How Can Anyone Now Rank Hopkins Lower than Roy Jones?

[JonesJrMayweather]

isn't obvious, that buster douglass provided the blueprint on how to beat tyson? and had they fought again the result would have been the same....again all you have to do is answer this: when hopkins and jones fought who won?

there's no need to speculate about anything...here's the scenario 50 years from now....

BOXING FAN #1: Man I saw some footage of this great fighter name Roy jones jr..damn he was fast, he did this crazy shiit like a chicken...

BOXING FAN #2 Who? Man This old guy named bernard hopkins was tough, he called the executioner because he executed motherfuccas in the ring

BOXING FAN #1: Damn really? I wish those two would have fought that would have been a great fight, but I think the ROy jones guy would win..

BOXING FAN #2: Ma you're crazy, Bernard was too tough and they said he'd been to jail...he would kick that dudes a**...Man I wish they would have fought...

BOXING FAN #3: They did fight...And Roy Jones won by a Unanimous DEcision with one hand....

Let me ask you something, when I asked if you knew the difference between being better and being greater, did you feel a huge gust of wind go over the top of your head

No...

I don't remember the post asking who's better or greater...but this is a comparison between to men right? and when comparing two fighters there's no need to speculate about who beat better competition, who had to lose what weight, who was old, who was green and all that when you can just simply ask when they fought who won? Roy Jones did so he's better...

and since i'm not easily offended like most, i did notice your attempt to be a smart ass with the "or don't you know the difference comment" and the "did you feel a gust of wind"

next time dont reply until i come back..the gust of wind was a bit early

but since you want to be the smart ass of the topic. Answer this...when comparing two things which do you use to distinquish the higher quality, better or greater?

[Koori Warrior]

These two guys have been great champions. They both should now retire. BUT you cant run either man down as they have both been greats of boxing. It also is very hard to compare both as RJJ has lightning speed and unbeleivable skill, whereas Hopkins is just mean and always in your face and brutally powerful. They are both champions and everyone should credit them with that instead of running them both down. That is coming from an Aussie! By the way Tarver isnt even close to being in their league, he beat a way, way, way past his prime RJJ, and got FLOGGED by a way, way past his prime B-HOP. Enuff said?!?

[Samson3000]

isn't obvious, that buster douglass provided the blueprint on how to beat tyson? and had they fought again the result would have been the same....again all you have to do is answer this: when hopkins and jones fought who won?

there's no need to speculate about anything...here's the scenario 50 years from now....

BOXING FAN #1: Man I saw some footage of this great fighter name Roy jones jr..damn he was fast, he did this crazy shiit like a chicken...

BOXING FAN #2 Who? Man This old guy named bernard hopkins was tough, he called the executioner because he executed motherfuccas in the ring

BOXING FAN #1: Damn really? I wish those two would have fought that would have been a great fight, but I think the ROy jones guy would win..

BOXING FAN #2: Ma you're crazy, Bernard was too tough and they said he'd been to jail...he would kick that dudes a**...Man I wish they would have fought...

BOXING FAN #3: They did fight...And Roy Jones won by a Unanimous DEcision with one hand....

Let me ask you something, when I asked if you knew the difference between being better and being greater, did you feel a huge gust of wind go over the top of your head

No...

I don't remember the post asking who's better or greater...but this is a comparison between to men right? and when comparing two fighters there's no need to speculate about who beat better competition, who had to lose what weight, who was old, who was green and all that when you can just simply ask when they fought who won? Roy Jones did so he's better...

and since i'm not easily offended like most, i did notice your attempt to be a smart a** with the "or don't you know the difference comment" and the "did you feel a gust of wind"

next time dont reply until i come back..the gust of wind was a bit early

but since you want to be the smart a** of the topic. Answer this...when comparing two things which do you use to distinquish the higher quality, better or greater?

