Why was Tito so obsessed with Roy and not with Oscar ????

[Beanflicker]

Tito had heart and courage for sure, but he had absolutely no idea how to go about dealing with Bernard's style. He was reduced to plodding forward and looking for the one big punch while getting eaten alive on the inside and from range. He was totally out of his class. This wasn't a bigger guy imposing his will on a smaller guy, this was a guy applying his superior craft on another guy and making him look stupid.

And I never said Trinidad was a natural MW. And if I did say that, I didn't say it was because he beat Joppy.

What I said was that the notion that Trinidad didn't carry power up to middleweight was stupid because he got in there with a LEGIT, MASSIVE, DURABLE middleweight and destroyed him with his power. We're not talking about getting in there with a journeyman middleweight: Joppy was top 5 at the time. World class. And Tito destroyed him.

Your Roy Jones analogy is totally irrelevant. Jones, despite being able to hit Ruiz at will, couldn't hurt Ruiz at all, which was further proof that he didn't belong at HW.

I believe Tito was a natural 154lber and that was a good weight for him, but we're only talking about going up one division. Does Hagler not deserve credit for beating Hearns and Duran, who were also coming up from WW and LMW?

[Jerry Rice]

Tito had heart and courage for sure, but he had absolutely no idea how to go about dealing with Bernard's style. He was reduced to plodding forward and looking for the one big punch while getting eaten alive on the inside and from range. He was totally out of his class. This wasn't a bigger guy imposing his will on a smaller guy, this was a guy applying his superior craft on another guy and making him look stupid.

And I never said Trinidad was a natural MW. And if I did say that, I didn't say it was because he beat Joppy.

What I said was that the notion that Trinidad didn't carry power up to middleweight was stupid because he got in there with a LEGIT, MASSIVE, DURABLE middleweight and destroyed him with his power. We're not talking about getting in there with a journeyman middleweight: Joppy was top 5 at the time. World class. And Tito destroyed him.

Your Roy Jones analogy is totally irrelevant. Jones, despite being able to hit Ruiz at will, couldn't hurt Ruiz at all, which was further proof that he didn't belong at HW.

I believe Tito was a natural 154lber and that was a good weight for him, but we're only talking about going up one division. Does Hagler not deserve credit for beating Hearns and Duran, who were also coming up from WW and LMW?

This is actually one of your best post ever. If you give Hopkins credit for beating Tito ( and you give Hagler as an example ) why don't you give him credit for beating De La Hoya.

[Violent Demise]

De La Hoya and Trinidad really should of fought 3 times. But Trinidad didn't want to. He knew he got a gift in there first fight. He knew in his heart he couldn't beat him. So he did everything he could to not make the fight. From demanding Oscar get 5 million while he took 20 million. And demanding the fight take place in Puerto Rico. Trinidad had deluded himself into thinking he was the draw. Oscar offered him a guaranteed 15 million for a rematch. Trinidad instead takes 4 million to fight David Reid. That proves he wanted nothing to do with Oscar De La Hoya

[Beanflicker]

This is actually one of your best post ever. If you give Hopkins credit for beating Tito ( and you give Hagler as an example ) why don't you give him credit for beating De La Hoya.

I give him credit for beating De La Hoya. Like Tito, DLH belonged at 154lb and not MW, but he was still a fantastic fighter with speed and skill, and I still believe he won a handful of those early rounds vs Hopkins.

[Beanflicker]

De La Hoya and Trinidad really should of fought 3 times. But Trinidad didn't want to. He knew he got a gift in there first fight. He knew in his heart he couldn't beat him. So he did everything he could to not make the fight. From demanding Oscar get 5 million while he took 20 million. And demanding the fight take place in Puerto Rico. Trinidad had deluded himself into thinking he was the draw. Oscar offered him a guaranteed 15 million for a rematch. Trinidad instead takes 4 million to fight David Reid. That proves he wanted nothing to do with Oscar De La Hoya

Wouldn't surprise me, Oscar outboxed Tito all day and got robbed.

[Master]

De La Hoya and Trinidad really should of fought 3 times. But Trinidad didn't want to. He knew he got a gift in there first fight. He knew in his heart he couldn't beat him. So he did everything he could to not make the fight. From demanding Oscar get 5 million while he took 20 million. And demanding the fight take place in Puerto Rico. Trinidad had deluded himself into thinking he was the draw. Oscar offered him a guaranteed 15 million for a rematch. Trinidad instead takes 4 million to fight David Reid. That proves he wanted nothing to do with Oscar De La Hoya

Wouldn't surprise me, Oscar outboxed Tito all day and got robbed.

That was smart from Tito to beat an undefeated olmpian at a higher weight and then be in a stronger position to negotiate.

[Violent Demise]

De La Hoya and Trinidad really should of fought 3 times. But Trinidad didn't want to. He knew he got a gift in there first fight. He knew in his heart he couldn't beat him. So he did everything he could to not make the fight. From demanding Oscar get 5 million while he took 20 million. And demanding the fight take place in Puerto Rico. Trinidad had deluded himself into thinking he was the draw. Oscar offered him a guaranteed 15 million for a rematch. Trinidad instead takes 4 million to fight David Reid. That proves he wanted nothing to do with Oscar De La Hoya

Wouldn't surprise me, Oscar outboxed Tito all day and got robbed.

That was smart from Tito to beat an undefeated olmpian at a higher weight and then be in a stronger position to negotiate.

