JMM: I'll fight him at any weight he wants, not a problem since he was 148

[Gandalf]

If Marquez really thinks he can go in there at 147 and get the job done then fair enough, but I think his heart is ruling over his head a bit. Marquez has been looking great at LW, but Pac has been looking great at WW. That's a big difference in power and muscle mass. Okay, they could be a similar weight on fight night, but with Pac it's all muscle, with Marquez it's more about rehydration unless he decides to bulk up too and that just isn't going to work for Marquez at his age.

I would love for Marquez to go up there and silence all the Pacheads, but I just cannot see it being a fair fight with a WW weigh in. It is the same as what Mayweather did to Marquez and we were all on his case. And now that Manny is doing it, you are all giving him a free pass and saying what's the problem? Total double standards. At least I am never less than consistent.

Actually there were some on his case, mainly Floyd's critics and haters. Not everyone. If the fight had taken place at 130 or 135 years ago, Floyd would dominate JMM even worse, considering he was even more offensive minded then and much faster. And considering that Floyd usually rehydrates 2 or 3 pounds at the most so it's not like he had a huge size advantage over JMM, it was the skills, speed, and reflexes that were the difference.

You're on about this fight being fair to JMM and the 3rd match should happen. But yet I posted that JMM turned down a '05 rematch against Pac for 750k years ago to fight 2 bums and Chris John for 30k. How do you explain that? If JMM had taken the fight the 3rd match would have happened in '08 or something like that. Or how about he asked for a 50/50 money split in January of this year when the fight was proposed to him by Pac's team? The fight more than likely would have been at 140 also since Pac was only 1 fight removed from fighting there. Talk about not taking the opportunities not presented to you. So who's fault was that? Who priced themselves out? Now JMM wants a 3rd match when he passed on the opportunities to fight Pac on a few occasions.

The moral of the story? Take opportunities in life that are presented to you. Don't turn them down and then chase down those opportunities that passed you by.

BTW, I don't think there will be a 3rd match with JMM. Floyd, Berto, Mosley, and the winner of Bradley/Alexander are on the horizon.

It doesn't matter what might have been between Mayweather and Marquez at LW. What matters is that Mayweather signed to fight a LW when he could have fought anyoone at WW. It was a hoax of a fight from the start and I give Mayweather little credit for it. The same as if Manny were to fight Marquez at 147.

Yes, there have been mistakes from the management of Marquez. For sure, I won't deny that, but right here, right now, I do not want to see a Pac/Marquez fight at 147. I would sooner have them look elsewhere for a fight. Marquez should not compromise on everything and if that means we don't see the fight then so be it.

[generalbulldog]

If Marquez really thinks he can go in there at 147 and get the job done then fair enough, but I think his heart is ruling over his head a bit. Marquez has been looking great at LW, but Pac has been looking great at WW. That's a big difference in power and muscle mass. Okay, they could be a similar weight on fight night, but with Pac it's all muscle, with Marquez it's more about rehydration unless he decides to bulk up too and that just isn't going to work for Marquez at his age.

I would love for Marquez to go up there and silence all the Pacheads, but I just cannot see it being a fair fight with a WW weigh in. It is the same as what Mayweather did to Marquez and we were all on his case. And now that Manny is doing it, you are all giving him a free pass and saying what's the problem? Total double standards. At least I am never less than consistent.

Actually there were some on his case, mainly Floyd's critics and haters. Not everyone. If the fight had taken place at 130 or 135 years ago, Floyd would dominate JMM even worse, considering he was even more offensive minded then and much faster. And considering that Floyd usually rehydrates 2 or 3 pounds at the most so it's not like he had a huge size advantage over JMM, it was the skills, speed, and reflexes that were the difference.

You're on about this fight being fair to JMM and the 3rd match should happen. But yet I posted that JMM turned down a '05 rematch against Pac for 750k years ago to fight 2 bums and Chris John for 30k. How do you explain that? If JMM had taken the fight the 3rd match would have happened in '08 or something like that. Or how about he asked for a 50/50 money split in January of this year when the fight was proposed to him by Pac's team? The fight more than likely would have been at 140 also since Pac was only 1 fight removed from fighting there. Talk about not taking the opportunities not presented to you. So who's fault was that? Who priced themselves out? Now JMM wants a 3rd match when he passed on the opportunities to fight Pac on a few occasions.

