B Hop is Overrated

[Hunter]

Yeah I said it....Seems everyone of late thinks B Hop is some boxing god but I am going to lay out a few points on why I dont think he is as good as everyone seems to think:

Claims to fame:

20 title defense - This is quite an accomplishment but who did he really beat? Glen Johnson, Joppy, Eastman, Allen? Not the cream of the crop...Trinidad was his best win but he is a blown up welter/jr welter at best....(please dont bring up de la hoya)

Tarver Victory - Yeah B Hop moved up to Lt Hvy to beat Tarver who beat Jones on his way down....I believe Tarver was overrated because of his victories over a faded Jones.....Dawson whopped tarver just as easy as B Hop and I dont think Dawson is going to be an all time great....

Pavlik - Pavlik's claim to fame is his victory over Taylor. I believe Pavlik was overrated at the time....Taylor punched himself out in the first fight and has been plagued by stamina issues of late. Pavlik moved up in weight and has had issues since....

Hopkins Strikes:

Loss to Jones. - Prime for prime Jones would beat Hopkins any day at middleweight....so even in his prime he wasnt the best middleweight....

Losses to Taylor - Whether you thought he won or lost he went life or death with Taylor at middleweight.....toward the end of his career he wasnt the best middleweight....

Loss to Joe Cal - Hopkins lost this fight and had to resort to trickery and cheating to even stay in the fight...wasnt the best Lt heavyweight either.......

For me Hopkins has been a whiner, dull fighter, dirty fighter and I am surprised at all of the people that have come out of the woodwork to proclaim how he is one of the greatest.....

[generalbulldog]

Yeah I said it....Seems everyone of late thinks B Hop is some boxing god but I am going to lay out a few points on why I dont think he is as good as everyone seems to think:

Claims to fame:

20 title defense - This is quite an accomplishment but who did he really beat? Glen Johnson, Joppy, Eastman, Allen? Not the cream of the crop...Trinidad was his best win but he is a blown up welter/jr welter at best....(please dont bring up de la hoya)

Tarver Victory - Yeah B Hop moved up to Lt Hvy to beat Tarver who beat Jones on his way down....I believe Tarver was overrated because of his victories over a faded Jones.....Dawson whopped tarver just as easy as B Hop and I dont think Dawson is going to be an all time great....

Pavlik - Pavlik's claim to fame is his victory over Taylor. I believe Pavlik was overrated at the time....Taylor punched himself out in the first fight and has been plagued by stamina issues of late. Pavlik moved up in weight and has had issues since....

Hopkins Strikes:

Loss to Jones. - Prime for prime Jones would beat Hopkins any day at middleweight....so even in his prime he wasnt the best middleweight....

Losses to Taylor - Whether you thought he won or lost he went life or death with Taylor at middleweight.....toward the end of his career he wasnt the best middleweight....

Loss to Joe Cal - Hopkins lost this fight and had to resort to trickery and cheating to even stay in the fight...wasnt the best Lt heavyweight either.......

For me Hopkins has been a whiner, dull fighter, dirty fighter and I am surprised at all of the people that have come out of the woodwork to proclaim how he is one of the greatest.....

[Hunter]

Yeah I said it....Seems everyone of late thinks B Hop is some boxing god but I am going to lay out a few points on why I dont think he is as good as everyone seems to think:

Claims to fame:

20 title defense - This is quite an accomplishment but who did he really beat? Glen Johnson, Joppy, Eastman, Allen? Not the cream of the crop...Trinidad was his best win but he is a blown up welter/jr welter at best....(please dont bring up de la hoya)

Tarver Victory - Yeah B Hop moved up to Lt Hvy to beat Tarver who beat Jones on his way down....I believe Tarver was overrated because of his victories over a faded Jones.....Dawson whopped tarver just as easy as B Hop and I dont think Dawson is going to be an all time great....

Pavlik - Pavlik's claim to fame is his victory over Taylor. I believe Pavlik was overrated at the time....Taylor punched himself out in the first fight and has been plagued by stamina issues of late. Pavlik moved up in weight and has had issues since....

Hopkins Strikes:

Loss to Jones. - Prime for prime Jones would beat Hopkins any day at middleweight....so even in his prime he wasnt the best middleweight....

