Joe Louis has the best record in HW world title fights... Right? Wrong!

[bradlee180]

And another smart ass is born! LOL

I think I could find more fitting comparisons than that.

I guess you can find shit looking clips of fights in any era.

So much for that argument lol, well done Bradlee!... Asshole!

Gotcha !

[bradlee180]

[powerpuncher]

You guys have it wrong. You are now days clearly in the realm of what is describes as "old time nutbags". I think most sober ppl these days "WITH PLENTY OF BOXING KNOWLEDGE" would agree that the guys your talking about would be banged out in an easy nights work Mr. Powerpuncher.

And as for you Spicoli, I wonder why Haye might be more hesitant than Marciano appeared to be. Take a look at the guys Haye fought and then look at the guys Rocky did. Rest my case. And David Haye didn't have to risk as much regardless because he knew how to box, Marciano barely did.

I would like to see how confident Marciano would be were he to have fought Wladimir Klitschko instead of Haye, ha. We all know what would happen there. Rocky would be knocked out with the first connected jab. Fact!

Audley Harrison would have dominated the Marciano era. I'm positive of THAT!

can you find me any boxing historian or expert that thinks like you? thats an honest question because i would be very interested in finding someone that has studied boxing for a living and thinks that haye would beat louis. again, i understand on the internet it may sound sarcastic, but im serious. if you could find some sort of expert on boxing that agrees with you, i would love to see it.

[Max Power]

I am surrounded by people who discuss boxing current and serious all the time. And I assure you most guys would agree that Haye would destroy Louis. It could not really be otherwise, just look at them.

Boxing historians opinions are not worth a drop of piss in the dessert when it comes to these matters and I'm not sure these so called "experts" on such matters are more equipped to draw any conclusions than what I am.

I think you'll find there is a very large "status quo" in line with your thinking around the gyms and forums but you will also find that there is a very large and ever growing number of "realist" fans like myself who happen to study the fights and the facts and look at it purely for how it really is without bias and influence. That is what makes an "expert" not writing a "back in my day book".

Futhermore your opinions are predominant only in America, and to a lesser extent Britain, and are pretty much frowned upon elsewhere (in Europe and Australia) which is a coincidence since most of these guys you are trying to save are "good old American heroes".

What you have to understand is a lot of these "experts" are "expected" to make such claims, for the several obvious reasons why they would want to promote the glory of the past. And the worst of all is the "old time historian".

I can think of some and there are articles on the internet but let me present to you Evander Holyfield. He was "told" to say that his era couldn't hold a candle to previous but went against the script mid interview and said what he really though. Respectfully of course, but pretty much admitting that he'd have smashed Louis!

David Haye is virtually the slickest HW we've had to date. Some of the best reflexes ever seen. He has problems against hard punchers with great delivery skills.

Louis couldn't land shit on Haye that would be worth anything. Were they to fight today, Haye would dominate him and knock him out.

Any so called "expert" must know this. If they really do their research properly and really reach an alternate conclusion, then they are either no expert at all... Or they are lying!

[bradlee180]

Regarding sports, Boxing is unique.

For example, despite a much larger global population, there was more Boxing matches per year that now during the mid to late 1920s(Dempsey), early 1930s, and the mid to late 1940s(Louis).

Early records are incomplete, but there is stats that over 27 thousand pro bouts did happen in 1931.
Nowadays, despite a much larger global population, we have about 20 000 pro bouts per year.

In the early 1980s Golden Age (Hagler, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hearns, Duran), there were about 12 to almost 15 thousand pro bouts per year.

The point is Joe Louis ruled the roost for 12 years and 25 Title defenses when there was far more Boxing than now, and what Joe ruled over has now been broken up into 2 weight classes.
1946 (Louis/Conn) has over 28 thousand matches that year.

David Haye is a world class fighter and has accomplishments, but they pale in comparison to the Great Joe Louis' accomplishments.

I think Joe Louis is the most fundamentally sound Heavyweight Champ in Boxing history.
Physically, they're about the same size. Louis carried his power late into fights, didn't gas out.

Haye is not very slick at all. He has very fast hands though.
With a better Coach to refine him for the top levels, Haye could have added more tools to his arsenal, the potential was there. Like how Roach refined and developed Pacquiao further. Like what Emanuel Stewart was able to do for Lennox and Wladimir. In Haye's entire career, he hasn't fought anything like what Joe Louis was.

[ruthless rocco]

With the exception of Chisora, all David the Fucking Sissy Haye's opponents were in their late 30's with many recent loses on their records. How can you consider him ELITE when he's fighting over the hill bums who have lost 2, 3 or 4 of their most recent fights?!!!

You are possibly the biggest idiot to have posted on Saddo's -- save for the racists and homophobes. Congratulations @Max Power... You're in tremendous company. You MORON!

[Max Power]

Complete rose-coloured glasses I'm afraid. Joe Louis demonstratably has trouble slipping punches. David Haye vs Wladimir Klitschko, made the long range, fast and accurate Wladimir miss all night, only 25% punch accuracy from the champ!

