Mike Tyson v Sonny Liston

[Master]

Liston had a brilliant jab that would cause Tyson problems, but go with Tyson, although Liston may have been over the hill by the time he fought Ali.

Liston beat up police officers and was harassed by them. He was a real bad man. Tyson is a puppy compared to Liston.

[El Kabong]

I'm not certain who the "badder man" was in actuality they were probably both so unsure of themselves that they were easier to break inside the ring than any rational man. Those guys did outrageous things to make people fear them and when they weren't feared they didn't do so well.

In a fight I figure this mirrors maybe the Frank Bruno fight or Bonecrusher Smith fight.....Tyson gets hurt but ends up KO-ing Sonny.

Foreman would have wrecked them both and perhaps Ron Lyle would have held his own as well. Ron Lyle killed somebody, so I reckon that puts him in the ballpark when we're talking about "bad men"

[ross]

You know, this is what pisses me off about Mikes regard on all time lists, when you consider Mike at his best the Mike that beat Spinks, put him in with Liston, we see him winning, I also see him beating Frazier and Foreman, theyd have to be strong and move well, I dont see Mike not being able to beat Ali I mean alot of people put him down just because they dont like him but try imagining him bobing and weaving avoiding getting hit and throwing fast 3 and 4 shot combinations, theres not many boxers who could have coped with that and given enough back to justify a win, some may have survived to hear the final bell.

[El Kabong]

Tyson MAY have been able to get to Frazier because Joe poured it on late in fights where as Mike was a quick starter....if it went past 5 I'd favor Frazier more. vs Foreman? Tyson had 0 chance, not vs the young Foreman, not vs the Old Foreman....Tyson would get the shit beat out of him plain and simple.

[eagle]

Tyson MAY have been able to get to Frazier because Joe poured it on late in fights where as Mike was a quick starter....if it went past 5 I'd favor Frazier more. vs Foreman? Tyson had 0 chance, not vs the young Foreman, not vs the Old Foreman....Tyson would get the shit beat out of him plain and simple.

I think your selling Mike a little short saying he'd have 0 chance against either version of Big George. Prime Tyson had enough power and skill to have a chance against anyone ever.

[boxer dude]

A prime Tyson would have beat Liston up, he was a much better boxer than Sunny, he had great head movement and unbelievable hand speed. Sunny was just big and strong but nothing special and he won the tittle from a much smaller man in Floyd Patterson.

I think outside the ring Liston was the badder man, while Tyson has made dumb choices and mistakes in his life he has a good heart. Liston on the other hand was a thug with well known ties to the Mafia.

[ICB]

Actually people are selling Sonny Liston short here, lets not forget Sonny Liston was a master at bullying opponents. Remember he taught George Foreman everything he knows about bullying opponents, he also had a ridiculous reach for his height, something like 84 inches wasn't it ? and lets remember Sonny Liston did have a ramrod jab.

Sonny Liston gets seriously underrated because of the Muhammad Ali fights, when infact theres strong sources that actually say Sonny Liston was 40 when he fought Muhammad Ali. Plus there was something for certain shady about the 2nd fight.

Sonny Liston at his best could very well of beaten Mike Tyson, he certainly had the tools. Im not saying he would of, because a prime Mike Tyson is a handful of anyone, and i do have Mike Tyson as the favorite in this fight. But lets not sell Sonny Liston short here.

[Zilla]

You know, this is what pisses me off about Mikes regard on all time lists, when you consider Mike at his best the Mike that beat Spinks, put him in with Liston, we see him winning, I also see him beating Frazier and Foreman, theyd have to be strong and move well, I dont see Mike not being able to beat Ali I mean alot of people put him down just because they dont like him but try imagining him bobing and weaving avoiding getting hit and throwing fast 3 and 4 shot combinations, theres not many boxers who could have coped with that and given enough back to justify a win, some may have survived to hear the final bell.

All you have to do is watch Mike against James Tillis and Larry Holmes to see he couldn't have beaten a prime Ali. Tillis gave Tyson problems and Holmes was able to tag Mike with the jab despite his bobbing and weaving. Neither man at the time would have matched Ali in his prime. Ali would have nailed Mike with the jab while leading him around the ring like a show dog. Even if Mike hit Ali with something and floored him early on, Ali would have gotten up and just continued blasting him with jabs until it got late, Mike slowed down and Ali didn't. It would have been a lopsided UD.

