Did that fight really make people believe that Manny will be able to beat Floyd?

[Taeth]

I remember after Floyd beat Marquez people were starting to retract their belief that Manny would just run rampant on Floyd if they fought. Then Manny faced COtto and Clottey and that instilled the same enthusiasm in his fans until Floyd beat up Mosley whom many felt both Manny and Floyd were ducking. THen Manny faced the guy who Floyd has been given the most flack for not fighting in Antonio Margarito, and Manny has looked great, but does anyone think that Floyd wouldn't have pitched an absolute shut out against a guy as ordinary in skill as Antonio?

To me Manny has been hand fed the same makeup of opponent since moving up in weight. They have given him guys who allow Manny to make the most of his style and his speed. Diaz, ODLH(weight-drained), Hatton, Cotto, CLottey, and Margarito are all guys who come forward, and with the exception of a younger Oscar and Clottey they are all easy to hit. I will be the first to give Manny credit for looking absolutely amazing and being so tireless in training so that he could give the kind of performances he did, but these were all guys right there in front of him, and when anyone stands just right there in front of Manny they are going to lose. The one guy actually of all of them that was IMO the most impressive win for Manny was against Hatton, because he actually has fast footwork and he uses angles coming in, but he couldn't overcome those huge mistakes that he makes against southpaws in particular, and Manny was the absolutely antithesis of the type of guy hatton could get away with those mistakes again. But these guys made Manny look like a non-stop punching machine with power, counter punching ability, a great chin, and great footwork, but I would like to disagree to a certain extent this belief. I think it's curious that Manny was able to throw more punches than he ever did earlier in his career against guys so much bigger than him, but then I looked a little more closely. Manny's angles, combinations all came when his opponents were rooted to the ground. When Manny was dancing around these guys, they were simply following him, and standing their ground. Manny was basically given a punching bag that followed him around, and nobody looks faster or better on a heavybag than Manny Pacquiao. Go back and watch Pacquiao-marquez II and see Marquez either beat Manny to the punch with his right hand or take a step back to get just out of range of Manny's attack. This is from a guy who isn't even a particularly good defensive fighter, but he had a antidote to Manny's offense that looked so relentless against Morales two fights earlier, and watch Barrera go against Manny the second time. Or Jorge Solis, watch how that movement took away Manny's punch output.

Now I think Floyd would mostly come forward against Manny, but I think it would be in a similar way he did against Judah. I don't think he would be particularly lead leg heavy, and he would stay light on his feet so if Manny tried to come in with a combination that he could move away quickly and wait for Manny to be off balance before coming in, but I think he would also use similar tactics as Marquez and beat Manny to the punch because Manny kind of drops his hands before he ever throws punches in bunches, and a guy like Floyd could tee off on that. Furthermore watch how good offensively Mosley looked against Margarito, he looked amazingly fast, well conditioned, etc, etc. Even at the advanced stage of his career, but Floyd negated him, not because he was physically faster than Mosley as much as he was so much sharper in the ring. Now I saw Manny look great throwing punches at Margarito, Cotto, CLottey, etc, but I also saw Manny getting hit by punches on the outside, he is an amazing combination puncher, but he isn't the greatest boxer on the outside, and I think all it take is movement to dissipate Manny's offensive combinations, and then you have Manny at his weakest element and that's trying to box like Mayweather, Leonard, RJJ, Hopkins do. Take away his output and he is like any other fast fighter that isn't "different". What makes Manny different is his speed and power combined with his stamina. Floyd arguably has better stamina and vastly superior technique with the same speed. We've seen Manny exploited in the fact that he lacks true technique and I don't think his recent fights have forced him to change that. In fact I think his sparring in preparation for this fight prove that if Manny isn't at his fastest that he has a hard time with relatively ordinary fighters. Whereas a guy with really great technique can adapt way easier to variables in the ring.

