Was the performance of B-Hop against Tarver enough to win over Roy?

[superlyrical]

people keep saying that if hopkins fought the way he did against taylor he would win...no he wouldnt


why you ask? because HE DID fight the same way as he did tarver


as much as jermain showed bernard respect in that fight..so did hopkins


jermain was aware of not walking into that right hand (too much)

and when he did go in he usually jabbed or double jabbed

hopkins did not initiate because he was aware of taylors power and speed advantage
so he had to wait until taylor slowed down a bit to make his move.

if they fought 3 more times the result would be the same..with taylor getting a wider win each time

[JonesJrMayweather]

I think all of you are seriously overrating something

What you all need to realise was that it wasn't a different Hopkins from the one that fought Taylor, it was just a different OPPONENT!!! Hopkins didn't change, the opponent did

You have to realize that when a fighter wins in impressive fashion many believe that he did something fantastic...i think the performance was heighten by tarver's weight loss...not hop would have lost, but it would have been closer.. and yeah hop looked the same as he always does, his performance against tito was way more impressive...

listen bhop is great..but lest not forget tarver was obviously hindered by the weight loss..and i seriously doubt the fight would have been so one sided had tarver not gone up to to film the movie...but to be roy no...hop would still get hit coming in trying to lunge and grab...roy by SD this time instead of UD

Whoa i know your a fan and all but roys chins is GONE. He was afraid to engage Johnson and Tarver and you think he would come in on hop. Lets be real. If you said this a few years ago i would agree but i feel like any one of those right hands that hop landed on tarver would ko jones. Did you see the punch that johnson hit him with? It was weak and it knocked him out cold. What about that right tarver hit him with? That was weak too and he was on queer street. At this point anyone who is not afraid to come in on roy will beat him. I wouldn't be surprised if that prince guy kos him. I love roy but he is done. I wish he would retire before he gets hurt.

listen bhop is great..but lest not forget tarver was obviously hindered by the weight loss..and i seriously doubt the fight would have been so one sided had tarver not gone up to to film the movie...but to be roy no...hop would still get hit coming in trying to lunge and grab...roy by SD this time instead of UD

That's what I am thinking about that's why I started this post. The lunge and hold for B-hop, can he catch Roy like that, given that Roy stays so low. But now, we may never know. This match has been boiling for ages shame that it didn't happen.

Are you 2 serious? If johnson can catch him why couldn't hop. You forget hops got a good chin,great defense and revenge on his mind. He would come after roy hard and be willing to take a few to get in knowing roy won't commit on any hard punches out of fear of being koed.Like i said i love roy but its over.

MRMANICK

Here's the problem I got...Hopkins defeated Tarver & beat him at his game more convincingly than anyone ever has...& people are going to use the weight excuse to detract from it?

Shameful.

Then again...that's why I think that Jones performed so poorly...but if anyone here thinks that Hopkins wouldn't have still won regardless...I gotta laugh.

Hopkins was back to his old game & that's what defeated Tarver...he fought a different fight than the one against Taylor...to say he didn't is ludicrous.

He was the agressor & he threw caution to the wind & he took the fight to Tarver.

you do know that eric harding kicked tarver's a** 116-111, breaking his jaw in the process...and it might be wishful thinking that roy would beat hop now, but i haven't seen any real drastic changes in hop's game since the first time they fought...hop might win but it would be due to Roy being over the hill not hop's progression....

You do know that antonio tarver kicked roy jones a**, knocking him out cold in 2 rounds.........he may not have made any drastic changes but he did make changes and got better but roy has been fighting the same way since 94 and that why he got knocked out. Weight ain't have nothing to do with it. He walked right into a left hand. Losing weight doesn't make you constantly move to your right against a southpaw. Hes been doing the wrong things for years and he finally paid for it.......roy might have beat him pre-tarver but he would definitely lose now.

I got a question for you. Why did roy move up 2 175? Was it the challenge? Please tell what fighter was at 175 that was supposed to test jones?Like i said i like jones but he only moved up cause he knew there wasn't anyone there for him. Damn i mean he wouldn't even fight the real champ but instead fights the guy that the champ already beat(virgil hill). Roy has been smoke and mirrors since 1995 and as soon as he met someone who wasn't mesmerized by his "legend" he got beat.

if tarver doesn't fully get credit for beating roy because of the weight..why should bhop...i seem to think that your offended by people saying that tarver was weight drained...yeah hop might have won but the margin of victory wouldn't have been that great...and as far telling you who roy beat at LHW and al this about someone not being memerized by his legend....you do know that it took 16 years for someone to come along and not be memerized at you put it...i find that a bit convienent considering that was 36 and by his own admission said he'd had nothing else to prove after the ruiz fight...

