B Hop-Rjj:Who was greater???

[Big_Deuce]

RJJ,
Behind the back KO makes me laugh to this day...

[Taeth]

I have RJJ all time #35, Hpokins #38:

39 Azumah Nelson
38 Bernard Hopkins
37 Jack Johnson
36 Ricardo Lopez
35 Roy Jones
34 George Foreman
33 Joe Gans

RJJ is IMO a Great fighter, but Hopkins is merely superb. I think there are only 35 Great fighters of the Queensberry Rules era, and RJJ is 35th of 35. In due course I think Hopkins will be considered Great by myself... but not for the moment

The difference between great and superb for you is 3 spaces?

[SimonH]

I have RJJ all time #35, Hpokins #38:

39 Azumah Nelson
38 Bernard Hopkins
37 Jack Johnson
36 Ricardo Lopez
35 Roy Jones
34 George Foreman
33 Joe Gans

RJJ is IMO a Great fighter, but Hopkins is merely superb. I think there are only 35 Great fighters of the Queensberry Rules era, and RJJ is 35th of 35. In due course I think Hopkins will be considered Great by myself... but not for the moment

The difference between great and superb for you is 3 spaces?

No it is one space; when I did my 2004 all time 100 list, I had 34 great fighters stopping at Foreman. In March 2006 I re-did list and decided that IMO RJJ derserved the title Great.

In due course, I suspect I will consider the likes of Lopez, Johnson, Hopkins and Nelson Great... but for the minute, IMO, they are merely superb

[Taeth]

Jones is definitely greater. B-Hop is great as well, but Jones was simply unstoppable. The guy won titles all the way from middleweight to heavyweight. That has to count for something, not to mention, Jones beat B-Hop and would have beat him again if they fought in 2002 or 2003 when RJJ said to Hopkins on HBO during an interview with B-Hop about a possible fight "Gimme 60/40 and I'll whup yo a**!!!"

-Well thats kinda ironic how mr.unstoppable got stopped.Twice.Then you say roy would have beat him in 2002-03.Well thats your opinion but alot of people thought he would beat tarver.

-Did you notice in that same interview after his fight how roy mentioned tarver but then never gave him a chance until he crashed his press conference a year later and pissed him off even though tarver was his mandatory.I didn't want to believe that roy ducked this guy but looking back now it kinda seems that way.But as far as this debate goes i'll stick with MILES and say they were both great.I can't put one over the other. But i will say roy was the better athlete but hop was the better boxer.

-P.S. As far as that 60/40 thing goes. Its funny how roy wouldn't take 50/50 with hop but then goes onto fight clinton woods. In a 50/50 split with how big that fight would have been 50% would have been way more than what he got to fight woods. Thats when i knew it wasn't about money. Truth is i don't think he wanted to fight hop again.Roy ain't stupid he knew hop wouldn't go for anything less than 50/50 and thats why he said it.

-P.P.S The one thing i don't agree on in this article is how roy was a shell of his former self. Maybe he was by the time he fought johnson but no sooner. IMO a fighter don't go from great to a shell of his former self in one fight. He used SRL as an example but SRL was already showing the signs before norris beat him. SRR showed the signs,Ali showed the signs but roy was great in 2003 then hes a shell in 2004. I don't buy that.

... For the 60/40 thing Roy deserved it... Hopkins if he was so confident in winning he would have took the fight, but Roy Jones beat him the first time, and he was #1 p4p he deserves a greater share of the money IMO. Roy also had an ego which because of the things I mentioned made him feel he deserved more because he had done more. Also Prime Jones was never even close to being stopped... As for Jones' recent dramatic reduction is productivity/abilities is because he the 30 pounds so quickly, and he doesn't train like he used to... Another thing is Tarver's ko was blind luck... Jones was winning the fight though only in the second round up until that perfect punch after that he lost alot of his confidence in the ring which is probably the biggest thing most boxers have.

[MRMANICK]

Jones is definitely greater. B-Hop is great as well, but Jones was simply unstoppable. The guy won titles all the way from middleweight to heavyweight. That has to count for something, not to mention, Jones beat B-Hop and would have beat him again if they fought in 2002 or 2003 when RJJ said to Hopkins on HBO during an interview with B-Hop about a possible fight "Gimme 60/40 and I'll whup yo a**!!!"

-Well thats kinda ironic how mr.unstoppable got stopped.Twice.Then you say roy would have beat him in 2002-03.Well thats your opinion but alot of people thought he would beat tarver.

-Did you notice in that same interview after his fight how roy mentioned tarver but then never gave him a chance until he crashed his press conference a year later and pissed him off even though tarver was his mandatory.I didn't want to believe that roy ducked this guy but looking back now it kinda seems that way.But as far as this debate goes i'll stick with MILES and say they were both great.I can't put one over the other. But i will say roy was the better athlete but hop was the better boxer.

-P.S. As far as that 60/40 thing goes. Its funny how roy wouldn't take 50/50 with hop but then goes onto fight clinton woods. In a 50/50 split with how big that fight would have been 50% would have been way more than what he got to fight woods. Thats when i knew it wasn't about money. Truth is i don't think he wanted to fight hop again.Roy ain't stupid he knew hop wouldn't go for anything less than 50/50 and thats why he said it.

-P.P.S The one thing i don't agree on in this article is how roy was a shell of his former self. Maybe he was by the time he fought johnson but no sooner. IMO a fighter don't go from great to a shell of his former self in one fight. He used SRL as an example but SRL was already showing the signs before norris beat him. SRR showed the signs,Ali showed the signs but roy was great in 2003 then hes a shell in 2004. I don't buy that.

... For the 60/40 thing Roy deserved it... Hopkins if he was so confident in winning he would have took the fight, but Roy Jones beat him the first time, and he was #1 p4p he deserves a greater share of the money IMO. Roy also had an ego which because of the things I mentioned made him feel he deserved more because he had done more. Also Prime Jones was never even close to being stopped... As for Jones' recent dramatic reduction is productivity/abilities is because he the 30 pounds so quickly, and he doesn't train like he used to... Another thing is Tarver's ko was blind luck... Jones was winning the fight though only in the second round up until that perfect punch after that he lost alot of his confidence in the ring which is probably the biggest thing most boxers have.

-Well it would be one thing if he knocked hopkins out but the truth is he won a boring decision almost 10 years. A fight that i believe just as the writer was probably his toughest fight until tarver. Roy was #1 and hop was #2. Both undisputed champs and hop just beat tito at a time when roy ain't fight nobody worth mentioning since toney. All that considering i think 50/50 was fair. Who was roy gonna get big money fighting besides a heavyweight? Like i said 50/50 would have been alot of money.If tito would of beat hop do you think roy would have gotten 60/40 against tito? Hell no. Considering roy wasn't a big ppv draw i think 50/50 was fair.

-As far as his training and weight loss go how do YOU know thats what it is? Have you been to his training camp? Are you a doctor? I doubt that.

-I don't think that was a blind punch. Have you ever looked at the replay in slow-mo? It was a good counter left hand thats it. Weight loss and less training didn't make him walk into that punch.Look at the replay. Roy throws a straight right that barely hit tarver and instead of backing up after his miss me tried to throw a left hook and got caught with his right hand to far out and he got tagged.