"Ali hate"..... what's the point??

[TitoFan]

How is that even an argument, Bill?

Never mind.....

[Bill Paxtom]

How is that even an argument, Bill?

Never mind.....

TitoFan

It takes a deep intellect to understand the 'angle' on that one.

I believe that post is 'too deep' for you.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Of course I played the 'dumb blonde' in all those movies. They see a pretty blonde,
and automatically assume that I'm ditzy, and a 'Fucking' moron."

Judy Holliday

IQ .... '172' .. Very Superior Intelligence

[TitoFan]

[Bill Paxtom]

My whole thing was that I thought he got way too much credit for dodging the draft. I think there are plenty of things he did that could give him the "hero" moniker, especially his in-ring stuff and his humanitarian work outside the ring.

He was an amazing guy, it's just that one thing that bugs me about his legacy.

I don't think we're on opposite sides here. I've never considered him to be a hero for anything regarding his decision to dodge the draft. I do think, however, that it took guts for standing up to the establishment in that way, especially considering how much he stood to lose. It would've been easier for him to just go along with it, especially knowing (like HATER Bill said) that he wasn't going to be put in the front lines or anything like that.

But forget all that, for a moment. Think about the focus his actions put on the racial issues in America during those times. Think about all those blacks that said "Damn... he's right. Why should we go fight the Vietcong? They never called us niggers." Think about the whites that must've thought "Hmm.... maybe he's got a point there. We're asking them to put their lives on the line, but here in America we treat them like shit."

Bottom line is... many of us are glad he made the decision he made. And it cost him, too. Three prime years of his professional career. Think how much more he could've added to his professional legacy.

Tito-Fan,

You're 'brown-nosing' when you don't have to.

It's not very becoming sir.

You're taking Cassius Clay's views from 1966/1967 {Age; 25}. This from a guy who
was evaluated as having 'borderline mental retardation'.

Now that is 'Fucking' scary.

[TitoFan]

Ok so first I post quote on Ali saying he had no qualms against Viet Cong 'cause they never called him "nigger."

You respond by posting picture of white soldier killed in Vietnam and asking if Viet Cong ever called him "nigger."

Asinine point and completely off kilter.
It's like saying OJ Simpson was innocent 'cause he played for the Buffalo Bills.





Then, you equate my telling Beanflicker that I'm not pushing the "Ali is a hero" agenda for having dodged the draft.... and you equate that with brownnosing.

You bring up Ali's low IQ scores once again... as if that has anything to do with your bullshit agenda about him being a coward.





Finally.... you're likened Ali to Hitler.... been glad about his Parkinson's disease.... and just generally made a fool of yourself at every available opportunity on this forum and have gotten people laughing at you every time you make a post. The fact that you're still here speaks volumes about the patience of the mods in this forum.

So in summary.....

[C.J.Rock]

Remember rich young white men dodged the war by pulling political strings so jump on their case and call them cowards and frauds.

Are you referring to,

Former Vice President - Dick Cheney

Bill Clinton ran to England to avoid Vietnam He wasn't called yellow & cowardly You made him President of the United States The Commander in Chief of US Forces.
Ali stayed right here & faced whatever they threw at him how could that be called cowardly?? George W Bush dodged it too

[Dark Lord Al]

Remember rich young white men dodged the war by pulling political strings so jump on their case and call them cowards and frauds.

Are you referring to,

Former Vice President - Dick Cheney

Bill Clinton ran to England to avoid Vietnam He wasn't called yellow & cowardly You made him President of the United States The Commander in Chief of US Forces.
Ali stayed right here & faced whatever they threw at him how could that be called cowardly?? George W Bush dodged it too

Thank you for pointing out they are all cowards , now if you like you can start an individual thread for each of them and we can voice our opinions.

[Master]

Not many for obvious reasons, Bill you prat.

[Bill Paxtom]

1967

Carl Walker, Assistant District Attorney "United States', who helped prosecute Cassius Clay.

Mr. Carl Walker {who was black}, stated,

"Cassius Clay changed his story several times. First it was because of his religious beliefs.
Then it was because he was a good citizen in America, and was an honorable man. Then he
wanted a deferment because he had several upcoming Championship bouts lined up."

