Geez these f'ers are crazy.

[Trainer Monkey]

Trainer my experience in the Arab/Muslim world is that violence wins the day. Their culture doesn't respond to rational thought. It doesn't respond live and let live. They believe in absolutes. There is a reason that most arab/muslim nations are ruled by an iron fisted govt/monarch. I offered the world to tons of Iraqi's and rarely got anything but lipservice but a barrel of a gun got a lot of results. If you think we can play by our rules and win you are mistaken.

Be a hell of a surprise to Egypt and Turkey,two of our allies in the region,who are both predominantly Muslim

[VictorCharlie]

Trainer like I said I don't care for organized religion so bash away on Christians god knows that they have their own warts, but the reality is its apple and oranges. In today's world it is rare that mainstream christian denominations whole sale sponsor murder. That can't be said about Islam

[Trainer Monkey]

Trainer like I said I don't care for organized religion so bash away on Christians god knows that they have their own warts, but the reality is its apple and oranges. In today's world it is rare that mainstream christian denominations whole sale sponsor murder. That can't be said about Islam

There we get to my point,it is apples and oranges,when anyone says they speak for god,or god talks to them,something is most likely going to explode. My point being it doesnt matter what religion is setting the fuse,it seems to happen with all Judeo-Christian religions,including Islaam.
But to take a moral higher ground postion of "We dont do that" oh horseshit,you have more then your share of nutjobs as well

[El Kabong]

At the end of the day,Lyle is moderate to far right,he isnt even close to serious hard right,those guys have compounds and scare me way more then Muslims. I dont have a Muslim living anywhere near me,but I bet I can find a methed up Christian who gods been talking to lately.
If I judged christianity strictly on being anti gay while traiding meth for homosexual acts (Ted Haggerty) or claiming I redirected a hurricane away from Virginia right in to New England with the power of god(Pat "Actually ran for president"Robertson),youd think all Christians were out of their fucking gord

Now who's stereotyping

Nobody is trying to say that ALL Christians are good and great but the culture of the west is a lot better than the culture of the middle ages

[Trainer Monkey]

At the end of the day,Lyle is moderate to far right,he isnt even close to serious hard right,those guys have compounds and scare me way more then Muslims. I dont have a Muslim living anywhere near me,but I bet I can find a methed up Christian who gods been talking to lately.
If I judged christianity strictly on being anti gay while traiding meth for homosexual acts (Ted Haggerty) or claiming I redirected a hurricane away from Virginia right in to New England with the power of god(Pat "Actually ran for president"Robertson),youd think all Christians were out of their fucking gord

Now who's stereotyping

Nobody is trying to say that ALL Christians are good and great but the culture of the west is a lot better than the culture of the middle ages

Funny,Ive been on some of those compounds,its hard to stereotype what youve seen with your own eyes
And those guys are psychopaths for Christ
Ive been on the Christian Posse Comitatis and Aryan Nations compounds Lyle
Those guys are freaking nut jobs for the lord
Its not a matter of who they shoot,its a matter of making sure it isnt you until you get to the gate.

[Trainer Monkey]

And to save time,Im one of the original SHARP Skinheads,and despite being Polish and Cherokee,the German gave me the blue eyes,the boneheads assumed I was white as the driven snow

[Kev]

Funny the hard right has been trying to make those lunatics at Waco martyrs for years now

Lyle is the hard right and apparently he has made it quite clear that killing in the name of any religion is repulsive

At the end of the day,Lyle is moderate to far right,he isnt even close to serious hard right,those guys have compounds and scare me way more then Muslims. I dont have a Muslim living anywhere near me,but I bet I can find a methed up Christian who gods been talking to lately.
If I judged christianity strictly on being anti gay while traiding meth for homosexual acts (Ted Haggerty) or claiming I redirected a hurricane away from Virginia right in to New England with the power of god(Pat "Actually ran for president"Robertson),youd think all Christians were out of their fucking gord

But these are two examples though, and all they are examples of are either hypocrisy in the case of Haggerty or weird delused beliefs in the case of Robertson.

Nobody is arguing that religions don't or shouldn't have some weird beliefs, they all do, the difference is Christian sects don't represent mainstream Christianity and certainly don't represent national governments, and these people arn't beheading or stoning people.

How can you not see the difference here?

If you live in America you are free to choose to think Pat Robertson is a fucking loon and even to say so publicly.

If he was a Muslim cleric and you lived in Iran, your criticisms of him would get you killed.

THAT's the difference.

Why not move to the middle east if you prefer it and their values to your own country?

