Some evidence for my 'this new rep system is flawed' theory

[RP33]

Now let's look at DG' Diane as an example.

Let me say firstly that I really like Diane, she's a cool girl and one of my favourite new posters BUT

She has the 24th highest reputation on the whole of Saddo's despite having posted only 278 times

I can't help it if people are giving me good rep. I don't go around asking people to rep me, like some people I know.

Yes, a small portion of my reps is from those who welcomed me because I was Danny's friend, but the majority of it comes from people liking what I have to say, and those people do not have to give me full rep, they can always just give me 1 rep point if they want.

Why do you keep giving me full rep points when you obviously think that I don't deserve it?

This is something that is just supposed to be for fun. Rep points shouldn't matter, what should matter is the people of this forum, and the opinions they have to share.

So I'll tell you what, I think that I can go into my options, and make it so I cannot be rated by anyone anymore. Will that satisfy you then?

i don't think Bilbo was attacking you.. he was more so just using you as an example..

you may not be familiar with the past system, which is contributing to your misinterpretation of what he's trying to say.. basically you only have 200+ posts, and you have a ton of rep.. on the old system you could only "cool click" a person once per 24 hour period.. so think of a 50 punch power rep coming from bilbo not as 50, but as 1 point.. and my 10 punch not as 10 but also 1.. so you'd have 2 points and not 60.. it's a huge difference..

basically what he's saying is that on that old rep system, to have a smuch rep as you do is impossible unless you had everyone on the site give you a cool click every day..

hope that clarifies..

[Andre]

Also we cant use the term 'click whore' any more.

rep whore doesnt have the same ring.

[Deanrw]

I go to another forum where I have been a member since 1999. I don't have a special status there nor do i want it.

I'm not sure why I have a high REP ratio as I am a fairly invisible poster on this board. I keep fairly low key. I'm certainly not a great poster in any way shape or form.

To be honest I really don't pay any attention to it. I just jump in the threads I find interesting and if I have a comment or something I like to share I do it.

I don't think any forum should have a special hierarchy. We are all just posters sharing thoughts. Newbies, if responsible, can contribute just as much as someone long established. I see it as, if someone contributes positively to the community, I view them favorably. If they act like a jackass, I don't care for them them, no matter how long they have been here or what post count/rep they have.

[Gandalf]

Bilbo is talking a lot of sense. The new system is about here and now and if you dont keep up then you are left behind and forgotton. The CC system was about putting in the grind and working your way into recognition amongst your fellow posters. Wacko is a legend here and was untouchable when it came to putting in the work and in return had an awesome CC rating. It is a reflection of dedication, respect and hard work. Unfortunately unless he gets back here quickly he will be subsumed by people who really dont deserve a rating anywhere near his level. That is unfair.

With a new system things do change and old ideas will be left on the way side, but I have a fondness for the old system and liked it. If others dont care for it then I suppose you've got to move with the tide. But still.

[RP33]

basically to sum up the responses.. there are people who care about the system to an extent, and see that things are multiplying quite a bit.. and then there are the people who are saying "bilbo who cares"

so if the people who don't agree with bilbo, aren't disagreeing because they like the new system as opposed to old, but are disagreeing because they don't care which system is used, then it seems as though it would make sense to satisfy the rep whore himself

[AdamGB]

I don't get the new system at all... how much rep you have means nothing to me...

And I don't get how I can't give people reps most of the time... like if I get rep it won't let me give it back to the same person or half the time someone makes a good post and I have to 'spread it about' to give it to them...

Problem is I can't 'spread it about'...

[Kev]

Now let's look at DG' Diane as an example.

Let me say firstly that I really like Diane, she's a cool girl and one of my favourite new posters BUT

She has the 24th highest reputation on the whole of Saddo's despite having posted only 278 times

I can't help it if people are giving me good rep. I don't go around asking people to rep me, like some people I know.

Yes, a small portion of my reps is from those who welcomed me because I was Danny's friend, but the majority of it comes from people liking what I have to say, and those people do not have to give me full rep, they can always just give me 1 rep point if they want.

Why do you keep giving me full rep points when you obviously think that I don't deserve it?

This is something that is just supposed to be for fun. Rep points shouldn't matter, what should matter is the people of this forum, and the opinions they have to share.