Trinidad's combined purses for fighting David Reid, Mamadou Thiam, Fernando Vargas and William Joppy is still less than the 15 million De La Hoya offered him. Yeah real smart

[Master]

De La Hoya and Trinidad really should of fought 3 times. But Trinidad didn't want to. He knew he got a gift in there first fight. He knew in his heart he couldn't beat him. So he did everything he could to not make the fight. From demanding Oscar get 5 million while he took 20 million. And demanding the fight take place in Puerto Rico. Trinidad had deluded himself into thinking he was the draw. Oscar offered him a guaranteed 15 million for a rematch. Trinidad instead takes 4 million to fight David Reid. That proves he wanted nothing to do with Oscar De La Hoya

Wouldn't surprise me, Oscar outboxed Tito all day and got robbed.

That was smart from Tito to beat an undefeated olmpian at a higher weight and then be in a stronger position to negotiate.

Trinidad's combined purses for fighting David Reid, Mamadou Thiam, Fernando Vargas and William Joppy is still less than the 15 million De La Hoya offered him. Yeah real smart

Yes it was as he won them all.

[Mr140]

Tito did bad against great fighters who could box and could never adapt and never had a plan b. He got a huge gift against Oscar, then went on to lose every round against Bhop and then lose every round against Winky. Roy was pretty shot but still won every round but he was alot bigger as well.

[Violent Demise]

De La Hoya and Trinidad really should of fought 3 times. But Trinidad didn't want to. He knew he got a gift in there first fight. He knew in his heart he couldn't beat him. So he did everything he could to not make the fight. From demanding Oscar get 5 million while he took 20 million. And demanding the fight take place in Puerto Rico. Trinidad had deluded himself into thinking he was the draw. Oscar offered him a guaranteed 15 million for a rematch. Trinidad instead takes 4 million to fight David Reid. That proves he wanted nothing to do with Oscar De La Hoya

Wouldn't surprise me, Oscar outboxed Tito all day and got robbed.

That was smart from Tito to beat an undefeated olmpian at a higher weight and then be in a stronger position to negotiate.

Trinidad's combined purses for fighting David Reid, Mamadou Thiam, Fernando Vargas and William Joppy is still less than the 15 million De La Hoya offered him. Yeah real smart

Yes it was as he won them all.

From that point it was smart. Cuz he would of lost again to De La Hoya.

[Vendettos]

Tito beat Oscar so he had less to prove and more to lose.

He wanted Jones because he probably thought he could carry his punch up the weights but Hopkins told him different.

To be fair, he was knocking people out all over the place at MW before the Hopkins fight.

Tito fought one time at MW prior to Hopkins and that was to Joppy.

He went to light middle first.

Not a huge difference, if your power holds at LMW then not too far fetched hat you can hold it at MW.

[ruthless rocco]

Tito beat Oscar so he had less to prove and more to lose.

He wanted Jones because he probably thought he could carry his punch up the weights but Hopkins told him different.

To be fair, he was knocking people out all over the place at MW before the Hopkins fight.

Tito fought one time at MW prior to Hopkins and that was to Joppy.

He went to light middle first.

Not a huge difference, if your power holds at LMW then not too far fetched hat you can hold it at MW.

his power didn't hold against hopkins cause his hands weren't wrapped in the special way his father always wrapped them.

watch the fight tito. lands a few punches early and quickly realizes that he has no power. hopkins quickly realizes that tito has no plan b. easy fight for b-hop.

[Jerry Rice]

De La Hoya and Trinidad really should of fought 3 times. But Trinidad didn't want to. He knew he got a gift in there first fight. He knew in his heart he couldn't beat him. So he did everything he could to not make the fight. From demanding Oscar get 5 million while he took 20 million. And demanding the fight take place in Puerto Rico. Trinidad had deluded himself into thinking he was the draw. Oscar offered him a guaranteed 15 million for a rematch. Trinidad instead takes 4 million to fight David Reid. That proves he wanted nothing to do with Oscar De La Hoya

VD is no longer in his prime.


1. Yes I agree 100 percent they should have fought three times, which is why I made this thread.

2. Trinidad was one of the many boxers who believed that Oscar did not deserve his popularity, there were other great boxers at the time that werent getting a quarter of what he was getting, he got into an ego battle with Oscar, in their first fight he didn't have enough leverage to demand a 50-50 split despite being the champ for 6 years, so after his victory he used that as leverage.

3. Trinidad received 10 million for the fight and Oscar 20, Due to ego Tito wanted a swap in the rematch and Oscar's camp denied it, how you came up with 5 million is beyond me, and there is no evidence saying that Oscars camp ever offered anything close to a split.

4. Trinidad never wanted that fight to be on the Island, any fight in PR is a novelty fight, a fight put on for the local fans in appreciation for their support and its not about the revenue, if Tito wanted home turf advantage in a mega fight it would have been at MSG.

[Jerry Rice]

De La Hoya and Trinidad really should of fought 3 times. But Trinidad didn't want to. He knew he got a gift in there first fight. He knew in his heart he couldn't beat him. So he did everything he could to not make the fight. From demanding Oscar get 5 million while he took 20 million. And demanding the fight take place in Puerto Rico. Trinidad had deluded himself into thinking he was the draw. Oscar offered him a guaranteed 15 million for a rematch. Trinidad instead takes 4 million to fight David Reid. That proves he wanted nothing to do with Oscar De La Hoya

Wouldn't surprise me, Oscar outboxed Tito all day and got robbed.

If we are talking about rounds 5-8 I agree 100 percent, any other rounds and we are watching 2 different fights.

[Jerry Rice]

Tito did bad against great fighters who could box and could never adapt and never had a plan b. He got a huge gift against Oscar, then went on to lose every round against Bhop and then lose every round against Winky. Roy was pretty shot but still won every round but he was alot bigger as well.

Tito's 3 career losses were against

Hopkins
Wright
Jones

Which one of those guys could Oscar beat? We already know not Hopkins.