Now you tell me why was it that bhop stayed at middle for so long? Oh wait Bernard himself already said because the risks were lower than going up to SMW or LHW and he could capitalize on the weak MW division and break the record...

And Darius could have came over here to fight roy...I mean did sit ringside at the JOnes v Hill fight...but after he saw that body shot he hauled ass never to return...and didn't darius lose to gonazales the same fighter that roy toyed with for 12 rounds knocking him down three times too...

I can't decide if it's either your love fo bhop or your disliking for RJJ that makes you not accept the fact that prime vs prime roy beats bernard 10 out 10 times...now bernard would probably win because roy is over the hill and that's the only reason why...not because bernard has a great game plan or anything like that...roy is over the hill period...

[Wacko3205]

I can't decide if it's either your love fo bhop or your disliking for RJJ that makes you not accept the fact that prime vs prime roy beats bernard 10 out 10 times...now bernard would probably win because roy is over the hill and that's the only reason why...not because bernard has a great game plan or anything like that...roy is over the hill period...

I can't decide if it's your blind love for Jones that keeps you from realizing that the fight between Jones vs Hopkins was a lot closer than HBO said it was...or if it's the fact that you just took Jones's fight against Hopkins for what HBO tried to paint it out to be...a wipe out.

The fact of the matter is that no one...I don't give two flyin shats who they think they are or what they know or profess to know...can say that Jones prime & Hopkins prime would be 10 out of 10 times wins.

I like both fighters...but to say something like that just shows bias.

Tarver destroyed Jones...Hopkins destroyed Tarver...weight or what not...a win is a win is a win.

Hopkins deserves the credit for beating a weight drained Tarver as much as Tarver deserves the credit for besting/beating a weight drained Jones & then knocking out a half ass prepared Jones & then beating a prepared Jones the third go around.

[MRMANICK]

if tarver doesn't fully get credit for beating roy because of the weight..why should bhop...i seem to think that your offended by people saying that tarver was weight drained...yeah hop might have won but the margin of victory wouldn't have been that great...and as far telling you who roy beat at LHW and al this about someone not being memerized by his legend....you do know that it took 16 years for someone to come along and not be memerized at you put it...i find that a bit convienent considering that was 36 and by his own admission said he'd had nothing else to prove after the ruiz fight...

Now you tell me why was it that bhop stayed at middle for so long? Oh wait Bernard himself already said because the risks were lower than going up to SMW or LHW and he could capitalize on the weak MW division and break the record...

And Darius could have came over here to fight roy...I mean did sit ringside at the JOnes v Hill fight...but after he saw that body shot he hauled a** never to return...and didn't darius lose to gonazales the same fighter that roy toyed with for 12 rounds knocking him down three times too...

I can't decide if it's either your love fo bhop or your disliking for RJJ that makes you not accept the fact that prime vs prime roy beats bernard 10 out 10 times...now bernard would probably win because roy is over the hill and that's the only reason why...not because bernard has a great game plan or anything like that...roy is over the hill period...


Its funny that you say that cause the truth is i'm a big fan of both. I had roys career set before he fought ruiz. So this love hop hate roy thing is crazy. And as far as what i'm saying about roy its nothing that boxing experts haven't been saying for years.If he had nothing to prove after the ruiz fight then why did he fight? He had nothing to prove right.I love roy and i think he was a great fighter but the truth is he hadn't fought a worty opponent since toney. That was always the knock on him and i agree.As far as hop not leaving mw you are putting words in his mouth. I got the tape and he didn't say all that but i think you misunderstood. Roy was gettin 2-3 mil to fight nobodies at lhw. Do you think hop would of got that type of money?He was already getting paid crap at mw so hes supposed to move up and have to fight extra hard to still get crap? Would you have done that? The only fight at 175 that woud of gave him money was a roy fight. But if he stays at mw he had potential superfights with oscar,tito,vargas, he would of made more fighting david reid than any at lhw besides roy. He did the smart thing.

As far as Darius goes he was the champ point blank. It don't matter where he from he was the CHAMP.If roy wanted to be the real champ he should have went over. Come on if for example joe c moved up when roy was on top you would expect him to come to america to fight jones wouldn't you? not the other way around.To be the man you gotta beat the man and roy didn't beat the man.It don't matter if he went on to lose to julio cause that was years after jones got there.It don't change the fact that roy didn't want to fight him but instead fought his victims.

You still didn't answer my question about why roy moved up when there was better comp at 160 and 168.