It doesnt matter who Pacquiao has to beat down, you will still say Pacquiao isnt as good as mayweather. But guess we will never truly know will we, because Floyd Mayweather is to big of Pussy to step into a ring with someone that can match and exceed his skills in every department. Floyd has never faced someone that can put together combinations the way Manny does. Do you really think "WHEN" Pacquiao landed that big shot that Mosley did that he wouldn't finish Mayweather off. Im really not sure why Im even waisting my time with this post. Mayweather nut hugging is in your genes and no amount of common sense is going to change your mind. Surely! Suuuuuuuurely! If Mayweather believed he could beat Manny "Pacman" Pacquiao and get the Biggest paycheck of his life, recieve more fame and adoration than ever before, and go down in history as arguably one of the best fighters of all time, he would take the fight. Mayweather does more harm for the sport than good and im sick of people idolizing someone that cherry picks his opponets, comes and goes giving no respect to the sport or fans and is a loser woman beater from a loser family. Mayweather dont bother coming back to boxing unless you want to face the P4p King. Arrogant, self proclaimed best ever, and rich and his little butts about to be owned by the state. Congratulations!

Mayweather to many is the p4p king in the sport, and there are two sides to the arguement. I don't think B-Hop and Roy Jones Jr were ever scared to face eachother. This fight not happening is more about ego than anything else. These guys both are trying to find an edge to prove themselves superior to the other, and have everyone believe the other is ducking them. Manny's camp has been cherry picking his opponents as much as Mayweather's has. Hatton had been beaten by Mayweather, as had ODLH. Cotto had a been physically damaged by Margarito then had a really tough fight against Clottey where he didn't look good. Clottey was a perfect opponent for Pacquiao's style. Margarito was demolished by Mosley then looked bad against Robert Garcia.

Mayweather and Pacquiao have foughten great opponents, but Mayweather fought a better version of Hatton, De La Hoya who had destroyed Mayorga and floyd moved up, and he faced Mosley who destroyed Margarito like aforementioned. How is that cherry picking his opponents?

Pacquiao wouldn't land that type of shot on Mayweather, he doesn't move in with punches the same Mosley does, nor does he throw a counter left like Judah that he would catch Floyd coming in, at least not with that type of power.

You say Floyd is a loser woman beater, but Manny has had numerous girlfriends on the side of his marriage, and he kicked out his last girlfriend because she got pregnant. Besides I'm not sure about every other situation, but Josey Harris has already accussed Mayweather of beating her then denying it in court. We haven't even heard the real story from both sides yet.

But there is nobody in the history of boxing that can step into the ring and exceed Mayweather's skills in every department, same can be said about Pacquiao. They are both great, but Floyd is better. It's just as the saying goes "offense gets the glory, but defense wins the game". Manny looks great when has a target to land on, and he is amazing when that is the case, but we've seen him look less than scintilatting against guys with movement. The one guy that made Floyd look back, he fought again and totally dominated. Manny did that to Morales, but couldn't against Marquez who is the closest guy to Mayweather that he has faced, and based on their fight they are still a world apart.

[Gandalf]

I remember after Floyd beat Marquez people were starting to retract their belief that Manny would just run rampant on Floyd if they fought. Then Manny faced COtto and Clottey and that instilled the same enthusiasm in his fans until Floyd beat up Mosley whom many felt both Manny and Floyd were ducking. THen Manny faced the guy who Floyd has been given the most flack for not fighting in Antonio Margarito, and Manny has looked great, but does anyone think that Floyd wouldn't have pitched an absolute shut out against a guy as ordinary in skill as Antonio?