The moral of the story? Take opportunities in life that are presented to you. Don't turn them down and then chase down those opportunities that passed you by.

BTW, I don't think there will be a 3rd match with JMM. Floyd, Berto, Mosley, and the winner of Bradley/Alexander are on the horizon.

It doesn't matter what might have been between Mayweather and Marquez at LW. What matters is that Mayweather signed to fight a LW when he could have fought anyoone at WW. It was a hoax of a fight from the start and I give Mayweather little credit for it. The same as if Manny were to fight Marquez at 147.

Yes, there have been mistakes from the management of Marquez. For sure, I won't deny that, but right here, right now, I do not want to see a Pac/Marquez fight at 147. I would sooner have them look elsewhere for a fight. Marquez should not compromise on everything and if that means we don't see the fight then so be it.

Floyd dominated the no. 2 fighter in the sport at the time of his almost 2 year layoff. Again it's not like Floyd had a huge size advantage, it was the skills more than anything else. Floyd is a tiny Welterweight, more than likely could make the 140 pound limit. Again Floyd only rehydrates at the most 1-3 pounds on fight night. So it wasn't the size but skills that defeated JMM.

It is JMM that wants to fight for a 3rd time badly with Pac not the other way around. If he wants it, he's going to need to accept the demands. JMM wants the money, status, and biggest fights then he's going to need to take some huge risks for that. Just like Manny took some huge ones against Oscar in jumping another extra 2 weight classes after going from 130 to 135 and accepting only 32% of the overall money, not to mentioned ring size and glove size Oscar wanted. Floyd got his status as the PPV king of the sport right now and 1/2 the face of boxing by meeting all of Oscar's demands to fight him. It paid off.

Again I thought something else is funny, if JMM beat Pac twice as JMM and his supporters claim with all those writers and fans agreeing, then there is no need for a 3rd fight right? It's already decided, JMM has that. So why does he want a 3rd fight so badly then? You want to tell me Miles?

[fan johnny]

I think Mosely and JMM needs to bid. Ya know, like an auction (i.e. 50/50pac, 40/60, 30/70 and so on). Lowest bidder get to fight Pac.

Yea what about Berto? He could come in there at 80/20.

[Hornfinger]

Pac would win inside 5.

[:::PSL:::]

I think Mosely and JMM needs to bid. Ya know, like an auction (i.e. 50/50pac, 40/60, 30/70 and so on). Lowest bidder get to fight Pac.

Yea what about Berto? He could come in there at 80/20.

It's possible.

[CFH]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if Sugar Shane is finished because of his performance against Floyd, then how does Marquez escape that criticism?

Mosley at least hurt Floyd. Marquez lost 120-108 on all scorecards

For the record I believe Marquez loses to Mosley.

I assume the argument would go that while Marquez lost to Mayweather, was way out of his weightclass and he rebounded with some impressive performances over decent, though not great, opposition. Mosley looked awful against Sergio Mora and appears to be seriously on the slide.

[Julius Rain]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if Sugar Shane is finished because of his performance against Floyd, then how does Marquez escape that criticism?

Mosley at least hurt Floyd. Marquez lost 120-108 on all scorecards

For the record I believe Marquez loses to Mosley.

I assume the argument would go that while Marquez lost to Mayweather, was way out of his weightclass and he rebounded with some impressive performances over decent, though not great opposition. Mosley looked awful against Sergio Mora and appears to be seriously on the slide.

I agree. However, JMM said it would not matter where he fights pac welterweight or lightweight. Clearly it did matter against Floyd. Maybe he does not believe Pac and Floyd are the same size.

