I actually am beginning to think no-one can beat Paul Williams at WW............

[Mr140]

Thank you Gamo people keep bringing up how Floyde is number on yet he has not beat better guys then Cotto but he is better then Cotto in the pound for pound thing but he is not better then Cotto when it comes to the welter cc i complete agree with what you just said just look at the names.

[Galaxy]

Yea but how many All time great have they Fought i have to say it pretty close i say the same number what about you buddy.

Yeah you maybe right.

Gamo why should the Ring become like the alphabet groups? Thats whats ruining the sport. You said it's a reference point... thats what it is! If you wanna know who the champion of a division thats where you gotta look. Just because Cotto may have beaten the beater comp at 147 doesn't automatically make him champion. I agree he's the #1 contender which is where he is rated by the Ring. But Floyd is champ!!! It's plain & simple... until Mayweather is defeated he'll be champ. Thats how it should be. You may feel that Cotto will defeat Floyd I however don't, but if Cotto is victorious I'll then recognize him as champ at 147. Then someone may come along who we all say is better than Cotto but they won't be champ until they defeat him... see how things work... don't you want the game to succeed? At least the Ring is trying to clean up some of the mess!

[El Gamo]

Yea but how many All time great have they Fought i have to say it pretty close i say the same number what about you buddy.

Yeah you maybe right.

Gamo why should the Ring become like the alphabet groups? Thats whats ruining the sport. You said it's a reference point... thats what it is! If you wanna know who the champion of a division thats where you gotta look. Just because Cotto may have beaten the beater comp at 147 doesn't automatically make him champion. I agree he's the #1 contender which is where he is rated by the Ring. But Floyd is champ!!! It's plain & simple... until Mayweather is defeated he'll be champ. Thats how it should be. You may feel that Cotto will defeat Floyd I however don't, but if Cotto is victorious I'll then recognize him as champ at 147. Then someone may come along who we all say is better than Cotto but they won't be champ until they defeat him... see how things work... don't you want the game to succeed? At least the Ring is trying to clean up some of the mess!

Dam. Hey,I can be wrong sometimes,anyone can and although I'm not sure about the whole RING system,primarily because,as I already pointed out,there are so many fighters that do not know/recognise it,you just totally won me over with that post bro. I guess it's true that their system is the best for boxing,I meant,why don't they become an org like the others as in,give ALL thier fighters a title,TELL them they don't have to pay sanctioning fees etc rather than just handing titles to a select few.

Ok,ok,the Gamo was wrong,Floyd IS number 1 by virtue of beating the lineal champ(1 of the worst lineal champs,Badozar). I'll have Cotto at 2 then. Excellent posting though,when you state it like that,it dam sure as heck makes alot of sense. CC.

[Galaxy]

Yea but how many All time great have they Fought i have to say it pretty close i say the same number what about you buddy.

Yeah you maybe right.

Gamo why should the Ring become like the alphabet groups? Thats whats ruining the sport. You said it's a reference point... thats what it is! If you wanna know who the champion of a division thats where you gotta look. Just because Cotto may have beaten the beater comp at 147 doesn't automatically make him champion. I agree he's the #1 contender which is where he is rated by the Ring. But Floyd is champ!!! It's plain & simple... until Mayweather is defeated he'll be champ. Thats how it should be. You may feel that Cotto will defeat Floyd I however don't, but if Cotto is victorious I'll then recognize him as champ at 147. Then someone may come along who we all say is better than Cotto but they won't be champ until they defeat him... see how things work... don't you want the game to succeed? At least the Ring is trying to clean up some of the mess!

Dam. Hey,I can be wrong sometimes,anyone can and although I'm not sure about the whole RING system,primarily because,as I already pointed out,there are so many fighters that do not know/recognise it,you just totally won me over with that post bro. I guess it's true that their system is the best for boxing,I meant,why don't they become an org like the others as in,give ALL thier fighters a title,TELL them they don't have to pay sanctioning fees etc rather than just handing titles to a select few.

Ok,ok,the Gamo was wrong,Floyd IS number 1 by virtue of beating the lineal champ(1 of the worst lineal champs,Badozar). I'll have Cotto at 2 then. Excellent posting though,when you state it like that,it dam sure as heck makes alot of sense. CC.

cc Gamo I'm glad you see what I'm saying. Your one of the best posters on Saddo's so I could never understand why you couldn't see the good the Ring is trying to do.