To me Manny has been hand fed the same makeup of opponent since moving up in weight. They have given him guys who allow Manny to make the most of his style and his speed. Diaz, ODLH(weight-drained), Hatton, Cotto, CLottey, and Margarito are all guys who come forward, and with the exception of a younger Oscar and Clottey they are all easy to hit. I will be the first to give Manny credit for looking absolutely amazing and being so tireless in training so that he could give the kind of performances he did, but these were all guys right there in front of him, and when anyone stands just right there in front of Manny they are going to lose. The one guy actually of all of them that was IMO the most impressive win for Manny was against Hatton, because he actually has fast footwork and he uses angles coming in, but he couldn't overcome those huge mistakes that he makes against southpaws in particular, and Manny was the absolutely antithesis of the type of guy hatton could get away with those mistakes again. But these guys made Manny look like a non-stop punching machine with power, counter punching ability, a great chin, and great footwork, but I would like to disagree to a certain extent this belief. I think it's curious that Manny was able to throw more punches than he ever did earlier in his career against guys so much bigger than him, but then I looked a little more closely. Manny's angles, combinations all came when his opponents were rooted to the ground. When Manny was dancing around these guys, they were simply following him, and standing their ground. Manny was basically given a punching bag that followed him around, and nobody looks faster or better on a heavybag than Manny Pacquiao. Go back and watch Pacquiao-marquez II and see Marquez either beat Manny to the punch with his right hand or take a step back to get just out of range of Manny's attack. This is from a guy who isn't even a particularly good defensive fighter, but he had a antidote to Manny's offense that looked so relentless against Morales two fights earlier, and watch Barrera go against Manny the second time. Or Jorge Solis, watch how that movement took away Manny's punch output.

Now I think Floyd would mostly come forward against Manny, but I think it would be in a similar way he did against Judah. I don't think he would be particularly lead leg heavy, and he would stay light on his feet so if Manny tried to come in with a combination that he could move away quickly and wait for Manny to be off balance before coming in, but I think he would also use similar tactics as Marquez and beat Manny to the punch because Manny kind of drops his hands before he ever throws punches in bunches, and a guy like Floyd could tee off on that. Furthermore watch how good offensively Mosley looked against Margarito, he looked amazingly fast, well conditioned, etc, etc. Even at the advanced stage of his career, but Floyd negated him, not because he was physically faster than Mosley as much as he was so much sharper in the ring. Now I saw Manny look great throwing punches at Margarito, Cotto, CLottey, etc, but I also saw Manny getting hit by punches on the outside, he is an amazing combination puncher, but he isn't the greatest boxer on the outside, and I think all it take is movement to dissipate Manny's offensive combinations, and then you have Manny at his weakest element and that's trying to box like Mayweather, Leonard, RJJ, Hopkins do. Take away his output and he is like any other fast fighter that isn't "different". What makes Manny different is his speed and power combined with his stamina. Floyd arguably has better stamina and vastly superior technique with the same speed. We've seen Manny exploited in the fact that he lacks true technique and I don't think his recent fights have forced him to change that. In fact I think his sparring in preparation for this fight prove that if Manny isn't at his fastest that he has a hard time with relatively ordinary fighters. Whereas a guy with really great technique can adapt way easier to variables in the ring.

It doesnt matter who Pacquiao has to beat down, you will still say Pacquiao isnt as good as mayweather. But guess we will never truly know will we, because Floyd Mayweather is to big of Pussy to step into a ring with someone that can match and exceed his skills in every department. Floyd has never faced someone that can put together combinations the way Manny does. Do you really think "WHEN" Pacquiao landed that big shot that Mosley did that he wouldn't finish Mayweather off. Im really not sure why Im even waisting my time with this post. Mayweather nut hugging is in your genes and no amount of common sense is going to change your mind. Surely! Suuuuuuuurely! If Mayweather believed he could beat Manny "Pacman" Pacquiao and get the Biggest paycheck of his life, recieve more fame and adoration than ever before, and go down in history as arguably one of the best fighters of all time, he would take the fight. Mayweather does more harm for the sport than good and im sick of people idolizing someone that cherry picks his opponets, comes and goes giving no respect to the sport or fans and is a loser woman beater from a loser family. Mayweather dont bother coming back to boxing unless you want to face the P4p King. Arrogant, self proclaimed best ever, and rich and his little butts about to be owned by the state. Congratulations!

