The Brexit Thread

[walrus]

1. Prevent No Deal Chaos as a first priority.
2. Remove the Tories - who created this Brexit mess - from power.
3. Renegotiate an EU deal that doesn't involve annihilating the economy, trashing our rights and living standards, or triggering violent chaos by erecting a border in Ireland.
4. Hold a final say referendum with a sensible option for both sides, neither of which involve utterly wrecking the economy (between the two least-bad outcomes).

A notable problem with this strategy is that the ideological militants at either side both absolutely hate it, and they're capable of making an awful lot of noise.

The loudest of them not only do not even live here, they have the arrogance to suggest that you are not 'British' if you disagree, or if you do not fit into their caricature plastic version of what they think being British is, because they generally have moobs and are condescending American cunts or are skinny fuckers who think living outside of the UK means they are superior to most Brits.

Mental.

Yes it is mental. Listen to yourselves how arrogant and dishonest you both are.

So El Kabong can lecture us all on how democracy is the tyranny of the majority and then in the same breath suggest that I am a remainer which makes me a spoilt brat who wants to fuck the country up by giving people a chance to exercise their democratic rights. He then goes on to define what it means to be British on behalf of Brits

"and yeah you TOTALLY have more in common with Europe than the United States not like we share ancestry or language or culture at all...I do love that you see it that way, because you would, you're European, you've admitted as much "My family Germany, my family France"....what is British about you exactly? You speak like a pirate? You enjoy gin? You like punk rock?

I expect Swedes to be self loathing, but it hurts my heart when it's Brits....fucking pathetic. "

It is mental. You are both extremists pretending anyone not as stupid or bigoted as both of you are are the very thing you have always been.

Political idealogues obsessed with identity politics. How many white people there are, what constitutes being 'correct' in your eyes, the PC agenda you bring into everything. Your posts dominate EVERY thread on the forum. It's tiresome because it is bluster and bullshit from opinionated kids at best. Meanwhile all the actual men have to hold their tongue while you both tell us all how everything is on every subject, including our own lives.

I started this thread two years ago to bemoan the Tories NOT implementing the mess they engineered and you both twisted like a fucking pretzel to suggest that it was me and those who never asked for it who were responsible for the shit show it has turned into.

That is truly mental.

What is dishonest about arguing that Britain should be operating on a national state level with no orders coming from a command beyond the country? How is arguing for what most countries in the world have extreme? On the contrary, I consider you an absolute extremist and a traitor to your country. David Starkey would probably argue as much too. How arrogant to enforce a system on a populace without their consent and to then defend it? That is outrageous.

The tyranny of the majority? You mean the most democratic way of running things which is where a referendum actually gets to determine the path of the country. Do you see me calling for a new Scottish referendum? You have absolutely no respect for the will of the people. You are more interested in self interested things rather than the purity of democracy. Lyle is entitled to his view. It is not as though you can shut up about Donald Trump or America so do not be such a brazen hypocrite. Good on Lyle for agreeing with the majority.

At the end of the day you have declared yourself a European, whilst the majority of people see themselves as British more than anything else. I have never been part of this European project and I never will be. It is true that all we hear from you is about how much of your family does not live in the UK and how for you it is about keeping those avenues open. Like I say though, if your family wants to live overseas, then they can. Nobody is stopping them. It is you being histrionic about medicine when that is very unlikely there will be shortages.

Lyle is also right to point out the 'self loathing'. You appear to be an obvious case in point. You have absolutely zero faith in Britain as an independent functioning nation. It is amazing really. Starkey would argue that you hate Britain and would put you in that snobbish class that looks down on cashiers as you are too arty to work like anyone else. They should serve you, but you don't want to be one.

Sweden has destroyed itself as a country. I mean, do you not recognize that it has done so through a a lack of pride in who they are? Britain has done the same and we shouldn't feel bad about anything, but instead stand firm and show the rest of Europe what it means to be disciplined and strong. It is alright for you in homogeneous Plymouth, but you are so far away from what others are seeing. You are as out of touch as me except I do pay close attention of course, but not through your lefty clap trap. You are even being advised not to integrate immigrants as it will upset them. Why are you letting them in then? And you know which groups use the most welfare right?

Extreme? Hmm. Sensible border policies, national self respect and not wanting a super state akin to the USSR is now extreme? I would argue the opposite and that you are extreme. A zealot. An ideologue. Someone who never cedes an argument. Never alters his thinking. Never alters course. An extremist is what you are.

Culture matters and demographics matter and changes to communities matter. My own perspective and experience is that when these things are done carefully the impact is minimal. When you go crazy as the UK has, then you end up with problems. That is unfortunate, but the result of genuine extremism that you indeed have supported.

If you don't want to hear things that upset you, then go away. Nobody cares about your family or Snow White and the Seven Dwarves. It is neither here nor there with anybody. It is simply a discussion about national self determination and that seems to really send you over the deep end and people disagree with you. You are a rude, vulgar and horrible old man.

Independence, self determination, and moderation are not extremist values in the slightest. They are tenets of moral and social conservatism.

Beaner that quote “tyranny of the majority” was used by Ben Franklin, or one of the founding fathers, it was just used in context not throwing democracy in the trash. It could have been Madison I can’t remember I need to google it.

