A good article about the HW division!

[erics44]

if them 2 were american the americans would be raving about the HW division

and yeah, neither of them seem to ever loose a round nowadays and yep they would probably dominate any era

if only they werent so dull

[BIG H]

It's always been my opinion that there are very few really golden eras on Heavyweight boxing. I think perhaps only 2 infact - The era of Ali, Foreman, Frazier & Norton and the era of Holyfield, Bowe, Lewis & Tyson (although they were all at deifferent stages of careers and didn't all fight at thi time) There has always been 1 or 2 dominant fighters and then a lot of average to good contenders. I thnk the 'contenders' in the two era I mentioned were probably better than any other era including the current one. E.G Ray Mercer, Tommy Morrison, Michael Moorer, Razor Ruddock to name a few a far better than today's offering, outside of the Klits!

[erics44]

i dont think you are right

i think they look worse because the klits are so much better

they are bigger names but not neccessarily better boxers

[BIG H]

i dont think you are right

i think they look worse because the klits are so much better

they are bigger names but not neccessarily better boxers

Fair play mate it's all subjective, but I'm pretty sure if we actually looked at the top 10 'contenders' for example from 1992 and pitched them against the top 10 'contenders'' of today I don't think the majority would see many favourable outcomes for today's bunch

ICB -please do the match ups

[El Kabong]

I think the problem with boxing in general is the media (especially the American and British media) don't address the issue of the "talent gap" between the Klitschko's and their opponents in a positive light. Sure both have their reasons for doing so but the boxing commentators these days are doing the fans of the sport a great disservice by always (and I do mean ALWAYS) complaining about styles and how boring and blah blah blah....meanwhile you look at UFC, sure they have their fair share of bad fights, but their commentators USUALLY point out the good things. If you watched Edgar vs Penn II you basically see a rudamentary boxing match, but you listen to Joe Rogan and it's the greatest most wonderful awe inspiring match ever on the other hand you watch Klitschko-Peter II and all you hear is Teddy Atlas bitch about Wlad holding and Sam Peter not working on the inside, "making deals with himself", and you never hear much about Wlad openning up, they may have said 2 words about Wlad using the uppercut, Brian Kenney did try to keep Teddy from being so hard on the fighters, but the fans watch but they also listen and if you tell someone "look for the holding" odds are they'll see more of it, if you tell them to "watch for the power punches" odds are they'll see more of it. They never say "watch for Floyd's elbows" or "watch Floyd try not to engage his opponent until the end of the round" whenever he fights, so why be so hard on the Klitschko's? The British media (really one person specifically) doesn't give the Klitschko's their due credit, but I will say, the way they hype up Chicken Little and the way they've hyped up Audley Harrison to be a "dangerous challenger" is a big step in the right direction...I just wish that there weren't so many "homers" in boxing...I mean Larry Merchant and Cris Arreola was laughable...as was the British commentators describing John Ruiz getting repeatedly rabbit punched as some sort of cheeky attempt to have a point taken from his opponent

[erics44]

another haye hating post

i am starting to get the gyst of this forum

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

Lyle thats a blatant LIE!

[El Kabong]

another haye hating post

i am starting to get the gyst of this forum

The guy is talented but you've got to understand, when people are doing all these "look at me, look at me" attention whore things, they can't expect people to look past certain things. Its not all going to be good for the guy. Had he been humble and respectful, there's more of a chance that people like myself would give him the benefit of the doubt....but the dude is an asshole, he's a talented fighter but he's an asshole, and he CHOSE to be one.

[Taeth]

It's always been my opinion that there are very few really golden eras on Heavyweight boxing. I think perhaps only 2 infact - The era of Ali, Foreman, Frazier & Norton and the era of Holyfield, Bowe, Lewis & Tyson (although they were all at deifferent stages of careers and didn't all fight at thi time) There has always been 1 or 2 dominant fighters and then a lot of average to good contenders. I thnk the 'contenders' in the two era I mentioned were probably better than any other era including the current one. E.G Ray Mercer, Tommy Morrison, Michael Moorer, Razor Ruddock to name a few a far better than today's offering, outside of the Klits!

I would argue that a lot of these guys like Peter in shape, Povetkin, Eddie Chambers in shape, Chagaev, Ibragimov would do really well in any era of boxing. I think they could beat a lot of the guys from the 90's, and maybe even guys like Holyfield, Bowe, and Tyson on the right night.

