10 Most Accomplished of My Lifetime

[marbleheadmaui]

This is going to be nearly impossible. But I guess that's the fun. Here are the rules. Anyone who had a significant chunk of there career from 1970 on counts (1970 was when I remember watching my first fight, Ali-Quarry). Here is the criteria I'm basing things on
1. Great fighters defeated (preference for them being in their prime and at their best weight)
2. Dominance in multiple divisions, taking on all comers
2. Dominance in a division, taking on all comers
4. THE MAN championships
5. Other extraordinary accomplishments
6. Extraordinary displays of fighting spirit (hey, it's my damned list!)
---------------------------------------------

1. Muhammad Ali-Defeated the greatest heavyweight roster in history. Liston, Frazier, Foreman, Patterson, Norton, Folley, Bonavena, Lyle and Shavers. First three time lineal heavyweight champion. 19 defenses. The first big, highly mobile heavyweight.

2. Roberto Duran-Defeated Ernest Marcel, Ken Buchanan, Esteban DeJesus, Carlos Palomino, Ray Leonard, Pipino Cuevas and then as an old man Davey Moore and Iran Barkley. 12 defenses of lightweight crown. Defeated atop three all-time 147 in his prime to become undisputed king there too and fought a top five all-time middle to a standstill. Arguably had two HOF careers, before and after No Mas.

3. Ray Leonard-Defeated Tommy Hearns, Wilfredo Benitez, Roberto Duran and Marvin Hagler. That's as good a top four as maybe anyone in history. His durability and overall activity levels keep him from being higher. A true great.

4. Pernell Whittaker-THE MAN at both 135 and 147 with a total of 18 defenses. Schooled Azumah Nelson and Julio Cesar Chavez. One of history's great defenders.

5. Ruben Olivares-THE MAN at 118 and 126. He ruled the greatest bantamweight era in history defeating Castillo, Medel, Burruni, Rose, Pimintel and then went to 126 and knocked off Chacon (twice). The finest bodypuncher I've ever seen.

6. Julio Cesar Chavez-THE MAN at 135 and 140, defeated Meldrick Taylor, Edwin Rosario, Hector Camacho, Juan LaPorte and Ruben Castillo. 16 defenses.

7. Carlos Monzon-THE MAN at 160 for seven years and 13 defenses. Beat HOFers Benvenuti (twice), Griffith (twice) and Napoles as well as Rodrigo Valdez. Closed his career with a 13 year, 70+ fight unbeaten run.

8. George Foreman-Really hard to rank. He destroyed Joe Frazier twice and Kenny Norton and had a slugfest with Ron Lyle. He's here for a simple reason. He did the impossible. He won the heavyweight crown 21 years apart.

9. Marvin Hagler-Dominated 160 like perhaps no one in history. Won every one of twelve defenses by KO except Duran. Defeated Briscoe, Watts, Antuofuermo, Duran, Hearns and Mugabi.

10. Manny Pacquiao-First man ever to win four lineal championships. One of the few in history to excel across five of the original divisions. Not higher because many of his biggest wins were against men no longer at their best weight or in their primes. Could well move higher.

It Kills me, KILLS ME, that Ricardo Lopez, Alexis Arguello, Jose Napoles, Mike Spinks, Evander Holyfield, Roy Jones, Chiquita Gonzales, Wilfredo Benitez, Khaosai Galaxy, Tito Trinidad, Azumah Nelson, Salvador Sanchez, Carlos Zarate, Erik Morales, Tommy Hearns, Eusabio Pedroza, The Bodysnatcher, James Toney, BHOP and Rafael Marquez aren't on this list. But I only had ten slots!

Who did I leave out and where am I wrong?

[generalbulldog]

You better remove Pacquiao from your list, the hounds will be unleashed against you.

[marbleheadmaui]

You better remove Pacquiao from your list, the hounds will be unleashed against you.

To be fair after about the first five slots I could make good arguments for maybe a dozen guys to take the last five. This kida stuff is impossible.

[IamInuit]

Don't expect a fast answer. I will have to give this some thought. The first fight I watched live was Ali/Chuvalo in 66 lol. In addition the hockey playoffs are on.

[marbleheadmaui]

Don't expect a fast answer. I will have to give this some thought. The first fight I watched live was Ali/Chuvalo in 66 lol. In addition the hockey playoffs are on.

Damn. You're OLD!

[ICB]

I got to say i like this new guy, he's very enthusiastic. As for your topic i have no idea but great topic, and my favourite on your list is Pernell Whitaker

[captainanddew]

Don't expect a fast answer. I will have to give this some thought. The first fight I watched live was Ali/Chuvalo in 66 lol. In addition the hockey playoffs are on.

Damn. You're OLD!

you're not one to speak my friend. You aren't exactly young.