[JonesJrMayweather]

I didn't answer because i can't intelligently specualte about why he moved up other than to win the title in different weight classes..other than that i don't know...besides bernard should be happy roy moved up because that's why he got to "dominate" MW division for so long...courtesy of roy jones leaving the division...but its cool though..benard did what every other
graduate of "THE PRIME ROY JONES SCHOOL OF ASSWHOOPING" was supposed to do and that's go be a champ...

just like: Eric lucas, james toney, julio gonzales, lou de valle, otis grant, clinton woods, montel griffin, eric harding, virgil hill, john ruiz, derek harmon, vinny paz, thomas tate, thulani malinga...including bernard that makes 15 fighters that won titles after roy beat them... as opposed to

Bernard: oscar de la hoya, glen johnson, william joppy that's three. two of his title defenses came against two men he'd already beaten soundedly...

Now you tell me during their reigns who fought better competiton roy of bernard?

DISCLAIMER: This is not my attempt to discredit the great career of BHOP, I'm simply making a point not to get overly excited about what bhop has done and what he's actually done. He was great. But by no means is he or was he anywhere near RJJ...the only thing bernard did better than roy was get out of the sport when he should..

[Purist]

Hopkins still fights the same way. He just had a different opponent in tarver

[cringer]

RJJ said he will quit if he loses his up coming fight agianst that prince guy

[rob7022000]

YES

Roy is yesterdays man.

At his best ( and with steroids ) he was amazing.

The king is dead, long live the king!

[GAME]

In answer to the tpoic title . . .YES !

B- hop was amazing on Saturday , goig up in my estimation .

In their primes I think Jones just edges him with handspeed but over their careers , Bernard has knocked out more p4p rivals and obviously is superior in regards to longevity . If they had their retirement fight against each other ,Bernard would destroy Jones no question

[smashcrusher]

I didn't answer because i can't intelligently specualte about why he moved up other than to win the title in different weight classes..other than that i don't know...besides bernard should be happy roy moved up because that's why he got to "dominate" MW division for so long...courtesy of roy jones leaving the division...but its cool though..benard did what every other
graduate of "THE PRIME ROY JONES SCHOOL OF ASSWHOOPING" was supposed to do and that's go be a champ...

just like: Eric lucas, james toney, julio gonzales, lou de valle, otis grant, clinton woods, montel griffin, eric harding, virgil hill, john ruiz, derek harmon, vinny paz, thomas tate, thulani malinga...including bernard that makes 15 fighters that won titles after roy beat them... as opposed to

Bernard: oscar de la hoya, glen johnson, william joppy that's three. two of his title defenses came against two men he'd already beaten soundedly...

Now you tell me during their reigns who fought better competiton roy of bernard?

DISCLAIMER: This is not my attempt to discredit the great career of BHOP, I'm simply making a point not to get overly excited about what bhop has done and what he's actually done. He was great. But by no means is he or was he anywhere near RJJ...the only thing bernard did better than roy was get out of the sport when he should..

If Roy's opponents should get credit for what they did after they lost to him, which is win titles, then I think Bernard's opponents should maybe also get credit, for knocking Roy the f@#k out Oh but that's right, none of Roy's losses count, because he was old, came down in weight, mentally unprepared from his first KO loss, and just about any other excuse Roy nutthuggers pull out of thin air

[Purist]

Tarver destroyed Jones...Hopkins destroyed Tarver...weight or what not...a win is a win is a win.

Forrest destroyed Shane, Mayorga destroyed Forrest, so does that mean Mayorga did enough in that fight to win over Shane

Wacko, you know as well as I do that man who beats the man doesn't work in boxing.

And whether or not you see it, it was the same Hopkins that fought Tarver that fought jermain taylor, the difference is that he was fighting Tarver and not Jermain taylor, and you can cool believe that if Taylor had the style of tarver he would have gone out the same way

[gyrokai]

I just thought that was an awesome performance by B-Hop. I mean if he fought like that against JT he would have won both fight hands down. Now my question is "If B-Hop can perform like that against Roy, would it be enough to bother, get inside Roy's mind and eventually win over RJJ?"

Your thoughts

I agree, he would have beaten JT the first time, maybe even come closer to a Knockout. It's about time Hopkins started fighting by round One. He could have done that with both DLH and Taylor.

To answer your questions.

The answer is easy: He would downright murder Roy Jones at this point in his career.

Also, with this win over Tarver, Hopkins has serious arguments that it was actually HE that was the best fighter of his generation, better than Roy Jones. He definitely was more of a complete boxer who could fight both on the inside and out, and have great footwork.