[Spicoli]

Boxing as a whole needs to stop waiting around on Mayweather and get on with fighters who actually want to fight. Don't think Jmm belongs anywhere above 140 but the history cannot be denied and I'd pay to see it. Marquez has rebounded after that Imo charade vs an at least jr middle Floyd with solid wins and Manny needs a dance partner. Two words.... Thunder-dome!

[CutMeMick]

They should get it on and put this question to rest - once and for all. Make it a 15 rounder!

I love that idea...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if Sugar Shane is finished because of his performance against Floyd, then how does Marquez escape that criticism?

Mosley at least hurt Floyd. Marquez lost 120-108 on all scorecards

For the record I believe Marquez loses to Mosley.

I speak for myself when I say that for me "Your only as good as your last performance".
Yes JMM lost every round to PBF.
Yes SSM rocked and won 2 rds. vs. PBF.
Yes SSM did better vs. PBF.

However since then JMM immediately bounced back and put on 2 good to brilliant performances.
SSM on the other hand?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if Sugar Shane is finished because of his performance against Floyd, then how does Marquez escape that criticism?

Mosley at least hurt Floyd. Marquez lost 120-108 on all scorecards

For the record I believe Marquez loses to Mosley.

I assume the argument would go that while Marquez lost to Mayweather, was way out of his weightclass and he rebounded with some impressive performances over decent, though not great opposition. Mosley looked awful against Sergio Mora and appears to be seriously on the slide.

I agree. However, JMM said it would not matter where he fights pac welterweight or lightweight. Clearly it did matter against Floyd. Maybe he does not believe Pac and Floyd are the same size.

IMO, I feel that JMM is saying whatever it takes to get Pac to sign the deal and he'll worry about the rest later.
He just want's Pac in the ring.
I personally think it's stupid of JMM to think he can beat Pac at 147.
Not because of the PBF fight. But because clearly that's not a weight that suits him.
It would be who of JMM to have the fight be at 140 or 135.
But I'm certain Pac realizes that it's in his (Pacs) best interest to make JMM give up whatever he can as it is for any fighter prior to the fight.
Whether it's gloves, ring size whatever it maybe. In this case weight.
I think 147 better suits Pac. But we will never really know unless it happens.

CFH, I completely agree with you and view it the same way...

[CutMeMick]

Ok.

For those who are talking/mentioning this ordeal about JMM's performance vs. PBF let me shine some light on this...

Pac moves up to 154 and faces Sergio.
Sergio dominates him in the same fashion PBF dominated JMM.
Does that mean Pac is finished?

Go ahead I'll give you time to think it over.

In the mean time...

JMM did not receive the "He's finished criticism" after the PBF fight because it was clear he was fighting out of his class. Or who know's maybe that's how great PBF really is that the 2nd/3rd P4P fighter in the world couldn't even touch him. Maybe his greatness is that much more then the rest.

[Julius Rain]

Ok.

For those who are talking/mentioning this ordeal about JMM's performance vs. PBF let me shine some light on this...

Pac moves up to 154 and faces Sergio.
Sergio dominates him in the same fashion PBF dominated JMM.
Does that mean Pac is finished?

Go ahead I'll give you time to think it over.

In the mean time...

JMM did not receive the "He's finished criticism" after the PBF fight because it was clear he was fighting out of his class. Or who know's maybe that's how great PBF really is that the 2nd/3rd P4P fighter in the world couldn't even touch him. Maybe his greatness is that much more then the rest.

That is what I've been trying to figure out.

A. Floyd is so good JMM couldn't win a single round.

B. JMM look like shit due to the weight.

A or B? We will never know unless JMM fights again above 135. If he fights pac above 135 and he gets dominated, there wont be much credit to give to pac for the win cause JMM has not proven himself above 135.

I would love a third match but it looks like pac would need to cut down to 135 to get credit in a victory over JMM. JMM does not have any success above 135. However if JMM beats Pac above 135, IMO he and Floyd are greater fighters then Pac.

[CutMeMick]

Ok.

For those who are talking/mentioning this ordeal about JMM's performance vs. PBF let me shine some light on this...

Pac moves up to 154 and faces Sergio.
Sergio dominates him in the same fashion PBF dominated JMM.
Does that mean Pac is finished?