I think Chavez has to be lower. Monson and Hagler are too low. As a sweetpea fan I can't have him below Ray Leonard. He is by far the best defender of your (and my since I'm younger than you) lifetime.

Though Floyd Mayweather Jr. shouldn't be on the list or mentioned among your honorable mentions, many boxing fans and writers would mention him at least among the honorable mentions (though I hate that SOB).

[marbleheadmaui]

Don't expect a fast answer. I will have to give this some thought. The first fight I watched live was Ali/Chuvalo in 66 lol. In addition the hockey playoffs are on.

Damn. You're OLD!

you're not one to speak my friend. You aren't exactly young.

I think Chavez has to be lower. Monson and Hagler are too low. As a sweetpea fan I can't have him below Ray Leonard. He is by far the best defender of your (and my since I'm younger than you) lifetime.

Though Floyd Mayweather Jr. shouldn't be on the list or mentioned among your honorable mentions, many boxing fans and writers would mention him at least among the honorable mentions (though I hate that SOB).

Hey! Hey! Yup, I probably shoulda mentioned Floyd. As for the others, as much as I love Pete? I'm not sure he ever beat anyone as good as the top four Leonard beat...unless you want to count the Chavez draw/win

[IamInuit]

Don't expect a fast answer. I will have to give this some thought. The first fight I watched live was Ali/Chuvalo in 66 lol. In addition the hockey playoffs are on.

Damn. You're OLD!

Perhaps. Perhaps you were 20 when you watched Ali/Quarry lol which would make me quite young.

[DaxxKahn]

Interesting thread...

Ali- He is Ali what else is there to say, 1st 3 time LEGIT HW champion, beat more HW legends then any other 2 hwts combined...reinvented himself more then once...Again he is Ali his accomplishments speak for themselves

Mike Tyson- Like Ali an easy answer is He's Mike Tyson and that should be good enough. His best days had questionable comp but man did he walk through guys, Until his decline he dominated like no other HW...His over all attraction to the sport...Youngest HW champion, some of the largest live gates ever, one of if not the biggest PPV attraction of all time...remember PPV was just getting off the ground when Tyson was selling more then most of todays guys...He always kept you wanting more!!! Not many fighters have that ability despite what they can do in the ring

Roy Jones Jr- Middleweight, Super Middleweight, Light Heavyweight and HW champion, had skill we had never seen ina fighter, his athletic ability at MW and SMW were nothing short of jaw dropping, he DOMINATED his weight classes for years..5 or 6 time time world champion

Oscar De La Hoya- six division world champion, maybe the most popular fighter since Ali in terms of fanbase and drawing ability, fought the best competiton available he sought them out!!! Faced JCC, Pernell, Hopkins, PBF, Mosley, Trinidad, Quartey, Pacquiao.Vargas, Campas, Gatti, JJL, Paez, Ruelas, Hernandez,Camacho and the list goes on...Plus went on to be one of the most successful promoters ever....DLH wins even when he loses because he doesnt lose fans and uses the bout to further boxing one way or another

Sugar Ray Leonard- WW, JMW, MW, SMW and LHW world champion, fought Hagler, Hearns, Duran, Benitez, was not until after some wars and eye injuries did he ever look ordinary, popular top resume champion 5 weight classes three of the most memorible rivalries ever.....

[C-Lo]

I got to say i like this new guy, he's very enthusiastic. As for your topic i have no idea but great topic, and my favourite on your list is Pernell Whitaker

I agree! I like people who are unbiased and can stick to the topic while also posting quality replies. Great addition here at saddo.

[DaxxKahn]

Pernell Whitaker- This guy was slick as hell in the ring...I wish he was prime today a bout against Mayweather would be a boxing fans dream in terms of tecnique...was a world champion in one form or another for almost a decade....one of the greatest boxers of all time who until his later years when he stopped training as hard as he partied he was unbeatable

Roberto Duran- Over 100 career wins, was champion in 4 weight classes, had some of the most memorable fights win or lose of the last 40 years, tough as nails and overtime we thought he was done at an elite level he came back to prove the world wrong...The announcement of his name gave fans goosebumps because they knew they were in for a war...Was one of the most intimidating fighters of all time as well

Floyd Mayweather JR- Love him or hate him you can not deny his skill set and the fact he has claimed world titles in 5 weight classes, one of the most defensively skilled fighters ever. Can be exciting if he chooses but no matter what he gives us some sort of clinic against elite opponents one of the era biggest draws recently long time pound for pound best one of the ATG's and most successful fighters period let alone of my time

Manny Pacquiao- Again Love him or hate him the man holds titles in 8 different weight classes, has fought and beaten some of our eras biggest legends...only legitimate loss in his career is against Morales (You cant count losses at 15,16 yrs old in bouts against grown men) Only truly tested against JMM...Made himself a legend by battering bigger men.....An international celebertiy that just adds attention to the sport...pound for pound kingpin like Floyd one of the most successful fighters ever not just of my generation

[marbleheadmaui]

Interesting thread...