Awe man, you have got to be kidding me. Exactly why do you think virtually everyone who's posted here has mentioned accomplishments? Because that's what greatness is. That's what all time rankings are. Lennox and Vitaly would likely both beat Marciano, but Marciano ranks higher. Greatness is about accomplishments. You don't remember the post asking who's better or greater? Do you think there's a person out there that isn't aware of the fact that these two already fought and Roy won? If that's the only factor why would this thread even exist? It's because we're talking about who ranks higher, and that is in regards to greatness, not just who beat who. I'm kind of surprised you have to have this explained to you.

[Purist]

And the second you keep trying to hide from an argument with me shows you have no comeback against me

Excuses excuses. Why not try debating? Oh I forgot, you're afraid to so you'd rather hide behind an excuse

I guess some idiots can't read the very first post in a thread

and others choose not to debate because they don't have a counter so they insult instead

[Samson3000]

And the second you keep trying to hide from an argument with me shows you have no comeback against me

Excuses excuses. Why not try debating? Oh I forgot, you're afraid to so you'd rather hide behind an excuse

I guess some idiots can't read the very first post in a thread

and others choose not to debate because they don't have a counter so they insult instead

starr and smashcrusher, you do both realize you have the exact same stance in this argument right

[Purist]

isn't obvious, that buster douglass provided the blueprint on how to beat tyson? and had they fought again the result would have been the same....again all you have to do is answer this: when hopkins and jones fought who won?

there's no need to speculate about anything...here's the scenario 50 years from now....

BOXING FAN #1: Man I saw some footage of this great fighter name Roy jones jr..damn he was fast, he did this crazy shiit like a chicken...

BOXING FAN #2 Who? Man This old guy named bernard hopkins was tough, he called the executioner because he executed motherfuccas in the ring

BOXING FAN #1: Damn really? I wish those two would have fought that would have been a great fight, but I think the ROy jones guy would win..

BOXING FAN #2: Ma you're crazy, Bernard was too tough and they said he'd been to jail...he would kick that dudes a**...Man I wish they would have fought...

BOXING FAN #3: They did fight...And Roy Jones won by a Unanimous DEcision with one hand....

Let me ask you something, when I asked if you knew the difference between being better and being greater, did you feel a huge gust of wind go over the top of your head

No...

I don't remember the post asking who's better or greater...but this is a comparison between to men right? and when comparing two fighters there's no need to speculate about who beat better competition, who had to lose what weight, who was old, who was green and all that when you can just simply ask when they fought who won? Roy Jones did so he's better...

and since i'm not easily offended like most, i did notice your attempt to be a smart a** with the "or don't you know the difference comment" and the "did you feel a gust of wind"

next time dont reply until i come back..the gust of wind was a bit early

but since you want to be the smart a** of the topic. Answer this...when comparing two things which do you use to distinquish the higher quality, better or greater?

Awe man, you have got to be kidding me. Exactly why do you think virtually everyone who's posted here has mentioned accomplishments? Because that's what greatness is. That's what all time rankings are. Lennox and Vitaly would likely both beat Marciano, but Marciano ranks higher. Greatness is about accomplishments. You don't remember the post asking who's better or greater? Do you think there's a person out there that isn't aware of the fact that these two already fought and Roy won? If that's the only factor why would this thread even exist? It's because we're talking about who ranks higher, and that is in regards to greatness, not just who beat who. I'm kind of surprised you have to have this explained to you.

This isn't about who's better. it's about what they have both done in their careers and their credentials. not who would have beaten the other.

[Taeth]

I rank Hopkins lower than Roy because he didn't fight the same calibur of opponents by staying at the same weight as Roy did, nor did he beat his opponents as convincingly. I would say Bernard is as good as Toney or better, but both of them are bit below Roy Jones JR. as ATG's.

[JonesJrMayweather]

isn't obvious, that buster douglass provided the blueprint on how to beat tyson? and had they fought again the result would have been the same....again all you have to do is answer this: when hopkins and jones fought who won?

there's no need to speculate about anything...here's the scenario 50 years from now....

BOXING FAN #1: Man I saw some footage of this great fighter name Roy jones jr..damn he was fast, he did this crazy shiit like a chicken...

BOXING FAN #2 Who? Man This old guy named bernard hopkins was tough, he called the executioner because he executed motherfuccas in the ring

BOXING FAN #1: Damn really? I wish those two would have fought that would have been a great fight, but I think the ROy jones guy would win..