[Beanz]

1. Prevent No Deal Chaos as a first priority.
2. Remove the Tories - who created this Brexit mess - from power.
3. Renegotiate an EU deal that doesn't involve annihilating the economy, trashing our rights and living standards, or triggering violent chaos by erecting a border in Ireland.
4. Hold a final say referendum with a sensible option for both sides, neither of which involve utterly wrecking the economy (between the two least-bad outcomes).

A notable problem with this strategy is that the ideological militants at either side both absolutely hate it, and they're capable of making an awful lot of noise.

The loudest of them not only do not even live here, they have the arrogance to suggest that you are not 'British' if you disagree, or if you do not fit into their caricature plastic version of what they think being British is, because they generally have moobs and are condescending American cunts or are skinny fuckers who think living outside of the UK means they are superior to most Brits.

Mental.

Yes it is mental. Listen to yourselves how arrogant and dishonest you both are.

So El Kabong can lecture us all on how democracy is the tyranny of the majority and then in the same breath suggest that I am a remainer which makes me a spoilt brat who wants to fuck the country up by giving people a chance to exercise their democratic rights. He then goes on to define what it means to be British on behalf of Brits

"and yeah you TOTALLY have more in common with Europe than the United States not like we share ancestry or language or culture at all...I do love that you see it that way, because you would, you're European, you've admitted as much "My family Germany, my family France"....what is British about you exactly? You speak like a pirate? You enjoy gin? You like punk rock?

I expect Swedes to be self loathing, but it hurts my heart when it's Brits....fucking pathetic. "

It is mental. You are both extremists pretending anyone not as stupid or bigoted as both of you are are the very thing you have always been.

Political idealogues obsessed with identity politics. How many white people there are, what constitutes being 'correct' in your eyes, the PC agenda you bring into everything. Your posts dominate EVERY thread on the forum. It's tiresome because it is bluster and bullshit from opinionated kids at best. Meanwhile all the actual men have to hold their tongue while you both tell us all how everything is on every subject, including our own lives.

I started this thread two years ago to bemoan the Tories NOT implementing the mess they engineered and you both twisted like a fucking pretzel to suggest that it was me and those who never asked for it who were responsible for the shit show it has turned into.

That is truly mental.

What is dishonest about arguing that Britain should be operating on a national state level with no orders coming from a command beyond the country? How is arguing for what most countries in the world have extreme? On the contrary, I consider you an absolute extremist and a traitor to your country. David Starkey would probably argue as much too. How arrogant to enforce a system on a populace without their consent and to then defend it? That is outrageous.

The tyranny of the majority? You mean the most democratic way of running things which is where a referendum actually gets to determine the path of the country. Do you see me calling for a new Scottish referendum? You have absolutely no respect for the will of the people. You are more interested in self interested things rather than the purity of democracy. Lyle is entitled to his view. It is not as though you can shut up about Donald Trump or America so do not be such a brazen hypocrite. Good on Lyle for agreeing with the majority.

At the end of the day you have declared yourself a European, whilst the majority of people see themselves as British more than anything else. I have never been part of this European project and I never will be. It is true that all we hear from you is about how much of your family does not live in the UK and how for you it is about keeping those avenues open. Like I say though, if your family wants to live overseas, then they can. Nobody is stopping them. It is you being histrionic about medicine when that is very unlikely there will be shortages.

Lyle is also right to point out the 'self loathing'. You appear to be an obvious case in point. You have absolutely zero faith in Britain as an independent functioning nation. It is amazing really. Starkey would argue that you hate Britain and would put you in that snobbish class that looks down on cashiers as you are too arty to work like anyone else. They should serve you, but you don't want to be one.

Sweden has destroyed itself as a country. I mean, do you not recognize that it has done so through a a lack of pride in who they are? Britain has done the same and we shouldn't feel bad about anything, but instead stand firm and show the rest of Europe what it means to be disciplined and strong. It is alright for you in homogeneous Plymouth, but you are so far away from what others are seeing. You are as out of touch as me except I do pay close attention of course, but not through your lefty clap trap. You are even being advised not to integrate immigrants as it will upset them. Why are you letting them in then? And you know which groups use the most welfare right?

Extreme? Hmm. Sensible border policies, national self respect and not wanting a super state akin to the USSR is now extreme? I would argue the opposite and that you are extreme. A zealot. An ideologue. Someone who never cedes an argument. Never alters his thinking. Never alters course. An extremist is what you are.

Culture matters and demographics matter and changes to communities matter. My own perspective and experience is that when these things are done carefully the impact is minimal. When you go crazy as the UK has, then you end up with problems. That is unfortunate, but the result of genuine extremism that you indeed have supported.

If you don't want to hear things that upset you, then go away. Nobody cares about your family or Snow White and the Seven Dwarves. It is neither here nor there with anybody. It is simply a discussion about national self determination and that seems to really send you over the deep end and people disagree with you. You are a rude, vulgar and horrible old man.

Independence, self determination, and moderation are not extremist values in the slightest. They are tenets of moral and social conservatism.

Beaner that quote “tyranny of the majority” was used by Ben Franklin, or one of the founding fathers, it was just used in context not throwing democracy in the trash. It could have been Madison I can’t remember I need to google it.

El Kabong used it and I was quoting him.