Patterson, Louis, and others advice for training with the Heavy Bag

[Chris Nagel]

Patterson, Louis, and others advice for training with the Heavy Bag
Here are some notes that I made from a few books, where within the excerpts contain some interesting descriptions regarding the use of the heavy bag.

From Floyd Patterson’s how-to-book, Inside Boxing:

"The heavy bag can be used hanging free, or held by a trainer, to give you extra leverage. Either way, it represents an opponent—except that it doesn’t hit back.

In a workout with a free-swinging heavy bag, you also get practice using your weight to maneuver your opponent. Shove the bag away, and, as it swings back to you, throw one or two punches. Shove it away again, bob or duck out of the way as it comes at you, then when it swings back again, throw one or two hard punches.

The more the bag moves, the more you will move. If you’ve worked out with a bag that moves very little, you’ll tent to mover very little when you’re boxing. If you get a bag that swings way out and goes around you (the kind I have), you’ll find that you’ll have quite a bit more to catch up with.

I try to throw four, five or six combination punches at the heavy bag. The same combinations that I throw at the heavy bag during training are the ones I’ll throw during an actual fight. Most fighters use the heavy bag as an opponent. George Foreman used the heavy bag almost exclusively in preparing for his title fight against Joe Frazier, shoving it aside and hitting it hard in the area where Joe’s ribs would be. He followed almost the exact pattern during the fight, with some measure of success.

You can use the heavy bag in a defensive drill by bobbing under it and to the side as it comes toward you. A good flexibility drill is to duck completely under it, crouching low to the floor. But watch out that it doesn’t hit you when it is swinging back. This care will teach you to watch out that your opponent doesn’t hit you with a second punch after you ducked the first."


This is what Joe Louis advised about hitting the heavy bag (from Joe Louis's How to Box):

"After learning how to hit the bag while it is stationary, try giving it a slight push to start it slowly swinging. Then when it has started to swing away, hook sharply with the left or right in the direction of the swing of the bag. This is good practice as it accustoms you to hitting the side of an opponent who turns from a blow.
The heavy bag is also used to develop rapid hitting to the body which is called in-fighting. Crouch slightly forward with both feet in line together, and bring both hands upward in sharp, short blows to the bag. Treat the bag as you would your opponent. If the bag gives way, assume your opponent is retreating from your attack, step closer and continue punching away with both hands. Then assume that your opponent is holding, back away but quickly return to the attack with both hands. This will help you get more power behind your blows and teach you to stay in close, so that your opponent's blows are robbed of their force.
Punching the heavy bag should be timed into rounds, three minutes punching with one minute of rest in between.

Sessions with the bag help tune up your footwork, too. The bag keeps you shifting your weight around a good deal like you must when facing an opponent in the ring."


Here’s another interesting description for working the heavy bag from the story Million Dollar Baby written by F.X. Toole, who has been training boxers for 22 years.

"He went to the big bag and gave it a shove. Then he began to move with it, maintaining the same distance as he slid toward it or back, whether he pivoted to the side or moved around it.
"'Stalk, don't walk', he said. 'You gonna work the big bag, first you got to think of it as a man, not as a bag. Once you understand that, you don't start punchin until the bag swings away from you.' He demonstrated as he spoke. 'It's dead weight, see? So if you hit it when it swings toward you, it knocks you back, smothers your punches, takes your balance--it don't allow you full extension on your shots, no follow-through. Joe Louis said you don't punch your opponent, you punch THROUGH your opponent.
"She did as Frankie had instructed. She was awkward at first, but once she found her balance, she began to move as Frankie had, first rotating one shoulder forward, then the other, which kept her head moving without her having to think about it.
"That's it rotate. That way your head's always movin’ and you always have one shoulder back ready to fire a power shot--so you don't have to do somethin' before you do somethin, say if you got a openin. Don't stop, move with the bag, circle it, he said giving it a shove. 'It will tell you when to punch, just like an opponent.'
"'Dang thing does tell you when to punch,' she muttered, a world of angles and planes opening up to her."

Toole, F.X."Million $$$ Baby," in ROPE BURNS: STORIES FROM THE CORNER. New York: HarperCollins, 2000, pg. 69.

I hope that this interests someone. If anyone has any specific questions, we can talk about it.

[southpawed]

i couldnt really register the part where joe louis says to hit bag when its swinging away. i always hit the bag right when it swings back at me. Which is what the million dollar baby guy says will smother your punches.

If im throwing a hook in the same direction the bags swinging, wont i be throwing past my center line and be off balance, since my hook is chasing the bag, instead of meeting it in a collision?

im pretty sure i misunderstood


on another note, what i thought was interesting, was the exercise that Floyd mentions about weaving and crouching low underneath the bag and using head movement to avoid the oncoming swing. Thats a trademark Cus De Amato exercise right there i bet you. Cause ive seen Tyson do the exact thing in some fights.

[Chris Nagel]

i couldnt really register the part where joe louis says to hit bag when its swinging away. i always hit the bag right when it swings back at me. Which is what the million dollar baby guy says will smother your punches.

If im throwing a hook in the same direction the bags swinging, wont i be throwing past my center line and be off balance, since my hook is chasing the bag, instead of meeting it in a collision?

im pretty sure i misunderstood


on another note, what i thought was interesting, was the exercise that Floyd mentions about weaving and crouching low underneath the bag and using head movement to avoid the oncoming swing. Thats a trademark Cus De Amato exercise right there i bet you. Cause ive seen Tyson do the exact thing in some fights.

Joe Louis means exactly what he says. I don't think that you should reach with your punches when hitting it that way, instead a couple of rapid steps should put you in range to hit the bag as it simulates hitting an opponent who's on the retreat. In that sense, think about using the swinging bag to help you become better at coordinating your hands and feet. As the bag swings left or right, step in the same direction as the bag and then follow it with a punch (e.g. the bag swings to your right, so you take a step to the right, shifting your weight onto your right foot and then throw a left hook into the bag). One exercise you can do as the bag is swinging backward, is step in, punch, and then turn on an angle so that you avoid the bag's oncoming swing (which simulates an opponent's punch) allowing you to go follow up with a combination, or to punch and get back to long range. HBO did a special before on Paul Williams, Ring Life, which showed some clips from his training. Interestingly enough, it shows Williams stepping around the bag turning/spinning it like he would an opponent. It's worth checking out if you get the chance. A heavy bag is a good way to work on angles with your footwork.

Anyways about Patterson's ducking under the bag, I've seen a lot of other fighters do it. I think in general the bags they used swung a lot more, which can be a good thing too. It allows you work on a lot of different things, and even if you're not hitting the bag, keep bag moving with a shove and then you can practice footwork. Against the oncoming bag, you can practice side-stepping (i.e. stepping forward on an angle with your back foot, and not simply a step to the side), step around the bag with economy of movement, and shoot off your punches quickly, shifting your weight into your blows when you're in position.

To allow your bag to swing more, I recommend that it should be on a long line hanging from a higher spot such as a tree branch, or a high beam. The bottom of the bag should be at about waist height as this allows for weaving under the bag, as well as landing half uppercuts on the bottom. This is also better on your wrists as the bag will move more readily since you’re head shots land closer toward the middle of the bag instead of near the chain. You can control the bag’s swing with your jab.

[Dothius]

Awesome notes.Its amazing to know that by utelising the heavybag efficiently you can get a lot more out of your training sessions.