BOXING FAN #2: Ma you're crazy, Bernard was too tough and they said he'd been to jail...he would kick that dudes a**...Man I wish they would have fought...

BOXING FAN #3: They did fight...And Roy Jones won by a Unanimous DEcision with one hand....

Let me ask you something, when I asked if you knew the difference between being better and being greater, did you feel a huge gust of wind go over the top of your head

No...

I don't remember the post asking who's better or greater...but this is a comparison between to men right? and when comparing two fighters there's no need to speculate about who beat better competition, who had to lose what weight, who was old, who was green and all that when you can just simply ask when they fought who won? Roy Jones did so he's better...

and since i'm not easily offended like most, i did notice your attempt to be a smart a** with the "or don't you know the difference comment" and the "did you feel a gust of wind"

next time dont reply until i come back..the gust of wind was a bit early

but since you want to be the smart a** of the topic. Answer this...when comparing two things which do you use to distinquish the higher quality, better or greater?

Awe man, you have got to be kidding me. Exactly why do you think virtually everyone who's posted here has mentioned accomplishments? Because that's what greatness is. That's what all time rankings are. Lennox and Vitaly would likely both beat Marciano, but Marciano ranks higher. Greatness is about accomplishments. You don't remember the post asking who's better or greater? Do you think there's a person out there that isn't aware of the fact that these two already fought and Roy won? If that's the only factor why would this thread even exist? It's because we're talking about who ranks higher, and that is in regards to greatness, not just who beat who. I'm kind of surprised you have to have this explained to you.

yeah..lewis and vitaly would have likely beaten marciano...and greatness is often used in boxing when one is comparing an older fighter to a new fighter...much like you did...but there's is no need to list thier accomplishments to decide who would rank higher when they fought in the same era not to mention against each other....and as far as accomplishments...they are speculative and opinionated and i use the hard facts...understand one might think what hop did to tarver was great, one might think what roy did to ruiz was great..when you ask which is greater? that's opinionated and those types of questions never end...Sorry if I'm not the type to sit and try to convince you that my opinion is better than yours..i just prefer to use facts..and Jones is better so how can he not be greater than hopkins...certainly not based off accomplishment as a boxer...because really is that even fair? it would be a landslide for jones again without speculating...here are some jones accomplishments and how it would read in history...

1986 &1987 gold gloves champion, 88' olympic silver medalist, middleweight,supermiddleweight,light heavyweight and heavyweight champion. Voted "Fighter of the decade" in 1999. Voted "Fighter of the year" in 1994...first fighter in over a hundred years to move up from middleweight and win the heavyweight world title..

bernard hopkins----middleweight champion, light heavyweight champion, most consecutive defenses of the middleweight title...

a landslide based of accomplishments...now you can speculate about who's greater...

[tuckwopat]

http://www.whudat.com/news/images/royjones_ko1.jpg

http://www.whudat.com/news/images/royjones_ko1.jpg

http://dragonballyee.blogs.com/photo...royjonesjr.jpg

http://www.startribune.com/stonline/.../fite16w.l.jpg

you can post the videos for all I care.....when you get finished searching the internet for photos, and trying to make a argument with weak circumstantial crap & when you want to know the answer the post answer this:

ON May 22, 1993 at RFK stadium when two fighters fought for the IBF middleweight belt, who won? don't speculate, don't use your opinion, don't go off what if...just answer the simple question: who that fight on 5/22/93 for the IBF MW belt?

Why speculate? When you can see for yourself who's better....

I love that you keep pointing out that Roy beat Hopkins 14 years ago. Its odd how things change. In the end, all of Roy's accomplishments will be good, but they will linger below what Hopkins has done. If I were Hopkins I would never worry about that loss to Jones, because comparitvley Hopkins has won over history.

[Samson3000]

isn't obvious, that buster douglass provided the blueprint on how to beat tyson? and had they fought again the result would have been the same....again all you have to do is answer this: when hopkins and jones fought who won?

there's no need to speculate about anything...here's the scenario 50 years from now....

