ADAM BOOTH:Haye 3rd best HW in world! Where would you place Haye right now?

[ross]

This will be a fun fight but think Haye's punching power will get Chisora's respect and he will box himself to victory.

When was the last time David Haye boxed 12 rounds against an aggressive fighter? If he does what he did against Valuev he will lose a landslide. If he doesn't get Chisora out of there early no way can Haye win this. No one is going to tell me that Haye hits harder than Vitali and Dereck took some massive shots from him without so much as a budge!

Well I guarantee he KO's him right now! I've got £1000 on it at 15/8. That was with Skybet and their price has dropped this week from that to EVENS. Haye hits harder than Vitali and he'll prove it when he stops this bum. Vitali is not punching like he used to. Look at his recent opponents, He couldn't stop Kevin Johnson, in his prime there is not a chance he would have survived. Albert Sosnowski, Fucking Zuri Lawrence almost scored a KO against his guy but it took Vitali 10 rounds to get rid, the Vitali that bounced Herbie Hide round would have stopped Sosnowski very early! Shannon Briggs, now Briggs is a tough guy but look how Lennox dealt with a much fitter much younger and overall much better version, had Vitali fought Fought Briggs when he fought Lewis he too would have KO'd Briggs in the middle rounds IMO.

I believe Haye now hits harder than Vitali now and he'll prove it next weekend and i'll be cashing in

This fight will be very similar to Haye Ruiz with Chisora moving forward and being put down before that chap who got his jaw broke by Haye stops it.

Thats the stupidest bet iv ever seen in my life. Those who still bet that Elvis will make a reapearance have more chance of seeing their money back.

Yeah Haye can punch hard but so could Bruno. Power is nothing when you cant work under pressure and get knackered quick. Chisora is going to bully Haye and make Haye do some sissy crying to the ref until he quits.

Actually you can get 1000/1 that Elvis turns up alive. If you're willing to give me 1000/1 that Haye can't KO Chisora I will happily send £1000 your way (as long as you're good for the £1 million winnings ).


@rjj tszyu - even though I think Haye has a great chance of stopping Chisora, that is one brave bet (unless you're loaded) considering Chisora has never even been down. Good luck.

Would you be willing to offer the same odds that Chisora doesnt get knocked out?

err... what?

(I don't think you clearly understand odds ross so just swerve this one )

What!

Im saying, if either of us were a millionaire, would we be willing to lose 1 million. I would be more willing to risk losing 1 million that Chisora doesnt get knocked out, than of Haye scoring a KO. I cant think of anyone that would risk losing £1000 that Haye can knock Chisora out.

[Fenster]

If you want to get technical, "Haye fought the best fighter" is also an opinion. "Haye fought the current heavyweight titleholder" is actually the fact. As you were.

Actually that's not a fact. Haye was also a current heavyweight title holder as was Vitali.

"Chicken Little Boxing Loudmouth Champion" is not a universally recognized title.



Haye fought THE best fighter, who is still considered THE best fighter, according to all the worlds preeminent boxing publications/writers/web sites/TV stations (personally I believe Vitali is/was better than Wlad). As you were.

"Haye fought the current heavyweight titleholder" is not a fact?? Tell me, what part of the statement is untrue? Are you picking on the "the" part? Because if so, objection overruled. Wlad was a current heavyweight titleholder at the time he fought Haye. Quit wasting my time.

Next case!

Exhibit a) Wlad was THE current heavyweight title holder.

Exhibit b) Wlad was A current heavyweight title holder.

Does A differ from B? Yes. Is A incorrect? Yes. Is B correct? Yes.

Get your facts straight and stop wasting the court's time. Please proceed.

None of this changes the fact that Haye is a shitty heavyweight, and proved unworthy of the shot given to him by the generous Wlad. This, after all, is the real heart of the matter.

There was nothing "generous" about it. It's called business.

Haye was the current biggest name heavyweight for Wlad, the WBA champion, the highest independently ranked heavyweight and most importantly the fighter that makes him most money.

AS for Haye being "unworthy." That's always easy to say with hindsight. Cotto was "unworthy" against Mayweather and Pac with hindsight. It's not like the fights were even remotely close. Fact.

