Ring Magazine top 10 P4P as of 12th June 2006.

[MRMANICK]

Will someone explain to me why MAB would be ahead of Joe Calzaghe? He struggled with Rocky, will more than likely get destroyed by Pac if it happens again. Just a bit confused on that one..

I'll tell you why. Cause rocky is probably better than anyone joe has faced in the past 5 years. But take away the rocky fight and mab has still fought and beat way better guys than joe ever has and probably ever will.

[El Gamo]

Will someone explain to me why MAB would be ahead of Joe Calzaghe? He struggled with Rocky, will more than likely get destroyed by Pac if it happens again. Just a bit confused on that one..

MAB has beaten more A grade fighters than JC,has a great trilogy,multiple weight champ,front foot and back foot fighter,brilliant D etc etc You can't just base positions from MAB's last fight. and I am a JC fan so I'm not being biased.It may or may not be Joe's fault but his level of overall competition is nowhere near Mab's:Hamed,EM,Pac,Juarez,Junior Jones,Mckinnedy etc etc. JC is great though but I don't think he should be high than MAB.

My list:

1-pbf
2-pac man
3-winky wright
4-bernard hopkins
5-R.Marquez
6-barrera
7-hatton
8-joe c
9- j taylor
10-arce

I put pac ahead of wright cause i don't think him beating the smaller mosley and the semi-retired trinidad is all that but he hasn't lost in a while. The only reason i got jt up there is cause in a sense i have too. I can't take the W away from him even though i don't think he deserved it. But in a pound for pound sense i can see him losing to alot of people.I would have hatton lower too but he has fought 3 title fights in a row. Even though i think maussa and collazo(i feel collazo won) are weak opponents he did win.Joe only gets on cause of his longevity. I think most of his opponents were weak including lacy but he is undefeated and has defended his paper title 17 times so i have too.I love arce. If he fights and beats martin castillo i would bump him up like 3 spaces.Hes been undefeated for a while now and has fought a lot of game fighters. I respect that. Well thats my list. Some may like it some may not but i think its fair.

Not a bad list but I just can't put B Hop that high as his record in the last 3 fights include 2 losses so to have him higher than JT would feel weird,and I have Winky at number for great wins and P4P,I don't see anyone beating that style and when he beats JT,he will consolidate that.I like that you have Arce and Marquez there though.I wouldn't have Rafael that high yet though,he needs some more big fights.
Bilbo,that's what I am saying,B Hop lost the fights rather than JT winning them.Had Hop gone full throttle,we would still be calling him P4P number 1 right now.

[Bookkeeper]

Isn't it amazing how we can all watch the same thing's and have hundreds of different perceptions. This is the site ever.

[El Gamo]

Isn't it amazing how we can all watch the same thing's and have hundreds of different perceptions. This is the site ever.

True true,and did you mean this is the "best" site ever?

[raleights]

Makes sense, but their past opposition doesn't concern me when it comes to P4P rankings. What concerns me is how good the fighter is right now. MAB has lost a step or 2, and IMUO (in my uneducated opinion) no way is he on the same playing field as JC.

[Bookkeeper]

Isn't it amazing how we can all watch the same thing's and have hundreds of different perceptions. This is the site ever.

True true,and did you mean this is the "best" site ever?

Yea, I meant the best, when you get old your mind misses thing's. Good pick up.

[El Gamo]

Makes sense, but their past opposition doesn't concern me when it comes to P4P rankings. What concerns me is how good the fighter is right now. MAB has lost a step or 2, and IMEO (in my uneducated opinion) no way is he on the same playing field as JC.

Fair enough,but then your P4P list must change like every week!! Past opposition matters to me otherwise 1 big win and a fighter can be elevated too high up in my humble opinion and even then,no disrespect to Lacy but he was unproven,much like Juarez.

[raleights]

Does the fact that MAB looks like a rabies infected sheep hound help put JC ahead of him at all? Can't blame me for trying to help ol Joe out, if I'm not gonna what American will

[MRMANICK]

Will someone explain to me why MAB would be ahead of Joe Calzaghe? He struggled with Rocky, will more than likely get destroyed by Pac if it happens again. Just a bit confused on that one..

MAB has beaten more A grade fighters than JC,has a great trilogy,multiple weight champ,front foot and back foot fighter,brilliant D etc etc You can't just base positions from MAB's last fight. and I am a JC fan so I'm not being biased.It may or may not be Joe's fault but his level of overall competition is nowhere near Mab's:Hamed,EM,Pac,Juarez,Junior Jones,Mckinnedy etc etc. JC is great though but I don't think he should be high than MAB.

