Israel_Iran_Locator.PNG
Such bullies these damn Zionists, they should pick on someone their own size
 |
|
|
|
Thanks: 0
Likes: 0
Dislikes: 0
Forum Greatest Of All Time
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
Israel_Iran_Locator.PNG
Such bullies these damn Zionists, they should pick on someone their own size
Banned
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
And I saw that the UN passed new harsher sanctions on Iran yeserday and that the US spent a good five months putting the package together. What a charade. The US has veto'ed how many resolutions against Israel since the early '70's? And yet sanctions are handed out to other less than moral regimes like confetti. Iraq, North Korea, Iran and so on Why no sanctions for the Saudi's? And far more importantly why no sanctions on the Israeli's? Oh, because America dictates things at the end of the day and we should like Israel. Interesting how most international terrorism comes out of Washington and most middle east terrorism comes from Israel. A lot of common bonds there. That and the powerful Jewish lobby in the States. I guess there isn't much of an Iranian lobby.
And some softies think Iran are the dangerous ones? Get the propaganda out of yer ears! Two states are armed up to the eyes with the most sophisticated weaponry (frequently shared between them) in this world and Iran isn't one of them. Iran poses far less a risk to the world than either one of those well armed states.
Banned
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
Let's not forget the recent fallacy of Iraq. The entire premise for war was a lie and that is only one of countless faulty premises invented by the US government since WW2. Usually they involve smaller state sponsored terrorist attacks. The bombing of Libya in the 1980's for instance was particularly random and all of the US evidence fabricated. It is just that the US media is unwilling to go against the interests of Washington Hawks.
The propaganda and hype about Iran is much the same thing. The very idea that people are talking of the need for regime change bewilders me. Iran is admittedly a very dodgy place, but is it any more dodgy than countless other states in the world? Would anyone like to live in Saudi Arabia for instance? So let's invade them right? Oh, but it isn't in our interests.
I think war is way off, but I wouldn't bet against mini America (Israel) attempting to do something nutty in order to bolster domestic standing. It wouldn't be the first time.
Banned
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
They should stop bullying full stop, size doesn't come into it. It also helps that the other great sponsor of state led terrorist activity is right in their corner if push comes to shove. This is about nuclear weapons right? So why does tiny little Israel have an estimatel arsenal of around 300 right now? And Iran is being told "you are not allowed them". Iraq set the precedent. All states need to arm themselves with nuclear weapons incase of a preemptive strike by the US military. You don't even need evidence of wrongdoing, they will attack you anyway. It's been repeated over and over the past 50 years.Originally Posted by Bilbo
Israel_Iran_Locator.PNG
Such bullies these damn Zionists, they should pick on someone their own size
Fantastic Mr. Fox
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
Are you serious Miles? Why would you not want Iran to have nukes? You would get the world blown up because you are thinking to much in the interest of fairness. I don't care to talk about Israel, but do you not understand that it's paramount that someone like Iran's president never gets nukes. He's literally crazy and I mean hasn't he called for Israel to be wiped out? Calling for another country's extinction should disqualify you from Nukes. AGAIN, NOT TRYING TO TALK ABOUT ISRAEL but would you be comfortable if Iran was allowed to develop nukes?
I just fucken hate how people try to paint only one side as the bad guys. The people who absolutely kill me are those who think we should not be fighting the Taliban in Afghanistan. It's almost like they don't want the coalition military to take up a fight where they actually look like the good guys. These people, honestly have not got a clue. I don't either, but I can sure as hell bet you I would never ever want to spend a day under Taliban rule. They are among the most evil people on the planet, and these evil people are out there and it's NOT a bad thing to be fighting them. I don't give a fuck about politics, and the reasons why we are there and poor execution in the beginning, we're there and we couldn't possibly leave now knowing the true evils of the Taliban.