Cotto FOUGHT Mayweather and Pac.
Haye handed his ass to Wlad in a silver platter with trembling hands.

Big difference.

The only big difference is the size of fighter.

Cotto was the BIGGER man against both. Haye was giving Wlad around 30lb and 4-5 inches in height.. Wlad had every conceivable advantage.

Just cause Haye didn't get beat-up like Cotto did, especially against little Pac, you can't hold that against him. If little Pac can bust Cotto up with that ease, what would Froch, Chavez jr or Hopkins do to him? Because that's the size difference you're dealing with. Fact.

[TitoFan]

If you want to get technical, "Haye fought the best fighter" is also an opinion. "Haye fought the current heavyweight titleholder" is actually the fact. As you were.

Actually that's not a fact. Haye was also a current heavyweight title holder as was Vitali.

"Chicken Little Boxing Loudmouth Champion" is not a universally recognized title.



Haye fought THE best fighter, who is still considered THE best fighter, according to all the worlds preeminent boxing publications/writers/web sites/TV stations (personally I believe Vitali is/was better than Wlad). As you were.

"Haye fought the current heavyweight titleholder" is not a fact?? Tell me, what part of the statement is untrue? Are you picking on the "the" part? Because if so, objection overruled. Wlad was a current heavyweight titleholder at the time he fought Haye. Quit wasting my time.

Next case!

Exhibit a) Wlad was THE current heavyweight title holder.

Exhibit b) Wlad was A current heavyweight title holder.

Does A differ from B? Yes. Is A incorrect? Yes. Is B correct? Yes.

Get your facts straight and stop wasting the court's time. Please proceed.

None of this changes the fact that Haye is a shitty heavyweight, and proved unworthy of the shot given to him by the generous Wlad. This, after all, is the real heart of the matter.

There was nothing "generous" about it. It's called business.

Haye was the current biggest name heavyweight for Wlad, the WBA champion, the highest independently ranked heavyweight and most importantly the fighter that makes him most money.

AS for Haye being "unworthy." That's always easy to say with hindsight. Cotto was "unworthy" against Mayweather and Pac with hindsight. It's not like the fights were even remotely close. Fact.

Cotto FOUGHT Mayweather and Pac.
Haye handed his ass to Wlad in a silver platter with trembling hands.

Big difference.

The only big difference is the size of fighter.

Cotto was the BIGGER man against both. Haye was giving Wlad around 30lb and 4-5 inches in height.. Wlad had every conceivable advantage.

Just cause Haye didn't get beat-up like Cotto did, especially against little Pac, you can't hold that against him. If little Pac can bust Cotto up with that ease, what would Froch, Chavez jr or Hopkins do to him? Because that's the size difference you're dealing with. Fact.

Once again you're reaching for straws. They were all the same size. (slowly) T-h-a-t's w-h-y t-h-e-y h-a-v-e w-e-i-g-h-i-n-s. Haye gave up some size to Wlad? He is the one choosing to fight at HW. He's free to go back to light heavy whenever he wants. If he can't take the heat......



As to not holding against Haye that he didn't get "beat up like Cotto did" against Pac..... why shouldn't we?? He was paid to fight. Not run around like some scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs.

[Onix]

If you want to get technical, "Haye fought the best fighter" is also an opinion. "Haye fought the current heavyweight titleholder" is actually the fact. As you were.

Actually that's not a fact. Haye was also a current heavyweight title holder as was Vitali.

"Chicken Little Boxing Loudmouth Champion" is not a universally recognized title.



Haye fought THE best fighter, who is still considered THE best fighter, according to all the worlds preeminent boxing publications/writers/web sites/TV stations (personally I believe Vitali is/was better than Wlad). As you were.

"Haye fought the current heavyweight titleholder" is not a fact?? Tell me, what part of the statement is untrue? Are you picking on the "the" part? Because if so, objection overruled. Wlad was a current heavyweight titleholder at the time he fought Haye. Quit wasting my time.

Next case!

Exhibit a) Wlad was THE current heavyweight title holder.

Exhibit b) Wlad was A current heavyweight title holder.

Does A differ from B? Yes. Is A incorrect? Yes. Is B correct? Yes.

Get your facts straight and stop wasting the court's time. Please proceed.