I think guys like Lewis and the Klitschko brothers are a new breed in boxing that simply have too much size and athleticism for them to lose baring poor preparation or a special punch landing. Wladimir used to be less defensively aware and he used to get caught with stupid punches considering his chin. I don't think its a bad thing he takes his lack of punch durability into account when he fights. Vitali looks awkward as hell, but he is undeniably effective.

[rjj tszyu]

It's always been my opinion that there are very few really golden eras on Heavyweight boxing. I think perhaps only 2 infact - The era of Ali, Foreman, Frazier & Norton and the era of Holyfield, Bowe, Lewis & Tyson (although they were all at deifferent stages of careers and didn't all fight at thi time) There has always been 1 or 2 dominant fighters and then a lot of average to good contenders. I thnk the 'contenders' in the two era I mentioned were probably better than any other era including the current one. E.G Ray Mercer, Tommy Morrison, Michael Moorer, Razor Ruddock to name a few a far better than today's offering, outside of the Klits!

I would argue that a lot of these guys like Peter in shape, Povetkin, Eddie Chambers in shape, Chagaev, Ibragimov would do really well in any era of boxing. I think they could beat a lot of the guys from the 90's, and maybe even guys like Holyfield, Bowe, and Tyson on the right night.

I think guys like Lewis and the Klitschko brothers are a new breed in boxing that simply have too much size and athleticism for them to lose baring poor preparation or a special punch landing. Wladimir used to be less defensively aware and he used to get caught with stupid punches considering his chin. I don't think its a bad thing he takes his lack of punch durability into account when he fights. Vitali looks awkward as hell, but he is undeniably effective.

I disagree Taeth, the Likes of Chambers, Peter, Chagaev etc would be pulverised by the likes of Mercer, Morrison Ruddock etc IMO. Christ, Chagaev got a very dodgy decision over Ruiz.

As for Lennox, he was a great HW but the 2 best names on his record were both past their best when he fought them. Now I always think Lewis-Tyson would be a tough one to call if you could put them in together prime for prime and I would probably still just swing for lennox but I think the Holyfield who battered Douglas or the man who beat Bowe in the rematch would have just been too good and too relentless for Lewis. IMO Evander should have called it a day after the Lennox fights and by now he would be regarded as the 3rd greatest HW of all time.

I'd love to be able to take a prime Muhammad Ali (whenever that was) and a 25 year old Foreman and put them in todays era. They would absolutely dominate IMO and Ali's speed, skill and accuracy would cause everyone including the Klits and Haye nightmares and Foremans Power would just knock all 3 clean out within 6 rounds each. Ali wasn't that bad a puncher either it's just it's overlooked a lot because it wasn't phenominal like his speed and skill and Foreman and Frazier were around Knocking everyone that moved out at the time too.

[El Kabong]

I disagree Taeth, the Likes of Chambers, Peter, Chagaev etc would be pulverised by the likes of Mercer, Morrison Ruddock etc IMO. Christ, Chagaev got a very dodgy decision over Ruiz.

As for Lennox, he was a great HW but the 2 best names on his record were both past their best when he fought them. Now I always think Lewis-Tyson would be a tough one to call if you could put them in together prime for prime and I would probably still just swing for lennox but I think the Holyfield who battered Douglas or the man who beat Bowe in the rematch would have just been too good and too relentless for Lewis. IMO Evander should have called it a day after the Lennox fights and by now he would be regarded as the 3rd greatest HW of all time.

I'd love to be able to take a prime Muhammad Ali (whenever that was) and a 25 year old Foreman and put them in todays era. They would absolutely dominate IMO and Ali's speed, skill and accuracy would cause everyone including the Klits and Haye nightmares and Foremans Power would just knock all 3 clean out within 6 rounds each. Ali wasn't that bad a puncher either it's just it's overlooked a lot because it wasn't phenominal like his speed and skill and Foreman and Frazier were around Knocking everyone that moved out at the time too.