Go ahead I'll give you time to think it over.

In the mean time...

JMM did not receive the "He's finished criticism" after the PBF fight because it was clear he was fighting out of his class. Or who know's maybe that's how great PBF really is that the 2nd/3rd P4P fighter in the world couldn't even touch him. Maybe his greatness is that much more then the rest.

That is what I've been trying to figure out.

A. Floyd is so good JMM couldn't win a single round.

B. JMM look like shit due to the weight.

A or B? We will never know unless JMM fights again above 135. If he fights pac above 135 and he gets dominated, there wont be much credit to give to pac for the win cause JMM has not proven himself above 135.

I would love a third match but it looks like pac would need to cut down to 135 to get credit in a victory over JMM. JMM does not have any success above 135. However if JMM beats Pac above 135, IMO he and Floyd are greater fighters then Pac.

I think that 140 or 135 is perfect for both...
Neither one has an advantage.

But that's not how the game is played.
It's about getting the upper hand.
Whatever the case Pac get's credit for a win in my eyes.
A bit questionable at 147 but nonetheless a win.

The only people that wont credit him are trolls and let's be honest their opinions don't count.

[CFH]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if Sugar Shane is finished because of his performance against Floyd, then how does Marquez escape that criticism?

Mosley at least hurt Floyd. Marquez lost 120-108 on all scorecards

For the record I believe Marquez loses to Mosley.

I assume the argument would go that while Marquez lost to Mayweather, was way out of his weightclass and he rebounded with some impressive performances over decent, though not great opposition. Mosley looked awful against Sergio Mora and appears to be seriously on the slide.

I agree. However, JMM said it would not matter where he fights pac welterweight or lightweight. Clearly it did matter against Floyd. Maybe he does not believe Pac and Floyd are the same size.

But it's obvious that JMM and Pacquiao are closer in size than JMM and PBF, regardless of what weight Pacquiao is current campaigning at.

[Snakey]

I cant believe everyone is saying "Shane did better against mayweather obviously hed be better against pac" or indicating that JMM looked bad against Mayweather at a higher weight so obvisouly the weight was the issue.

Has anyone here ever thought that maybe...and only just maybe Floyd is a completely different fighter with a completely different style to pac? Styles make fights and we all know JMM has awesome boxing ability and he got outboxed by a better boxer in mayweather. Pac is a good boxer but his ability is more in brawling, he outslugs sluggers because he is quick and has better movement then the straight forward brawler. Now JMM has great timing (as seen vs katsidis where he was able time kats between punches and land combos as kats was trying to load up) and we all know what is required to compete with speed....timing. JMM had the timing to compete with mayweather but not the boxing ability as floyds defence is just waaaay too good. Where as pac leaves himself open which allows JMM to capitalise on openings when pac does those flurries. So far no one has been able to capitalise on that as they arent that sort of boxer.

Mosley these days considers himself a power puncher and just looks to unload the right hand. He only really had two good rounds against mayweather and this is because mosley was fighting a one dimensional fight, instead of being the boxer puncher he was being the puncher and every puncher that has faced floyd ends up being schooled. Pac has destroyed guys who just want to stand and trade (mosley in a nutshell these days) and we all know mosley doesnt have the stamina to trade all night so that would end up in a one sided beat down with either a late tko or lopside decision for pac. I disagree with everyone who says pac is a different animal at higher weight classes, to me he hasnt changed. He has always eaten brawlers alive for the fact he is way quicker and thats all he has done so far. Who was the last actual boxer he fought? You cant call Cotto a boxer, he was always more of a brawler. Pac has not fought a guy with the boxing skill of JMM since moving up, this fight would still be close no matter what weight division especially since JMM has the experience of fighting pac before where as these other poor souls have been just been shell shocked in the first round and not knowing what to expect.


Well thats my opinion anyway.