BOXING FAN #1: Man I saw some footage of this great fighter name Roy jones jr..damn he was fast, he did this crazy shiit like a chicken...

BOXING FAN #2 Who? Man This old guy named bernard hopkins was tough, he called the executioner because he executed motherfuccas in the ring

BOXING FAN #1: Damn really? I wish those two would have fought that would have been a great fight, but I think the ROy jones guy would win..

BOXING FAN #2: Ma you're crazy, Bernard was too tough and they said he'd been to jail...he would kick that dudes a**...Man I wish they would have fought...

BOXING FAN #3: They did fight...And Roy Jones won by a Unanimous DEcision with one hand....

Let me ask you something, when I asked if you knew the difference between being better and being greater, did you feel a huge gust of wind go over the top of your head

No...

I don't remember the post asking who's better or greater...but this is a comparison between to men right? and when comparing two fighters there's no need to speculate about who beat better competition, who had to lose what weight, who was old, who was green and all that when you can just simply ask when they fought who won? Roy Jones did so he's better...

and since i'm not easily offended like most, i did notice your attempt to be a smart a** with the "or don't you know the difference comment" and the "did you feel a gust of wind"

next time dont reply until i come back..the gust of wind was a bit early

but since you want to be the smart a** of the topic. Answer this...when comparing two things which do you use to distinquish the higher quality, better or greater?

Awe man, you have got to be kidding me. Exactly why do you think virtually everyone who's posted here has mentioned accomplishments? Because that's what greatness is. That's what all time rankings are. Lennox and Vitaly would likely both beat Marciano, but Marciano ranks higher. Greatness is about accomplishments. You don't remember the post asking who's better or greater? Do you think there's a person out there that isn't aware of the fact that these two already fought and Roy won? If that's the only factor why would this thread even exist? It's because we're talking about who ranks higher, and that is in regards to greatness, not just who beat who. I'm kind of surprised you have to have this explained to you.

yeah..lewis and vitaly would have likely beaten marciano...and greatness is often used in boxing when one is comparing an older fighter to a new fighter...much like you did...but there's is no need to list thier accomplishments to decide who would rank higher when they fought in the same era not to mention against each other....and as far as accomplishments...they are speculative and opinionated and i use the hard facts...understand one might think what hop did to tarver was great, one might think what roy did to ruiz was great..when you ask which is greater? that's opinionated and those types of questions never end...Sorry if I'm not the type to sit and try to convince you that my opinion is better than yours..i just prefer to use facts..and Jones is better so how can he not be greater than hopkins...certainly not based off accomplishment as a boxer...because really is that even fair? it would be a landslide for jones again without speculating...here are some jones accomplishments and how it would read in history...

1986 &1987 gold gloves champion, 88' olympic silver medalist, middleweight,supermiddleweight,light heavyweight and heavyweight champion. Voted "Fighter of the decade" in 1999. Voted "Fighter of the year" in 1994...first fighter in over a hundred years to move up from middleweight and win the heavyweight world title..

bernard hopkins----middleweight champion, light heavyweight champion, most consecutive defenses of the middleweight title...

a landslide based of accomplishments...now you can speculate about who's greater...

Kind of sad how you now have to try and reach back to the amatuer ranks to find ways to add to Roy's legacy And like has been stated numerous times, do you actually give credence to Roy beating John Ruiz? I guess you also call Oscar the middleweight champ for getting that trinket from Sturm too huh?

[tuckwopat]

I rank Hopkins lower than Roy because he didn't fight the same calibur of opponents by staying at the same weight as Roy did, nor did he beat his opponents as convincingly. I would say Bernard is as good as Toney or better, but both of them are bit below Roy Jones JR. as ATG's.

Please do tell, who are these awesome opponents. Okay, I'll give you Toney and Hopkins. Now your turn.