Losses to Taylor - Whether you thought he won or lost he went life or death with Taylor at middleweight.....toward the end of his career he wasnt the best middleweight....

Loss to Joe Cal - Hopkins lost this fight and had to resort to trickery and cheating to even stay in the fight...wasnt the best Lt heavyweight either.......

For me Hopkins has been a whiner, dull fighter, dirty fighter and I am surprised at all of the people that have come out of the woodwork to proclaim how he is one of the greatest.....

Good points......thanks for sharing....

[Truth]

Why BHOP isn't overrated:
20 Straight Defenses : Opposition wasn't that Bad he was just that good. PS Nobody said that about Trinidad as he was steamrolling through the middleweight division, DLH was a great win Bernard used his size and eventually wore down the smaller man
Win Over Tarver : Comes Up at 40 years old and does something the great Sugar Ray Robinson was UNABLE to accomplish
Pavlik : at 44 beats a young UNDEFEATED champion known for his KO Power

Jones: I disagree when you say it was prime vs prime I think for the 2 in this particular case it would be a 25 or so Jones against a 34 or so Hopkins
Taylor : Jermain had Bernard's # or so the judges thought, close entertaing fights But Jermain was able to sort of solve Bernard which is almost impossible to do. Jermain is to Bernard sort of how Vernon was to Shane.
Calzaghe: At 43 lose a controversial decision an UNDEFEATED 36 year old who has ruled his division for a decade and had annihlated the highly regarded Mikkell Kessler and one time highly regarded Jeff Lacy.

As for being dirty and whining sure he can be annoying and his antics at times are crazy (PR Flag, I'll never lose to a white boy). You can't underestimate his greatness.

[kingfrnk]

this wont end well.

and Bhop is in no way overrated.

[Gandalf]

I agree completely. He is well overrated.

His only really meaningful fight against a fighter in his own weight class in recent times was Calzaghe and Hopkins lost that quite convincingly. All of his fights since Taylor have been smoke and mirrors....except for Tarver. But even then Tarver has been pretty rubbish since then so you can argue that Tarver was over the hill and overrated anway.

Hopkins barely squeezed by Taylor giving up half the fight in both of those showings. And prior to that his record had a lot of filler and money fights with smaller men moving up.

[HattonTheHammer]

lol this is almost laughable

If you wanna claim hopkins is overrated you may as well play the same card with the likes of jones, mosley etc

The guy hasnt been put down in 20+ years of boxing, has completely dominated a division over a 5-6 year period. Every single one of his losses have been due to close decisions that could of gone either way...

Jones 115-113 Hopkins
Taylor 115-113 Hopkins
Taylor 115-113 Hopkins
Calzaghe 115-112 Hopkins

If you wanna hate the man by all accounts hate away as many do. But to actually make such a ridiculous statement about an all time greats legacy isnt gonna gain you much noterity amongst the hardcore posters on this site

[Dadi Astthorsson]

I'm sure B-Hop is now sitting somewhere hanging his head and crying in his non-alcoholic beverage after these scathing statements.

Echols and Allen, for example, were tough SOBs. Just watch the fights. A guy's record doesn't mean anything. The guy isn't going to hit you with softer punches or be less difficult to hit if he doesn't have a protective management/promotional team and if he has to work a full-time job in addition to his boxing career. Hopkins is the guy that had to actually BE IN THE RING with these guys.

There are two types of people in this world: Those that talk the most and do the least, and those who talk the least and do the most. Keyboard warriors underrating a professional like Hopkins make me sick. The guy's 44 years old, on the top of his game, fought anybody he could get in the ring with him, is the best pure technician in the game and outperforms any old boxer in history. He may not be the best fighter of all time, but he is in no way overrated. Ask anyone who's actually in the game what they think of Bernard Hopkins. Nothing but respect.

The very fact that you say he fought Roy Jones Jr prime to prime tells me you have an axe to grind. If you've actually seen Hopkins fight throughout the years and know what his development was like, you'll know that's BS.