[JonesJrMayweather]

I didn't answer because i can't intelligently specualte about why he moved up other than to win the title in different weight classes..other than that i don't know...besides bernard should be happy roy moved up because that's why he got to "dominate" MW division for so long...courtesy of roy jones leaving the division...but its cool though..benard did what every other
graduate of "THE PRIME ROY JONES SCHOOL OF ASSWHOOPING" was supposed to do and that's go be a champ...

just like: Eric lucas, james toney, julio gonzales, lou de valle, otis grant, clinton woods, montel griffin, eric harding, virgil hill, john ruiz, derek harmon, vinny paz, thomas tate, thulani malinga...including bernard that makes 15 fighters that won titles after roy beat them... as opposed to

Bernard: oscar de la hoya, glen johnson, william joppy that's three. two of his title defenses came against two men he'd already beaten soundedly...

Now you tell me during their reigns who fought better competiton roy of bernard?

DISCLAIMER: This is not my attempt to discredit the great career of BHOP, I'm simply making a point not to get overly excited about what bhop has done and what he's actually done. He was great. But by no means is he or was he anywhere near RJJ...the only thing bernard did better than roy was get out of the sport when he should..

If Roy's opponents should get credit for what they did after they lost to him, which is win titles, then I think Bernard's opponents should maybe also get credit, for knocking Roy the f@#k out Oh but that's right, none of Roy's losses count, because he was old, came down in weight, mentally unprepared from his first KO loss, and just about any other excuse Roy nutthuggers pull out of thin air

only one Bhop opponent ko'ed roy...glen johnson...roy beat tarver before hop did...and listing who they fought was only to show that many say roy took the easy fights, and praise bernard for this mw record...when many of the fighter he fought were padded set up men that didn't even fight after he beat them...and when comparing one's opponents selection i think fighting a fighter that wins a belt is bit tougher competition than a guy that does nothing for the rest of career but lose...those are the guys that roy fought as opposed to the guys that bhop fought....

and yeah roy's losses count on paper...but if bernard hopkins and joe calzaghe say they believe that tarver and glen johnson would have got beaten by roy four years ago...then i could care less what a bernard hopkins supporter says...i guess you count the losses ali suffered at the hands of holmes and berbick too huh?

[Purist]

HOPKINS FOUGHT THE SAME WAY!!!! he just had a different opponent in front of him then jermain Taylor

[smashcrusher]

I didn't answer because i can't intelligently specualte about why he moved up other than to win the title in different weight classes..other than that i don't know...besides bernard should be happy roy moved up because that's why he got to "dominate" MW division for so long...courtesy of roy jones leaving the division...but its cool though..benard did what every other
graduate of "THE PRIME ROY JONES SCHOOL OF ASSWHOOPING" was supposed to do and that's go be a champ...

just like: Eric lucas, james toney, julio gonzales, lou de valle, otis grant, clinton woods, montel griffin, eric harding, virgil hill, john ruiz, derek harmon, vinny paz, thomas tate, thulani malinga...including bernard that makes 15 fighters that won titles after roy beat them... as opposed to

Bernard: oscar de la hoya, glen johnson, william joppy that's three. two of his title defenses came against two men he'd already beaten soundedly...

Now you tell me during their reigns who fought better competiton roy of bernard?

DISCLAIMER: This is not my attempt to discredit the great career of BHOP, I'm simply making a point not to get overly excited about what bhop has done and what he's actually done. He was great. But by no means is he or was he anywhere near RJJ...the only thing bernard did better than roy was get out of the sport when he should..

If Roy's opponents should get credit for what they did after they lost to him, which is win titles, then I think Bernard's opponents should maybe also get credit, for knocking Roy the f@#k out Oh but that's right, none of Roy's losses count, because he was old, came down in weight, mentally unprepared from his first KO loss, and just about any other excuse Roy nutthuggers pull out of thin air

only one Bhop opponent ko'ed roy...glen johnson...roy beat tarver before hop did...and listing who they fought was only to show that many say roy took the easy fights, and praise bernard for this mw record...when many of the fighter he fought were padded set up men that didn't even fight after he beat them...and when comparing one's opponents selection i think fighting a fighter that wins a belt is bit tougher competition than a guy that does nothing for the rest of career but lose...those are the guys that roy fought as opposed to the guys that bhop fought....

and yeah roy's losses count on paper...but if bernard hopkins and joe calzaghe say they believe that tarver and glen johnson would have got beaten by roy four years ago, ...then i could care less what a bernard hopkins supporter says...i guess you count the losses ali suffered at the hands of holmes and berbick too huh?

Actually Ali had marginal performances a number of times before he lost to holmes and Berbick, so that proves there was evidence of him slowing down, whereas Roy came off a dominant win over Ruiz. But that's right, nothing after that counts, because he had to struggle to make weight. The mere fact that you put Roy's name in the same sentence with Ali in itself is laughable.