[ross]

James Tillis and Larry Holmes to see he couldn't have beaten a prime Ali. Tillis gave Tyson problems and Holmes was able to tag Mike with the jab despite his bobbing and weaving.

Thats just craap.

We could say the same about Ali being dropped by Sonny Banks and Henry Cooper and struggling bad and getting a gift decision against Doug Jones

You call knocking out Holmes in the 4th proof Mike was poor? Well the same but older version of Holmes took Holyfield the distance, beat Ray Mercer quite widely and was unlucky to not get the decision against McCall, he only lost by split decision.

Against Tillis he wan easy and knocked him down

Unlike Ali, Mike has no gift decisions.

Its a shame evrything happened the way it did because revisionists would now have you believe Mike was nothing, he doesnt even exist on some greatest lists, its pathetic because the same boxing journalists were saying at the time that Ali has a challenger for the greatest of all time

[Zilla]

James Tillis and Larry Holmes to see he couldn't have beaten a prime Ali. Tillis gave Tyson problems and Holmes was able to tag Mike with the jab despite his bobbing and weaving.

Thats just craap.

We could say the same about Ali being dropped by Sonny Banks and Henry Cooper and struggling bad and getting a gift decision against Doug Jones

You call knocking out Holmes in the 4th proof Mike was poor? Well the same but older version of Holmes took Holyfield the distance, beat Ray Mercer quite widely and was unlucky to not get the decision against McCall, he only lost by split decision.

Against Tillis he wan easy and knocked him down

Unlike Ali, Mike has no gift decisions.

Its a shame evrything happened the way it did because revisionists would now have you believe Mike was nothing, he doesnt even exist on some greatest lists, its pathetic because the same boxing journalists were saying at the time that Ali has a challenger for the greatest of all time

You got it all wrong. I'm a huge Tyson fan. And I would love to say Tyson would have chopped Ali in two. It just isn't true. Tyson beat Holmes and Tillis, but look at what they were able to do to a prime or near prime Tyson when neither man was considered at the top of the game. Holmes hit Tyson with his jab wayyyyy too much, particularly with Tyson's bob and weave defense. A prime Ali would have been able to do even more and how Tillis blunted most of Tyson's offense by playing keep away would have been employed by Ali as well.

[ross]

James Tillis and Larry Holmes to see he couldn't have beaten a prime Ali. Tillis gave Tyson problems and Holmes was able to tag Mike with the jab despite his bobbing and weaving.

Thats just craap.

We could say the same about Ali being dropped by Sonny Banks and Henry Cooper and struggling bad and getting a gift decision against Doug Jones

You call knocking out Holmes in the 4th proof Mike was poor? Well the same but older version of Holmes took Holyfield the distance, beat Ray Mercer quite widely and was unlucky to not get the decision against McCall, he only lost by split decision.

Against Tillis he wan easy and knocked him down

Unlike Ali, Mike has no gift decisions.

Its a shame evrything happened the way it did because revisionists would now have you believe Mike was nothing, he doesnt even exist on some greatest lists, its pathetic because the same boxing journalists were saying at the time that Ali has a challenger for the greatest of all time

You got it all wrong. I'm a huge Tyson fan. And I would love to say Tyson would have chopped Ali in two. It just isn't true. Tyson beat Holmes and Tillis, but look at what they were able to do to a prime or near prime Tyson when neither man was considered at the top of the game. Holmes hit Tyson with his jab wayyyyy too much, particularly with Tyson's bob and weave defense. A prime Ali would have been able to do even more and how Tillis blunted most of Tyson's offense by playing keep away would have been employed by Ali as well.

Playing keep away and flicking out a week jab wouldnt keep Tyson off them, neither would it get them a win on the judges cards

Holmes could have ran like a biitch all night and flicked out his little sissy jab to the 12th round but he wouldnt have beaten him, thats all he would have been able to hope to do against Mike, anyone who trys to plant their feet against that Tyson gets knocked out and Ali wouldnt have lasted long on the ropes either.