[Gandalf]

If Marquez really thinks he can go in there at 147 and get the job done then fair enough, but I think his heart is ruling over his head a bit. Marquez has been looking great at LW, but Pac has been looking great at WW. That's a big difference in power and muscle mass. Okay, they could be a similar weight on fight night, but with Pac it's all muscle, with Marquez it's more about rehydration unless he decides to bulk up too and that just isn't going to work for Marquez at his age.

I would love for Marquez to go up there and silence all the Pacheads, but I just cannot see it being a fair fight with a WW weigh in. It is the same as what Mayweather did to Marquez and we were all on his case. And now that Manny is doing it, you are all giving him a free pass and saying what's the problem? Total double standards. At least I am never less than consistent.

Actually there were some on his case, mainly Floyd's critics and haters. Not everyone. If the fight had taken place at 130 or 135 years ago, Floyd would dominate JMM even worse, considering he was even more offensive minded then and much faster. And considering that Floyd usually rehydrates 2 or 3 pounds at the most so it's not like he had a huge size advantage over JMM, it was the skills, speed, and reflexes that were the difference.

You're on about this fight being fair to JMM and the 3rd match should happen. But yet I posted that JMM turned down a '05 rematch against Pac for 750k years ago to fight 2 bums and Chris John for 30k. How do you explain that? If JMM had taken the fight the 3rd match would have happened in '08 or something like that. Or how about he asked for a 50/50 money split in January of this year when the fight was proposed to him by Pac's team? The fight more than likely would have been at 140 also since Pac was only 1 fight removed from fighting there. Talk about not taking the opportunities not presented to you. So who's fault was that? Who priced themselves out? Now JMM wants a 3rd match when he passed on the opportunities to fight Pac on a few occasions.

The moral of the story? Take opportunities in life that are presented to you. Don't turn them down and then chase down those opportunities that passed you by.

BTW, I don't think there will be a 3rd match with JMM. Floyd, Berto, Mosley, and the winner of Bradley/Alexander are on the horizon.

It doesn't matter what might have been between Mayweather and Marquez at LW. What matters is that Mayweather signed to fight a LW when he could have fought anyoone at WW. It was a hoax of a fight from the start and I give Mayweather little credit for it. The same as if Manny were to fight Marquez at 147.

Yes, there have been mistakes from the management of Marquez. For sure, I won't deny that, but right here, right now, I do not want to see a Pac/Marquez fight at 147. I would sooner have them look elsewhere for a fight. Marquez should not compromise on everything and if that means we don't see the fight then so be it.

Floyd dominated the no. 2 fighter in the sport at the time of his almost 2 year layoff. Again it's not like Floyd had a huge size advantage, it was the skills more than anything else. Floyd is a tiny Welterweight, more than likely could make the 140 pound limit. Again Floyd only rehydrates at the most 1-3 pounds on fight night. So it wasn't the size but skills that defeated JMM.

It is JMM that wants to fight for a 3rd time badly with Pac not the other way around. If he wants it, he's going to need to accept the demands. JMM wants the money, status, and biggest fights then he's going to need to take some huge risks for that. Just like Manny took some huge ones against Oscar in jumping another extra 2 weight classes after going from 130 to 135 and accepting only 32% of the overall money, not to mentioned ring size and glove size Oscar wanted. Floyd got his status as the PPV king of the sport right now and 1/2 the face of boxing by meeting all of Oscar's demands to fight him. It paid off.

Again I thought something else is funny, if JMM beat Pac twice as JMM and his supporters claim with all those writers and fans agreeing, then there is no need for a 3rd fight right? It's already decided, JMM has that. So why does he want a 3rd fight so badly then? You want to tell me Miles?

Come on now, Floyd is a large WW these days. He couldn't even make the catchweight to fight Matquez and looked absolutely huge next to him. No way did he put on just 2-3 pounds that night. Mayweather is in his mid-30's and has grown into the weight properly.

Why does Marquez want the fight so badly? I would imagine it has a lot to do with pride and Marquez being annoyed that the judges wouldn't see it the way the majority of the people scoring the fight saw it. He wants that win in the history books because what he has is not satisfactory and will be glossed over in the future.

Unfortunately it appears he is going to give up everything at the bargaining table to get it.