How Can Anyone Now Rank Hopkins Lower than Roy Jones?

[CopeAli]

isn't obvious, that buster douglass provided the blueprint on how to beat tyson? and had they fought again the result would have been the same....again all you have to do is answer this: when hopkins and jones fought who won?

there's no need to speculate about anything...here's the scenario 50 years from now....

BOXING FAN #1: Man I saw some footage of this great fighter name Roy jones jr..damn he was fast, he did this crazy shiit like a chicken...

BOXING FAN #2 Who? Man This old guy named bernard hopkins was tough, he called the executioner because he executed motherfuccas in the ring

BOXING FAN #1: Damn really? I wish those two would have fought that would have been a great fight, but I think the ROy jones guy would win..

BOXING FAN #2: Ma you're crazy, Bernard was too tough and they said he'd been to jail...he would kick that dudes a**...Man I wish they would have fought...

BOXING FAN #3: They did fight...And Roy Jones won by a Unanimous DEcision with one hand....

Let me ask you something, when I asked if you knew the difference between being better and being greater, did you feel a huge gust of wind go over the top of your head

No...

I don't remember the post asking who's better or greater...but this is a comparison between to men right? and when comparing two fighters there's no need to speculate about who beat better competition, who had to lose what weight, who was old, who was green and all that when you can just simply ask when they fought who won? Roy Jones did so he's better...

and since i'm not easily offended like most, i did notice your attempt to be a smart a** with the "or don't you know the difference comment" and the "did you feel a gust of wind"

next time dont reply until i come back..the gust of wind was a bit early

but since you want to be the smart a** of the topic. Answer this...when comparing two things which do you use to distinquish the higher quality, better or greater?

Awe man, you have got to be kidding me. Exactly why do you think virtually everyone who's posted here has mentioned accomplishments? Because that's what greatness is. That's what all time rankings are. Lennox and Vitaly would likely both beat Marciano, but Marciano ranks higher. Greatness is about accomplishments. You don't remember the post asking who's better or greater? Do you think there's a person out there that isn't aware of the fact that these two already fought and Roy won? If that's the only factor why would this thread even exist? It's because we're talking about who ranks higher, and that is in regards to greatness, not just who beat who. I'm kind of surprised you have to have this explained to you.

yeah..lewis and vitaly would have likely beaten marciano...and greatness is often used in boxing when one is comparing an older fighter to a new fighter...much like you did...but there's is no need to list thier accomplishments to decide who would rank higher when they fought in the same era not to mention against each other....and as far as accomplishments...they are speculative and opinionated and i use the hard facts...understand one might think what hop did to tarver was great, one might think what roy did to ruiz was great..when you ask which is greater? that's opinionated and those types of questions never end...Sorry if I'm not the type to sit and try to convince you that my opinion is better than yours..i just prefer to use facts..and Jones is better so how can he not be greater than hopkins...certainly not based off accomplishment as a boxer...because really is that even fair? it would be a landslide for jones again without speculating...here are some jones accomplishments and how it would read in history...

1986 &1987 gold gloves champion, 88' olympic silver medalist, middleweight,supermiddleweight,light heavyweight and heavyweight champion. Voted "Fighter of the decade" in 1999. Voted "Fighter of the year" in 1994...first fighter in over a hundred years to move up from middleweight and win the heavyweight world title..

bernard hopkins----middleweight champion, light heavyweight champion, most consecutive defenses of the middleweight title...

a landslide based of accomplishments...now you can speculate about who's greater...

Kind of sad how you now have to try and reach back to the amatuer ranks to find ways to add to Roy's legacy And like has been stated numerous times, do you actually give credence to Roy beating John Ruiz? I guess you also call Oscar the middleweight champ for getting that trinket from Sturm too huh?