None of this changes the fact that Haye is a shitty heavyweight, and proved unworthy of the shot given to him by the generous Wlad. This, after all, is the real heart of the matter.

There was nothing "generous" about it. It's called business.

Haye was the current biggest name heavyweight for Wlad, the WBA champion, the highest independently ranked heavyweight and most importantly the fighter that makes him most money.

AS for Haye being "unworthy." That's always easy to say with hindsight. Cotto was "unworthy" against Mayweather and Pac with hindsight. It's not like the fights were even remotely close. Fact.

Cotto FOUGHT Mayweather and Pac.
Haye handed his ass to Wlad in a silver platter with trembling hands.

Big difference.

The only big difference is the size of fighter.

Cotto was the BIGGER man against both. Haye was giving Wlad around 30lb and 4-5 inches in height.. Wlad had every conceivable advantage.

Just cause Haye didn't get beat-up like Cotto did, especially against little Pac, you can't hold that against him. If little Pac can bust Cotto up with that ease, what would Froch, Chavez jr or Hopkins do to him? Because that's the size difference you're dealing with. Fact.

Once again you're reaching for straws. They were all the same size. (slowly) T-h-a-t's w-h-y t-h-e-y h-a-v-e w-e-i-g-h-i-n-s. Haye gave up some size to Wlad? He is the one choosing to fight at HW. He's free to go back to light heavy whenever he wants. If he can't take the heat......



As to not holding against Haye that he didn't get "beat up like Cotto did" against Pac..... why shouldn't we?? He was paid to fight. Not run around like some scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs.

Damn Tito, you just outed yourself as a hypocrite. How can your weigh-in argument be taken seriously when you bash on JCC Jr all the time about having a weight advantage??

[TitoFan]

If you want to get technical, "Haye fought the best fighter" is also an opinion. "Haye fought the current heavyweight titleholder" is actually the fact. As you were.

Actually that's not a fact. Haye was also a current heavyweight title holder as was Vitali.

"Chicken Little Boxing Loudmouth Champion" is not a universally recognized title.



Haye fought THE best fighter, who is still considered THE best fighter, according to all the worlds preeminent boxing publications/writers/web sites/TV stations (personally I believe Vitali is/was better than Wlad). As you were.

"Haye fought the current heavyweight titleholder" is not a fact?? Tell me, what part of the statement is untrue? Are you picking on the "the" part? Because if so, objection overruled. Wlad was a current heavyweight titleholder at the time he fought Haye. Quit wasting my time.

Next case!

Exhibit a) Wlad was THE current heavyweight title holder.

Exhibit b) Wlad was A current heavyweight title holder.

Does A differ from B? Yes. Is A incorrect? Yes. Is B correct? Yes.

Get your facts straight and stop wasting the court's time. Please proceed.

None of this changes the fact that Haye is a shitty heavyweight, and proved unworthy of the shot given to him by the generous Wlad. This, after all, is the real heart of the matter.

There was nothing "generous" about it. It's called business.

Haye was the current biggest name heavyweight for Wlad, the WBA champion, the highest independently ranked heavyweight and most importantly the fighter that makes him most money.

AS for Haye being "unworthy." That's always easy to say with hindsight. Cotto was "unworthy" against Mayweather and Pac with hindsight. It's not like the fights were even remotely close. Fact.

Cotto FOUGHT Mayweather and Pac.
Haye handed his ass to Wlad in a silver platter with trembling hands.

Big difference.

The only big difference is the size of fighter.

Cotto was the BIGGER man against both. Haye was giving Wlad around 30lb and 4-5 inches in height.. Wlad had every conceivable advantage.

Just cause Haye didn't get beat-up like Cotto did, especially against little Pac, you can't hold that against him. If little Pac can bust Cotto up with that ease, what would Froch, Chavez jr or Hopkins do to him? Because that's the size difference you're dealing with. Fact.

Once again you're reaching for straws. They were all the same size. (slowly) T-h-a-t's w-h-y t-h-e-y h-a-v-e w-e-i-g-h-i-n-s. Haye gave up some size to Wlad? He is the one choosing to fight at HW. He's free to go back to light heavy whenever he wants. If he can't take the heat......



