Green is officially in.

[killersheep]

I just don't think he is that good, hasn't beat anyone but like you say there isnt many names out there. But imo he is a second/third rate fighter.

Would you say he is on par with Taylor? I think at super middle he absolutely is.

Taylor is finished, Taylor 12-18 months ago would make Green look stupid, I have seen three Green fights and I dont rate him one bit.

I guess I just don't rate Taylor as being that good, he has a great jab, but that's about it. I mean dissect his record a bit, his two wins that got him all his fame were the ones over Hopkins, a Hopkins that looked lethargic and uninterested in the fight for 8 rounds both times. His middleweight wins over Spinks and Ouma (both much smaller men fighting at 154 and Spinks at 147/154) Then a win over a completely chewed up Lacy. In the two best efforts he's had in the ring was sparked by Froch and Pavlik.

[Fenster]

This is pointless. He'll be a big underdog against Ward, then his next fight is meant to be Kessler, who might be coming off a loss to Froch, and even if not you have Kessler fighting Green - two Ward victims, it means nothing

Super six just dont work.

[Rantcatrat]

This is pointless. He'll be a big underdog against Ward, then his next fight is meant to be Kessler, who might be coming off a loss to Froch, and even if not you have Kessler fighting Green - two Ward victims, it means nothing

Super six just dont work.

To you, the eternal pessimist when it comes to the Super Six, it is impossible for the tournament to succeed.

Think about it. Already there has been one major upset, one spectacular knockout, and one controversial win. And that's only round one! Why don't you wait until after the tournament fails to put it down? It's premature and frankly, it's tired.

[Fenster]

This is pointless. He'll be a big underdog against Ward, then his next fight is meant to be Kessler, who might be coming off a loss to Froch, and even if not you have Kessler fighting Green - two Ward victims, it means nothing

Super six just dont work.

To you, the eternal pessimist when it comes to the Super Six, it is impossible for the tournament to succeed.

Think about it. Already there has been one major upset, one spectacular knockout, and one controversial win. And that's only round one! Why don't you wait until after the tournament fails to put it down? It's premature and frankly, it's tired.

But gives you something to reply to everytime


Fenster the eternal pessimist - Love it!!!

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

This is pointless. He'll be a big underdog against Ward, then his next fight is meant to be Kessler, who might be coming off a loss to Froch, and even if not you have Kessler fighting Green - two Ward victims, it means nothing

Super six just dont work.

Of course it works. It guarantees fights & lots of em. All interesting and totally relevant to working out who the best fighter in the div is. Regardless of how early things take shape. Cynic

**** Edit ****

Iv'e just seen Rantcatrat's post. Noting better than a duplicated effort

[Fenster]

Bute is ranked no.1 by The Ring at supermiddle. So how does the SS establish the top man in the division?

[killersheep]

Bute is ranked no.1 by The Ring at supermiddle. So how does the SS establish the top man in the division?

The ring (owned by Golden Boy) does not have a contract with Showtime. Think of the resume of the winner of the tournament and compare it to what Bute will have at that point, no comparison, the winner should be number one at Super Middle. Furthermore, the winner of the tournament will be in a position of only having Bute left to fight, because all of the other meaningful names at 168 were in the tourney.

All that aside, explain what Bute has done to be number 1.................

[411JRoche]

Bute is ranked no.1 by The Ring at supermiddle. So how does the SS establish the top man in the division?

The ring (owned by Golden Boy) does not have a contract with Showtime. Think of the resume of the winner of the tournament and compare it to what Bute will have at that point, no comparison, the winner should be number one at Super Middle. Furthermore, the winner of the tournament will be in a position of only having Bute left to fight, because all of the other meaningful names at 168 were in the tourney.

All that aside, explain what Bute has done to be number 1.................

Going to have to agree with killersheep here -- while I think Lucian Bute is a great talent when the Super Six is all said and done his resume just won't be strong enough to put him over which ever fighter comes out of the tournament as the winner. If we're going by The Ring ratings the Super Six has the #2, 3, 4, 6 and 7 ranked super middleweights all involved. Bute has two victories over Andrade (ranked # and a win over Sakio Bika (ranked #5). Other then those two notable wins he beat Joppy into retirement (not permanent) about four years late and beat Zuniga pretty easily. Bute hasn't fought outside of Canada since 2004 and he's only been outside Montreal twice since then. Bute's fight with Edison Miranda is interesting but Miranda isn't a top ranked super middleweight and he's lost to Ward and Abraham (twice) so beating him isn't more impressive then anything the top Super Six fighter will have done.

In the meantime if - lets say Andre Ward was to win the Super Six he'd have victories over Mikkel Kessler (#4), Allan Green (#7), Andre Dirrell, and then some combination of Carl Froch (#3) and Arthur Abraham (#6) and Ward is already the #2 ranked Ring super middleweight. With that resume there is no question that Ward (or really anyone other then Dirrell) would shoot to the #1 spot and likely have an argument to be crowned the Ring's super middleweight champion.

[Fenster]

Bute is ranked no.1 by The Ring at supermiddle. So how does the SS establish the top man in the division?

The ring (owned by Golden Boy) does not have a contract with Showtime. Think of the resume of the winner of the tournament and compare it to what Bute will have at that point, no comparison, the winner should be number one at Super Middle. Furthermore, the winner of the tournament will be in a position of only having Bute left to fight, because all of the other meaningful names at 168 were in the tourney.

All that aside, explain what Bute has done to be number 1.................

