Saddo's Official Pound 4 Pound List November, 2006

[Wacko3205]

Okay everyone...here's the link over in Wackoland for the P4P discussion: http://www.saddoboxing.com/boxing_fo...c,27714.0.html

The list is also posted below for those to lazy to crossover in to the land of the wacka's...discuss it wherever you like.

Cheers...& koneecheewah bitches.
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As of the month of November, 2006...here are the current changes that I have made to our P4P list.

Before we set it in stone, I want everyone to discuss it here & also if need be we can make changes...that's up to you...the forum goers.

I am going to keep this as the sticky-thread for our section here & once we get settled from month to month I will save the rankings & delete the thread & re-new it with each month or big fight.

Here's the list...so let's talk my brothers...

Saddo's Official Pound 4 Pound List November, 2006:

1: "Pretty Boy" Floyd Mayweather. Continuing to work his way through the ranks of each weight within arm's reach, Little Floyd cements his status as the #1 P4P Champion of recent years...filling in where Hopkins left off. Boasting recent wins over Gatti, Judah, Mitchell, & his 12 round unanimous decision over Carlos Baldomir, Mayweather has hung another strap around his waist. Impressively, Floyd is still running on an undefeated record of 37 wins with 24 knokckouts & always over coming the competition in humiliating fashion, Floyd has muscled his way to the top spot of the 147 mark. Only one strap & contender left to conquer & that is Margarito & his WBA ranking. Instead, Floyd has decided to defy all logic & odds as he makes a bid for the WBC's Light Middleweight Title. Who holds this title? None other than the Golden Boy Oscar De La Hoya, himself. In the past, Floyd has set insurmountable goals & he has always conquered them. On top of that, he has effectively answered quite a few questions pertaining to his chin & his ability to maintain the weights succesfully as he continues to rise to the occassion. A career defining win against any of the top 10 Welters or Light Welters should have solidified Mayweather's title as "The Man to Beat" & earned him accolades of respect, but for some reason...it did not come about. Floyd is even more hated & unappreciated now than before. Sad but true. Maybe a win over Oscar will change the mind of the people...maybe not. Maybe he will beat Oscar...maybe not. Can Floyd continue to rise above them all or will he fall to the ground like a star that's climbed to far into the atmosphere? Hard questions to answer...but one thing is for sure...no matter what Floyd does...he will always be plagued by the scorn of purists & casual fans alike.

2: Manny Pacquiao. Pacquiao has done a hell of a lot over the past 5 years and he just keeps on trucking. In winning or losing he's gained a shat load of fans. After beating the likes of Hussein, Velazquez, Lucero, and the great Marco Antonio Barrera he has stamped his name on the Super Bantamweight division. To date, his grip on the Super Feather & Featherweight division seems to be tightening also. After drawing with Marquez, Pacquiao moved on to score against Erik Morales with an impressive knockdown drag out fight that resulted in the first knock down & out loss of Morales glorious career. Pac, taking no gimmee's then moved on to stamp out a 12 rounder over the durable Oscar Larios. 4 months later a third fight with Morales would end abruptly in a 3rd round knockout of the Tijuana warrior...most likely ending the career of the great Erik "El Terrible" Morales. Now that a rematch with Marco Antonio Barrera has been solidified for March of 2007...Pacquiao's star can continue to rise to the heavens of boxing greatness...or fall scorching to the ground under the fists of another P4P legend...Barrera. Being a fan of Barrera...my money's on Pac. We shall see.

3: Ronald "Winky" Wright. Let's face it...Wright has worked hard to get to where he is and being in the #2 spot on a P4P list aint all that bad...but he goes down one...just due to the fact that Manny blew out a P4P great this month...if Wright humiliates Quartey...then we have a P4P delima on our hands. Winky Wright faces, quite often, the same scorn as Floyd Mayweather does...just not the same level of unappreciation that Mayweather does. Often criticized for being a safety first fighter...a boring fighter...blah blah blah blah. No matter what spews from the lips of the "couch bound arm chair warriors" as they clasp their remotes each Saturday night, Wright keeps on winning & surprising all. Of recent date Wright came to a controversial draw with our newly oppointed middleweight prince, Jermain Taylor. Prior to that...Wright shocked the world by humiliating Felix Trinidad & then boxing awkward, volume punching, Aussie Sam Solimon to a stand still. No matter what Wright does...he's rarely on the recieving end of love from the casual fan. Look for Wright to be taken to then end of his rope agianst Ike Quartey this December in what promises to be an action packed showdown.