As to not holding against Haye that he didn't get "beat up like Cotto did" against Pac..... why shouldn't we?? He was paid to fight. Not run around like some scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs.

Damn Tito, you just outed yourself as a hypocrite. How can your weigh-in argument be taken seriously when you bash on JCC Jr all the time about having a weight advantage??

Cotto and Pac agreed on a weight and both arrived at that weight.
Chavez Jr masquerades as a middleweight fighter.... then arrives at fight time weighing over 180 pounds.

Big difference.

[Onix]

If you want to get technical, "Haye fought the best fighter" is also an opinion. "Haye fought the current heavyweight titleholder" is actually the fact. As you were.

Actually that's not a fact. Haye was also a current heavyweight title holder as was Vitali.

"Chicken Little Boxing Loudmouth Champion" is not a universally recognized title.



Haye fought THE best fighter, who is still considered THE best fighter, according to all the worlds preeminent boxing publications/writers/web sites/TV stations (personally I believe Vitali is/was better than Wlad). As you were.

"Haye fought the current heavyweight titleholder" is not a fact?? Tell me, what part of the statement is untrue? Are you picking on the "the" part? Because if so, objection overruled. Wlad was a current heavyweight titleholder at the time he fought Haye. Quit wasting my time.

Next case!

Exhibit a) Wlad was THE current heavyweight title holder.

Exhibit b) Wlad was A current heavyweight title holder.

Does A differ from B? Yes. Is A incorrect? Yes. Is B correct? Yes.

Get your facts straight and stop wasting the court's time. Please proceed.

None of this changes the fact that Haye is a shitty heavyweight, and proved unworthy of the shot given to him by the generous Wlad. This, after all, is the real heart of the matter.

There was nothing "generous" about it. It's called business.

Haye was the current biggest name heavyweight for Wlad, the WBA champion, the highest independently ranked heavyweight and most importantly the fighter that makes him most money.

AS for Haye being "unworthy." That's always easy to say with hindsight. Cotto was "unworthy" against Mayweather and Pac with hindsight. It's not like the fights were even remotely close. Fact.

Cotto FOUGHT Mayweather and Pac.
Haye handed his ass to Wlad in a silver platter with trembling hands.

Big difference.

The only big difference is the size of fighter.

Cotto was the BIGGER man against both. Haye was giving Wlad around 30lb and 4-5 inches in height.. Wlad had every conceivable advantage.

Just cause Haye didn't get beat-up like Cotto did, especially against little Pac, you can't hold that against him. If little Pac can bust Cotto up with that ease, what would Froch, Chavez jr or Hopkins do to him? Because that's the size difference you're dealing with. Fact.

Once again you're reaching for straws. They were all the same size. (slowly) T-h-a-t's w-h-y t-h-e-y h-a-v-e w-e-i-g-h-i-n-s. Haye gave up some size to Wlad? He is the one choosing to fight at HW. He's free to go back to light heavy whenever he wants. If he can't take the heat......



As to not holding against Haye that he didn't get "beat up like Cotto did" against Pac..... why shouldn't we?? He was paid to fight. Not run around like some scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs.

Damn Tito, you just outed yourself as a hypocrite. How can your weigh-in argument be taken seriously when you bash on JCC Jr all the time about having a weight advantage??

Cotto and Pac agreed on a weight and both arrived at that weight.
Chavez Jr masquerades as a middleweight fighter.... then arrives at fight time weighing over 180 pounds.

Big difference.

What was Chavez's weight on the day of the weigh in against andy Lee? was it not the agreed upon weight?

[TitoFan]

What was Chavez's weight on the day of the weigh in against andy Lee? was it not the agreed upon weight?

(Got rid of the annoying nesting).

But to clarify.... Cotto and Pac were one pound apart at the weigh-in, and not very far apart in weight on fight night. Chavez and Lee also made the weight for the weigh-in... but observers put Chavez's weight on fight night at over 180 pounds, far larger than Andy Lee. Put another way.... Cotto and Pac looked pretty much the same size on fight night. Chavez was considerably bigger than Lee on fight night.

[Onix]

What was Chavez's weight on the day of the weigh in against andy Lee? was it not the agreed upon weight?

(Got rid of the annoying nesting).

