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Thread: Duran legacy?

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    Default Duran legacy?

    So some on this forum might already know I don't particularly like Duran its solely down to the no mas against Leonard but I will admit he was a beast in the ring. It's just the no mas didn't sit well with me.
    So I've been watching a few of his fights the past week and was enjoying them then a video pops up on YouTube duran vs lawlor 1 so decided to watch it. Fuck me 1st off Duran was getting outclassed outboxed whatever you want to call it by a novice and just quits yet again. Just wanted to get the opinions of Duran fans and why use have him in such high regard.

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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    You say he was getting schooled by a novice but Duran was a fat pensioner in that fight, technically the doc stopped it when he busted his arm.

    It's a bit harsh to judge a fighter that had over a hundred fights on one instance. Especially when you consider who Duran fought and the success he had.
    3-Time SADDO PREDICTION COMP CHAMPION.

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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    Come on he wasn't a fat pensioner he's didn't look fat in the ring and was younger that Floyd mayweather is now so that's not an excuse. Also Duran wanted no part in the fight he only protested after the fight had been stopped. Before the doctor stops the fight someone clearly tells Duran if you can't continue the fight will be stopped and he wants no part in it.
    No doubt about it Duran beat and gave some really great fighters hell but the no mas and fights like lowlar 1 must surly affect his legacy no ?

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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    That Lawlor fight doesn't mean anything.

    Duran might have been a similar age to Floyd but he had nearly double the fights. He was light years past his best and he was fat considering he started fighting 20 odd years before at bantamweight.

    I guess you can knock him about quitting the Leonard fight. But overall his career was packed with success either side of "no mas" and was a brilliant fighter.
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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    I can kind of see what your saying fenster but I'm a firm believer if your a great fighter and chose to fight past your prime you can not use the I wasn't in my prime excuse you need to take the good with the bad, so for that reason for me the lawlor fight has got to mean somthing. I guess I just kind of wanted to know what real hardcore Duran fans make of his quitting in the ring

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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    I'm no hardcore Duran fan, but I can appreciate greatness when I see it. Fenster's right about being able to criticize the Leonard "no mas" without putting the Lawlor fight in the same context. How do you categorize a fighter as a quitter when he's had a long and storied career full of wars against some elite opposition? How does a quitter pull out a hard-fought Iran Barkley fight? How does a quitter amass victories over such warriors as Carlos Palomino, Esteban de Jesus, Pipino Cuevas, Sugar Ray Leonard, etc.?

    I saw the Lawlor fight. It was a sudden, debilitating arm injury which made Duran immediately wince in obvious pain. It was the doctor who stopped the fight, prompting an immediate protest from Duran.

    "Quitting" is thrown around so carelessly here.
    It's obvious very few of us here have ever laced up boxing gloves.

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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    IMO people focus way too much on Duran in the "no mas" situation , rather than give credit to SRL. To make Duran quit by taking his Pride and breaking him down mentally is a massive achievement.
    I reckon Duran would rather have been Pummelled for every minute of every round than to lose face like that. For him to quit must've broke him.
    I don't think that one moment should take away the amazing career he had.

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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    I give all the credit in the world to SRL. In fact, he and Duran rank among the alltime ATG's in my personal opinion. Their first fight was one of the best ever. However, Duran did quit. He robbed us fans of witnessing a 2nd great installment in what was a riveting rivalry in boxing. Why did quit? I don't know, even after watching the HBO documentary about Leonard and Duran. Still..... I compartmentalize that into what was one of the most storied careers ever for a boxer.

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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    Quote Originally Posted by g3org3 View Post
    So some on this forum might already know I don't particularly like Duran its solely down to the no mas against Leonard but I will admit he was a beast in the ring. It's just the no mas didn't sit well with me.
    So I've been watching a few of his fights the past week and was enjoying them then a video pops up on YouTube duran vs lawlor 1 so decided to watch it. Fuck me 1st off Duran was getting outclassed outboxed whatever you want to call it by a novice and just quits yet again. Just wanted to get the opinions of Duran fans and why use have him in such high regard.

    I know what you mean on the "no mas" or whatever he said. Plus he was an arrogant/asshole/prick over the first fight. Not relavent.

    Perspective is called for though. If Ali was not in his era he would have been that era's Floyd. Almost unbeatable for 13 years and compiling a 71-1 record with 56 knockouts. We need to think about that....
    One shy of 72 and 0. Both Hannibal and Khan lost fights and most likely quit when it didn’t feel right.

    It’s a stain on Duran’s legacy and is really the only definitive "quit" in modern day history so it stands out given its circumstances. You also have to consider that Leonard knew/Dundee that Duran was having problems making weight and that’s why they demanded the rematch 6 months later keeping Duran anorexic to keep weight. In a way the guy cheated and shares in Duran’s quitting but that’s another thread.

