Tell me that THIS is not the MOST TALENTED fighter that has ever lived

[HattonTheHammer]

Just cant have him up there with the true 21st century greats (lewis, pacquiao, mayweather) because of the fact he got found out a few too many times in the prime of his career.

On his day he truly is up there as one of the most talented boxers to have ever fought. The schooling he gave toney that night will always live long in my memory.

But getting knocked out by tarve and johnson just diminished the accomplishments of the man. He was in his mid 30s and was hardly looking like a shot fighter when those KO`s came.

Seeing him take the battering calzaghe gave him was a very sad sight for everyone who has had the joy of bringing roy jones jr into their lives!!

[amat]

It's like you never cease to amaze me, it's a cliche but I mean it quite literally right now.

He WAS NOT in his prime for losses against Tarver and Johnson. And Johnson is a guy who feasts on guys who are out of their prime because of that constant workrate. Please Hammer, go educate yourself on a PRIME Roy then go watch the fight versus Johnson and Tarver III and try to convince everyone here that was the same Jones. Christ man get a clue!

Talented, ehh what's the definition of talent here? He was an awesome fighter and P4P one of the best all time imo. He's not the greatest achievements but he's one of the best fighters of all time imo simply because most could not complete with his athleticism. No arguing it, one of the most talented fighters of all time. By all accounts, Robinson was pretty fucken special in his prime but we just have no video account of it. What we do have is very limited but does allow us to see glimpses of what these guys were really like.

I have no interest in discussing a Jones-Mayweather/anyone else P4P matchup, come on guys don't be ridiculous. It's a foolish argument/topic.

[HattonTheHammer]

It's like you never cease to amaze me, it's a cliche but I mean it quite literally right now.

He WAS NOT in his prime for losses against Tarver and Johnson. And Johnson is a guy who feasts on guys who are out of their prime because of that constant workrate. Please Hammer, go educate yourself on a PRIME Roy then go watch the fight versus Johnson and Tarver III and try to convince everyone here that was the same Jones. Christ man get a clue!

Talented, ehh what's the definition of talent here? He was an awesome fighter and P4P one of the best all time imo. He's not the greatest achievements but he's one of the best fighters of all time imo simply because most could not complete with his athleticism. No arguing it, one of the most talented fighters of all time. By all accounts, Robinson was pretty fucken special in his prime but we just have no video account of it. What we do have is very limited but does allow us to see glimpses of what these guys were really like.

I have no interest in discussing a Jones-Mayweather/anyone else P4P matchup, come on guys don't be ridiculous. It's a foolish argument/topic.

what was hopkins and calzaghe doing around about the time RJJ was either getting KO`d or just refusing to fight (tarver III)

No he wasnt at his very best when he fought those guys, far from it infact. But why the hell does everyone play the same card everytime a great fighter gets beat that he was "past his prime"

Hopkins didnt lose to taylor because he was "past his prime" calzaghe didnt almost get beat by robin reid because he was "past his prime" and RJJ was not and still amazingly is not a shot fighter just because he got beat up a couple of times.

[amat]

It's like you never cease to amaze me, it's a cliche but I mean it quite literally right now.

He WAS NOT in his prime for losses against Tarver and Johnson. And Johnson is a guy who feasts on guys who are out of their prime because of that constant workrate. Please Hammer, go educate yourself on a PRIME Roy then go watch the fight versus Johnson and Tarver III and try to convince everyone here that was the same Jones. Christ man get a clue!

Talented, ehh what's the definition of talent here? He was an awesome fighter and P4P one of the best all time imo. He's not the greatest achievements but he's one of the best fighters of all time imo simply because most could not complete with his athleticism. No arguing it, one of the most talented fighters of all time. By all accounts, Robinson was pretty fucken special in his prime but we just have no video account of it. What we do have is very limited but does allow us to see glimpses of what these guys were really like.

I have no interest in discussing a Jones-Mayweather/anyone else P4P matchup, come on guys don't be ridiculous. It's a foolish argument/topic.

what was hopkins and calzaghe doing around about the time RJJ was either getting KO`d or just refusing to fight (tarver III)

No he wasnt at his very best when he fought those guys, far from it infact. But why the hell does everyone play the same card everytime a great fighter gets beat that he was "past his prime"

Hopkins didnt lose to taylor because he was "past his prime" calzaghe didnt almost get beat by robin reid because he was "past his prime" and RJJ was not and still amazingly is not a shot fighter just because he got beat up a couple of times.

Hopkins is different. Hopkins didn't rely as much on his physical advantages like Jones did. Reactions were everything for Jones and once those slipped it made his fall much more dramatic then others. This is best exemplified in the Johnson fight.

[HattonTheHammer]

It's like you never cease to amaze me, it's a cliche but I mean it quite literally right now.