But to clarify.... Cotto and Pac were one pound apart at the weigh-in, and not very far apart in weight on fight night. Chavez and Lee also made the weight for the weigh-in... but observers put Chavez's weight on fight night at over 180 pounds, far larger than Andy Lee. Put another way.... Cotto and Pac looked pretty much the same size on fight night. Chavez was considerably bigger than Lee on fight night.

Observers say I weigh like 170lbs but in reality I weigh like 200...in other words observers dont know shit so we cannot speculate on that and use it as a fact. However assuming Chavez did weigh that much, well isnt that part of the game? I mean you literally spelled out "THATS WHY THEY HAVE WEIGH-INS" well ill spell one out for you..."THATS WHY THE WEIGH-INS ARE A DAY BEFORE THE FIGHT"

I mean it cant be ok for one and not the other just because you dont like Mexican fighters....just kidding its Mexican fans you cant stand haha

[TitoFan]

What was Chavez's weight on the day of the weigh in against andy Lee? was it not the agreed upon weight?

(Got rid of the annoying nesting).

But to clarify.... Cotto and Pac were one pound apart at the weigh-in, and not very far apart in weight on fight night. Chavez and Lee also made the weight for the weigh-in... but observers put Chavez's weight on fight night at over 180 pounds, far larger than Andy Lee. Put another way.... Cotto and Pac looked pretty much the same size on fight night. Chavez was considerably bigger than Lee on fight night.

Observers say I weigh like 170lbs but in reality I weigh like 200...in other words observers dont know shit so we cannot speculate on that and use it as a fact. However assuming Chavez did weigh that much, well isnt that part of the game? I mean you literally spelled out "THATS WHY THEY HAVE WEIGH-INS" well ill spell one out for you..."THATS WHY THE WEIGH-INS ARE A DAY BEFORE THE FIGHT"

I mean it cant be ok for one and not the other just because you dont like Mexican fighters....just kidding its Mexican fans you cant stand haha

"Observers" is a relative term. The observers that thought Chavez looked like 180 pounds (and of course there's no need for him to get weighed the day of the fight) are more than the casual observers off the street. But whatever. The consensus seems to be that Chavez has an unfair advantage over his opponents by rehydrating so outlandishly after the weigh-in. And then there's the spectre of doping, which Junior has not totally dispelled. There was no such outcry when Cotto fought Pac. Matter of fact, some said Pac looked even slightly bigger than Cotto on fight night. Not that I'm in agreement, but they at least looked the same size.

[Onix]

What was Chavez's weight on the day of the weigh in against andy Lee? was it not the agreed upon weight?

(Got rid of the annoying nesting).

But to clarify.... Cotto and Pac were one pound apart at the weigh-in, and not very far apart in weight on fight night. Chavez and Lee also made the weight for the weigh-in... but observers put Chavez's weight on fight night at over 180 pounds, far larger than Andy Lee. Put another way.... Cotto and Pac looked pretty much the same size on fight night. Chavez was considerably bigger than Lee on fight night.

Oh and one more thing, Cotto is a warrior in the ring and gives it his all...up until the moment he is getting his ass beat, then runs around the ring "like some scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs" See Cotto VS MArgarito I, see Cotto VS Pac, hell he even was running around from Mosley in a fight he won.

Observers say I weigh like 170lbs but in reality I weigh like 200...in other words observers dont know shit so we cannot speculate on that and use it as a fact. However assuming Chavez did weigh that much, well isnt that part of the game? I mean you literally spelled out "THATS WHY THEY HAVE WEIGH-INS" well ill spell one out for you..."THATS WHY THE WEIGH-INS ARE A DAY BEFORE THE FIGHT"

I mean it cant be ok for one and not the other just because you dont like Mexican fighters....just kidding its Mexican fans you cant stand haha

"Observers" is a relative term. The observers that thought Chavez looked like 180 pounds (and of course there's no need for him to get weighed the day of the fight) are more than the casual observers off the street. But whatever. The consensus seems to be that Chavez has an unfair advantage over his opponents by rehydrating so outlandishly after the weigh-in. And then there's the spectre of doping, which Junior has not totally dispelled. There was no such outcry when Cotto fought Pac. Matter of fact, some said Pac looked even slightly bigger than Cotto on fight night. Not that I'm in agreement, but they at least looked the same size.