So I'll tell you what, I think that I can go into my options, and make it so I cannot be rated by anyone anymore. Will that satisfy you then?

Diane, sorry if my postings put you on the defensive they wern't meant to.

Basically what I'm saying is this. Under the old system a person built up a reputation over a long periord of time and the ranking system meant that it was stable. So a poster who didn't post very often but posted consistently good postings over many months or years would build a great reputation.

Under the new system, the ONLY people who get a good reputation are those who have posted a lot in the past few weeks.

This has nothing to do with me grumbling for myself or attacking you.

It's just that great posters on this board, who used to have excellent rep built up over years, now have no very little rep on this board to show for their years of dedication and service to the site.

Guys like Miles and Adam GB who both posted in this thread have thousands of posts and used to have excellent rep. But because they havn't been very active in the last few weeks there reputations have all but disappeared.

You on the other hand who have only really been active in the past couple months (I know you registered earlier) have built an outstanding rep which although deserved is skewed. For example when I rep you you get the equivilent of 60 coolclicks in one go and from many others you get say 40,35,23,14 and so on coolclicks in a single go!

You say I could limit it, but why should I? I like you and would consider it rude to hold back some of my rep when complimenting your postings.

Again this is not an attack on you or anyone else. It's just this board no longer rewards users who have built a reputation over many years but who are not active at this particular point in time.

It's a shitty system and unfair for such posters.

And to people who think I'm whinging about this personally, I'm always here, this system works great for me! I've risen to number 2 on the whole board

It's not about ME complaining for ME, I'm trying to make it fairer for all the other longterm Saddo members who have seen their once great reputations erased because they havn't posted much in the past few weeks.

And this will happen EVERY 6 weeks or so. The reputation board no longer reflects a reputation built over time through consistent good postings over years, but rather just the popularity and activity of a poster over the past few weeks alone.

It's a flawed system and doesn't sit well with either what this board stands for or our own philosophy of ranking. When we make p4p lists for boxers as nearly all of us do we don't only base them on the last 6 weeks

We base them on the last few months and years and in the case of all time, last hundred years. What a fighter has done in the last 6 weeks isn't more important than what a fighter did 50 years ago when evaluating p4p rabkings so if we wouldn't use the system we have in place for building rep for ranking boxers p4p why do we use it for ranking our members?

Do you see what I'm trying to get at here? Please don't think I'm attacking you, you are a great new poster, I just don't think this new system is fair for a majority of posters.

Most maybe don't care, but as I care about the whole board and all the members I wanted to bring it up

[Kev]

I go to another forum where I have been a member since 1999. I don't have a special status there nor do i want it.

I'm not sure why I have a high REP ratio as I am a fairly invisible poster on this board. I keep fairly low key. I'm certainly not a great poster in any way shape or form.

To be honest I really don't pay any attention to it. I just jump in the threads I find interesting and if I have a comment or something I like to share I do it.

I don't think any forum should have a special hierarchy. We are all just posters sharing thoughts. Newbies, if responsible, can contribute just as much as someone long established. I see it as, if someone contributes positively to the community, I view them favorably. If they act like a jackass, I don't care for them them, no matter how long they have been here or what post count/rep they have.

Hey Dean like with Diane I wasn't attacking you personally. I also agree we shouldn't have a hierarchy. Under the old system there was no punch power, everyone could give a coolclick or sadclick, just a single point either way to any user every 24 hours.

There was no rating people with, like in my case a 60 point punch power whereas somebody else has only 3 punch power.

It was completely fair, everybody had the same worth, and everyone's opinion meant the same, one point.

It was a totally balanced and fair system that could allow any poster to build a reputation no matter how infrequently they posted as it was built over time and not skewed to only count the past few weeks.

I really feel if people understood what Im trying to say here they would prefer to go back to the old system.

Most people can't get beyond the fact I seem to be complaining which is sad as I'm not complaining for myself but because I want everybody on the site to be able to build a reputation over time and not have it erased every few weeks because they didn't get much time to post.

By the way, like with Diane any rep you have received in the last few weeks has been deserved. I'm not slating you in any way. All I'm saying is that in time past a poster would have had to wait months to have built the rep up that you and Diane have in just the past few weeks with the new system.

Someone who made a good point 6 months ago and got a coolclick would get a single point. Someone who makes the same point now could get more than 60 points.