Of course credence should be given to the fact that Jones Jnr beat Ruiz as no matter how much people try to dress it down it was still a good achievement. To go from middleweight to heavyweight, and win at heavyweight, deserves credit. OK so John Ruiz isn't a great heavyweight but he's fully fledged and has been a champion and contender in that division. OK so he was possibly the easiest option, but it was still dangerous for Jones Jnr to move up to heavyweight and fight him, and as i remember rightly, plenty of people believed that Ruiz would walk straight through Jones Jnr despite Ruiz's obvious limitations. As i've said, with regards to recognition in boxing history i believe that Jones Jnr and Hopkins deserve equal merit despite the outcome of the fight between the pair, but i can understand why people argue that Jones Jnr beat Hopkins (therefore, making him the better fighter) but i don't go along with that. However, great fighters are sometimes given further acknowledgement by their defining fights i.e. Lewis - Tyson, Ali - Foreman/Frazier, and you can't mention Marvin Hagler without mentioning Tommy Hearns etc etc. With the exception of Ali - Foreman/Frazier, cases can be made for Hagler/Hearns, Lewis/Tyson of who has a greater standing with regards to their achievements in boxing. This is what makes boxing such a great sport, the debates boxing creates has no match but Hopkins and Jones Jnr are equal when it comes to achievements in my eyes.

[sillent killer]

isn't obvious, that buster douglass provided the blueprint on how to beat tyson? and had they fought again the result would have been the same....again all you have to do is answer this: when hopkins and jones fought who won?

there's no need to speculate about anything...here's the scenario 50 years from now....

BOXING FAN #1: Man I saw some footage of this great fighter name Roy jones jr..damn he was fast, he did this crazy shiit like a chicken...

BOXING FAN #2 Who? Man This old guy named bernard hopkins was tough, he called the executioner because he executed motherfuccas in the ring

BOXING FAN #1: Damn really? I wish those two would have fought that would have been a great fight, but I think the ROy jones guy would win..

BOXING FAN #2: Ma you're crazy, Bernard was too tough and they said he'd been to jail...he would kick that dudes a**...Man I wish they would have fought...

BOXING FAN #3: They did fight...And Roy Jones won by a Unanimous DEcision with one hand....

Let me ask you something, when I asked if you knew the difference between being better and being greater, did you feel a huge gust of wind go over the top of your head

No...

I don't remember the post asking who's better or greater...but this is a comparison between to men right? and when comparing two fighters there's no need to speculate about who beat better competition, who had to lose what weight, who was old, who was green and all that when you can just simply ask when they fought who won? Roy Jones did so he's better...

and since i'm not easily offended like most, i did notice your attempt to be a smart a** with the "or don't you know the difference comment" and the "did you feel a gust of wind"

next time dont reply until i come back..the gust of wind was a bit early

but since you want to be the smart a** of the topic. Answer this...when comparing two things which do you use to distinquish the higher quality, better or greater?

Awe man, you have got to be kidding me. Exactly why do you think virtually everyone who's posted here has mentioned accomplishments? Because that's what greatness is. That's what all time rankings are. Lennox and Vitaly would likely both beat Marciano, but Marciano ranks higher. Greatness is about accomplishments. You don't remember the post asking who's better or greater? Do you think there's a person out there that isn't aware of the fact that these two already fought and Roy won? If that's the only factor why would this thread even exist? It's because we're talking about who ranks higher, and that is in regards to greatness, not just who beat who. I'm kind of surprised you have to have this explained to you.

yeah..lewis and vitaly would have likely beaten marciano...and greatness is often used in boxing when one is comparing an older fighter to a new fighter...much like you did...but there's is no need to list thier accomplishments to decide who would rank higher when they fought in the same era not to mention against each other....and as far as accomplishments...they are speculative and opinionated and i use the hard facts...understand one might think what hop did to tarver was great, one might think what roy did to ruiz was great..when you ask which is greater? that's opinionated and those types of questions never end...Sorry if I'm not the type to sit and try to convince you that my opinion is better than yours..i just prefer to use facts..and Jones is better so how can he not be greater than hopkins...certainly not based off accomplishment as a boxer...because really is that even fair? it would be a landslide for jones again without speculating...here are some jones accomplishments and how it would read in history...