I couldn't care less whether Bute is rated no.1 or not.

MOST fans reference the Ring's ratings when judging fighters. I bet most fans would rate Bute top 5 whatever, which means one of the best at 168 isn't part of the SS.

If the SS establishes a dominant champion then yeah they should be rated no.1... currently though there are better fights at supermiddle that don't involve SS players, that's all.

[HattonTheHammer]

Bute is ranked no.1 by The Ring at supermiddle. So how does the SS establish the top man in the division?

The ring (owned by Golden Boy) does not have a contract with Showtime. Think of the resume of the winner of the tournament and compare it to what Bute will have at that point, no comparison, the winner should be number one at Super Middle. Furthermore, the winner of the tournament will be in a position of only having Bute left to fight, because all of the other meaningful names at 168 were in the tourney.

All that aside, explain what Bute has done to be number 1.................

I couldn't care less whether Bute is rated no.1 or not.

MOST fans reference the Ring's ratings when judging fighters. I bet most fans would rate Bute top 5 whatever, which means one of the best at 168 isn't part of the SS.

If the SS establishes a dominant champion then yeah they should be rated no.1... currently though there are better fights at supermiddle that don't involve SS players, that's all.

Apart from bute-kessler, bute-ward, bute-froch etc, fights such as??

[killersheep]

Bute is ranked no.1 by The Ring at supermiddle. So how does the SS establish the top man in the division?

The ring (owned by Golden Boy) does not have a contract with Showtime. Think of the resume of the winner of the tournament and compare it to what Bute will have at that point, no comparison, the winner should be number one at Super Middle. Furthermore, the winner of the tournament will be in a position of only having Bute left to fight, because all of the other meaningful names at 168 were in the tourney.

All that aside, explain what Bute has done to be number 1.................

I couldn't care less whether Bute is rated no.1 or not.

MOST fans reference the Ring's ratings when judging fighters. I bet most fans would rate Bute top 5 whatever, which means one of the best at 168 isn't part of the SS.

If the SS establishes a dominant champion then yeah they should be rated no.1... currently though there are better fights at supermiddle that don't involve SS players, that's all.

What fights? When you get down to it, Super Middle is an extremely shallow division. Bute opted out of the tournament, should that be held against the rest of the field?

[Zilla]

Would you say he is on par with Taylor? I think at super middle he absolutely is.

Taylor is finished, Taylor 12-18 months ago would make Green look stupid, I have seen three Green fights and I dont rate him one bit.

I guess I just don't rate Taylor as being that good, he has a great jab, but that's about it. I mean dissect his record a bit, his two wins that got him all his fame were the ones over Hopkins, a Hopkins that looked lethargic and uninterested in the fight for 8 rounds both times. His middleweight wins over Spinks and Ouma (both much smaller men fighting at 154 and Spinks at 147/154) Then a win over a completely chewed up Lacy. In the two best efforts he's had in the ring was sparked by Froch and Pavlik.

I'll do you one better, I think Spinks beat him. And Winky did too. I think Taylor had great potential, but never lived up to it and was hyped as the next golden one. He's got enough money for his kids' kids' kids', he should probably hang 'em up.

[killersheep]

Taylor is finished, Taylor 12-18 months ago would make Green look stupid, I have seen three Green fights and I dont rate him one bit.

I guess I just don't rate Taylor as being that good, he has a great jab, but that's about it. I mean dissect his record a bit, his two wins that got him all his fame were the ones over Hopkins, a Hopkins that looked lethargic and uninterested in the fight for 8 rounds both times. His middleweight wins over Spinks and Ouma (both much smaller men fighting at 154 and Spinks at 147/154) Then a win over a completely chewed up Lacy. In the two best efforts he's had in the ring was sparked by Froch and Pavlik.

I'll do you one better, I think Spinks beat him. And Winky did too. I think Taylor had great potential, but never lived up to it and was hyped as the next golden one. He's got enough money for his kids' kids' kids', he should probably hang 'em up.

That's just it, I think Taylor had the tools to become a much better all around boxer than he was, but he peaked early and stopped improving early. He's a nice guy so I don't want to bash him too much, but he was so frustrating to watch because you could see he understood what he needed to do, but simply didn't do it. That and his conditioning seemed to always come into play.

[HattonTheHammer]

I guess I just don't rate Taylor as being that good, he has a great jab, but that's about it. I mean dissect his record a bit, his two wins that got him all his fame were the ones over Hopkins, a Hopkins that looked lethargic and uninterested in the fight for 8 rounds both times. His middleweight wins over Spinks and Ouma (both much smaller men fighting at 154 and Spinks at 147/154) Then a win over a completely chewed up Lacy. In the two best efforts he's had in the ring was sparked by Froch and Pavlik.

I'll do you one better, I think Spinks beat him. And Winky did too. I think Taylor had great potential, but never lived up to it and was hyped as the next golden one. He's got enough money for his kids' kids' kids', he should probably hang 'em up.

That's just it, I think Taylor had the tools to become a much better all around boxer than he was, but he peaked early and stopped improving early. He's a nice guy so I don't want to bash him too much, but he was so frustrating to watch because you could see he understood what he needed to do, but simply didn't do it. That and his conditioning seemed to always come into play.

He was never the same guy that beat hopkins. After those fights he didnt produce what we all expected and i agree with you on that he just seemed to peek so young other than a half decent second fight with pavlik its just been blotted with poor performances and running out of stamina late on in fights. We`ll never know how the taylor of 5years ago would of handled froch/abraham