight only 4... sometimes even only 3 pounds divide each weight class?

Or let me put it like this: If they are going to be heavier on fight night anyway what motive does Roach have for asking him to weigh in at 144? If it wasn't going to affect Mosely then they wouldn't bother to ask.

With the right people Mosely may be able to rehydrate properly... the lower he goes the harder it is and ODLH was also meant to have the right people around him... look how that turned out.

The subject is Mosley vs Pacquiao, not Pacquiao vs ODLH. The subject is a welterweight fight with a catchweight limit. The subject is not who has more Anatomy and Physiology knowledge for that you can start another thread.

147-145=2, 147-144=3. that's a few pounds. It's called math. Is Mosley a welterweight or not? If he is a "Middleweight" you have a valid argument and Mosley shouldn't be fighting at welter should he.

The catch weight will most likely be made at 144/145. Welter is 140 to 147. You wrote this how many times? You don't want to focus the subject because you want to mislead the point, just own up to it you want an excuse if Pacquiao beats Mosley!

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. A few pounds can make a huge difference, especially in a fighter like Mosley who is both very old in boxing terms relative to his competition and who has been competiting at 147 or above since 1999.

[fan johnny]

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. A few pounds can make a huge difference, especially in a fighter like Mosley who is both very old in boxing terms relative to his competition and who has been competiting at 147 or above since 1999.

I know exactly what I'm talking about, perhaps you are just having problems reading.

From your statement, I see that you also think Mosley shouldn't be fighting at Welterweight either.

You can be of the opinion that Mosley can't make the catchweigh and not weight drained. but I think it's a stretch. Mosley met Cotto at 146.25, Mosley will be fine at 144/145 catchweigh.

[CFH]

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. A few pounds can make a huge difference, especially in a fighter like Mosley who is both very old in boxing terms relative to his competition and who has been competiting at 147 or above since 1999.

I know exactly what I'm talking about, perhaps you are just having problems reading.

From your statement, I see that you also think Mosley shouldn't be fighting at Welterweight either.

You can be of the opinion that Mosley can't make the catchweigh and not weight drained. but I think it's a stretch. Mosley met Cotto at 146.25, Mosley will be fine at 144/145 catchweigh.

Where did I say that? Mosley has proven that he is fine at 147.

To address your other points, Adam already explained how even a few pounds can make a big difference for a fighter. If you can't understand (or admit) that then there is no reason to continue this discussion with you.

[fan johnny]

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. A few pounds can make a huge difference, especially in a fighter like Mosley who is both very old in boxing terms relative to his competition and who has been competiting at 147 or above since 1999.

I know exactly what I'm talking about, perhaps you are just having problems reading.

From your statement, I see that you also think Mosley shouldn't be fighting at Welterweight either.

You can be of the opinion that Mosley can't make the catchweigh and not weight drained. but I think it's a stretch. Mosley met Cotto at 146.25, Mosley will be fine at 144/145 catchweigh.

Where did I say that? Mosley has proven that he is fine at 147.

To address your other points, Adam already explained how even a few pounds can make a big difference for a fighter. If you can't understand (or admit) that then there is no reason to continue this discussion with you.

I'm sorry, you didn't, but your supporting the same argument that Mosley can't make shed the few pounds without being weight drained. If that is true, then Mosley shouldn't be fighting at Welterweight. Is that not what part of what weightclasses are about? "To keep fighters from having an unfair weight advantage".

Now, I fully understand that it's a valid point for fighters below their weightclass but Mosley is fighting within his weightclass. To say that he'd be weight drained is just a premise for losing in advance.

If Mosley loses, he loses to a better fighter, not because he couldn't plan a proper weight program. Or do you think he's invested in the "De La Hoya fighter's netrution plan". If so it makes Mosley an idiot as well as a loser. Mosley doesn't strike me as an idiot.

[CFH]

I know exactly what I'm talking about, perhaps you are just having problems reading.

From your statement, I see that you also think Mosley shouldn't be fighting at Welterweight either.

You can be of the opinion that Mosley can't make the catchweigh and not weight drained. but I think it's a stretch. Mosley met Cotto at 146.25, Mosley will be fine at 144/145 catchweigh.

Where did I say that? Mosley has proven that he is fine at 147.