He WAS NOT in his prime for losses against Tarver and Johnson. And Johnson is a guy who feasts on guys who are out of their prime because of that constant workrate. Please Hammer, go educate yourself on a PRIME Roy then go watch the fight versus Johnson and Tarver III and try to convince everyone here that was the same Jones. Christ man get a clue!

Talented, ehh what's the definition of talent here? He was an awesome fighter and P4P one of the best all time imo. He's not the greatest achievements but he's one of the best fighters of all time imo simply because most could not complete with his athleticism. No arguing it, one of the most talented fighters of all time. By all accounts, Robinson was pretty fucken special in his prime but we just have no video account of it. What we do have is very limited but does allow us to see glimpses of what these guys were really like.

I have no interest in discussing a Jones-Mayweather/anyone else P4P matchup, come on guys don't be ridiculous. It's a foolish argument/topic.

what was hopkins and calzaghe doing around about the time RJJ was either getting KO`d or just refusing to fight (tarver III)

No he wasnt at his very best when he fought those guys, far from it infact. But why the hell does everyone play the same card everytime a great fighter gets beat that he was "past his prime"

Hopkins didnt lose to taylor because he was "past his prime" calzaghe didnt almost get beat by robin reid because he was "past his prime" and RJJ was not and still amazingly is not a shot fighter just because he got beat up a couple of times.

Hopkins is different. Hopkins didn't rely as much on his physical advantages like Jones did. Reactions were everything for Jones and once those slipped it made his fall much more dramatic then others. This is best exemplified in the Johnson fight.

He was actually doing well in the fight and was showing flashes of his old self up until he walked on to that monster of a punch.

I agree jones never quite recovered from what tarver did to him. At the same time though he clearly demonstrated against lacy he has what it takes to compete at the very highest level.

Does that mean he is now back in his prime - course it doesnt

[Numa]

Alot of the reason why Roy lost his stride in his early thirties was because he was relying on his physical gifts those are the first to go. His dominance did not have the longevity of other fighters, but when he was king he was a force of nature.

[CutMeMick]

As far as Athletics I agree.

As for Pure Boxing you have SRR, PBF, Alexis and "Finito" whom IMO are more talented then RJJ.

[Numa]

Just cant have him up there with the true 21st century greats (lewis, pacquiao, mayweather) because of the fact he got found out a few too many times in the prime of his career.

On his day he truly is up there as one of the most talented boxers to have ever fought. The schooling he gave toney that night will always live long in my memory.

But getting knocked out by tarve and johnson just diminished the accomplishments of the man. He was in his mid 30s and was hardly looking like a shot fighter when those KO`s came.

Seeing him take the battering calzaghe gave him was a very sad sight for everyone who has had the joy of bringing roy jones jr into their lives!!

Whoa there... Jones was weight depleted and 33 years old when he finally lost. To say he was in his prime is crazy considering 33 is old for a guy who spent his career relying on his speed and reflexes.

[Beanflicker]

Just cant have him up there with the true 21st century greats (lewis, pacquiao, mayweather) because of the fact he got found out a few too many times in the prime of his career.

On his day he truly is up there as one of the most talented boxers to have ever fought. The schooling he gave toney that night will always live long in my memory.

But getting knocked out by tarve and johnson just diminished the accomplishments of the man. He was in his mid 30s and was hardly looking like a shot fighter when those KO`s came.

Seeing him take the battering calzaghe gave him was a very sad sight for everyone who has had the joy of bringing roy jones jr into their lives!!

Whoa there... Jones was weight depleted and 33 years old when he finally lost. To say he was in his prime is crazy considering 33 is old for a guy who spent his career relying on his speed and reflexes.

Roy was 35 when he lost actually. 15 years into his career. At that point I don't think his heart was in boxing anymore. After the Ruiz fight, he said he wanted to fight one more megafight against Mike Tyson at HW then retire.

Roy fucked himself over when he chose to gain all that bulk and then struggle to burn 20lbs of muscle off to fight Tarver, especially at his age. Look what happened to Chris Byrd when he burned off a simliar amount of weight at a simliar age to go down to 175. He was slow, weak, and his once great chin was gone and he got knocked down repeatedly and finally KO'd by a no-name LHW with like 8 KOs in 18 fights. He was never the same after that, physically or mentally.

Its hard for regular people to understand because if you or I lose 20lbs, thats awesome. We feel great because we could afford to lose 20lbs. But when you're 200lbs of chisled, ripped muscle, losing 20lbs is going to hurt you physically, especially at an older age.

Look at PBF today compared to what he looked like when he was fight at 130. He's packed on a LOT of bulk. Imagine what would happen if he tried to shave himself back down to 130. He wouldn't look like the guy who dominated Marquez a few weeks ago I gaurentee you.

[zhubin]

Just cant have him up there with the true 21st century greats (lewis, pacquiao, mayweather) because of the fact he got found out a few too many times in the prime of his career.