Of course you would be imprisoned immediately for training women to fight thus hinting at their equality, and they would be lashed, beaten and stoned to death for being whores for daring to bare their midriffs in public but its a better place right?

[Trainer Monkey]

Lyle is the hard right and apparently he has made it quite clear that killing in the name of any religion is repulsive

At the end of the day,Lyle is moderate to far right,he isnt even close to serious hard right,those guys have compounds and scare me way more then Muslims. I dont have a Muslim living anywhere near me,but I bet I can find a methed up Christian who gods been talking to lately.
If I judged christianity strictly on being anti gay while traiding meth for homosexual acts (Ted Haggerty) or claiming I redirected a hurricane away from Virginia right in to New England with the power of god(Pat "Actually ran for president"Robertson),youd think all Christians were out of their fucking gord

But these are two examples though, and all they are examples of are either hypocrisy in the case of Haggerty or weird delused beliefs in the case of Robertson.

Nobody is arguing that religions don't or shouldn't have some weird beliefs, they all do, the difference is Christian sects don't represent mainstream Christianity and certainly don't represent national governments, and these people arn't beheading or stoning people.

How can you not see the difference here?

If you live in America you are free to choose to think Pat Robertson is a fucking loon and even to say so publicly.

If he was a Muslim cleric and you lived in Iran, your criticisms of him would get you killed.

THAT's the difference.

Why not move to the middle east if you prefer it and their values to your own country?

Of course you would be imprisoned immediately for training women to fight thus hinting at their equality, and they would be lashed, beaten and stoned to death for being whores for daring to bare their midriffs in public but its a better place right?

How can you not
Bush ran this country for 8 years
Remember anti gay marriage amendement attempt,cutting funding to family planning
Almost like he was beholden to the extreme end of some religion

[Andre]

Trainer personally I don't think that enemy combatants deserve the same rights as US citizens nor do I think we should follow any rules of war that our adversary doesn't. I'll take torture at Gitmo over decapitation on Al Jazeera all day. And you are right to an extent. The big picture isn't always about religion. It is about power and money. But the tool used to recruit and motivate men and women to murder and commit horrible acts is religion. Islam's supreme leaders could stop this. They could be widely vocal against jihadism but they don't. The world's muslim population is woefully silent on the unattractive underside of their faith.

They are silent because the whole Muslum thing is ran on the power of fear to control those under them.

Like the mob used to be; question them and pay or die; so general people let them go on the way put their heads down and shut up; so the mob evolved and now they are hidden and intrenched into higher places so that Mr and Mrs lewis dont have to see them at work in their streets any longer and now think they dont exist as a force.

Same goes for Our boys at the top of world affairs ,we've done our hard yards in the fields of blood already and we now run the global show.

Now its a matter of protect the position we have.The false Christain "we are here doing the job of the rightouss" is the biggest sham in history your bosses bow to politians who bow to the world banking order who bow to no one, not even God.So religion or freedom isnt what they are really protecting.

Religion is just the excuse now given from the politicans so that Mr and Mrs "Dumb as sh!t Lewis" nod there heads and keep voting and keep on paying taxes for your tours so that the top dogs can keep their control of the only system they belive in.

From our 'Political point of view' it isnt so much Muslim verses us ,although that does exist and they are a threat, sort of with that much oil under them and also the odd attack against our financial buildings etc (thats was a message from them hitting world trade like they did).If they were against Christians they would have shot a plane down into Vatican city (and dont rule that out)if we play that false card they will have a go at it.

Its now all a great excuse to justify the use of what we have built our society up on;which is also warfare and control of society as a whole.

Both sides are antiChrist both sides are insane in terms of the true message and the real way outlined in all the scriptures.

[Kev]

At the end of the day,Lyle is moderate to far right,he isnt even close to serious hard right,those guys have compounds and scare me way more then Muslims. I dont have a Muslim living anywhere near me,but I bet I can find a methed up Christian who gods been talking to lately.
If I judged christianity strictly on being anti gay while traiding meth for homosexual acts (Ted Haggerty) or claiming I redirected a hurricane away from Virginia right in to New England with the power of god(Pat "Actually ran for president"Robertson),youd think all Christians were out of their fucking gord

But these are two examples though, and all they are examples of are either hypocrisy in the case of Haggerty or weird delused beliefs in the case of Robertson.

Nobody is arguing that religions don't or shouldn't have some weird beliefs, they all do, the difference is Christian sects don't represent mainstream Christianity and certainly don't represent national governments, and these people arn't beheading or stoning people.

How can you not see the difference here?

If you live in America you are free to choose to think Pat Robertson is a fucking loon and even to say so publicly.

If he was a Muslim cleric and you lived in Iran, your criticisms of him would get you killed.