Mayweather to many is the p4p king in the sport, and there are two sides to the arguement. I don't think B-Hop and Roy Jones Jr were ever scared to face eachother. This fight not happening is more about ego than anything else. These guys both are trying to find an edge to prove themselves superior to the other, and have everyone believe the other is ducking them. Manny's camp has been cherry picking his opponents as much as Mayweather's has. Hatton had been beaten by Mayweather, as had ODLH. Cotto had a been physically damaged by Margarito then had a really tough fight against Clottey where he didn't look good. Clottey was a perfect opponent for Pacquiao's style. Margarito was demolished by Mosley then looked bad against Robert Garcia.

Mayweather and Pacquiao have foughten great opponents, but Mayweather fought a better version of Hatton, De La Hoya who had destroyed Mayorga and floyd moved up, and he faced Mosley who destroyed Margarito like aforementioned. How is that cherry picking his opponents?

Pacquiao wouldn't land that type of shot on Mayweather, he doesn't move in with punches the same Mosley does, nor does he throw a counter left like Judah that he would catch Floyd coming in, at least not with that type of power.

You say Floyd is a loser woman beater, but Manny has had numerous girlfriends on the side of his marriage, and he kicked out his last girlfriend because she got pregnant. Besides I'm not sure about every other situation, but Josey Harris has already accussed Mayweather of beating her then denying it in court. We haven't even heard the real story from both sides yet.

But there is nobody in the history of boxing that can step into the ring and exceed Mayweather's skills in every department, same can be said about Pacquiao. They are both great, but Floyd is better. It's just as the saying goes "offense gets the glory, but defense wins the game". Manny looks great when has a target to land on, and he is amazing when that is the case, but we've seen him look less than scintilatting against guys with movement. The one guy that made Floyd look back, he fought again and totally dominated. Manny did that to Morales, but couldn't against Marquez who is the closest guy to Mayweather that he has faced, and based on their fight they are still a world apart.

It is merely your opinion and until they fight you just don't know that. In terms of common opponents Pac has done the FAR more impressive work. Pacquiao would annihilate this version of Mosley too. Mosley doesn't have the defence to stop those combos bouncing off of his head. He's too old, just as he was too old and inactive for Floyd too. Pac would mess up a Marquez quite badly at 147 too. Mayweather pot shotted his way to victory. Pac would have messed him up.

Floyd is great, but Pac is beyond him right now and is the P4P best fighter and considering all the great work since the first Morales fight, the best fight of this century. Floyd has just coasted for FAR too long. He has been eclipsed.

[brucelee]

I remember after Floyd beat Marquez people were starting to retract their belief that Manny would just run rampant on Floyd if they fought. Then Manny faced COtto and Clottey and that instilled the same enthusiasm in his fans until Floyd beat up Mosley whom many felt both Manny and Floyd were ducking. THen Manny faced the guy who Floyd has been given the most flack for not fighting in Antonio Margarito, and Manny has looked great, but does anyone think that Floyd wouldn't have pitched an absolute shut out against a guy as ordinary in skill as Antonio?

