Quote Originally Posted by The Promoter
Mike Tyson was certainly a force and I think his media exposure certainly added a great deal as to where most posters on this board want to put a prime Tyson...but before we make him an "all-time great" or say he could have beaten anyone in history some questions must be asked;

1) What All-Time great was beaten by a C level fighter in what should have been their prime?...Tyson at 24 was clobbered by Buster Douglas. Tyson fans are quick for excuses; Tyson's head wasn't in it, he didn't train, Don King, Robin Givens, etc... Fact is he was spanked for 10 rounds by a C level fighter not a lucky punch but a complete beat down...great fighters adapt, Tyson did not. Mike Tyson was 24 years old. Ali, Foreman, etc., all face adversity but found a way to win in their prime, that's what made them special.

2) Great Fighters fight the best of their era...Tyson did not, instead he faced carefully picked opponents...Why didn't Tyson face Mercer, Holyfield(prime), Foreman and what would have been the biggest payday in history Tommy Morrison?...because Tyson's style didn't work with guys who would push him back. This is a long known Cus D'Amato fighter trait they don't fight going backward, Lou Duva knew this that's why he and Evander were calling Mike out day one. I'm not saying that Tyson would have lost these fights but exposed....maybe.

3) Guts, great champs have great heart, did Tyson ever have great heart? ask the poeple that knew him best he always had trouble psychologically when fighting opponents who fought back even back to the amatuers...did anyone see he yelping and crying in his corner about pain against Holyfield and LL?...was Mike ever able to get up from a knockdown to win a fight? Did he ever avenge a loss? Did he ever suck it up to come from behind to pull out a fight?...The only fight that I've seen Tyson be able to come from behind was Botha and some would argue that that was a lucky punch and Mike was ready to fold...

Tyson was not all that unique he just had better coverage...Look at Liston, Dempsey(And I too would take Dempsey) and most recently Ernie Shavers to see the same sorts of quickness and devstation...As I've said many times and I was a Tyson fan...Mike Tyson was a fighter with great potential and had some great fights...but an all-time great is certainly debatable...

That Buster fight was bitter sweet to me for a few reasons

1) That was one of the times Tyson did display heart and kept coming forward regardless he took a great deal of punishment but never gave up

2) That LONG COUNT PISSES ME OFF TO THIS DAY!!!!!!  I was watching thay fight as a youngster screaming at the FUKING TV Buster was counted out period!!!!! but if it wasnt that fight would of Mike Collapsed and derailed in the next fight?Who knows??

3) amazing nite and one of the most memorable fights I have ever seen from a historical standpoint BIGGEST UPSET IMO EVER IN BOXING..

Mike pressed on like a warrior against Buster and didnt give up AND KEPT FIGHTING.. I think the Lewis,Holyfield,McBride fights would have been different if he displayed that kind of fighting spirit,He just gave up against those guys