In another 6 weeks the same point could likely make 120 points in one go etc!

It will double every 6 weeks or so so that the value of a single click is diminished every further every few weeks.

It's an unfair system for those who can't post all the time as it doesnt reward them for their longterm efforts only the immediate term

[Kev]

Bilbo is talking a lot of sense. The new system is about here and now and if you dont keep up then you are left behind and forgotton. The CC system was about putting in the grind and working your way into recognition amongst your fellow posters. Wacko is a legend here and was untouchable when it came to putting in the work and in return had an awesome CC rating. It is a reflection of dedication, respect and hard work. Unfortunately unless he gets back here quickly he will be subsumed by people who really dont deserve a rating anywhere near his level. That is unfair.

With a new system things do change and old ideas will be left on the way side, but I have a fondness for the old system and liked it. If others dont care for it then I suppose you've got to move with the tide. But still.

Cheers Miles you explained it really well there buddy.

What I think a lot of these newer posters dont realise is that under the old system you and I had a similar reputation. In the past 6 weeks or so we have had this board however I have posted a lot whereas you have not.

I now have a reputation over double your own and that's just clearly unfair. 6 weeks isnt a fair reflection of the 3 years or more we have both been here.

Adam GB also had a great rep before and now has less than a 1000 rep!

What did he do to deserve to be dumped so low in the rankings, he's also one of our longest serving and well liked members.

I just wish the ones who were attacking me could see that I'm trying to argue fairness for all the long time popular posters like yourself and Adam who earned their reps the hard way, one point at a time

[Kev]

basically to sum up the responses.. there are people who care about the system to an extent, and see that things are multiplying quite a bit.. and then there are the people who are saying "bilbo who cares"

so if the people who don't agree with bilbo, aren't disagreeing because they like the new system as opposed to old, but are disagreeing because they don't care which system is used, then it seems as though it would make sense to satisfy the rep whore himself

I like your way of thinking!

[Ghost]

I'm not sure why I have a high REP ratio as I am a fairly invisible poster on this board. I keep fairly low key. I'm certainly not a great poster in any way shape or form.

The Rep's have to be spread around, so people are starting to give them out like candy, until they have gone thru their ten lesser posters, and then they can give the big numbers to those they think deserve them.

Thats one of the problems with forums in general. At some point the "post counts" and "Rep count" starts to become more of an issue than the "debates" going on.

[Kev]

I'm not sure why I have a high REP ratio as I am a fairly invisible poster on this board. I keep fairly low key. I'm certainly not a great poster in any way shape or form.

The Rep's have to be spread around, so people are starting to give them out like candy, until they have gone thru their ten lesser posters, and then they can give the big numbers to those they think deserve them.

Thats one of the problems with forums in general. At some point the "post counts" and "Rep count" starts to become more of an issue than the "debates" going on.

On reflection the old coollclick system was perfect. None of this spreading rep crap. You could click anybody once in a 24 hour period. There was none of this you MUST click 10 other people before you can click that person again.

And there was none of this 'my opinion is worth 60 points whilst yours is only worth 5 points' crap either.

It was a fair and meritocritous system for all. I'm probably the biggest beneficiary of this new system my own rep has gone through the roof, but I can see beyond my own nose and see how other great posters have faired really poorly in this system due to not posting 24 hours a day like me.

People who say it doesnt matter, then if it doesnt matter why object to changing it back?

The rep system we have in place should be fair for EVERYBODY. That's all I'm getting at.

[Gandalf]

Bilbo is talking a lot of sense. The new system is about here and now and if you dont keep up then you are left behind and forgotton. The CC system was about putting in the grind and working your way into recognition amongst your fellow posters. Wacko is a legend here and was untouchable when it came to putting in the work and in return had an awesome CC rating. It is a reflection of dedication, respect and hard work. Unfortunately unless he gets back here quickly he will be subsumed by people who really dont deserve a rating anywhere near his level. That is unfair.

With a new system things do change and old ideas will be left on the way side, but I have a fondness for the old system and liked it. If others dont care for it then I suppose you've got to move with the tide. But still.

Cheers Miles you explained it really well there buddy.

What I think a lot of these newer posters dont realise is that under the old system you and I had a similar reputation. In the past 6 weeks or so we have had this board however I have posted a lot whereas you have not.