To me Manny has been hand fed the same makeup of opponent since moving up in weight. They have given him guys who allow Manny to make the most of his style and his speed. Diaz, ODLH(weight-drained), Hatton, Cotto, CLottey, and Margarito are all guys who come forward, and with the exception of a younger Oscar and Clottey they are all easy to hit. I will be the first to give Manny credit for looking absolutely amazing and being so tireless in training so that he could give the kind of performances he did, but these were all guys right there in front of him, and when anyone stands just right there in front of Manny they are going to lose. The one guy actually of all of them that was IMO the most impressive win for Manny was against Hatton, because he actually has fast footwork and he uses angles coming in, but he couldn't overcome those huge mistakes that he makes against southpaws in particular, and Manny was the absolutely antithesis of the type of guy hatton could get away with those mistakes again. But these guys made Manny look like a non-stop punching machine with power, counter punching ability, a great chin, and great footwork, but I would like to disagree to a certain extent this belief. I think it's curious that Manny was able to throw more punches than he ever did earlier in his career against guys so much bigger than him, but then I looked a little more closely. Manny's angles, combinations all came when his opponents were rooted to the ground. When Manny was dancing around these guys, they were simply following him, and standing their ground. Manny was basically given a punching bag that followed him around, and nobody looks faster or better on a heavybag than Manny Pacquiao. Go back and watch Pacquiao-marquez II and see Marquez either beat Manny to the punch with his right hand or take a step back to get just out of range of Manny's attack. This is from a guy who isn't even a particularly good defensive fighter, but he had a antidote to Manny's offense that looked so relentless against Morales two fights earlier, and watch Barrera go against Manny the second time. Or Jorge Solis, watch how that movement took away Manny's punch output.

Now I think Floyd would mostly come forward against Manny, but I think it would be in a similar way he did against Judah. I don't think he would be particularly lead leg heavy, and he would stay light on his feet so if Manny tried to come in with a combination that he could move away quickly and wait for Manny to be off balance before coming in, but I think he would also use similar tactics as Marquez and beat Manny to the punch because Manny kind of drops his hands before he ever throws punches in bunches, and a guy like Floyd could tee off on that. Furthermore watch how good offensively Mosley looked against Margarito, he looked amazingly fast, well conditioned, etc, etc. Even at the advanced stage of his career, but Floyd negated him, not because he was physically faster than Mosley as much as he was so much sharper in the ring. Now I saw Manny look great throwing punches at Margarito, Cotto, CLottey, etc, but I also saw Manny getting hit by punches on the outside, he is an amazing combination puncher, but he isn't the greatest boxer on the outside, and I think all it take is movement to dissipate Manny's offensive combinations, and then you have Manny at his weakest element and that's trying to box like Mayweather, Leonard, RJJ, Hopkins do. Take away his output and he is like any other fast fighter that isn't "different". What makes Manny different is his speed and power combined with his stamina. Floyd arguably has better stamina and vastly superior technique with the same speed. We've seen Manny exploited in the fact that he lacks true technique and I don't think his recent fights have forced him to change that. In fact I think his sparring in preparation for this fight prove that if Manny isn't at his fastest that he has a hard time with relatively ordinary fighters. Whereas a guy with really great technique can adapt way easier to variables in the ring.

It doesnt matter who Pacquiao has to beat down, you will still say Pacquiao isnt as good as mayweather. But guess we will never truly know will we, because Floyd Mayweather is to big of Pussy to step into a ring with someone that can match and exceed his skills in every department. Floyd has never faced someone that can put together combinations the way Manny does. Do you really think "WHEN" Pacquiao landed that big shot that Mosley did that he wouldn't finish Mayweather off. Im really not sure why Im even waisting my time with this post. Mayweather nut hugging is in your genes and no amount of common sense is going to change your mind. Surely! Suuuuuuuurely! If Mayweather believed he could beat Manny "Pacman" Pacquiao and get the Biggest paycheck of his life, recieve more fame and adoration than ever before, and go down in history as arguably one of the best fighters of all time, he would take the fight. Mayweather does more harm for the sport than good and im sick of people idolizing someone that cherry picks his opponets, comes and goes giving no respect to the sport or fans and is a loser woman beater from a loser family. Mayweather dont bother coming back to boxing unless you want to face the P4p King. Arrogant, self proclaimed best ever, and rich and his little butts about to be owned by the state. Congratulations!

Mayweather to many is the p4p king in the sport, and there are two sides to the arguement. I don't think B-Hop and Roy Jones Jr were ever scared to face eachother. This fight not happening is more about ego than anything else. These guys both are trying to find an edge to prove themselves superior to the other, and have everyone believe the other is ducking them. Manny's camp has been cherry picking his opponents as much as Mayweather's has. Hatton had been beaten by Mayweather, as had ODLH. Cotto had a been physically damaged by Margarito then had a really tough fight against Clottey where he didn't look good. Clottey was a perfect opponent for Pacquiao's style. Margarito was demolished by Mosley then looked bad against Robert Garcia.