Ok but you are getting off point. You stated that Haye has no right to complain, if he cant take it from the heavyweights because they are that much bigger than he needs to move down, thats why they have weihg-ins right?? As far as doping is concerned well he has not tested positive yet so while you are comfortable already assuming that he id doing another shady thing you cannot use that as a defense because it hasnt been proven.

[TitoFan]

What was Chavez's weight on the day of the weigh in against andy Lee? was it not the agreed upon weight?

(Got rid of the annoying nesting).

But to clarify.... Cotto and Pac were one pound apart at the weigh-in, and not very far apart in weight on fight night. Chavez and Lee also made the weight for the weigh-in... but observers put Chavez's weight on fight night at over 180 pounds, far larger than Andy Lee. Put another way.... Cotto and Pac looked pretty much the same size on fight night. Chavez was considerably bigger than Lee on fight night.

Oh and one more thing, Cotto is a warrior in the ring and gives it his all...up until the moment he is getting his ass beat, then runs around the ring "like some scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs" See Cotto VS MArgarito I, see Cotto VS Pac, hell he even was running around from Mosley in a fight he won.

Observers say I weigh like 170lbs but in reality I weigh like 200...in other words observers dont know shit so we cannot speculate on that and use it as a fact. However assuming Chavez did weigh that much, well isnt that part of the game? I mean you literally spelled out "THATS WHY THEY HAVE WEIGH-INS" well ill spell one out for you..."THATS WHY THE WEIGH-INS ARE A DAY BEFORE THE FIGHT"

I mean it cant be ok for one and not the other just because you dont like Mexican fighters....just kidding its Mexican fans you cant stand haha

"Observers" is a relative term. The observers that thought Chavez looked like 180 pounds (and of course there's no need for him to get weighed the day of the fight) are more than the casual observers off the street. But whatever. The consensus seems to be that Chavez has an unfair advantage over his opponents by rehydrating so outlandishly after the weigh-in. And then there's the spectre of doping, which Junior has not totally dispelled. There was no such outcry when Cotto fought Pac. Matter of fact, some said Pac looked even slightly bigger than Cotto on fight night. Not that I'm in agreement, but they at least looked the same size.

Ok but you are getting off point.
(You're the one who dragged Chavez into this thread).



You stated that Haye has no right to complain, if he cant take it from the heavyweights because they are that much bigger than he needs to move down, thats why they have weihg-ins right?? As far as doping is concerned well he has not tested positive yet so while you are comfortable already assuming that he id doing another shady thing you cannot use that as a defense because it hasnt been proven.

Ok... you went from Chavez to Haye to Chavez. Let's stay on one topic, ok? So now you're defending Chavez from the doping suspicions although most boxing observers feel there's something shady about the way he's avoided providing piss tests at least twice, am I correct? Well, yes..... nothing's been proven. That's an ironclad defense I guess.



I prefer the boxers who I'm a fan of, to have no suspicious behavior to have to be defending all the time. I don't expect you to understand.

As for Haye... he chooses to fight at HW. Heavyweight is open-ended. You can weigh 400 pounds, if you'd like. If he chooses to fight at HW, then his running from Wlad is disgraceful, and Fenster's defending it is just as disgraceful.

Anything else?

[Onix]

What was Chavez's weight on the day of the weigh in against andy Lee? was it not the agreed upon weight?

(Got rid of the annoying nesting).

But to clarify.... Cotto and Pac were one pound apart at the weigh-in, and not very far apart in weight on fight night. Chavez and Lee also made the weight for the weigh-in... but observers put Chavez's weight on fight night at over 180 pounds, far larger than Andy Lee. Put another way.... Cotto and Pac looked pretty much the same size on fight night. Chavez was considerably bigger than Lee on fight night.

Oh and one more thing, Cotto is a warrior in the ring and gives it his all...up until the moment he is getting his ass beat, then runs around the ring "like some scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs" See Cotto VS MArgarito I, see Cotto VS Pac, hell he even was running around from Mosley in a fight he won.

