Who comes close to being a "perfect fighter?"

[ICB]

I agree on the first 3.

However, Jones lacked the urge to finish fights when he could have at times, & I think that means he can't be.

Toney has all the natural physical abilities to be a perfect fighter but his lack of interest in conditioning & so on means he loses out for me.

Holmes is close, although I'm sceptical whether his handspeed was good enough to make him 'perfect'.

Arguello I agree on.

Im actually on about on there best night Jaz, like the James Toney that took apart Iran Barkley. Or the Roy Jones Jr that would destroy fighters, before the Nigel Benn vs Gerald McClellan incident made him cautious, like when he dismantled Thomas Tate for example. Or the Larry Holmes that took apart Earnie Shavers in there first fight, i think Larry Holmes is easily in top 10 for the fastest Heavyweights of all time.

no question Holmes is fast. no question. Top 5 nevermind top 10. I think he was a little underated but then again he'd only himself to blame for that by having so many soft defences and not fighting to unify the heavyweight title. Great boxer though and great heart. How he got up from earnie shavers right hand still amazes me, more so each time i watch it

Well to be honest i think he fought, pretty much everyone he needed to fight at that time. I know he was supposed to fight Greg Page. But he went on too lose to Trevor Berbick, Tim Witherspoon, David Bey, all Larry Holmes victims.

And i also heard that he was supposed to fight, Gerrie Coetzee. But he didn't last long enough and was beaten badly in the later rounds, by Mike Weaver. Maybe you can tell me some others, because i wasn't around in that era as im only 19 myself.

[holmcall]

19?!!!! No wonder you called me an "old man." EErrragh.

Do you know who Fighting Harrada is? He comes very close as well. Also, Galaxy.

[ICB]

19?!!!! No wonder you called me an "old man." EErrragh.

Do you know who Fighting Harrada is? He comes very close as well. Also, Galaxy.

I know who is but i haven't seen much footage of him, i've seen a few Khaosai Galaxy's fights. One of the best stalking fighters i've seen.

[The Fightfan]

I'd say who comes close to being the perfect fighter I will go on the edge and say the perfect fighters are Rocky Marciano,Ricardo Lopez,Joe Calzaghe (at the moment). Yes there are all undefeated and sure they have flaws but that's what works in this sport. Do what your good at and keep at it. If I am a power punching heavyweight am I going to simply concentrate on footwork and ring generalship? These three are the perfect fighter's. No Marciano didn't have great foot speed and didn't really look good in the ring but he got it to work with him.

Ricardo Lopez a tremendous gifted looking fighter no he didn't move up in weight to really dazzle us to see how far he could go up in weight and multiple different belts. Is that really a flaw?

Now I know people will really rip into me with Joe Calzaghe but did he not beat everyone also put in front of him and do it pretty easily I must say. Sure he didn't have Marciano's pop or Lopez's ring smarts but damn he sure as hell slapped the hell out of opponent's.

These are my perfect fighter's any flaws that you seen with these fighter's they made it work to the advantage, Hence the reason for their zero losses.

[johnmaff36]

I'd say who comes close to being the perfect fighter I will go on the edge and say the perfect fighters are Rocky Marciano,Ricardo Lopez,Joe Calzaghe (at the moment). Yes there are all undefeated and sure they have flaws but that's what works in this sport. Do what your good at and keep at it. If I am a power punching heavyweight am I going to simply concentrate on footwork and ring generalship? These three are the perfect fighter's. No Marciano didn't have great foot speed and didn't really look good in the ring but he got it to work with him.

Ricardo Lopez a tremendous gifted looking fighter no he didn't move up in weight to really dazzle us to see how far he could go up in weight and multiple different belts. Is that really a flaw?

Now I know people will really rip into me with Joe Calzaghe but did he not beat everyone also put in front of him and do it pretty easily I must say. Sure he didn't have Marciano's pop or Lopez's ring smarts but damn he sure as hell slapped the hell out of opponent's.

These are my perfect fighter's any flaws that you seen with these fighter's they made it work to the advantage, Hence the reason for their zero losses.