Old Guard's cutman
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
I don't like the Taliban either but the funny thing is that the Taliban has been put in place with the help of the CIA and the American Gov. They did that because they thought that by helping them, the Talibans would let them to use a pipeline on their territory to suck up petrol from the Caspian sea. When helping the bad guys serving your interests is ok and then very bad when they aren't doing the Yes Men, I call that hypocrisy. If they would have been ok with the pipeline, you can bet that the US would have never landed here and wouldn't give a flying f about the peoples over there.
IF you want a very good summary of it all: Afghanistan, the CIA, bin Laden, and the Taliban
Hidden Content
That's the way it is, not the way it ends
Banned
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
I have already said I would prefer a nuclear free region. But Israel having such a stockpile is a huge white elephant in the room. What I am saying is that to say that Iran cannot have them is hypocrisy. Which it obviously is. And all I am saying in addition is that in the age of the preemptive strike, a time when they will fabricate evidence and just make up a reason to attack, then you have to understand individual states wanting to try and prevent that. Whence North Korea supposedly bolstering itself up. Nobody wants to be the next Iraq.
You say Ahmadinejad is crazy, but I look at him as being unhinged mainly in the sense of his flamboyant use of rhetoric. He talks of the desire to see Israel go down in a ball of fire, but then again Kim Jong-il often comes out with the same stuff about attacking South Korea. It's lunatic talk, but do they ever do anything about it? Personally, I am not 100% convinced that North Korea really did torpedo that South Korean ship either, but even if they did, that is as far as they go. Terrible yes, but no more terrible than what Israel did really. Israel is actually in the process of ethnically cleansing Palestine, not too much talk about it mind, but that's what they are actually doing. I would prefer to listen to the crazies with their "seas of fire" rhetoric and no action than to actually see the silent huge concentration camp in action. Both are quite wrong and like I say both shouldn't really have this kind of weaponry.
We read the media every day and they are trying to set your mindset in a particular direction. It isn't all black and white at all, but usually our media likes to paint us as being the good guys in a just battle, but it really isn't the case. The Taliban suck, but go back through your own countries history and see the evil that has been done all too many times. Yes, we have freedom of speech and have certain freedoms, but at what cost to how many countries in the world through our brutal and unnecessary military colonialism and inability to respect the rights of other nations to be free from our sphere of influence? And Nameless covered it quite well, we even put the Taliban there in the first place and we only wanted them out again when they were no longer working in our interests. Where are these 9-11 terror suspects BTW? All forgotten about.
Banned
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
And before anyone tries to brand me as soft on Iran, I would like to make clear that I think their regime is horrible and the suppression of human rights and political freedoms harsh. No doubt about that, but that's a different point than the nuclear issue. If we want to go about dealing with Iran on that level then fair enough, but other nations should then also be called on the same kinds of things.
Fantastic Mr. Fox
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
It doesn't matter, these are awful people and who gives a fuck about the terror suspects. We could have killed Bin Laden on day 1, we would still have a reason to get rid of the fucking taliban. They are awful. I just read today they executed a 7 year old boy accusing him of being a spy. Whether we gave them support in the past or not, is anyone here actually against fighting the Taliban?
Taliban Kill, Hang 7-Year-Old Boy as Government Spy
Old Guard's cutman
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
Who said they were friendly guys? Is the 7 years old murder really a surprise? Nope. We all know they things like that. However, how is it ok to loyally support them all gun ho till the Afghan war, even inviting them to Washington to promote their image and then deciding they were bad guys because they didn't obey their master? Nobody gave a fuck about peoples over there in Washington because they financed their most radical leaders and wouldn't it be for the Caspian sea petrol, they would have never landed a boot over there to "hunt Bin Laden". There are regimes as bad in Africa, notably Somalia where pirates stole more than 100 millions of material a year but they do not land in there because there ain't money to do. Same for North Korea which is much more frightening than a handful of bearded man riding 1970 motorcycles and drinking tea in some caves. The problem now is that they created a gigantic havok and can't afford to lose face, especially because of the tensions everywhere else make the region too dangerous. Talibans are disgusting peoples but you're very naive if you think that the US landed there to "save their peoples". If the Talibans would have accepted the Caspian Sea pipe, they would rule with iron hands and not even a single G.I would have land over there, at best they would condone their actions at the UN but they would not have removed them from power.