Mayweather and Pacquiao have foughten great opponents, but Mayweather fought a better version of Hatton, De La Hoya who had destroyed Mayorga and floyd moved up, and he faced Mosley who destroyed Margarito like aforementioned. How is that cherry picking his opponents?

Pacquiao wouldn't land that type of shot on Mayweather, he doesn't move in with punches the same Mosley does, nor does he throw a counter left like Judah that he would catch Floyd coming in, at least not with that type of power.

You say Floyd is a loser woman beater, but Manny has had numerous girlfriends on the side of his marriage, and he kicked out his last girlfriend because she got pregnant. Besides I'm not sure about every other situation, but Josey Harris has already accussed Mayweather of beating her then denying it in court. We haven't even heard the real story from both sides yet.

But there is nobody in the history of boxing that can step into the ring and exceed Mayweather's skills in every department, same can be said about Pacquiao. They are both great, but Floyd is better. It's just as the saying goes "offense gets the glory, but defense wins the game". Manny looks great when has a target to land on, and he is amazing when that is the case, but we've seen him look less than scintilatting against guys with movement. The one guy that made Floyd look back, he fought again and totally dominated. Manny did that to Morales, but couldn't against Marquez who is the closest guy to Mayweather that he has faced, and based on their fight they are still a world apart.

You can actually also make a case how Pac totally dominated DLH and Hatton with his offense while Mayweather had a hard time with them.

Manny is a different beast and there's no one in boxing right now that can be compared with him. Mayweather's defense will fall because he won't be able to see Pac's punches. Pac will corner him and Floyd can run (like Barrera did in the 2nd fight with Pac) and people will see him scared. If he fights Pac, Pac's weird angle shots will come into play and he won't risk being Knock out by Pac. Because the truth of the matter is, Pac does not only have SPEED in his arsenal. He also has POWER. That's the reason his opponents are shocked. MArgarito with his granite chin and his weight and height advantage did not take the risk of going against Pac because he knows Pac could rock him. Cotto and Hatton knows that.

[zhubin]

Manny is a different beast and there's no one in boxing right now that can be compared with him. Mayweather's defense will fall because he won't be able to see Pac's punches. Pac will corner him and Floyd can run (like Barrera did in the 2nd fight with Pac) and people will see him scared. If he fights Pac, Pac's weird angle shots will come into play and he won't risk being Knock out by Pac. Because the truth of the matter is, Pac does not only have SPEED in his arsenal. He also has POWER. That's the reason his opponents are shocked. MArgarito with his granite chin and his weight and height advantage did not take the risk of going against Pac because he knows Pac could rock him. Cotto and Hatton knows that. [/QUOTE]

You are either blind or stupid...or maybe both. Floyd had a hard time with Oscar and Hatton?!! Spoken like a true Pac nut hugger. Floyd schooled a much more live body Oscar. And Hatton had his will crushed against Floyd...another reason Ricky was easy pickings for Pac. Pac's defense is like swiss cheese. He gets tagged by limited, slow stiffs like Margerito. The difference is...slow guys like Tony can hit Pac...but they cannot avoid getting hit themselves. They play into Pac's hands by walking forward. Manny has not faced a prime, skilled fighter since Marquez in early 2008. Marquez showed the blue print on how to handle Manny. And you think Floyd won't do what Marquez did times 100??!!! Floyd doesn't give a damn how he wins. You think he will brawl to make people happy?! He has a plan a, b, and c. He can adapt however he needs. What happens when your hero realizes he does not have a come forward punching bag? What happens when Floyd tags him with laser like precision and then slips away using his unparalleled defense? How else will Pac fight? Keep drinking the kool aid.