To address your other points, Adam already explained how even a few pounds can make a big difference for a fighter. If you can't understand (or admit) that then there is no reason to continue this discussion with you.

I'm sorry, you didn't, but your supporting the same argument that Mosley can't make shed the few pounds without being weight drained. If that is true, then Mosley shouldn't be fighting at Welterweight. Is that not what part of what weightclasses are about? "To keep fighters from having an unfair weight advantage".

Now, I fully understand that it's a valid point for fighters below their weightclass but Mosley is fighting within his weightclass. To say that he'd be weight drained is just a premise for losing in advance.

If Mosley loses, he loses to a better fighter, not because he couldn't plan a proper weight program. Or do you think he's invested in the "De La Hoya fighter's netrution plan". If so it makes Mosley an idiot as well as a loser. Mosley doesn't strike me as an idiot.

Mosley can compete between 147 - 300 lbs if he wants, it's dropping below 147 which is going to make him weight drained. Just because he fights at both 154 and 147 safely does not mean he can fight below 147. That's a logical falicy. It's got nothing to do with a proper nutrition plan or anything like that, I'm sure De La Hoya had one of the worlds finest nutritionists set up his plan, there is no nutrition plan that can get a fighter to a weight to which he is physically unsuited and have him perform at his best. It's impossible, especially at Mosley's age and considering that he has not fought below 147 in 10 years.

As for you last point, fighters almost always decide on the most profitable fights rather than the most intelligent (relative to their prospects of winning) ones. Is it smart for Mosley to fight Pac at 142/144 regarding his chances for victory? No, it's not, but I'm sure it makes a lot of sense financially. However, as a boxing fan I'm not all that interested in Mosley's finances, I want to see the best fighters fight eachother in the most competitive and fair environments. If Pac doesn't think he can compete at 147 then that's fair enough, stay at 140 and fight Marquez or Mayweather, I have no problem with that. But making welter's fight at weights in which they are not suited in unfair to those fighters and the only reason they would do it is because of the gold-plated carrot dangling in front of their noses.

If Pacquiao beats Mosley at 147, which I think he potentially could, I will give him all the credit in the world. If he beats Mosley below 147 it's a tainted victory in my opinion because he would not be facing the best Shane Mosley.

[fan johnny]

Mosley can compete between 147 - 300 lbs if he wants, it's dropping below 147 which is going to make him weight drained. Just because he fights at both 154 and 147 safely does not mean he can fight below 147. That's a logical falicy. It's got nothing to do with a proper nutrition plan or anything like that, I'm sure De La Hoya had one of the worlds finest nutritionists set up his plan, there is no nutrition plan that can get a fighter to a weight to which he is physically unsuited and have him perform at his best. It's impossible, especially at Mosley's age and considering that he has not fought below 147 in 10 years.

As for you last point, fighters almost always decide on the most profitable fights rather than the most intelligent (relative to their prospects of winning) ones. Is it smart for Mosley to fight Pac at 142/144 regarding his chances for victory? No, it's not, but I'm sure it makes a lot of sense financially. However, as a boxing fan I'm not all that interested in Mosley's finances, I want to see the best fighters fight eachother in the most competitive and fair environments. If Pac doesn't think he can compete at 147 then that's fair enough, stay at 140 and fight Marquez or Mayweather, I have no problem with that. But making welter's fight at weights in which they are not suited in unfair to those fighters and the only reason they would do it is because of the gold-plated carrot dangling in front of their noses.

If Pacquiao beats Mosley at 147, which I think he potentially could, I will give him all the credit in the world. If he beats Mosley below 147 it's a tainted victory in my opinion because he would not be facing the best Shane Mosley.

IMO, Mosley would be Pacquiao's toughest challenge and I'm sure if the fight happens, it has a good chance to make the distance and a very challenging and exciting fight to watch. If Mosley were to steps into the ring at 160 vs Pacquiao at 148, Mosley has an even bigger (unfair) advantage, how does that meet your criteria? Roach wouldn't be doing right by Pacquiao to let that happen. Isn't that what everyone was saying would be the case when Pac fought DLH?

I see this as a difference of opinion. I feel that if a fighter cannot fight at any weight within the weightclass, he doesn't belong there. You guys appear to be on the other side of the coin on this one. i.e. Pac doesn't belong there. Hence we have the catchweight to even out the fight.