[tuckwopat]

Kind of sad how you now have to try and reach back to the amatuer ranks to find ways to add to Roy's legacy And like has been stated numerous times, do you actually give credence to Roy beating John Ruiz? I guess you also call Oscar the middleweight champ for getting that trinket from Sturm too huh?
[/quote]

[JonesJrMayweather]

http://www.whudat.com/news/images/royjones_ko1.jpg

http://www.whudat.com/news/images/royjones_ko1.jpg

http://dragonballyee.blogs.com/photo...royjonesjr.jpg

http://www.startribune.com/stonline/.../fite16w.l.jpg

you can post the videos for all I care.....when you get finished searching the internet for photos, and trying to make a argument with weak circumstantial crap & when you want to know the answer the post answer this:

ON May 22, 1993 at RFK stadium when two fighters fought for the IBF middleweight belt, who won? don't speculate, don't use your opinion, don't go off what if...just answer the simple question: who that fight on 5/22/93 for the IBF MW belt?

Why speculate? When you can see for yourself who's better....

I love that you keep pointing out that Roy beat Hopkins 14 years ago. Its odd how things change. In the end, all of Roy's accomplishments will be good, but they will linger below what Hopkins has done. If I were Hopkins I would never worry about that loss to Jones, because comparitvley Hopkins has won over history.

I guess being undefeated for fifteen years and winning four titles in four divisions...isn't considered winning over history....

Listen hop is great..but after the tarver fight..bhop said he stayed at MW because the risk where lower and he could go after the record...now having said this...prior to jermain taylor beating bhop..who was the last middleweight to beat bhop? RJJ..so would hopkins' prized record of title defenses even exist had roy stayed at middleweight? no...so that accomplishment should have an asterix by it..much like the houston rockets winning the NBA title because micheal jordan decided to take a break....

[JonesJrMayweather]

Kind of sad how you now have to try and reach back to the amatuer ranks to find ways to add to Roy's legacy And like has been stated numerous times, do you actually give credence to Roy beating John Ruiz? I guess you also call Oscar the middleweight champ for getting that trinket from Sturm too huh?

[/quote]

Well I guess bernard hopkins didn't beat all the best middleweights, because he didn't beat sturm, now did he?

[babyboNe]

bernard hopkins should most definatly be rank higher then roy jones...yes bhop lost to roy...lets look at what happen afterwards...roy division hoops hand picking oppenents...while bhop built a legacy in the middleweight division...bhop sat at his kingdom and all who came to take it from him he face...ROY went on a journey going on to fight abc champions in different division...prime or not...ROY was finally hit flush and he was knock out...and that was the end of roy...bhop reaching 40 loses twice by close fights to taylor...goes on to challenge tarver the man who banish roy...and bhop dominates tarver at the age of 41 at roy's lightheavy division...

its a matter of who survive longer...at 41 bhop still has never been hurt or knock out...between the two of them bhop outlast roy...bhops technically rough and tough style against roys speed and atletic style in 12 rounds or in a career speed and atleticism will decrease more...while technic and inner toughness will always remain if not increase...

I have a question though...
list me someone alike trinidad and oscar that roy has fought? (note bhop k.o both tito and oscar)

(tarver glen k.o jones both lost to bhop)

weren't tito and oscar both smaller than bhop? and didn't roy beat the S*** out of pound for pound king James toney? james toney is better than everyone hopkins ever faced...except roy of course...

name one fighter that benard hopkins beat that was on top of the pound for pound list..... in fact the only fighter he that was even ranked pound for pound was tito and tito was the smaller man moving up..so go figure...

Slow down there Burt Sugar, Toney had to kill himself to make 168 for that fight, just like Jones had to kill himself to make 175 for Tarver. It wasn't the great Roy we all know that Tarver beat, and it wasn't the great Toney we all know that Roy beat. And on top of that, Hopkins wasn't favored over either Trinidad or Tarver.

p.s.--Toney was never p4p king. Last I checked Pernell Whitaker held that distinction at that time.

doesn't matter if hop was favored..he was the bigger man...so why did it surprise anyone that the bigger man knocked out the smaller men?.....that just says that even the odds makers bought into the superstar hype and not common sense.....even if toney was number two..he's still better than anyone bhop ever faced.....

okay in that case roy was the bigger man then bhop when he beat bhop...plus roy was the bigger man agianst tarver too...because he went back down to lightheavyweight....