My list:

1-pbf
2-pac man
3-winky wright
4-bernard hopkins
5-R.Marquez
6-barrera
7-hatton
8-joe c
9- j taylor
10-arce

I put pac ahead of wright cause i don't think him beating the smaller mosley and the semi-retired trinidad is all that but he hasn't lost in a while. The only reason i got jt up there is cause in a sense i have too. I can't take the W away from him even though i don't think he deserved it. But in a pound for pound sense i can see him losing to alot of people.I would have hatton lower too but he has fought 3 title fights in a row. Even though i think maussa and collazo(i feel collazo won) are weak opponents he did win.Joe only gets on cause of his longevity. I think most of his opponents were weak including lacy but he is undefeated and has defended his paper title 17 times so i have too.I love arce. If he fights and beats martin castillo i would bump him up like 3 spaces.Hes been undefeated for a while now and has fought a lot of game fighters. I respect that. Well thats my list. Some may like it some may not but i think its fair.

Not a bad list but I just can't put B Hop that high as his record in the last 3 fights include 2 losses so to have him higher than JT would feel weird,and I have Winky at number for great wins and P4P,I don't see anyone beating that style and when he beats JT,he will consolidate that.I like that you have Arce and Marquez there though.I wouldn't have Rafael that high yet though,he needs some more big fights.
Bilbo,that's what I am saying,B Hop lost the fights rather than JT winning them.Had Hop gone full throttle,we would still be calling him P4P number 1 right now.

I see what you saying but you gotta admit the kid got beat up in both fights(worst in the first fight)but got the W. So will i call him the #1 MW? Yes i have too but he in no way in a pound for pound sense is he better than bernard hopkins only younger. I can't reward a guy for looking like an amateur. I just can't. Only 1 man showed pound for pound skill in that ring regardless of the desicion.

[El Gamo]

Nice way of looking at it again Mr.Manick but again,we can't argue with the facts,open any book 10 years from now(or whenever)and it will say JT beat BHop and for that reason I can't have him higher.I had JT winning the second and B Hop winning the first.Out of interest,why you think JT looked amatuer?? I'm not a boxing expert or anything but I noticed that arrow thing he does when punching(ie pulling back one hand whilst punching with the other,leaving himself open)

[MRMANICK]

Nice way of looking at it again Mr.Manick but again,we can't argue with the facts,open any book 10 years from now(or whenever)and it will say JT beat BHop and for that reason I can't have him higher.I had JT winning the second and B Hop winning the first.Out of interest,why you think JT looked amatuer?? I'm not a boxing expert or anything but I noticed that arrow thing he does when punching(ie pulling back one hand whilst punching with the other,leaving himself open)

Well be sides for the bow and arrow his movement was sloppy and his punches were telegraphed. He only threw one combo and that was jab,jab, overhand right and he couldn't land it. How many times must you get hit with lead rights before you say to yourself maybe i should start blocking those and when he got hit in the later round he almost looked like he was in a panic. Why would you turn your back on punches? That could have got him seriously hurt and i'm surprised hop didn't hit him when he kept doin it.People talk about his jab but once he got in the ring with a skilled fighter it didn't mean much. All and all he looked like an amateur. His youthful aggression in the early rounds is what saved him. But forget prime for prime i say age for age the 27 year old still a little green hopkins would have koed the 27 year green taylor and the hop of 4 years ago would have hospitalized him if he fought like that. Taylor is smart. He got him at just the right time.

[Howlin Mad Missy]

why no ODH? Hatton beats one name and makes the list? Castillo shouldn't be there either.

Because Dela Hoya has fought once in last 2 years, and beat a guy who was probably not in the top 50 p4p in Mayorga, priror to that he had lost two out of three, so how can he be top 10 please tell me?

On the other hand Hatton has won three belts in his last three fights and also moved up weight oh and i forgot the first of those three fights was against most peoples p4p No.3, who had not been beaton for the previous eight years, so does that explain it for you??

I'll explain it to YOU Hatton has ONE name on his record DLH has a ton. ONE fight does not shoot you in to the P4P list, that's why they screwed up. Longevity at the top and continuing to beat class fighters and the way you beat them gets you a P4P

[skel1983]

why no ODH? Hatton beats one name and makes the list? Castillo shouldn't be there either.

Because Dela Hoya has fought once in last 2 years, and beat a guy who was probably not in the top 50 p4p in Mayorga, priror to that he had lost two out of three, so how can he be top 10 please tell me?