I don't believe, a catchweight of 145 or even 144 is going to drain him as you and Adam presuppose. (even with that expert opinion) If Mosley was forced to come down to 142, I could agree it's a bit much. Why, because his performance against Margarito was stellar at 147. I didn't see an ounce of weight drain in him in that fight. He fought Cotto at 146.25 in 2007, contrary to your early statement. I believe that all Roach is doing is lowering the handy cap against Mosley because he much bigger. What you guys are stating is just supposition based on a typical fighter which is a subjective opinion and not based on Mosley specific physiology or direct experience working with him.

My best guess is the fight happens at 145, possibly 144 if Mosley can't get Roach up any more, but it ain't going to happen at 42/43, and Roach already conceded 44 even stating it was negotiable.

[HattonTheHammer]

Mosley can compete between 147 - 300 lbs if he wants, it's dropping below 147 which is going to make him weight drained. Just because he fights at both 154 and 147 safely does not mean he can fight below 147. That's a logical falicy. It's got nothing to do with a proper nutrition plan or anything like that, I'm sure De La Hoya had one of the worlds finest nutritionists set up his plan, there is no nutrition plan that can get a fighter to a weight to which he is physically unsuited and have him perform at his best. It's impossible, especially at Mosley's age and considering that he has not fought below 147 in 10 years.

As for you last point, fighters almost always decide on the most profitable fights rather than the most intelligent (relative to their prospects of winning) ones. Is it smart for Mosley to fight Pac at 142/144 regarding his chances for victory? No, it's not, but I'm sure it makes a lot of sense financially. However, as a boxing fan I'm not all that interested in Mosley's finances, I want to see the best fighters fight eachother in the most competitive and fair environments. If Pac doesn't think he can compete at 147 then that's fair enough, stay at 140 and fight Marquez or Mayweather, I have no problem with that. But making welter's fight at weights in which they are not suited in unfair to those fighters and the only reason they would do it is because of the gold-plated carrot dangling in front of their noses.

If Pacquiao beats Mosley at 147, which I think he potentially could, I will give him all the credit in the world. If he beats Mosley below 147 it's a tainted victory in my opinion because he would not be facing the best Shane Mosley.

IMO, Mosley would be Pacquiao's toughest challenge and I'm sure if the fight happens, it has a good chance to make the distance and a very challenging and exciting fight to watch. If Mosley were to steps into the ring at 160 vs Pacquiao at 148, Mosley has an even bigger (unfair) advantage, how does that meet your criteria? Roach wouldn't be doing right by Pacquiao to let that happen. Isn't that what everyone was saying would be the case when Pac fought DLH?

I see this as a difference of opinion. I feel that if a fighter cannot fight at any weight within the weightclass, he doesn't belong there. You guys appear to be on the other side of the coin on this one. i.e. Pac doesn't belong there. Hence we have the catchweight to even out the fight.

I don't believe, a catchweight of 145 or even 144 is going to drain him as you and Adam presuppose. (even with that expert opinion) If Mosley was forced to come down to 142, I could agree it's a bit much. Why, because his performance against Margarito was stellar at 147. I didn't see an ounce of weight drain in him in that fight. He fought Cotto at 146.25 in 2007, contrary to your early statement. I believe that all Roach is doing is lowering the handy cap against Mosley because he much bigger. What you guys are stating is just supposition based on a typical fighter which is a subjective opinion and not based on Mosley specific physiology or direct experience working with him.

My best guess is the fight happens at 145, possibly 144 if Mosley can't get Roach up any more, but it ain't going to happen at 42/43, and Roach already conceded 44 even stating it was negotiable.

if it was to ever happen it would be a unique challenge for pacquiao in that he would go from fighting out and out brawlers which manny is well suited to a technical craftsmen of the game with even quicker hands.

Anything below 130 and almost every fight is an out an out slugfest with endless amount of punches. The 3 fights he has had above that he has fought genuine brawlers who like to tear it up in the centre of the ring and its suited mannys counterpunching style to a tee.

Against sugar at 147 or at a catchweight he would be in with someone who will insist on letting pacquiao dictate the pace and catching him coming in and pacquiao would simply have to chase the fight.

Mosley in 9