On his day he truly is up there as one of the most talented boxers to have ever fought. The schooling he gave toney that night will always live long in my memory.

But getting knocked out by tarve and johnson just diminished the accomplishments of the man. He was in his mid 30s and was hardly looking like a shot fighter when those KO`s came.

Seeing him take the battering calzaghe gave him was a very sad sight for everyone who has had the joy of bringing roy jones jr into their lives!!

Whoa there... Jones was weight depleted and 33 years old when he finally lost. To say he was in his prime is crazy considering 33 is old for a guy who spent his career relying on his speed and reflexes.

Roy was 35 when he lost actually. 15 years into his career. At that point I don't think his heart was in boxing anymore. After the Ruiz fight, he said he wanted to fight one more megafight against Mike Tyson at HW then retire.

Roy fucked himself over when he chose to gain all that bulk and then struggle to burn 20lbs of muscle off to fight Tarver, especially at his age. Look what happened to Chris Byrd when he burned off a simliar amount of weight at a simliar age to go down to 175. He was slow, weak, and his once great chin was gone and he got knocked down repeatedly and finally KO'd by a no-name LHW with like 8 KOs in 18 fights. He was never the same after that, physically or mentally.

Its hard for regular people to understand because if you or I lose 20lbs, thats awesome. We feel great because we could afford to lose 20lbs. But when you're 200lbs of chisled, ripped muscle, losing 20lbs is going to hurt you physically, especially at an older age.

Look at PBF today compared to what he looked like when he was fight at 130. He's packed on a LOT of bulk. Imagine what would happen if he tried to shave himself back down to 130. He wouldn't look like the guy who dominated Marquez a few weeks ago I gaurentee you.

I agree. Some people really overlook the damage Roy did to himself coming back down in weight to fight Tarver. It certainly cannot be used as an excuse for all of his recent performances...but it had a negative effect at the least ideal time of his career (he wasn't a young buck who could just shrug off losing that much muscle and recover quickly). I also think it's a huge injustice to his enormous talent to say Roy Jones was just a great athlete. He certainly was that...but he was a smart fighter. Sure, he wasn't as technically brilliant like Whitaker or Mayweather...but he had great skills. He was never this raw, wild fighter. He was deadly accurate with his powerful and fast punches. And he wasn't a guy who just walked in a ring looking to knock his opponents head off with one punch. He was patient. He could toy with a fighter...blast them when he wanted too...or simply dance and take his time. Look at his fight with Toney. James was a more "skilled" fighter than Roy. He had a better defense than Roy, etc. etc.....yet Roy toyed with him (and please don't use the "Toney was weight drained" excuse). All i am saying is that Roy has not ended his career the way he should have...and maybe some of that is his fault. But at his prime...i still do not see any fighter that could have handled him.

[Beanflicker]

Yeah I agree. Roy's detractors will always say he never fought anyone, and will always have an excuse for the greats he did beat (Toney was weight drained, Hopkins wasn't in his prime yet, ect). People who say that are either biased against him or just don't know their history. Guys like Sugarboy Malinga, Tate, Sosa, Griffen, Virgil Hill, ect were solid fighters. Reggie Johnson was a fantastic fighter, very underrated, who gave a lot of guys a lot of problems and Roy dominated him.

If you look back at his career, you'll see a ton of guys who gave other greats a lot of problems, or perhaps beat other greats, who were murdered or embarrassed by Roy Jones. Once in a lifetime fighter.

[ElTerribleMorales]

Yeah I agree. Roy's detractors will always say he never fought anyone, and will always have an excuse for the greats he did beat (Toney was weight drained, Hopkins wasn't in his prime yet, ect). People who say that are either biased against him or just don't know their history. Guys like Sugarboy Malinga, Tate, Sosa, Griffen, Virgil Hill, ect were solid fighters. Reggie Johnson was a fantastic fighter, very underrated, who gave a lot of guys a lot of problems and Roy dominated him.

If you look back at his career, you'll see a ton of guys who gave other greats a lot of problems, or perhaps beat other greats, who were murdered or embarrassed by Roy Jones. Once in a lifetime fighter.

yea he wasn't like Calzaghe who finally jumped at the chance to fight the big names once they were past their best (aside Lacey and maybe Hopkins, who i felt beat Joe), but IMO he's not the most talented fighter that ever lived, there are plenty of others that can make the same claim, and there are different types of talent, i'd say Jones WAS the most athletically talented fighter ever, but terms of skill, power, strategy, or even speed, i wouldn't pick him

in short my top two are Robinson and Armstrong

[El Kabong]

I wonder how that fight vs Tyson would have turned out? RJJ vs Toney at heavyweight would have been nice and RJJ vs Holyfield at heavyweight would have also been nice.