    Lastly and as @Fenster alluded to, legacy is not a fight regardless of its ending. Legacy by definition is essentially a body of work where sport is concerned. It has to be and especially in boxing. It can’t be property or an item left by a relative or a mistake made. A bad pitch or bad call. Sure those single events count especially at the level we are talking about but it’s not the sum. The moment we as boxing fans write-off a professional fighter of his magnitude over one fight is the moment objectivity goes on a hiatus.

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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    So your favourite fighter Floyd has retired into the sunset with a 0.

    Is this your implied way of saying he was greater than Duran? Will you bring up losses suffered by Ali, Robinson and Armstrong next?
    Do not let success go to your head and do not let failure get to your heart.

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    Default

    I believe the OP has never seen any Duran fights pre-Leonard 2. Probably didn't watch the first one either. Why else would he define a legend's career on one fight?

    Definitely a highlight reel fan.

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    Default

    Floyd would school all versions of duran.

    Its so true.

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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    In the 70s Duran was a monster, a phenomenon, he just got better and better.

    Some of us suggest he peaked when beating Palomino; the majority say his first (big) fight in the 80s (Leonard) was his best; either way going into Montreal Duran was 72-1; the defeat avenged twice.

    And then the King of Machismo (sorry Hector) quit in a fight he was losing but hardly being destroyed in...

    Duran was finished, but he carried on, and frankly it got worst; Benitez beat him easy and then the quirky Laing embarrassed him.

    At an all time low Duran was brought in as cannon fodder for Cuevas, but Duran defied the critics and beat the former champ, but many, perhaps rightly suggested that Cuevas was shot himself and a matchup with the new sensation Davey Moore would be the finale for Duran.

    When the fight came Duran thought as well as he had for three years and dismantled the much hyped Moore in eight, a sort of redemption had been earned for Montreal, but still...

    Duran then stepped up and fought the Marvelous One and gave him battle; well done hands of stone, a good way to finish... But no.

    Hearns was next and he destroyed Duran, it was a little embarrassing, even more so in some ways than Montreal. Duran refused to call it a day though and things went downhill as Hagler's younger brother, Robbie Sims beat him; and sluggish wins over win contenders were not anything special.

    But Duran had a name and Iran Barkley coming off the first win over Hearns needed a body, Duran fit the bill. The hope was Duran would lose with a bit of dignity, but he stood little to no chance over the primed Blade.

    And then it happened; Duran fought as good as he had for six years and finally redeemed himself after Montreal, winning a brutal war.

    And that is why I think only Robinson, Armstrong and perhaps Greb are better fighters pound for pound in the history of Queensberry Rules boxing.
    Last edited by Britkid; 03-04-2016 at 04:38 AM.
    "Boxing is like jazz. The better it is, the less people appreciate it."

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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Britkid View Post
    In the 70s Duran was a monster, a phenomenon, he just got better and better.

    Some of us suggest he peaked when beating Palomino; the majority say his first (big) fight in the 80s (Leonard) was his best; either way going into Montreal Duran was 72-1; the defeat avenged twice.

    And then the King of Machismo (sorry Hector) quit in a fight he was losing but hardly being destroyed in...

    Duran was finished, but he carried on, and frankly it got worst; Benitez beat him easy and then the quirky Laing embarrassed him.

    At an all time low Duran was brought in as cannon fodder for Cuevas, but Duran defied the critics and beat the former champ, but many, perhaps rightly suggested that Cuevas was shot himself and a matchup with the new sensation Davey Moore would be the finale for Duran.

    When the fight came Duran thought as well as he had for three years and dismantled the much hyped Moore in eight, a sort of redemption had been earned for Montreal, but still...

    Duran then stepped up and fought the Marvelous One and gave him battle; well done hands of stone, a good way to finish... But no.

    Hearns was next and he destroyed Duran, it was a little embarrassing, even more so in some ways than Montreal. Duran refused to call it a day though and things went downhill as Hagler's younger brother, Robbie Sims beat him; and sluggish wins over win contenders were not anything special.

    But Duran had a name and Iran Barkley coming off the first win over Hearns needed a body, Duran fit the bill. The hope was Duran would lose with a bit of dignity, but he stood little to no chance over the primed Blade.

    And then it happened; Duran fought as good as he had for six years and finally redeemed himself after Montreal, winning a brutal war.

    And that is why I think only Robinson, Armstrong and perhaps Greb are better fighters pound for pound in the history of Queensberry Rules boxing.
    And lolenga mock ?
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    Default Re: Duran legacy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Lord Al View Post
    And lolenga mock ?
    I stand corrected; the man who as glorified Super Middleweight floored and would have beat the greatest Heavyweight of our lifetimes; if Haye was not fighting at home; and who then beat an ancien... sorry, able former world champ in Charles Brewer is clearly up there with Robinson!
    "Boxing is like jazz. The better it is, the less people appreciate it."

    George Foreman

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