Haye barely sustains any damage whole career, Louis was a punch bag. Haye fought and beat giant boxers with condition and skill Louis outsized 90%! of his opponents, of the 6 bigger boxers he faced, only 3 were real giants and they were all complete oafs. Haye was outgunned at HW in all his fights!

Louis was bested by cruiser Max Scmelling, dropped by an emporer penguin, a danny DeVito look alike in Tony Galento. Haye would not be allowed to KO Schmelling and would laugh at Galento.

I'm sorry but either you cannot have watched Haye's fights, have seen them and know I'm right but are trying to cover it up or you have some special issues if you don't think Haye is slick at all.

Same for Louis. If you really watch Louis one can only conclude is that his performance relative to today is not very impressive.

Joe Louis never fought anybody like David Haye more like it, if Joe Louis had decent coaching like Haye he might be as polished as Haye, THAT's more like it. And Haye has fought opponents like Louis before... In the Amatuers!

It's interesting to note though that you implied the truth, that the modern division is one of the MOST active of all time and the Louis and Dempsey eras were exceptions.

However you alluded to but didn't complete the picture- The HW era then was a combined CW+HW era. If you take CW and HW eras together today then guess what.. You find there were MORE fights now!

And another even more important point- there are comparable fights now even despite the fact that those old guys fought for a dollar and a meal ticket every month or so where as the modern HW fights only 3 times a year. Kind of shits all over the nobody is interested in boxing anymore theory doesn't it!

[Master]

You are a grade A clown comparing Haye with the great Joe Louis is silly. Haye lost against the great cruiserweight Thompson, so how can you compare?

[Max Power]

Rocco I never said Haye is greater than Louis, let's get that straight, he is not to be mentioned alongside Louis in that sense, and you'll notice Haye doesn't appear on the title list either.

But I MUST insist on Haye beating the living crap out of Louis.. Not in a competitive fight either.

Haye would belt up Louis like it was an easy sparring session, not even close!

And that's just a plain fact, like it or not.

[ruthless rocco]

Complete rose-coloured glasses I'm afraid. Joe Louis demonstratably has trouble slipping punches. David Haye vs Wladimir Klitschko, made the long range, fast and accurate Wladimir miss all night, only 25% punch accuracy from the champ!

Haye barely sustains any damage whole career, Louis was a punch bag. Haye fought and beat giant boxers with condition and skill Louis outsized 90%! of his opponents, of the 6 bigger boxers he faced, only 3 were real giants and they were all complete oafs. Haye was outgunned at HW in all his fights!

Louis was bested by cruiser Max Scmelling, dropped by an emporer penguin, a danny DeVito look alike in Tony Galento. Haye would not be allowed to KO Schmelling and would laugh at Galento.

I'm sorry but either you cannot have watched Haye's fights, have seen them and know I'm right but are trying to cover it up or you have some special issues if you don't think Haye is slick at all.

Same for Louis. If you really watch Louis one can only conclude is that his performance relative to today is not very impressive.

Joe Louis never fought anybody like David Haye more like it, if Joe Louis had decent coaching like Haye he might be as polished as Haye, THAT's more like it. And Haye has fought opponents like Louis before... In the Amatuers!

It's interesting to note though that you implied the truth, that the modern division is one of the MOST active of all time and the Louis and Dempsey eras were exceptions.

However you alluded to but didn't complete the picture- The HW era then was a combined CW+HW era. If you take CW and HW eras together today then guess what.. You find there were MORE fights now!

And another even more important point- there are comparable fights now even despite the fact that those old guys fought for a dollar and a meal ticket every month or so where as the modern HW fights only 3 times a year. Kind of shits all over the nobody is interested in boxing anymore theory doesn't it!

Your "insightful" comments about Haye vs Klit would only be relevant if Haye had won so much as ONE ROUND... He lost the whole fight... Start to finish. So it doesn't matter what Klitschko's connect percentage was because Haye did FUCKALL!!!

Haye beat giant boxers with no skill or stamina. Yes they were bigger. Were they utter shit? YES!!! Is Valuev a good fighter despite the fact that he is bigger than most old school heavyweights? NO! He sucks no matter what era he fought in. I'd pick any of the TOP current middleweight, supermiddle, light heavy or cruiserweights to beat Valuev. That fucking giant was a JOKE!

The fact that Louis had tough fights over the course of his career attests to the skills of the opponents at the time not to the skills of the current HW fighters who are steroid using fat fucks or pseudo giants with little or no co-ordination.

As for your comments about SIZE... POUND 4POUND given all the opportunities of DIET, MEDICINE, SCIENCE and STEROIDS the greats of yesteryear would have KICKED the ASSES of the FAT FUCKS of today.

Your limited agenda has been exposed. Stop trying to argue the same point over and over again.

Get a girlfriend. Start banging your mom. Date a dude.... Whatever it takes, but stop trying to change facts. You look like sad fucking moron every time.