The Ring does give all their champions belts! They do tell them they don't have to pay fees! It'll take time but I think it'll make a difference.
I also agree that Baldomir wasn't brilliant but Floyd had been set to face Judah (until Zab crumbled) which at the time looked to be a great match-up!

[ICB]

Yea but how many All time great have they Fought i have to say it pretty close i say the same number what about you buddy.

Genaro Hernandez had never been beaten at Superfeatherweight when Mayweather fought him. And Hernandez had win against the great Azumah Nelson that was great victory for Mayweather considering he only had 17 pro fights.

Reminds me of when Whitaker fought Jose Luis Ramirez when Whitaker only had 15 pro fights except Whitaker got robbed unfortunately

[El Gamo]

Yea but how many All time great have they Fought i have to say it pretty close i say the same number what about you buddy.

Yeah you maybe right.

Gamo why should the Ring become like the alphabet groups? Thats whats ruining the sport. You said it's a reference point... thats what it is! If you wanna know who the champion of a division thats where you gotta look. Just because Cotto may have beaten the beater comp at 147 doesn't automatically make him champion. I agree he's the #1 contender which is where he is rated by the Ring. But Floyd is champ!!! It's plain & simple... until Mayweather is defeated he'll be champ. Thats how it should be. You may feel that Cotto will defeat Floyd I however don't, but if Cotto is victorious I'll then recognize him as champ at 147. Then someone may come along who we all say is better than Cotto but they won't be champ until they defeat him... see how things work... don't you want the game to succeed? At least the Ring is trying to clean up some of the mess!

Dam. Hey,I can be wrong sometimes,anyone can and although I'm not sure about the whole RING system,primarily because,as I already pointed out,there are so many fighters that do not know/recognise it,you just totally won me over with that post bro. I guess it's true that their system is the best for boxing,I meant,why don't they become an org like the others as in,give ALL thier fighters a title,TELL them they don't have to pay sanctioning fees etc rather than just handing titles to a select few.

Ok,ok,the Gamo was wrong,Floyd IS number 1 by virtue of beating the lineal champ(1 of the worst lineal champs,Badozar). I'll have Cotto at 2 then. Excellent posting though,when you state it like that,it dam sure as heck makes alot of sense. CC.

cc Gamo I'm glad you see what I'm saying. Your one of the best posters on Saddo's so I could never understand why you couldn't see the good the Ring is trying to do.

The Ring does give all their champions belts! They do tell them they don't have to pay fees! It'll take time but I think it'll make a difference.
I also agree that Baldomir wasn't brilliant but Floyd had been set to face Judah (until Zab crumbled) which at the time looked to be a great match-up!

I guess I didn't respect the RING as much as I should because of the things I mentioned plus you never hear the announcer say "RING champion" and so many fighters dont mention it. I agree with you now though,1 champ per division is awesome BUT,I honestly didn't know they told the fighters there were no sanctioning fees and they gave them all titles. Are you sure? That makes the fighters look like mornons if they don't like the RING then! Man,I just ate a big slice of humble pie :P

[Pugilistic]

he's a good fighter and imagining anyone beating him is hard because of his activity, height and reach.

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

Ok,I give Tony a chance IF he starts early and I did think Kermit would be able to KO him but now I think Kermit is unable to take pressure and has not improved as I had thought. I think Williams beats 2 bags of S*** out of Hatton,Oscar,Clottey,Collazo and Judah if ANY dare to fight him

(I'd like to add that Zab Judah and Carlos Quintana have been offered to fight Williams for Feb 3,since Kermit "injured", I doubt either takes it)

The only question mark for me is Cotto and I LOVE Cotto but I only think PW style gives him hell. PW would pot shot,and whenever he got inside,PW would hold.Like he did with Tony.He would have to bang early and hope PW tries to war. Tony and Cotto have the best chances imo.

(I actually hate to admit this but this freak is going to be a handful for ANYONE and he will fight ANYONE.Tall,good handspeed,pitty patty punches which don't hurt but dam sure as heck count and a FREAKISHLY long jab make him a force. I think he would struggle at the higher weights but as for now,at 147,he is going to take some beating )

I pretty much agree with you. I know he took big shots from Tony but i did wonder how he'd handle shots form Cintron...