Ali- He is Ali what else is there to say, 1st 3 time LEGIT HW champion, beat more HW legends then any other 2 hwts combined...reinvented himself more then once...Again he is Ali his accomplishments speak for themselves

Mike Tyson- Like Ali an easy answer is He's Mike Tyson and that should be good enough. His best days had questionable comp but man did he walk through guys, Until his decline he dominated like no other HW...His over all attraction to the sport...Youngest HW champion, some of the largest live gates ever, one of if not the biggest PPV attraction of all time...remember PPV was just getting off the ground when Tyson was selling more then most of todays guys...He always kept you wanting more!!! Not many fighters have that ability despite what they can do in the ring

Roy Jones Jr- Middleweight, Super Middleweight, Light Heavyweight and HW champion, had skill we had never seen ina fighter, his athletic ability at MW and SMW were nothing short of jaw dropping, he DOMINATED his weight classes for years..5 or 6 time time world champion

Oscar De La Hoya- six division world champion, maybe the most popular fighter since Ali in terms of fanbase and drawing ability, fought the best competiton available he sought them out!!! Faced JCC, Pernell, Hopkins, PBF, Mosley, Trinidad, Quartey, Pacquiao.Vargas, Campas, Gatti, JJL, Paez, Ruelas, Hernandez,Camacho and the list goes on...Plus went on to be one of the most successful promoters ever....DLH wins even when he loses because he doesnt lose fans and uses the bout to further boxing one way or another

Sugar Ray Leonard- WW, JMW, MW, SMW and LHW world champion, fought Hagler, Hearns, Duran, Benitez, was not until after some wars and eye injuries did he ever look ordinary, popular top resume champion 5 weight classes three of the most memorible rivalries ever.....

Thanks for your thoughts. A couple of counters
1. The only way Tyson can make a list like this is if you add entertainment as a criteria. He was a THE MAN champ with two defenses. And he was NOT the champion until he defeated Spinks. More on that below.
2. The equating of alphabet belts with true champions is a curse of the last 15 years. It literally is Bullspit. If you're an American it is equating division champs with the World Series Champ. If you're a soccer fan it is like equating World Cup semi-finalists with the WC champion. The alphabet straps literally are meaningless in determining a champion. For that concept to have meaning in boxing it is because the title is WORLD Champion. That means there can only be one per division at a time.

Let's look at Roy Jones as an example.
160-He beat BHOP for a vacant strap. At the time BHOP was the 8th ranked middle in the world. At the time the middles were a mess and stayed that way for another seven years. In NO sense was Jones CHAMPION here the way Hagler or Monzon was.
168-Again, an enormously muddled division. Jones claim rests on his defeat of James Toney. A GREAT win. But why was Toney a strapholder? he'd taken it from Tony Thornton, ranked #8 at 168. The lineal champion at that time was Michael Nunn who had taken the crown from Victor Cordoba who had taken it from Chris Tiozzo etc. Roy has no legit claim here either.
175-This one is easiest of all. Darius Michlashewski won, in the ring, every belt Roy held here. It was simply stripped because Darius wouldn't pay sanctioning fees...and Roy wouldn't fight him. Zero claim
Heavyweight-John Ruiz? Come on. Lennox Lewis was the lineal champ in a line going back all the way to Patterson.

A last point on Jones. He had monster TALENT, his skill set was seriously deficient. His footwork was awful, he had no jab, his balance was only ok, it's just that he was blessed with such amazing natural gifts he was able to win in spite of mediocre skills.

By comparison, in the days of eight divisions and one champ per? THE WORST champion had the equivalent of eight of today's belts and two division champions like Robinson had the equivalent of 16 and Henry Armstrong held every belt between 126 and 154. That's 24 belts.

See how silly this gets when one values the alphabet straps!


Oscar was THE MAN in two divisions. A fine fighter. But the only way he makes a list like this is if you count entertainment value rather than in-ring accomplishment.

Leonard belongs though I think my reasons are far better than yours

[marbleheadmaui]

Don't expect a fast answer. I will have to give this some thought. The first fight I watched live was Ali/Chuvalo in 66 lol. In addition the hockey playoffs are on.

Damn. You're OLD!

Perhaps. Perhaps you were 20 when you watched Ali/Quarry lol which would make me quite young.

LOL, I'm 47.

[IamInuit]

Don't expect a fast answer. I will have to give this some thought. The first fight I watched live was Ali/Chuvalo in 66 lol. In addition the hockey playoffs are on.

Damn. You're OLD!

Perhaps. Perhaps you were 20 when you watched Ali/Quarry lol which would make me quite young.

LOL, I'm 47.

52. Lol we started watching at roughly the same age. 8.