Hidden Content
That's the way it is, not the way it ends
Forum Greatest Of All Time
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
So you agree with me then that we must all be very naieve to believe that the furore against Israel now is all to do with concern for the plight of the Gazan people. You just explained excellently how the world cares nothing for the plight of others except when it suits their own ends, and thus in the case of Gaza, it is the new propaganda tool to exploit the Israeli's with. They are just pawns in an anti semitic attack. The Arab world would like to have another go at the six day war, but obviously with different results this time, and the first stage is to win the war of public opinion.
Who said they were friendly guys? Is the 7 years old murder really a surprise? Nope. We all know they things like that. However, how is it ok to loyally support them all gun ho till the Afghan war, even inviting them to Washington to promote their image and then deciding they were bad guys because they didn't obey their master? Nobody gave a fuck about peoples over there in Washington because they financed their most radical leaders and wouldn't it be for the Caspian sea petrol, they would have never landed a boot over there to "hunt Bin Laden". There are regimes as bad in Africa, notably Somalia where pirates stole more than 100 millions of material a year but they do not land in there because there ain't money to do. Same for North Korea which is much more frightening than a handful of bearded man riding 1970 motorcycles and drinking tea in some caves. The problem now is that they created a gigantic havok and can't afford to lose face, especially because of the tensions everywhere else make the region too dangerous. Talibans are disgusting peoples but you're very naive if you think that the US landed there to "save their peoples". If the Talibans would have accepted the Caspian Sea pipe, they would rule with iron hands and not even a single G.I would have land over there, at best they would condone their actions at the UN but they would not have removed them from power.
Excellent post Nameless, I agree with everything you said
Old Guard's cutman
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
Thanks for agreeing. However, I do not agree with your logic:So you agree with me then that we must all be very naieve to believe that the furore against Israel now is all to do with concern for the plight of the Gazan people. You just explained excellently how the world cares nothing for the plight of others except when it suits their own ends, and thus in the case of Gaza, it is the new propaganda tool to exploit the Israeli's with. They are just pawns in an anti semitic attack. The Arab world would like to have another go at the six day war, but obviously with different results this time, and the first stage is to win the war of public opinion.
Who said they were friendly guys? Is the 7 years old murder really a surprise? Nope. We all know they things like that. However, how is it ok to loyally support them all gun ho till the Afghan war, even inviting them to Washington to promote their image and then deciding they were bad guys because they didn't obey their master? Nobody gave a fuck about peoples over there in Washington because they financed their most radical leaders and wouldn't it be for the Caspian sea petrol, they would have never landed a boot over there to "hunt Bin Laden". There are regimes as bad in Africa, notably Somalia where pirates stole more than 100 millions of material a year but they do not land in there because there ain't money to do. Same for North Korea which is much more frightening than a handful of bearded man riding 1970 motorcycles and drinking tea in some caves. The problem now is that they created a gigantic havok and can't afford to lose face, especially because of the tensions everywhere else make the region too dangerous. Talibans are disgusting peoples but you're very naive if you think that the US landed there to "save their peoples". If the Talibans would have accepted the Caspian Sea pipe, they would rule with iron hands and not even a single G.I would have land over there, at best they would condone their actions at the UN but they would not have removed them from power.
Excellent post Nameless, I agree with everything you said
More than 200 motions have voted against Israel, many for war crimes at the UN but the Us systematically used their veto to block the whole deal. When 200 motions have been voted, it shows people care.
The Afghan case is absolutely different from Palestine who gets its land stolen, their water blocked and the simplest of material blocked from getting in. Afghan's borders aren't in cause in the case that interests us.
When you send 10 000 tons of medical help to a place where there is not a dime to be made (compared to billions with the pipeline) and that you challenge one very dangerous Army in Tsahal, it must be because somehow, you care about these peoples to take such risks.