1986 &1987 gold gloves champion, 88' olympic silver medalist, middleweight,supermiddleweight,light heavyweight and heavyweight champion. Voted "Fighter of the decade" in 1999. Voted "Fighter of the year" in 1994...first fighter in over a hundred years to move up from middleweight and win the heavyweight world title..

bernard hopkins----middleweight champion, light heavyweight champion, most consecutive defenses of the middleweight title...

a landslide based of accomplishments...now you can speculate about who's greater...

Kind of sad how you now have to try and reach back to the amatuer ranks to find ways to add to Roy's legacy And like has been stated numerous times, do you actually give credence to Roy beating John Ruiz? I guess you also call Oscar the middleweight champ for getting that trinket from Sturm too huh?

Of course credence should be given to the fact that Jones Jnr beat Ruiz as no matter how much people try to dress it down it was still a good achievement. To go from middleweight to heavyweight, and win at heavyweight, deserves credit. OK so John Ruiz isn't a great heavyweight but he's fully fledged and has been a champion and contender in that division. OK so he was possibly the easiest option, but it was still dangerous for Jones Jnr to move up to heavyweight and fight him, and as i remember rightly, plenty of people believed that Ruiz would walk straight through Jones Jnr despite Ruiz's obvious limitations. As i've said, with regards to recognition in boxing history i believe that Jones Jnr and Hopkins deserve equal merit despite the outcome of the fight between the pair, but i can understand why people argue that Jones Jnr beat Hopkins (therefore, making him the better fighter) but i don't go along with that. However, great fighters are sometimes given further acknowledgement by their defining fights i.e. Lewis - Tyson, Ali - Foreman/Frazier, and you can't mention Marvin Hagler without mentioning Tommy Hearns etc etc. With the exception of Ali - Foreman/Frazier, cases can be made for Hagler/Hearns, Lewis/Tyson of who has a greater standing with regards to their achievements in boxing. This is what makes boxing such a great sport, the debates boxing creates has no match but Hopkins and Jones Jnr are equal when it comes to achievements in my eyes.

great post my friend

[Preme]

I don't think hopkins can ever be P4P better than RJJ.

First off RJJ beat him, with ease i might add.

Second, hopkins on moe than one occasion priced him self out of fights, fights that would have been alot tougher on him than the people he ended up beating up within a few rounds.

Hopkins stayed in the middle weight for this long 'coz he knew there was no very little risk of him lossing at that weight. RJJ, moved up fought all he could, there were people at SMW, LH who hopkins cuda fought, maybe even shuda fought; he talked about fighting um, but never did.

Lastley i think hopkins has one big flaw he managed to keep hidden after RJJ fight. A fighter of the same size, with a good chin who will come froward at him will cause him alot of problems, RJJ done it and wuda done it again if they fought, i believe calzaghe wuda shown that flaw too...

Don't get me wrong i think hop i a superb fighter, thought tarer was gunna win but u damn sure wanted hopkins to win. i think RJJ was a much better fighter, all around.

[CopeAli]

I don't think hopkins can ever be P4P better than RJJ.

First off RJJ beat him, with ease i might add.

Second, hopkins on moe than one occasion priced him self out of fights, fights that would have been alot tougher on him than the people he ended up beating up within a few rounds.

Hopkins stayed in the middle weight for this long 'coz he knew there was no very little risk of him lossing at that weight. RJJ, moved up fought all he could, there were people at SMW, LH who hopkins cuda fought, maybe even shuda fought; he talked about fighting um, but never did.

Lastley i think hopkins has one big flaw he managed to keep hidden after RJJ fight. A fighter of the same size, with a good chin who will come froward at him will cause him alot of problems, RJJ done it and wuda done it again if they fought, i believe calzaghe wuda shown that flaw too...

Don't get me wrong i think hop i a superb fighter, thought tarer was gunna win but u damn sure wanted hopkins to win. i think RJJ was a much better fighter, all around.

First of all, thanks to silent killer. With regards to the above post, Jones Jnr was just as guilty as Hopkins for avoiding certain fights and plenty of great fighters are, that's boxing. But when it comes to both their collective achievements, again, i think they deserve equal praise at this moment in time, unless either of the fighters go on to achieve greater things, Hopkins being the most likely unless age finally catches up with him.