[Beanz]

I have another test, which I've performed numerous times to my expected affect.

Take a woman, or a child or somebody else who knows nothing at all of boxing. Coach them not at all. Put them in front of an olden days championship fight, then put them in front of a modern championship fight, and ask them to honestly tell you which set looks better?

Almost all say the same thing. The old guys look weak, slow and unco. The new guys look fast, strong and crisp.

Ha! Really? Your dumb argument puts you firmly in the camp of the ignorant and ill informed. Enjoy your X Factor "talent" and the vacuous celebrity twit filled world that masquerades as ability. You are quite obviously not interested in rationality or a discussion and therefor are simply trolling. You are suggesting that people ignore trainers, boxers themselves and promoters, journalists etc with decades of first hand experience and entertain your own proposal simply because you are personally unable to understand conventional thought on what constitutes greatness in a boxer. You are accusing people of wearing rose tinted glasses whilst burying your own head in a hole.

[Max Power]

As a matter of fact Rocco, I presented facts, THE facts, that aren't changed and you couldn't handle them.

I did give up on trying to educate you, long ago.

But for some reason you keep popping up out of the woodwork for more and you can throw abuse all you want but at the end of the day... These so called "fat fucks" are still gonna kick your favourites asses!

By the way I'm married and have 1 month til the birth of my first child, going to be called by coincidence... Max! =P

So you should only have to put up with adversity for the next month then I'll be too busy to be argue and you can go back to your little fantasy land where Louis beats up todays HW division. But until then... He's a great champion in an ancient era.

[powerpuncher]

As a matter of fact Rocco, I presented facts, THE facts, that aren't changed and you couldn't handle them.

I did give up on trying to educate you, long ago.

But for some reason you keep popping up out of the woodwork for more and you can throw abuse all you want but at the end of the day... These so called "fat fucks" are still gonna kick your favourites asses!

By the way I'm married and have 1 month til the birth of my first child, going to be called by coincidence... Max! =P

So you should only have to put up with adversity for the next month then I'll be too busy to be argue and you can go back to your little fantasy land where Louis beats up todays HW division. But until then... He's a great champion in an ancient era.

i feel like you have presented some facts but your last few posts have just been random ranting about you knowing better than everybody with absolutely no facts. you said that you have talked to a lot of people who know boxing that would agree with you. i will tell you that i have not talked to anybody who knows boxing that would agree with you and thats a fact. that means that i have to just trust your word that your friends (or whoever you are talking to) know a lot about boxing and its history and also agree with you. its hard to trust that when i havent met anyone with your opinions. maybe you hang out with people like you though.

like i keep saying, if you cant trust "experts" or historians then i dont know what to tell you. they, along with many other people including myself, have seen many old fights and can clearly see that someone like joe louis was great and that david haye is just good. for example, if you watch 5 joe louis fights and 5 haye fights, i guarantee you that anybody who really knows boxing will be able to easily observe that louis has way more skill set than haye.

and did you live in the 30's? you are just assuming that people like galento and schmelling are bad boxers? schmelling was actually a very good fighter. galento was fat but wasnt as bad as most people think. he was actually very athletic and strong. he just didnt train hard. kind of like a lot of HWs today. the difference is that galento wasnt considered a top fighter like arreola.

[brocktonblockbust]

Joe Louis---26 consecutive title defenses. Holy Fuck!

cut the cock off of anyone who talks shit about The Bomber.

[Max Power]

What constitutes an "expert" to you? Many of us box, have boxed, train boxing, watch boxing, know boxing and analyse it all the time so aren't we the "experts".

It pisses me off when guys like you turn away from true facts to bring up a statement issued by a guy in a position of authority to support your argument when that statement in the first place was not backed up with anything solid to start.

At the end of the day perspectives are perspectives. But facts are also facts.
Where do you live? I know that nobody in their right bloody mind around any of the gyms in Adelaide SA thinks that Joe Louis would be anything but a punch bag in the modern HW division. They call him as I do a great champion in his day, who might do alright at CW today if he was modern trained.

It is easy to point out on film how lacking Louis is really compared to Haye. If I hadn't done this already many times I wouldn't be so confident about it.

And here you go again, comparing Galento to Arreola! Why cause Arreola was a bit fat too? He was never as fat as Galento and Galento not only didn't train, he drank a gallon of grog before his fights. Arreola is considered a top fighter because he IS a great fighter. Galento was pathetic, just fat and strong and nothing else and the fact that he was a top fighter in the 30's is ABSOLUTE PROOF AGAIN that the Louis era was a vey weak era!

Basically today, you are unable to be a bum and sub200lbs are forbidden..

The further you go back in time, the lighter the opponents get and the more bums are prevalent.

The 70's was about the point where the division was about half HW and half CW. And half the guys were bums.

Previous eras to that like Louis's were cruiser divisions MAINLY and were riddled with bums mainly!

And this can be shown statistically in the records. Is becoming the general consensus abroad. And in my opinion is supported by the film evidence (empirical) as well as the other forms. It is a fact!