I now have a reputation over double your own and that's just clearly unfair. 6 weeks isnt a fair reflection of the 3 years or more we have both been here.

Adam GB also had a great rep before and now has less than a 1000 rep!

What did he do to deserve to be dumped so low in the rankings, he's also one of our longest serving and well liked members.

I just wish the ones who were attacking me could see that I'm trying to argue fairness for all the long time popular posters like yourself and Adam who earned their reps the hard way, one point at a time

Im geared towards the old system, but ultimately come on here to make a few bad predictions and have a word or two with the English speaking world. My lack of power punch isnt gonna get me down too much. Thats just me though. It is unfair that contributions made over a long time are only really reflected in post counts now. Anyone can post a lot, but there is no indication regarding the quality of those posts or the respect given by others at those points in time. A case of in with the new and out with the old there.

Sacrifices have been made to try and modernise the site. Sacrifices that include my hard won CC's and the SC's too!! I liked how things had evolved before but I supppose its impossible to go back and recalculate everything. Maybe we could ammend the current system somewhat, but if the general concensus is that people dont care too much then I suppose there is little to do but keep on posting.

[Ghost]

[
On reflection the old coollclick system was perfect. None of this spreading rep crap. You could click anybody once in a 24 hour period. There was none of this you MUST click 10 other people before you can click that person again.

And there was none of this 'my opinion is worth 60 points whilst yours is only worth 5 points' crap either.

It was a fair and meritocritous system for all. I'm probably the biggest beneficiary of this new system my own rep has gone through the roof, but I can see beyond my own nose and see how other great posters have faired really poorly in this system due to not posting 24 hours a day like me.

People who say it doesnt matter, then if it doesnt matter why object to changing it back?

The rep system we have in place should be fair for EVERYBODY. That's all I'm getting at.

Why not just get rid of both systems?

Why not do away with post counts all together?

What difference does it make how many posts you have or how many reps you have?

Does having more posts make you a smarter/better/all knowing poster?

Or just a person with more free time on your hands?

[Kev]

Bilbo is talking a lot of sense. The new system is about here and now and if you dont keep up then you are left behind and forgotton. The CC system was about putting in the grind and working your way into recognition amongst your fellow posters. Wacko is a legend here and was untouchable when it came to putting in the work and in return had an awesome CC rating. It is a reflection of dedication, respect and hard work. Unfortunately unless he gets back here quickly he will be subsumed by people who really dont deserve a rating anywhere near his level. That is unfair.

With a new system things do change and old ideas will be left on the way side, but I have a fondness for the old system and liked it. If others dont care for it then I suppose you've got to move with the tide. But still.

Cheers Miles you explained it really well there buddy.

What I think a lot of these newer posters dont realise is that under the old system you and I had a similar reputation. In the past 6 weeks or so we have had this board however I have posted a lot whereas you have not.

I now have a reputation over double your own and that's just clearly unfair. 6 weeks isnt a fair reflection of the 3 years or more we have both been here.

Adam GB also had a great rep before and now has less than a 1000 rep!

What did he do to deserve to be dumped so low in the rankings, he's also one of our longest serving and well liked members.

I just wish the ones who were attacking me could see that I'm trying to argue fairness for all the long time popular posters like yourself and Adam who earned their reps the hard way, one point at a time

Im geared towards the old system, but ultimately come on here to make a few bad predictions and have a word or two with the English speaking world. My lack of power punch isnt gonna get me down too much. Thats just me though. It is unfair that contributions made over a long time are only really reflected in post counts now. Anyone can post a lot, but there is no indication regarding the quality of those posts or the respect given by others at those points in time. A case of in with the new and out with the old there.

Sacrifices have been made to try and modernise the site. Sacrifices that include my hard won CC's and the SC's too!! I liked how things had evolved before but I supppose its impossible to go back and recalculate everything. Maybe we could ammend the current system somewhat, but if the general concensus is that people dont care too much then I suppose there is little to do but keep on posting.

Nah I'm sure if enough people understand what I'm saying they will want to either change back or at least make changes to this system.

At the end of the day if we are going to have a reputation system at all we should make sure its a fair one that rewards everybody for the contribution they make to the site.

A lot of people wont care at all but its still nice for for everyones contribution to be fairly acknowledged.

Your rep is now half of what it once was, many others have suffered much worse.