[Majesty]

Yeah I said it....Seems everyone of late thinks B Hop is some boxing god but I am going to lay out a few points on why I dont think he is as good as everyone seems to think:

Claims to fame:

20 title defense - This is quite an accomplishment but who did he really beat? Glen Johnson, Joppy, Eastman, Allen? Not the cream of the crop...Trinidad was his best win but he is a blown up welter/jr welter at best....(please dont bring up de la hoya)

Tarver Victory - Yeah B Hop moved up to Lt Hvy to beat Tarver who beat Jones on his way down....I believe Tarver was overrated because of his victories over a faded Jones.....Dawson whopped tarver just as easy as B Hop and I dont think Dawson is going to be an all time great....

Pavlik - Pavlik's claim to fame is his victory over Taylor. I believe Pavlik was overrated at the time....Taylor punched himself out in the first fight and has been plagued by stamina issues of late. Pavlik moved up in weight and has had issues since....

Hopkins Strikes:

Loss to Jones. - Prime for prime Jones would beat Hopkins any day at middleweight....so even in his prime he wasnt the best middleweight....

Losses to Taylor - Whether you thought he won or lost he went life or death with Taylor at middleweight.....toward the end of his career he wasnt the best middleweight....

Loss to Joe Cal - Hopkins lost this fight and had to resort to trickery and cheating to even stay in the fight...wasnt the best Lt heavyweight either.......

For me Hopkins has been a whiner, dull fighter, dirty fighter and I am surprised at all of the people that have come out of the woodwork to proclaim how he is one of the greatest.....

There's a million things one could say to completely tear apart this post.

But its mostly already been said, this in particular

Why BHOP isn't overrated:
20 Straight Defenses : Opposition wasn't that Bad he was just that good. PS Nobody said that about Trinidad as he was steamrolling through the middleweight division, DLH was a great win Bernard used his size and eventually wore down the smaller man
Win Over Tarver : Comes Up at 40 years old and does something the great Sugar Ray Robinson was UNABLE to accomplish
Pavlik : at 44 beats a young UNDEFEATED champion known for his KO Power

Jones: I disagree when you say it was prime vs prime I think for the 2 in this particular case it would be a 25 or so Jones against a 34 or so Hopkins
Taylor : Jermain had Bernard's # or so the judges thought, close entertaing fights But Jermain was able to sort of solve Bernard which is almost impossible to do. Jermain is to Bernard sort of how Vernon was to Shane.
Calzaghe: At 43 lose a controversial decision an UNDEFEATED 36 year old who has ruled his division for a decade and had annihlated the highly regarded Mikkell Kessler and one time highly regarded Jeff Lacy.

As for being dirty and whining sure he can be annoying and his antics at times are crazy (PR Flag, I'll never lose to a white boy). You can't underestimate his greatness.

But I'll leave it to Willy Wonka to make points and keep things simple.

YouTube - Good Day Sir!

[Tysonbruno]

Are my eyes playing tricks on me or did the title say OVERRATED??


This guy is W49 L5 D1 Never been stopped

He lost his first world title bid on points to Roy Jones this is when every fighter Roy faced was getting sparked yet bernard made an argument of it and lost on points.

He then fought for his second chance at the IBF middleweight crown against Sergundo Mecado he was dropped twice once in the 5th and in the 7th yet fought hard enough to get the draw. In the rematch Bernard won to become IBF middleweight champion Mecado was no mug

John David jackson

Glenn Johnson We all know what Glenn has gone on to achieve Bernard is the only man to stop him.

Simon brown
Antwun Echols
Robert Allen
Syd Vanderpool
Carl Daniels
William Joppy
Howard Eastman

None of these guys were mugs and some were former world champs


He unified the middleweight division by beating

Keith Holmes WBC

Felix Trinidad WBA

Oscar De La Hoya WBO


He became the Light-heavyweight Kingpin by beating Antonio Tarver he also beat Winky Wright

He lost a close SD12 to Joe Calzaghe many think Bernard did enough to win me included

He then went on to totally outbox the next unbeaten big thing who was KTFO everything in his path Kelly Pavlik

Lets not forget alot of his big wins have come in his 40's he's now 44 soon to be 45

So OVERRATED i think not my friend

[HattonTheHammer]

Are my eyes playing tricks on me or did the title say OVERRATED??


This guy is W49 L5 D1 Never been stopped

He lost his first world title bid on points to Roy Jones this is when every fighter Roy faced was getting sparked yet bernard made an argument of it and lost on points.

