Chavez Jr was a hype job because he wasn't that good and got gift decisions. I honestly think Canelo will be a good/great fighter. Problem is people lash out at him rather than his promoters for making him bigger and better than he actually is. Truth of the matter is that he is still a pretty solid boxer and heck I'd love to see him vs Cotto, Lara, Molina, Kirkland and the rest.
Could someone tell me why Canelo is not a hype job? In particular answer the below:
What was he hyped to be? An all time great? A top 5, 10 P4Per? A dominant world champion?
Did he or will he reach this?
What has he done to deserve this hype? Who has he beat who was any use? Had he beat anyone who several other guys in the div wouldn't beat?
I think he is a hype job because people thought he was the 2nd coming. People were telling me he would beat Floyd and be one of the best boxers of his generation. I thought this was nonsense. I'm not saying he's a shit fighter, he's world class but he was still hyped beyond his abilities which makes him a hype job to me.
You don't post as much on the main board as you do the others, but this particular topic seems to have sparked your interest. Yeah ok, I'm not gonna pretend I had absolutely no bias while watching the fight. But some things are just plain factual. That Canelo's previously unbeaten record of 42 victories doesn't stack up well against those of other fighters with less wins and some losses? You can argue against that, but you'd be wrong. That the Canelo-Floyd fight was hyped more than just about any recent fight on record? That's pretty clear also, I believe. And that Canelo failed to deliver what many expected, given the gaudy record and the hype? Well.... most observers had it as a shutout, maybe charitably giving Canelo one round.
Maybe if I hadn't expressed myself so fervently about the fight, you'd be singing a different tune yourself. But rather, you wait to see which side you should take, and then take it. No problem.
As much as the term can be overused or abused like so much other boxing terminology which we can all be guilty of I have to side with @TitoFan a bit on this specific case but much of the hype is not even the kids fault. He was being touted as the guy that would do what no other had yet to do by Golden Boy, the media and forum fans. He had every advantage going for him starting with his youth which was probably also his downfall coupled with the fact that outside of Trout he was fed a steady diet of much smaller and less then elite worn out gentlemen. To cap it off, his team believed that he was actually capable of going in and out boxing Floyd and then went with that plan pretty much until the end of the fight. He never once tried to pull a Lamotta. So in that sense he was a hype job. He never at that point in time lived up to the standards others placed on him. But that does not mean that he is a hype job today as a fighter. He's only 23 and just fought this era's Robinson and is still at the elite level.
Imo its what comes after this fight that will prove one way or the other whether he is or was a hype job as a fighter. That is not to be determined by his next fight but rather what he accomplishes over the next few years. A challenge for him may be that he has to go to 160 because 154 is starting to look dryer then a popcorn fart. I doubt Floyd has any intentions on defending or fighting anyone else out of that crop. Alvarez could start by getting both belts he lost back and the unifying the division. If he folds or implodes the guess what? He is and was both a literal and figurative hype job.
Btw and ftr I think its unfair to accuse Titofan of being clouded about everything he says concerning fighters that happen to be Mexican just because at times the Mex/PR rivalry gets out of hand. That’s as unfair as what he's accused of or inferred to be doing. Lots of his thoughts on contests that may have included Mexican fighters both past and present since I joined the site have been spot on and even when I disagreed valid. I've also seen him prop countless Mexican fighter’s lots of times in all kinds of conversations and threads.
I'm not qualified to speak about this hype question but I have a few thoughts
1)boxing fans, the media, and casual fans have become far too quick to dismiss fighters. A few losses used to be accepted as part of the process. If you overreact to a loss you feed into the failing system. Promoters may not pay direct attention to the fans but be sure that they have someone on staff thatt is paying direct attention. If fans overreact promoters feel more need to protect records and we lose out. We can't expect better from boxing if we aren't better ourselves.
2)Canelo may have put on a poor performance against Mayweather but he showed some good qualities while failing in others. Qualities that bode well for his future. He showed more ring intellect than I thought he would. There were more but here are a few quick examples
(A)When Floyd gets into the forward posture and raises his trail heel he is looking for the pull counter. Canelo is the first fighter I recall to resist the trap of leading into it. You have to respect the awareness.
(B)when Floyd throws the lead right he looks to duck and back out to his right because he knows the left hook will follow. Canelo smartly didn't bother with the left hook in these instances and tried to catch Floyd with the uppercut as he ducked out. He was unable to connect but it was a very clever adjustment.
I wasn't really a fan before but I'm eager to see where his career goes partly because of clever manuveurs like those. I had figured he coasted on size but his intellect is intriguing as well.
Sorry so long
Last edited by Ron Swanson; 09-18-2013 at 04:56 AM.
I start plenty of threads on the main board and have always said that Canelo is underrated. So your nonsense just doesn't wash.Your last 30 odd posts have been about Canelo being unjustly rewarded and it just sounds like sour grapes. You have been calling everyone left right and centre who disagrees with you a cunt. I am not alone in noticing this. I am trying to be civil but your output is overwhelmingly negative and confrontational and its getting old fast. You have preconceptions about everyone and everything so it is pointless even trying to show you common courtesy but just as a heads up, for everyone else around the world the Mexican-Puerto rivalry is a bit childish.
Don't get your blood pressure up, gramps. No one is calling anyone a cunt here. You blatantly ignored my points about being more even-handed toward Mexican fighters than you're giving me credit for. But that's ok, really. I'm way past caring what you think, since that seems to be engraved in stone anyway.
And you know what? The rivalry does get a bit childish. Everyone could use a little lightening up, including myself.
Think about it. (Say what you see)
Ok so your pointed witticism went to waste, as the illustration did not show as intended (at least on my screen). No doubt it was a funny slam, intended to ridicule, and avoid the "just-posed" question.
Shame though. I'm sure it was pretty funny.
P.S. - BTW, you never did address my assertion of being even-handed toward Mexican fighters in general. Why is that? Does it undermine your point and your funny monologue? Why can't we just address the issue without the "winks to the side"? Can you do that?
Epic Face Palm. Exasperation. Disbelief. Incredulity. Really? WTFness, etc.
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