But since Cintron is STILL showing signs of flapping under pressure, I guess Williams has the tools to beat Cintron too

[ICB]

Ok,I give Tony a chance IF he starts early and I did think Kermit would be able to KO him but now I think Kermit is unable to take pressure and has not improved as I had thought. I think Williams beats 2 bags of S*** out of Hatton,Oscar,Clottey,Collazo and Judah if ANY dare to fight him

(I'd like to add that Zab Judah and Carlos Quintana have been offered to fight Williams for Feb 3,since Kermit "injured", I doubt either takes it)

The only question mark for me is Cotto and I LOVE Cotto but I only think PW style gives him hell. PW would pot shot,and whenever he got inside,PW would hold.Like he did with Tony.He would have to bang early and hope PW tries to war. Tony and Cotto have the best chances imo.

(I actually hate to admit this but this freak is going to be a handful for ANYONE and he will fight ANYONE.Tall,good handspeed,pitty patty punches which don't hurt but dam sure as heck count and a FREAKISHLY long jab make him a force. I think he would struggle at the higher weights but as for now,at 147,he is going to take some beating )

I pretty much agree with you. I know he took big shots from Tony but i did wonder how he'd handle shots form Cintron...

But since Cintron is STILL showing signs of flapping under pressure, I guess Williams has the tools to beat Cintron too

I think Cintron's power is a bit overrated he has never stopped anyone worth mentioning.

[LEGION]

Williams will easily beat Cintron. He'll have him so frustrated by the 8th round or so that it will be like mugging a baby after that. I know I'm a Cintron hater, but the guy seemed like he was going to fold under Feliciano at the end of several rounds and we all know what a shamefaced performance against Margarito he had. Just because he ktfo Mathysse doesn't mean he'll stay with any of the top tier WW's. Williams will wear him down mentally and then either get a UD or will k.o. Cintron in the late rounds. Williams is a good fighter, but because of that freaky frame he will be tough to beat just on a punch outrate point of view. Cotto will have to go back to mauling people to beat PW, as he can't sit out and box with a guy with that much reach. I'd love to see a PW/Cotto fight just to watch Cotto get inside and go old school on him, if he can. I'd like to see PW fight Zab and beat what little hair Zab still has on his face off. PW is a tough, tough fight for anyone, Mayweather included.

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

I pretty much agree with you. I know he took big shots from Tony but i did wonder how he'd handle shots form Cintron...

But since Cintron is STILL showing signs of flapping under pressure, I guess Williams has the tools to beat Cintron too

I think Cintron's power is a bit overrated he has never stopped anyone worth mentioning.

This is true. Mind you, he may still improve.

[JT Rock]

Yea but how many All time great have they Fought i have to say it pretty close i say the same number what about you buddy.

Yeah you maybe right.

Gamo why should the Ring become like the alphabet groups? Thats whats ruining the sport. You said it's a reference point... thats what it is! If you wanna know who the champion of a division thats where you gotta look. Just because Cotto may have beaten the beater comp at 147 doesn't automatically make him champion. I agree he's the #1 contender which is where he is rated by the Ring. But Floyd is champ!!! It's plain & simple... until Mayweather is defeated he'll be champ. Thats how it should be. You may feel that Cotto will defeat Floyd I however don't, but if Cotto is victorious I'll then recognize him as champ at 147. Then someone may come along who we all say is better than Cotto but they won't be champ until they defeat him... see how things work... don't you want the game to succeed? At least the Ring is trying to clean up some of the mess!

Dam. Hey,I can be wrong sometimes,anyone can and although I'm not sure about the whole RING system,primarily because,as I already pointed out,there are so many fighters that do not know/recognise it,you just totally won me over with that post bro. I guess it's true that their system is the best for boxing,I meant,why don't they become an org like the others as in,give ALL thier fighters a title,TELL them they don't have to pay sanctioning fees etc rather than just handing titles to a select few.

Ok,ok,the Gamo was wrong,Floyd IS number 1 by virtue of beating the lineal champ(1 of the worst lineal champs,Badozar). I'll have Cotto at 2 then. Excellent posting though,when you state it like that,it dam sure as heck makes alot of sense. CC.

to the both of you for a good clean debate, great points on both sides. A right proper clinic on how to compromise