THAT's the difference.

Why not move to the middle east if you prefer it and their values to your own country?

Of course you would be imprisoned immediately for training women to fight thus hinting at their equality, and they would be lashed, beaten and stoned to death for being whores for daring to bare their midriffs in public but its a better place right?

How can you not
Bush ran this country for 8 years
Remember anti gay marriage amendement attempt,cutting funding to family planning
Almost like he was beholden to the extreme end of some religion

So not allowing gays to marry is the same as killing them , interesting

Gay people are tolerated in America, no attempt is made to stop them from being gay. It's just that the Christian religion and the sacrament of marriage says 'one man for one woman' and Bush wanted to uphold that. It doesn't allow polygmay either or human animal marriages but you didnt seem to mind that.

How does that even remotely compare to the Islamic world KILLING people SUSPECTED of being gay?

[El Kabong]

Almost like he was attempting to please his backers like somebody who is in office right now

[Trainer Monkey]

But these are two examples though, and all they are examples of are either hypocrisy in the case of Haggerty or weird delused beliefs in the case of Robertson.

Nobody is arguing that religions don't or shouldn't have some weird beliefs, they all do, the difference is Christian sects don't represent mainstream Christianity and certainly don't represent national governments, and these people arn't beheading or stoning people.

How can you not see the difference here?

If you live in America you are free to choose to think Pat Robertson is a fucking loon and even to say so publicly.

If he was a Muslim cleric and you lived in Iran, your criticisms of him would get you killed.

THAT's the difference.

Why not move to the middle east if you prefer it and their values to your own country?

Of course you would be imprisoned immediately for training women to fight thus hinting at their equality, and they would be lashed, beaten and stoned to death for being whores for daring to bare their midriffs in public but its a better place right?

How can you not
Bush ran this country for 8 years
Remember anti gay marriage amendement attempt,cutting funding to family planning
Almost like he was beholden to the extreme end of some religion

So not allowing gays to marry is the same as killing them , interesting

Gay people are tolerated in America, no attempt is made to stop them from being gay. It's just that the Christian religion and the sacrament of marriage says 'one man for one woman' and Bush wanted to uphold that. He doesn't allow polygmay either or human animal marriages but you didnt seem to mind that.

How does that even remotely compare to the Islamic world KILLING people SUSPECTED of being gay?

Not funding AIDS research was
Not interesting,but very true,well if you were a family member of someone dying of AIDS in the 80's I guess that would seem pretty interesting. Reagan refused to fund research
Any religion coming from America that spent most of the last century responding to Christs admonition "Whatsoever you do to the least of my children" by letting the victim of the lynching pick their tree branch, is going to sound more then a bit of BS

[Trainer Monkey]

Almost like he was attempting to please his backers like somebody who is in office right now

Heaven forbid the President was beholden to the American people,that might end up looking like representative democracy

[Andre]

But these are two examples though, and all they are examples of are either hypocrisy in the case of Haggerty or weird delused beliefs in the case of Robertson.

Nobody is arguing that religions don't or shouldn't have some weird beliefs, they all do, the difference is Christian sects don't represent mainstream Christianity and certainly don't represent national governments, and these people arn't beheading or stoning people.

How can you not see the difference here?

If you live in America you are free to choose to think Pat Robertson is a fucking loon and even to say so publicly.

If he was a Muslim cleric and you lived in Iran, your criticisms of him would get you killed.

THAT's the difference.

Why not move to the middle east if you prefer it and their values to your own country?

Of course you would be imprisoned immediately for training women to fight thus hinting at their equality, and they would be lashed, beaten and stoned to death for being whores for daring to bare their midriffs in public but its a better place right?

How can you not
Bush ran this country for 8 years
Remember anti gay marriage amendement attempt,cutting funding to family planning
Almost like he was beholden to the extreme end of some religion

So not allowing gays to marry is the same as killing them , interesting

So far they are your words Bilbo not Tms.

Bilbo I agree ,it is wrong to treat your societies like that true;Ours is the better. There is a vast difference; but even you know that isnt why we are over there fighting them and thats not why you are placing those other facts out here to air either.

From what I read Tm is only drawing comparissions on evils out of both sides.

I think he well knows and admitts the evil undertones of both sides.

Can you see that side of it?

i maybe putting words in his mouth from reading between the lines too but I think he is against us in the West saying we are the warriors of God doing Gods work as Christians ,where as our undertones are also greed and insanity, just on a different level. Thus my posts on the matter.

[El Kabong]

Heaven forbid the President was beholden to the American people,that might end up looking like representative democracy

Maybe we'll get there one day...but it won't be soon