4: Marco Antonio Barrera. By majority vote, the forums gave this man third place by a land slide...but once again..."the Baby Faced Assasin" get's dropped by Manny Pacquiao. Barrera has jumped leaps and bounds up through the weight classes and he has never turned down an offer taking on anyone and everyone that was ignorant enough to call his name. The two time conqueror of Morales & once victim of Manny Pacquiao now has the opportunity, once again, to prove his greatness next year as the date has been set for a rematch with the infamous Manny Pacquiao. With a win, not only is redemption at stake, but the chance to finally cement his name in pound for pound history. Barrera constantly betters himself with each outting and like a fine wine he seems to just age gracefully. The only dark horse here is that Barrera has toiled in rematch city all year with Juarez...& there were some struggles involved...it makes one wonder how he will hold up under the fists of Pac...who seems to be a wizard in rematches. You can't help but develop a taste for him. We gave Pac the bump to second place...2 notches above MAB due to the fact that he just keeps conquering and stepping up the opposition. Can the same be said for Barrera?

5: Rafael Marquez. Rafael Marquez is one of the best kept secrets in boxing. The Marquez brothers have both skyrocketed to fame in the last 3 or 4 years...but it's Rafael, with his blistering knockout power, that is finally starting to gain prestige. To see Marquez in form and on point is almost amazing. He currently runs a record of 39 fights, 36 wins with 32 knockouts, and 3 losses. Not too bad. He's brought a lot of recognition to the almost ignored Bantamweight division in recent years and he has defended his IBF strap nine times in a row. Again...not bad. The kid definently owns his division.

6: Joe Calzaghe. Joe Calzaghe has dominated his division from the get go and now takes a huge leap in our P4P Rankings! As an amatuer Calzaghe was nothing short of amazing...what he did Saturday March 3rd, 2006 was the accomplishment of his lifetime. His professional career consists of running undefeated in 41 fights with 31 ko's starting in 1993. That says it all. Joe just passed the turning point of his career by defeating world wide recognized top Super Middleweight IBF Title holder Jeff Lacy. The American public and world media has no other choice than to respect and recognize the Pride of Wales as the Undisputed Unified Super Middleweight Man of the Hour...he's all that and that much more. After going a the full 12 with Bika...Joe has faced some criticism...his logical opponant is 168lb Danish Kingpin Mikkel Kessler. If Joe were to play checkers & jump this challenge...his career could fall deep into question. Again...another year is nearly here...& another cliffhanger keeps our mouths watering. Will Joe rise to the occassion again? We shall see.

7: Ricky Hatton. Hatton, a lot like Floyd, has done a lot...but that nagging question has always been out there...who has Hatton done a lot against? Well...he beat Kostya Tszyu and he beat Maussa pretty damned convincingly...so that my friends equates to who and also a lot. Even though he has an undefeated record and always besting the competition, many showed him little respect...well he's got it now...or partially. Hatton was to take the U.S. by storm as he faced Collazo at 147lbs. The Welterweight division & his first opponant turned out to be a bit of a struggle for Hatton, he didn't win all of America over, & he's dropped back down to 140lbs...but being an unbiased Yank (or liking to think I am)...you want to give him a second chance...just to see if he's hype worthy. A future showdown with Floyd Mayweather Jr remains to be the focus of Hatton's career...but he's moved down since the questionable performance against Collazo & Floyd has skyrocketed upwards & even farther to 154. Next up he's set to face hard hitting Urango & if all goes well there...Castillo. Hefty plates for a thin menu. Let's see how he handles the buffet.

8: Jermain Taylor. After winning two decisions over Super Champion Bernard Hopkins and dominating everyone that he has faced to date...it's high time that Jermain be moved onto our list. Young, marketable, skilled, and powerful Jermain has cut an impressive record with wins against names like Hopkins, Joppy, Eduord, Cuevas, and Marquez. Recently drawing with Wright...Taylor remains on the list...but it's hard to say what will happen in the future of Jermain Taylor. A rematch with Wright is what fans probably most want...but a disgruntled Wright seems ready to pass on such after putting forth the fight of his career. Wright will take on Ike Quartey...& in a mind boggler...Taylor will take on Kassim Ouma. If that aint enough to keep you scratching your heads...our heir apparent has announced that he will vacate his titles & RUN up to 168lbs. Stranger things.

9: Juan Manuel Marquez. Oddly enough after his loss to Chris John...we brought Marquez back onto the list...and rightly so. With his impressive stoppage in his most recent outting against Jandaeng. Next on the list is Jimrex Jaca...after that...let's just hope that Marquez is sealing & stamping the envelope to appeal for a rematch against Chris John in the very near future. A fight that would gain redemption & one that he could clearly win...on nuetral soil.