On the other hand Hatton has won three belts in his last three fights and also moved up weight oh and i forgot the first of those three fights was against most peoples p4p No.3, who had not been beaton for the previous eight years, so does that explain it for you??

I'll explain it to YOU Hatton has ONE name on his record DLH has a ton. ONE fight does not shoot you in to the P4P list, that's why they screwed up. Longevity at the top and continuing to beat class fighters and the way you beat them gets you a P4P

Well go and ask teveryone on here there P4p, hardly anyone would have Dela Hoya on it, longevity?? The guy has fought once in the last two years against a guy who was knocked about the ring like a rag doll previous by Trinadad? Dela Hoya has been beaton in 2 of his last three coming into that fight, he is not P4p at the moment, this is the current P4P, not from 3/4 years ago.


When has Dela Hoya continued to beat class guys thats the main reson he aint on there, he was KO by Hopkins and beaton by Mosley and put in a shocking show Strum, so he hasnt continued to beat class fighters has he??

[BigLuke]

I have Winky@1,B Hop,as amazing as he is (and I think he beat JT at least once_),I don't think should be there.He has lost 2 of his last 3.The history books will say JT beat B Hop twice so he should be there more than B Hop.JLC should defintely not be there anymore and Wonjongkam does not deserve to be there more than Arce/Calderon.

I see what you are saying but if hop shouldn't be there than neither should taylor.A disputed win over one man should not get you on the list. I didn't even put hatton on list at first and he stopped tszyu. Why?Cause fighting and beating 1 man does not prove you are pound for pound. It proves you have potential.Hop didn't get on the list for 1 guy. He worked hard for years and only hit the top during the end of his career.Imo taylor lost those fights and looked like a novice in both. That ain't the stuff pound for pounders are made of.

Wow,nice stuf,CC bro.Looking at it your way though would mean leaving out Hatton and JT,can you do me your P4P list then??Just out of interest.

Taylor should be there, the hate this guy gets is incredible.

If Taylor looked S*** in his two fights with Hopkins then Hopkins obviously looked even more so.

Hopkins beat Tarver, but lets be honest Tarver just wasn't there that night. I reckon Virgil Hill or Thomas Hearns could have beat him on that showing.

It's not hate,I like the guy but the first fight could have gone either way,the second to JT but in neither fight did he look like a world beater.He looked OK....at best.He was fighting a 40 year old albeit a wily one but you would think he would have let his hands go more etc People see it more as Bernard losing than Taylor winning and I can concur with that view.Evidence of that can be seen in the latter stages of fight 1 where B Hop,upped the work rate a tiny bit and Taylor could not handle it.


Ok,sooo,I'm buzzing,Mr Manicks outlook has changed my own view on P4P,maybe I have Hatton too high,I mean it is not only skill but who you have beaten etc is 1 admittedly A* win enough for top 5 position??Let's talk people.

I'm tired of all this 40 year old talk. Bernard Hopkins may have been 40 but he was like no 40 year old to ever fight in the ring. Bernard Hopkins was as good then as he ever was. Dont bring that to the table.

[Howlin Mad Missy]

why no ODH? Hatton beats one name and makes the list? Castillo shouldn't be there either.

Because Dela Hoya has fought once in last 2 years, and beat a guy who was probably not in the top 50 p4p in Mayorga, priror to that he had lost two out of three, so how can he be top 10 please tell me?

On the other hand Hatton has won three belts in his last three fights and also moved up weight oh and i forgot the first of those three fights was against most peoples p4p No.3, who had not been beaton for the previous eight years, so does that explain it for you??

I'll explain it to YOU Hatton has ONE name on his record DLH has a ton. ONE fight does not shoot you in to the P4P list, that's why they screwed up. Longevity at the top and continuing to beat class fighters and the way you beat them gets you a P4P

Well go and ask teveryone on here there P4p, hardly anyone would have Dela Hoya on it, longevity?? The guy has fought once in the last two years against a guy who was knocked about the ring like a rag doll previous by Trinadad? Dela Hoya has been beaton in 2 of his last three coming into that fight, he is not P4p at the moment, this is the current P4P, not from 3/4 years ago.


When has Dela Hoya continued to beat class guys thats the main reson he aint on there, he was KO by Hopkins and beaton by Mosley and put in a shocking show Strum, so he hasnt continued to beat class fighters has he??

funny thing that, plenty of people picked Mayorga to beat DLH and now people are picking DLH to beat PBF he is still deserves P4P ranking IMO.