He then fought for his second chance at the IBF middleweight crown against Sergundo Mecado he was dropped twice once in the 5th and in the 7th yet fought hard enough to get the draw. In the rematch Bernard won to become IBF middleweight champion Mecado was no mug

John David jackson

Glenn Johnson We all know what Glenn has gone on to achieve Bernard is the only man to stop him.

Simon brown
Antwun Echols
Robert Allen
Syd Vanderpool
Carl Daniels
William Joppy
Howard Eastman

None of these guys were mugs and some were former world champs


He unified the middleweight division by beating

Keith Holmes WBC

Felix Trinidad WBA

Oscar De La Hoya WBO


He became the Light-heavyweight Kingpin by beating Antonio Tarver he also beat Winky Wright

He lost a close SD12 to Joe Calzaghe many think Bernard did enough to win me included

He then went on to totally outbox the next unbeaten big thing who was KTFO everything in his path Kelly Pavlik

Lets not forget alot of his big wins have come in his 40's he's now 44 soon to be 45

So OVERRATED i think not my friend

you have to laugh about threads like this otherwise you just end up getting angry

2 words that will never go together are "hopkins" and "overrated" and if you do happen to use them in the same sentance you dont know a hell of a lot about this sport!!

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

I agree completely. He is well overrated.

His only really meaningful fight against a fighter in his own weight class in recent times was Calzaghe and Hopkins lost that quite convincingly. All of his fights since Taylor have been smoke and mirrors....except for Tarver. But even then Tarver has been pretty rubbish since then so you can argue that Tarver was over the hill and overrated anway.

Hopkins barely squeezed by Taylor giving up half the fight in both of those showings. And prior to that his record had a lot of filler and money fights with smaller men moving up.

These are very valid points.

I appreciate Hopkins ability greatly. I've come to basically love his style of fighting. The old young him, the new old him... All top draw boxing.

But yes unfortunately, as with his style of fighting... Perception is a key word.

I wont pick too many holes though, Bernard is a marque fighter when referring to Boxing's elite BUT i do think the time has come as of late where Bernard is no longer good for the sport of boxing.

[blegit]

When I read this title I thought I had come from the bar and drank too much. But then I remembered...I don't drink! WTF! Bernard Hopkins overrated?! Really Well, we know who on this forum doesn't watch boxing. Outside of the RJJ fight name one fight in Bernard's career where he was beat without controversy? YOU CAN'T!!! I am no BHop fan at all! But I know what the truth is and I know Bernard is definitely not overrated. That is just stupid. Who is the only man to beat Kelly Pavlik and with ease at that? Who is the only man to KO Felix Trinidad? Who is the only man to KO, not TKO, Oscar De la Hoya? Who is the only man to KO Glen Johnson? Who is the only man in boxing history to go defend his middleweight title 20 times successfully? Who gave Joe Calzaghe his closest and only controversial fight at 44 years old? Anybody who thinks Calzaghe won that fight convincingly is drunk off hatred. He may have won but that fight was razor thin either way. What is overrated about Bernard Hopkins Anybody can break down any fighter with bullcrap hating stats and in attempts to lessen his status. But how do you take away the accomplishments? I challenge anyone who thinks BHop is overrated to name a fighter who they think is better at middleweight and I will show how that fighter is overrated. That game is too easy to do when you don't have to show their accomplishments and belittle "all" of them with facts. Tarver was the undisputed light heavweight champ, Winky was the most avoided fighter in the game, Pavlik was the undefeated KO steamrolling middleweight champ, and BHop was over 40 years old beating all these guys. Name one guy who you think is better than BHop and its an easy picking to belittle their status just as well. RJJ, PBF, Pac, they all can be belittle but the argument will sound just as stupid as...Bernard Hopkins is overrated.

[DaxxKahn]

................

Is there a punchline to this thread?

[Kel]

His best wins were againsed smaller guys I've always said that, called him boring too. The Calzaghe fight play acting was just pathetic though, really it was embarrassing to watch a world class fighter try cheat like that.

The Pavlik fight was great though he put on a master class and I enjoyed the fight from start to finish, I wish he was that eager to fight in every fight.