10: Jose Luis Castillo. No explanation needed here...but maybe your wondering why he's in the 10 slot? Inactivity & conduct. Not fighting...not making weight...suspension s...blah blah blah. Look at the record and this guy has to make a splash in the P4P division. With wins over the best in his division and around the bend against the likes of Corrales, Casamayor, Johnston, Lazcano, Diaz, and a really really close one to Floyd...there aint much room to argue here. Castillo's exciting, powerful, and really hard to beat.

[Wacko3205]

I know that everyone is busy over the holidays...so I will sticky this until maybe Friday or Saturday...then you can discuss it over on the other board...or here...somewhere within the many pages.

Happy Holidays bitches.

Marquez Jimrex Jaca DRBR soon to be up & running also.

[superheavyrhun]

Good to see that it isn't entirely American focussed, and I think that Calzaghe and Hatton deserve their spots in there, but need to look to ocnsolidate them with some big ass bouts in 2007. Can't argue with Pretty Boy at 1, even though I dislike his attitude, and post-fight conduct, there is simply no-one that has given him a real run for his money.
The one change I'd make is to switch Winky and the Pacman, the odds for that fight reflected that Morales had had a lot taken out of him in the second installment of the trilogy, and that short win was what the majority were expecting, but bigger and better things from those two might see them threaten Mayweather next year hopefully.

[Wacko3205]

Good to see that it isn't entirely American focussed, and I think that Calzaghe and Hatton deserve their spots in there, but need to look to ocnsolidate them with some big a** bouts in 2007.

Fair is fair...& nationality to make a fwock! They do deserve their spots.

Can't argue with Pretty Boy at 1, even though I dislike his attitude, and post-fight conduct, there is simply no-one that has given him a real run for his money.

Agreed. Outside the ropes...he's a douche bag...inside...he's a wizard. Crying shame he can't be both in & out at the same time.

The one change I'd make is to switch Winky and the Pacman, the odds for that fight reflected that Morales had had a lot taken out of him in the second installment of the trilogy, and that short win was what the majority were expecting, but bigger and better things from those two might see them threaten Mayweather next year hopefully.

You know me...I'm a HUGE Winky fan...but Pac has destroyed Barrera, then drawn with Marquez, destroyed Larios, dropped two contenders in the mean time, & as I hate to be repetitive...been the only man to knockout the great Morales.

The jump in P4P slots is up for forum debate...but Pac, IWO, is deserving of the bump.

I leave it to the forum.

[smashup]

Tell you what...
Pacman is very nearly level if not above PBF imo after the Morales beating.
It is an unarguable fact imo that Paquiao is the more entertaining fighter who FIGHTS in every matchup.
No reverse gear on the Pacman and he is pure entertainment.

[Wacko3205]

Tell you what...
Pacman is very nearly level if not above PBF imo after the Morales beating.
It is an unarguable fact imo that Paquiao is the more entertaining fighter who FIGHTS in every matchup.

No reverse gear on the Pacman and he is pure entertainment.

Good points.

That being said...Pac's got as many question marks on his record as Floyd does...but Floyd doesn't have the losses.

Floyd is riding on 37 wins with 24 ko's & the rest are performances of which he humiliated everyone that he faced outside of the first Castillo fight.

Pacquiao's record boats 48 fights with 34 ko's, 3 losses, & 2 draws. Nearing the latter part of Pac's career he has faced 3 of the greatest Mexi's of our decade & he's disposed of 2 of them by knockout. The other, Marquez, withstood his full speed ahead gear & over came it to outbox him to a draw. Then there's Larios & Lucero...but not many rate them...& that's just wrong.

Also...now...some fans are giving Pac the Mayweather treatment & disguarding the destruction of Morales based on the fact that he like many of Floyd's opponents were chosen at the right time as fall guys.

Amazing that we as fans can be so disrespectful of our champs...but wer'e all guilty of it...so we can't go throwin stones.

Pac's record is great from 2003 & up...but it's marred by the 3 losses.

Floyd's record is great from 1999 to 2004...but from the skeptical fan...it's downhill after that...I don't agree with that. Gatti, Mitchell, Judah, & Baldomir all had skills...there were just flaws.

No shame in either game...but Floyd, hate his attitude or not, is still the master boxer...Pac is just an unstoppable brute force.

In Wacko's opinion...this is all about boxing...pound for pound...Floyd is superior...but this aint Wacko's list nor is it his forum...so it's all up to you...the people.

This is your list.