Somehow in hindsight it's very easy to gloss over the flaws of guys like Mercer, Morrison, Ruddock, etc. I'm not disrespecting your view in any way shape or form, those guys were very solid fighters, but I'm just saying it's not like they didn't have their off nights just like today's crop of heavyweight contenders. Looking back on guys like Morrison it's easy to recall his big wins and how exciting of a fighter he was, but it's harder to recall the real troubles he had with mediocre fighters that nobody thinks are good, like Michael Bentt or Joe Hipp.

I think if we are to compare these guys we should probably compare certain fights to emphasize points for and against those contenders, eg I think Lamon Brewster could beat Tommy Morrison just based on Mercer-Morrison or Morrison-Bentt and Klitschko-Brewster I, but on the other hand I also think Morrison could outbox Lamon given Morrison-Foreman and Brewster-Lyakhovich. If you look at a whole career in an unbiased fashion you will have ups and downs and on some nights Ray Mercer should have been THE Heavyweight Champion of the world and on other nights he would be lucky to be considered a contender. The guys today can only fight who is in the division at the time, they shouldn't be judged against anyone else until their career is over or like Wlad they are a champion...then you can compare a little more fairly.

But it's ok to form some theories as to how ____ would do in today's division. I find myself wondering how Joe Mesi would handle a lot of these guys. I think that guy, although no great shakes as a pure boxer, was a very entertaining fighter and he was a very good puncher. I think he would have fallen short of a title but he would have given his all for it, it wouldn't have been some wasted opportunity. I think he would pair up well with a lot of the smaller heavyweights but perhaps Eddie Chambers gives him trouble. The bigger guys would crush him, he was too easy to hit. Mesi vs Povetkin or Boytsov would have been classic brawls (not comparing them to any of the all-time greats but the styles these guys have/had would have been great to see)!

[BIG H]

Top 10 in 1992

1 Evander Holyfield
2 Razor Ruddock
3.Riddick bowe
4 Lennox Lewis
5 Michael Moorer
6 Larry Homes
7 George Foreman
8 Tony Tucker
9 Ray Mercer
10.frank bruno

Top 10 2010

1 Wlad
2 Vitali
3 Haye
4 Povetkin
5 Adamek
6 Chagaev
7 Chambers
8 Boytsov
9 Valuev
10 Dimitrenk

I don't see anybody from 3-10 in 2010 beating anybody from 3 - 10 in 1992 and that includes the 2 grandads!

[Master]

Top 10 in 1992

1 Evander Holyfield
2 Razor Ruddock
3.Riddick bowe
4 Lennox Lewis
5 Michael Moorer
6 Larry Homes
7 George Foreman
8 Tony Tucker
9 Ray Mercer
10.frank bruno

Top 10 2010

1 Wlad
2 Vitali
3 Haye
4 Povetkin
5 Adamek
6 Chagaev
7 Chambers
8 Boytsov
9 Valuev
10 Dimitrenk

I don't see anybody from 3-10 in 2010 beating anybody from 3 - 10 in 1992 and that includes the 2 grandads!

Damn, you are right! That is bad.

[rjj tszyu]

Top 10 in 1992

1 Evander Holyfield
2 Razor Ruddock
3.Riddick bowe
4 Lennox Lewis
5 Michael Moorer
6 Larry Homes
7 George Foreman
8 Tony Tucker
9 Ray Mercer
10.frank bruno

Top 10 2010

1 Wlad
2 Vitali
3 Haye
4 Povetkin
5 Adamek
6 Chagaev
7 Chambers
8 Boytsov
9 Valuev
10 Dimitrenk

I don't see anybody from 3-10 in 2010 beating anybody from 3 - 10 in 1992 and that includes the 2 grandads!

Totally Agree BIG, and I'm a Haye fan!

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

Top 10 in 1992

1 Evander Holyfield
2 Razor Ruddock
3.Riddick bowe
4 Lennox Lewis
5 Michael Moorer
6 Larry Homes
7 George Foreman
8 Tony Tucker
9 Ray Mercer
10.frank bruno

Top 10 2010

1 Wlad
2 Vitali
3 Haye
4 Povetkin
5 Adamek
6 Chagaev
7 Chambers
8 Boytsov
9 Valuev
10 Dimitrenk

I don't see anybody from 3-10 in 2010 beating anybody from 3 - 10 in 1992 and that includes the 2 grandads!

This is that moment when you go ''Oh fuck! It's TRUE!''

2 divisions in class there mate.