"Then it was the Muslim faith. Then he claimed to be a Minister."

"I didn't believe him at all. But I didn't make the Decision, I only presented a case. The
'Jury' of 6 men and 6 women found him guilty."

"That is our system, good, bad or indifferent. Did I make my points, Yes I think I did."
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"Yes, you did make a 'point'. Two of them are good enough for me"

Kim Novak

[Master]

1967

Carl Walker, Assistant District Attorney "United States', who helped prosecute Cassius Clay.

Mr. Carl Walker {who was black}, stated,

"Cassius Clay changed his story several times. First it was because of his religious beliefs.
Then it was because he was a good citizen in America, and was an honorable man. Then he
wanted a deferment because he had several upcoming Championship bouts lined up."

"Then it was the Muslim faith. Then he claimed to be a Minister."

"I didn't believe him at all. But I didn't make the Decision, I only presented a case. The
'Jury' of 6 men and 6 women found him guilty."

"That is our system, good, bad or indifferent."

The system was indifferent then. Ali won the case eventually.

[Bill Paxtom]

1967

Carl Walker, Assistant District Attorney "United States', who helped prosecute Cassius Clay.

Mr. Carl Walker {who was black}, stated,

"Cassius Clay changed his story several times. First it was because of his religious beliefs.
Then it was because he was a good citizen in America, and was an honorable man. Then he
wanted a deferment because he had several upcoming Championship bouts lined up."

"Then it was the Muslim faith. Then he claimed to be a Minister."

"I didn't believe him at all. But I didn't make the Decision, I only presented a case. The
'Jury' of 6 men and 6 women found him guilty."

"That is our system, good, bad or indifferent. Did I make my points, Yes I think I did."
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Yes, you did make a 'point'. Two of them are good enough for me"

Kim Novak

I hear you.

[brocktonblockbust]

Cassius Clay called Archie Moore all kinds of insulting names and openly mocked him. Moore was 48 and clay was 24 then.

Archie Moore was perhaps the most kind, interesting. entrepreneurial, good hearted, humble man boxing has ever seen. who in their right mind would want to disrespect the great iconic Archie Moore?

Where was clays respect for his elders?

[Bill Paxtom]

Cassius Clay called Archie Moore all kinds of insulting names and openly mocked him. Moore was 48 and clay was 24 then.

Archie Moore was perhaps the most kind, interesting. entrepreneurial, good hearted, humble man boxing has ever seen. who in their right mind would want to disrespect the great iconic Archie Moore?

Where was clays respect for his elders?

If you really 'Peel the Onion',

Most will realize that Cassius Clay was an 'ingrate'.
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"I never thought much of Cassius Clay. After 5-Minutes, I found him to be dull and quite boring."

Hedy Lamar

[Mr140]

Wait Wait Wait you guys are calling a person a coward for not going to some bull shit war when they said Ali was to dumb to join the army the first go around and when he is champ they draft him. Say what you want but Ali felt the war was against what he believed in and served his time wtf is cowardly about that nothing. You know what i call a person who goes to war for a country who treats them like they are low class i call them a fucking drone and nothing noble about that. Ali clowned people with Frazier i am not so sure how much was real and how much was bullshit. Patterson got what he got he was being disrespectful to Ali and he got it right back as for Liston fucker was gangster who was a mobster so i could careless talking shit on that guy kill you in a heart beat and not think about. Anyone one saying coward must have some balls what would you do if you had to go to war for a country that hated you and it was against what you believed in tell me everyone calling him a coward what would you do. Also as for you bill got to tell me did Ali fuck your girlfriend or wife or something did you walk in on it or what got to know.

[Master]

Cassius Clay called Archie Moore all kinds of insulting names and openly mocked him. Moore was 48 and clay was 24 then.

Archie Moore was perhaps the most kind, interesting. entrepreneurial, good hearted, humble man boxing has ever seen. who in their right mind would want to disrespect the great iconic Archie Moore?

Where was clays respect for his elders?

What else you going to bring up? Ali trained with Archie Moore and had a lot of respect for him.