[smashup]

Yeah Floyd is the man stats wise no question but i always like to think of P4P's as more of a current thing,you know,like who's 'Doing it right about now'kinda stylee

It's a fair list too and a true reflection of genuine fight fans views.
Well done everyone

[El Gamo]

Glad to see you put Rafa Marquez there,kudos to you,he's a great fighter. PBF is first if you are looking at numbers but comparing resumes,I think beating EM twice is as good,nay better than anything PBF has done and for that reason Manny is my number 1. Manny is also a multiple weight champ but he fought the best in those weights or at least most of the dangermen PLUS stopping 2 HOF?! I don't think PBF can compare to that and skills alone do not make you P4P number 1 imo....

I'm not sure about Hatton's ranking,he has fought good competition but isn't that a bit high? Jermain Taylor should be higher,wether anyone likes it or not(I don't)he gave 2 legends 3 tough tough fights and came out undefeated after that....I think he deserves more credit for that and remember,he wanted Winky again,Winky priced himself out.....AND he's unbeaten......

I think Winky's position is fine as is MAB's...MAB has not fought a really tough opponent for a while(and no I don't rate Juarez) and Winky drew with JT and most of his big wins,although excellent,were against naturally smaller men I guess( i know that;s being critical)

Castillo...hmmm....not sure,plus he's suspended right,I'm trying to think who else could go there Jorge Arce is close,needs a big fight...hmm

ISREAL VAZQUEZ!!!!!!!! He's beaten Larios who is VERY VERY dangerous,and he beat Johnny Gonzalez who is super skilled and I think Vazquez is a champ and he's highly skilled.....he should get number 10....

Cotto musn't be far off,and a win over Quintana in your first fight at 147 would impress be BIGTIME! He has beaten the decent level of opposition so he deserves credit...Corley,Paulie(a future champ)Pinto,Ndou,Sosa,Torres(champ now too),olympic medallists,undefeated bangers,boxers etc etc...

[p4pking]

I have a hard time deciding between Winky and Pac for no.2... Beating Morales is great, but really the fact that he did it twice doesn't mean a whole lot imo since MOrales brought nothing to the table in the 3rd fight.. I don't really see why Pac's ranking should change at all tbo.. I think it was generally recognized that he was no.3 after beating MOrales the first time, and I just don't see the 2nd win as having much substance.. Morales was shot, like it or not. And Winky did deserve to win his fight against Jermain Taylor, which is far more impressive than Pac beating MOrales at this point in time.... Winky humiliated Mosley and Trinidad, and should have won against Taylor but drew... Pac humiliated Barerra, but drew with Marquez and did lose to MOrales the first time then avenged it in dominant fashion.. It's really, really close that's for sure.. I guess I would go with Winky just by putting achievements aside, I consider him to be a better fighter p4p, and he doesn't have any blemishes on his record in years.. It seems like most people do have Pac at no.2 now though, but like Wacko said if Winky owns Quartey, he'll probably take that spot back for the mean time.. I could literally see these guys swapping spots every time one of them fights.. Unless Floyd loses to Oscar, then they'll both likely move up 1.

[El Gamo]

Ivan Calderon is also an excellent boxer but he does not get credit because of his size. I also believe he needs some more big names but he is very skilled...no power though~!

[SalTheButcher]

I PROTEST THIS LIST

[Preme]

I just don't get why winky isnt number one. His resume in the last few years beats everyones, he looks tot ake the best fights out there. I mean looke at him fighting Ike next, he may not be the fighter he onces was, but hes still pretty dangerous and beating him wont do much for winkys legecy. honestly, wou wudnt see mayweather taking that risk.

Just 'coz winky isnt some flash, lound mouth power puncher, he gets overlooked. P4P No1 in the world.

[Hairdoo]

The thing with p4p is alot of poeple think its who looks to be the more skilled boxer... and thats not the case. Just imagine Wright, Mayweather, Barrera and Pacquiao all shrunk down to 130 pounds or all inflated to 175 pounds!! who wins? my money would be on the little Philippino Mike Tyson thats for sure!!

[AdamGB]

being the best P4P doesn't mean getting shrunk or made bigger... it's who who has the best skills and can apply them over the biggest range of weight classes.

I can't say that Ali or Tyson where P4P greats because they probably couldn't have fought more than one weight class below theirs, if at all... despite being immensely gifted in their weight class.

For me any way... we need a clear cut definition really... :P

[Hairdoo]

being the best P4P doesn't mean getting shrunk or made bigger... it's who who has the best skills and can apply them over the biggest range of weight classes.
I can't say that Ali or Tyson where P4P greats because they probably couldn't have fought more than one weight class below theirs, if at all... despite being immensely gifted in their weight class.

For me any way... we need a clear cut definition really... :P

if thats the case then whats Rafael Marquez doing at 4th he has only ever won the IBF and IBO Bantamweight Title? and has 3 losses?