Also, Comparatively to Afghanistan where the Us did put Hamid Karzai, an ex Texaco consultant (or Chevron, anyway one of these) to the head of the country to serve their interests, Israel did elect themselves their very own government which is not an ex consultant who works for the American oil interests to replace the Talibans, the butchers, the same U.S did put before to serve these same interests but had to be removed because they weren't docile.
Do not lose from sight that the US gag balled the UN because Israel, despite their incessant massacres and illegal land stealing, were serving their interests by being a threat to the "muslim" world.
2 very different situations Mr BAggins, I tell ya but thanks for agreeing with me on the Afghan case
Last edited by Nameless; 06-11-2010 at 02:14 PM.
Hidden Content
That's the way it is, not the way it ends
Forum Greatest Of All Time
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
To be fair to Isreal its enemies declare everything it does to be a war crime. There are so many claims made regarding their 'ethnic cleansing' and 'genocide' which create the popular opinion that they are commiting atrocities but none of them bear up to scrutiny.Thanks for agreeing. However, I do not agree with your logic:So you agree with me then that we must all be very naieve to believe that the furore against Israel now is all to do with concern for the plight of the Gazan people. You just explained excellently how the world cares nothing for the plight of others except when it suits their own ends, and thus in the case of Gaza, it is the new propaganda tool to exploit the Israeli's with. They are just pawns in an anti semitic attack. The Arab world would like to have another go at the six day war, but obviously with different results this time, and the first stage is to win the war of public opinion.
Who said they were friendly guys? Is the 7 years old murder really a surprise? Nope. We all know they things like that. However, how is it ok to loyally support them all gun ho till the Afghan war, even inviting them to Washington to promote their image and then deciding they were bad guys because they didn't obey their master? Nobody gave a fuck about peoples over there in Washington because they financed their most radical leaders and wouldn't it be for the Caspian sea petrol, they would have never landed a boot over there to "hunt Bin Laden". There are regimes as bad in Africa, notably Somalia where pirates stole more than 100 millions of material a year but they do not land in there because there ain't money to do. Same for North Korea which is much more frightening than a handful of bearded man riding 1970 motorcycles and drinking tea in some caves. The problem now is that they created a gigantic havok and can't afford to lose face, especially because of the tensions everywhere else make the region too dangerous. Talibans are disgusting peoples but you're very naive if you think that the US landed there to "save their peoples". If the Talibans would have accepted the Caspian Sea pipe, they would rule with iron hands and not even a single G.I would have land over there, at best they would condone their actions at the UN but they would not have removed them from power.
Excellent post Nameless, I agree with everything you said
More than 200 motions have voted against Israel, many for war crimes at the UN but the Us systematically used their veto to block the whole deal. When 200 motions have been voted, it shows people care.
The Afghan case is absolutely different from Palestine who gets its land stolen, their water blocked and the simplest of material blocked from getting in. Afghan's borders aren't in cause in the case that interests us.
When you send 10 000 tons of medical help to a place where there is not a dime to be made (compared to billions with the pipeline) and that you challenge one very dangerous Army in Tsahal, it must be because somehow, you care about these peoples to take such risks.
Also, Comparatively to Afghanistan where the Us did put Hamid Karzai, an ex Texaco consultant (or Chevron, anyway one of these) to the head of the country to serve their interests, Israel did elect themselves their very own government which is not an ex consultant who works for the American oil interests.
2 very different situations Mr BAggins, I tell ya but thanks for agreeing with me on the Afghan case
They have been subject to some terrible propaganda and outright lies against them.
Please comment on my points below and tell me where you disagree.
Firstly, the idea that they are being starved to death is simply not bourne out. The Palestinian population has actually increased, from 240,000 in 1950 to 1.5 million today.
Secondly when Israel took over control of Gaza in 1967 the average life expectancy of a Palestinaian was 48 years. Now despite being brutally mistreated their life expectanies have INCREASED to 72 years, making them the only persecuted people's in history to have seen their health so drastically improve under such intolerable conditions.
Interestingly infant mortality in Palestine since the Jews took over has dropped from 100 per 1000 live births to 23 per 1000 live births.