With respect, i can understand you vouching for marciano and lopez, but calzaghe? JC was an above average champ at best, certainly no all-time great. I saw JC slag off Roy Jones jnr as, and i quote, "finished 4 or 5 years ago" and i agreed with him. He was right, jones was finished. But to turn round 6 months later (after he signed to fight him)and try to say that Jones still had gas in the tank is nothing short of insulting peoples intelligence. Have a look at his defences and tell me how many were in the top 10 of the other, more prestigeous governing bodies. I may be wrong but i counted 6. Now im not here to slag off calzaghe as he comes across as a decent enough guy and the name of the game is to make as much money as you can and get out with your senses intact, but to claim to be an all-time great is nonsense. Some people point to his unbeaten(and well padded) record but another british guy from basildon called terry marsh was an unbeaten world champion and im sure he wouldnt claim to be a superstar. Nowadays unbeaten records dont carry the clout they once did. Can you imagine if Valeuv hadnt lost to chagrev (i think) he'd have now broken marcianos record!!! Blasphemy!

[The Fightfan]

I'd say who comes close to being the perfect fighter I will go on the edge and say the perfect fighters are Rocky Marciano,Ricardo Lopez,Joe Calzaghe (at the moment). Yes there are all undefeated and sure they have flaws but that's what works in this sport. Do what your good at and keep at it. If I am a power punching heavyweight am I going to simply concentrate on footwork and ring generalship? These three are the perfect fighter's. No Marciano didn't have great foot speed and didn't really look good in the ring but he got it to work with him.

Ricardo Lopez a tremendous gifted looking fighter no he didn't move up in weight to really dazzle us to see how far he could go up in weight and multiple different belts. Is that really a flaw?

Now I know people will really rip into me with Joe Calzaghe but did he not beat everyone also put in front of him and do it pretty easily I must say. Sure he didn't have Marciano's pop or Lopez's ring smarts but damn he sure as hell slapped the hell out of opponent's.

These are my perfect fighter's any flaws that you seen with these fighter's they made it work to the advantage, Hence the reason for their zero losses.

With respect, i can understand you vouching for marciano and lopez, but calzaghe? JC was an above average champ at best, certainly no all-time great. I saw JC slag off Roy Jones jnr as, and i quote, "finished 4 or 5 years ago" and i agreed with him. He was right, jones was finished. But to turn round 6 months later (after he signed to fight him)and try to say that Jones still had gas in the tank is nothing short of insulting peoples intelligence. Have a look at his defences and tell me how many were in the top 10 of the other, more prestigeous governing bodies. I may be wrong but i counted 6. Now im not here to slag off calzaghe as he comes across as a decent enough guy and the name of the game is to make as much money as you can and get out with your senses intact, but to claim to be an all-time great is nonsense. Some people point to his unbeaten(and well padded) record but another british guy from basildon called terry marsh was an unbeaten world champion and im sure he wouldnt claim to be a superstar. Nowadays unbeaten records dont carry the clout they once did. Can you imagine if Valeuv hadnt lost to chagrev (i think) he'd have now broken marcianos record!!! Blasphemy!

I understand but you do have to also say Calzaghe beat everyone in front of him. He did his job and a prime Kessler if I am not mistaken and a prime Jeff Lacy. These two were no slouches. You can't blame Calzaghe who he fight's or doesn't fight he was a champion for a long period of time and did exactley what he was supposed to and beat everyone in front of him. Do also remember he beat the legend B-Hop convincingly and then B-Hop being embarrassed fought Kelly Pavlik and beat him easily. Calzaghe IMO is completley underrated on these boards. I would have put him in with any of the supermiddle's of his era and have him win.

[ICB]

Donald Curry at one time looked like he had all the tools.

[johnmaff36]

I'd say who comes close to being the perfect fighter I will go on the edge and say the perfect fighters are Rocky Marciano,Ricardo Lopez,Joe Calzaghe (at the moment). Yes there are all undefeated and sure they have flaws but that's what works in this sport. Do what your good at and keep at it. If I am a power punching heavyweight am I going to simply concentrate on footwork and ring generalship? These three are the perfect fighter's. No Marciano didn't have great foot speed and didn't really look good in the ring but he got it to work with him.

Ricardo Lopez a tremendous gifted looking fighter no he didn't move up in weight to really dazzle us to see how far he could go up in weight and multiple different belts. Is that really a flaw?

