HOLDING: STRATEGY, CHEATING, OR BOTH?

[DaxxKahn]

holy did it vs tyson 1
i consider it a cheating strategy

Ha thats rich considering Tyson is known as a dirty fighter

Because Holyfield is such a clean fighter

Lets speak the truth among ourselves on that one my friend....

Tyson loved to follow up with the forearm and elbow his whole career and Holyfield loved to use his head...

6 of one and a half dozen of the other if you ask me

Im not denying that Holyfield wasn't dirty but Tyson was alot dirtier.

That I agree with....100%

[Violent Demise]

Half his fights? You havent seen half his fights = Talking bollocks.

I'll give you an unbiased opinion. I seen about 75% of Hatton's fights. And by all rights the man should have 4 losses. 3 by DQ and 1 on points. I don't understand how you as a boxing fan (I'm guessing your one) can see a fighter hold his way to victory and have no problem with it?

Take a look at my initial post. Does it sound like Im for a fighter holding his way to victory?

Im glad you can admit when your wrong though.

Than were in agreement that he shouldn't be undefeated. Right?

[Punisher136]

If your hurt and clinging on for dear life then OK, but if a fighter is holding for no obvious reason or excessively then punish him.

Thats exactly how i think about it. If your using it sparingly and only in desarate straights then i don't see a problem with it. If you're using it as a substitue for defense and just using to to wear your opponent down its cheating and should be enforced heavily.

[El Kabong]

Holding/Clinching is only illegal if the ref enforces it....kind of like the Umpires in a baseball game determine the strike zone.


I don't think it really affected the Hatton-Castillo fight though

[Wacko3205]

VD you dont have to talk bollocks the entire time your on here you do know that dont you?

Why is that if one is not always singing Hatton's praises, it's consider talking "bullocks"?

Half his fights? You havent seen half his fights = Talking bollocks.

Heh heh heh.

Alright ladies...calm down...don't make me have to moderate 'cho ass!

Oh wait...one of you is a moderator...I humbly, drunkenly apologize.

That being said...I didn't click the link...but the thread title "Re: HOLDING: STRATEGY, CHEATING, OR BOTH?"...I'm assuming it's in regards to Hatton's style.

So...my thoughts?

I aint a fan of Hatton's style. Not just the holding...but the brawly bullish type. But that's just me. I'm more of a defensive fighter fan & love techy counter punchers.

The thing about Hatton is...it works for him & that's all that counts I suppose. I don't like it, though. I think that he holds on entirely too long & there are times that I believe he needs to lose a point or so for it...but it is what it is.

Take Wlad for instance...he's been pushed into the holding tactics that he pulls. Steward schooled him into the hit & hold fighter that he's become...still...I don't like that either.

Wrestling bothers me to no end...that being said...I don't see it as cheating...just another weapon in the arsenal.

[El Kabong]

....it's not like guys couldn't let their hands go and stop the other fighter from clinching

[Lords Gym]

Hatton does this alot

there is a difference between what Hatton does and holding. Hatton is jockeying for position , forcing his will on the opponent in an offensive manner .. Holding is tying up to survive or stop the action. Sometimes the by product of in fighting is a clinch , as long as the ref is there when it happens no worries. with Hatton it usually works its self out… Hell of a fighter !

[El Kabong]

Exactly, it's not like JLC couldn't have thrown punches when Ricky moved in close like that

[Punisher136]

Exactly, it's not like JLC couldn't have thrown punches when Ricky moved in close like that

So you're saying its perfectly legal, after someone locks up your left arm and they're going for your right, for you the just blast them dead on with your right?

[El Kabong]

....no I'm saying before your left arm gets locked up you have time to throw punches

[Punisher136]

....no I'm saying before your left arm gets locked up you have time to throw punches

Yes but wouldn't hitting them while they have one of your arms locked up (only in the case that they initiated the clinch) deter them from doing it again or is hitting on the clinch (regardless of who starts it) completely illegal?

[El Kabong]

I'm not discussing that I'm saying the guy who gets tied up lets it happen for the most part....hitting in the clinch is ok I guess unless the ref warns you about it, then just stop it and move on with the fight.

[CutMeMick]

Some holding is OK.
Excessive holding IMO should NOT be allowed, it SHOULD be noted by the ref. and then begin to deduct points.

[7777]

Hatton does this alot

there is a difference between what Hatton does and holding. Hatton is jockeying for position , forcing his will on the opponent in an offensive manner .. Holding is tying up to survive or stop the action. Sometimes the by product of in fighting is a clinch , as long as the ref is there when it happens no worries. with Hatton it usually works its self out… Hell of a fighter !

Boss post. I will nick that, being trying to word it properly for years

cc I believe is the course of action