Despite your claims to drinking water being withheld, they actually have far more access now than they didn prior to 1967. Also illiteracy was rampant prior to 1967 whereas now, again under Israeli control illiteracy has been almost wiped out amongst those born after 1967.
These statistical facts obviously don't help the anti-Israeli cause however and so never get mentioned.
Also there have been numerous false allegations made against Israel, which have been proven false, yet still the idea still persist.
The 2002 massacre of hundred of Palestiniants in Jenin for example has since been exposed as a total fabrication. The bombing of two Lebanese Red Cross ambulances in 2006, which received worldwide condemnation was later found to be a hoax as well yet only the condemnation of Israel is ever publicised. When events are proven to be not as desrcibed, no retraction of Isreal's 'wrong doing' is made thus the myth of Jewis aggression persists in the minds of the public.
The fake killing of the 12 year old Palestinian Mohammed al-Dura in 2000 is another atrocity commited against Israel. The whole event was staged, he wasn't even dead but was killed later by the Arabs to propogate their atrocity claims. It was an evil, inhumane attempt to besmirch the Israeli reputation.
There have been a long list of false claims and allegations made against Israel, hardly any of which stand up to scrutiny, henced why they are never scrutinised.
Last edited by Kev; 06-11-2010 at 02:33 PM.
Forum Greatest Of All Time
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
Here's an interesting link to health and literacy statistics in the Middle East
CAMERA: Will Massive Infusions of Aid Rescue the Palestinian Economy?
Amazingly these cruelly persecuted people living in intolerable conditions have the second highest life expectancy, the second lowest infant mortality rate and the highest literacy rates in the entire Arab world.
Also one of the highest primary school attendance rates.
Why does THIS never get mentioned. You would think from the media that these people were living in refugee campst and dying daily from plague and famine, and yet their standard of living is better than ANY Arab nation other than Syria.
Interesting.......
FGE
Array
Re: So....is war in the Middle East imminent?
JERUSALEM — As Israel ordered a slight easing of its blockade of the Gaza Strip Wednesday, McClatchy obtained an Israeli government document that describes the blockade not as a security measure but as "economic warfare" against the Islamist group Hamas, which rules the Palestinian territory.
Israel imposed severe restrictions on Gaza in June 2007, after Hamas won elections and took control of the coastal enclave after winning elections there the previous year, and the government has long said that the aim of the blockade is to stem the flow of weapons to militants in Gaza.
Last week, after Israeli commandos killed nine volunteers on a Turkish-organized Gaza aid flotilla, Israel again said its aim was to stop the flow of terrorist arms into Gaza.
However, in response to a lawsuit by Gisha, an Israeli human rights group, the Israeli government explained the blockade as an exercise of the right of economic warfare.
Israeli document: Gaza blockade isn't about security | McClatchy
Economic warfare. Lovely. So it's not about weapons, it's all about the Binyamins.
A 2010 World Health Organization report stated that "chronic malnutrition in the Gaza Strip has risen over the past few years and has now reached 10.2%. Micronutrient deficiencies among children and women have reached levels that are of concern." According to UN OCHA:"Over 60 percent of households are now food insecure, threatening the health and wellbeing of children, women and men. In this context, agriculture offers some practical solutions to a humanitarian problem. However, Israel's import and access restrictions continue to suffocate the agriculture sector and directly contribute to rising food insecurity.
Israel has not permitted supplies into the Gaza Strip to rebuild the sewage system.Amnesty International reports that 90-95 percent of the drinking water in Gaza is contaminated and unfit for consumption. The United Nations even found that bottled water in Gaza contained contaminants, likely due to the plastic bottles recycled in dysfunctional factories. The lack of sufficient power for desalination and sewage facilities results in significant amounts of sewage seeping into Gaza's costal aquifer--the main source of water for the people of Gaza.
etc. etc.
What exactly is the blockade of Gaza? by Yousef Munayyer | The Middle East Channel
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Reply With Quote
Bookmarks