Now I know people will really rip into me with Joe Calzaghe but did he not beat everyone also put in front of him and do it pretty easily I must say. Sure he didn't have Marciano's pop or Lopez's ring smarts but damn he sure as hell slapped the hell out of opponent's.

These are my perfect fighter's any flaws that you seen with these fighter's they made it work to the advantage, Hence the reason for their zero losses.

With respect, i can understand you vouching for marciano and lopez, but calzaghe? JC was an above average champ at best, certainly no all-time great. I saw JC slag off Roy Jones jnr as, and i quote, "finished 4 or 5 years ago" and i agreed with him. He was right, jones was finished. But to turn round 6 months later (after he signed to fight him)and try to say that Jones still had gas in the tank is nothing short of insulting peoples intelligence. Have a look at his defences and tell me how many were in the top 10 of the other, more prestigeous governing bodies. I may be wrong but i counted 6. Now im not here to slag off calzaghe as he comes across as a decent enough guy and the name of the game is to make as much money as you can and get out with your senses intact, but to claim to be an all-time great is nonsense. Some people point to his unbeaten(and well padded) record but another british guy from basildon called terry marsh was an unbeaten world champion and im sure he wouldnt claim to be a superstar. Nowadays unbeaten records dont carry the clout they once did. Can you imagine if Valeuv hadnt lost to chagrev (i think) he'd have now broken marcianos record!!! Blasphemy!

I understand but you do have to also say Calzaghe beat everyone in front of him. He did his job and a prime Kessler if I am not mistaken and a prime Jeff Lacy. These two were no slouches. You can't blame Calzaghe who he fight's or doesn't fight he was a champion for a long period of time and did exactley what he was supposed to and beat everyone in front of him. Do also remember he beat the legend B-Hop convincingly and then B-Hop being embarrassed fought Kelly Pavlik and beat him easily. Calzaghe IMO is completley underrated on these boards. I would have put him in with any of the supermiddle's of his era and have him win.

yeah, thats fair enough, JC did beat everynoe put in front of him. Makes it a whole lot easier though,if you can handpick who is put in front of you.

[InvincibleKamikaze]

I'd say who comes close to being the perfect fighter I will go on the edge and say the perfect fighters are Rocky Marciano,Ricardo Lopez,Joe Calzaghe (at the moment). Yes there are all undefeated and sure they have flaws but that's what works in this sport. Do what your good at and keep at it. If I am a power punching heavyweight am I going to simply concentrate on footwork and ring generalship? These three are the perfect fighter's. No Marciano didn't have great foot speed and didn't really look good in the ring but he got it to work with him.

Ricardo Lopez a tremendous gifted looking fighter no he didn't move up in weight to really dazzle us to see how far he could go up in weight and multiple different belts. Is that really a flaw?

Now I know people will really rip into me with Joe Calzaghe but did he not beat everyone also put in front of him and do it pretty easily I must say. Sure he didn't have Marciano's pop or Lopez's ring smarts but damn he sure as hell slapped the hell out of opponent's.

These are my perfect fighter's any flaws that you seen with these fighter's they made it work to the advantage, Hence the reason for their zero losses.

No offense intended but using this logic Sven Ottke also qualifies as a 'perfect fighter', and that is all sorts of wrong, as is calzaghe and marciano being listed. Lopez has no problem making an argument though

[holmcall]

Here are two very, very good fighters (and both Hall of Famers) in action a=gainst each other. Enjoy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ft1JgSqHzTM

[johnmaff36]

Here are two very, very good fighters (and both Hall of Famers) in action a=gainst each other. Enjoy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ft1JgSqHzTM

Great call with Jofre. Theres a local guy where i live who sadly passed away 2 weeks ago called john caldwell who lost his world title to Jofre in the early 60s. I watched local boys watching the big fights on the big screens in bars on a saturday night, whooping and cheering for their favourite fighters, blissfully unaware that the elderly guy sipping his pint quietly at the end of the bar, was a former world champ when it meant something and was a passport to a fantastic era in boxing. Ignorance is bliss eh?

[MGG]

Mike McCallum
Carlos Monzon


Tony Tubbs was a excellent fighter - no chin.

[CutMeMick]

As I've said Ricardo Lopez & Alexis Arguello for me.