Observers say I weigh like 170lbs but in reality I weigh like 200...in other words observers dont know shit so we cannot speculate on that and use it as a fact. However assuming Chavez did weigh that much, well isnt that part of the game? I mean you literally spelled out "THATS WHY THEY HAVE WEIGH-INS" well ill spell one out for you..."THATS WHY THE WEIGH-INS ARE A DAY BEFORE THE FIGHT"

I mean it cant be ok for one and not the other just because you dont like Mexican fighters....just kidding its Mexican fans you cant stand haha

"Observers" is a relative term. The observers that thought Chavez looked like 180 pounds (and of course there's no need for him to get weighed the day of the fight) are more than the casual observers off the street. But whatever. The consensus seems to be that Chavez has an unfair advantage over his opponents by rehydrating so outlandishly after the weigh-in. And then there's the spectre of doping, which Junior has not totally dispelled. There was no such outcry when Cotto fought Pac. Matter of fact, some said Pac looked even slightly bigger than Cotto on fight night. Not that I'm in agreement, but they at least looked the same size.

Ok but you are getting off point.
(You're the one who dragged Chavez into this thread).



You stated that Haye has no right to complain, if he cant take it from the heavyweights because they are that much bigger than he needs to move down, thats why they have weihg-ins right?? As far as doping is concerned well he has not tested positive yet so while you are comfortable already assuming that he id doing another shady thing you cannot use that as a defense because it hasnt been proven.

Ok... you went from Chavez to Haye to Chavez. Let's stay on one topic, ok? So now you're defending Chavez from the doping suspicions although most boxing observers feel there's something shady about the way he's avoided providing piss tests at least twice, am I correct? Well, yes..... nothing's been proven. That's an ironclad defense I guess.



I prefer the boxers who I'm a fan of, to have no suspicious behavior to have to be defending all the time. I don't expect you to understand.

As for Haye... he chooses to fight at HW. Heavyweight is open-ended. You can weigh 400 pounds, if you'd like. If he chooses to fight at HW, then his running from Wlad is disgraceful, and Fenster's defending it is just as disgraceful.

Anything else?

Ya, why do you think your shit dont stink? I understand what you are saying about the boxers you prefer there are alot of boxers that I support that dont have any asteriks in their careers however we are not talking about them. You saying that I switch from Haye - Chavez - Haye is a sorry excuse to avoid the point, see in an argument you use other points of reference to get a point across its not considered jumping off topic if you are still talking about the same thing. Im using your statements to prove a point.

You talk about these "observers" like they are the truth in all that is boxing, hell you are an observer and trust me you dont know half as much as you think. Your argument that these observers believe he's doping is no stronger than me saying nothing has been proven on all the tests he has had.

Haye fought a bad fight against Vlad for the entire fight, Cotto fought the same way in the last few rounds again Margarito , Pacquiao, and even an older Shane Mosley. It wasnt the same for the entire fight but he was retreating in the final rounds, that being the case would you agree the Cotto fought "like a scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs." for those final rounds??

[TitoFan]

What was Chavez's weight on the day of the weigh in against andy Lee? was it not the agreed upon weight?

(Got rid of the annoying nesting).

But to clarify.... Cotto and Pac were one pound apart at the weigh-in, and not very far apart in weight on fight night. Chavez and Lee also made the weight for the weigh-in... but observers put Chavez's weight on fight night at over 180 pounds, far larger than Andy Lee. Put another way.... Cotto and Pac looked pretty much the same size on fight night. Chavez was considerably bigger than Lee on fight night.

Oh and one more thing, Cotto is a warrior in the ring and gives it his all...up until the moment he is getting his ass beat, then runs around the ring "like some scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs" See Cotto VS MArgarito I, see Cotto VS Pac, hell he even was running around from Mosley in a fight he won.

Observers say I weigh like 170lbs but in reality I weigh like 200...in other words observers dont know shit so we cannot speculate on that and use it as a fact. However assuming Chavez did weigh that much, well isnt that part of the game? I mean you literally spelled out "THATS WHY THEY HAVE WEIGH-INS" well ill spell one out for you..."THATS WHY THE WEIGH-INS ARE A DAY BEFORE THE FIGHT"

I mean it cant be ok for one and not the other just because you dont like Mexican fighters....just kidding its Mexican fans you cant stand haha

"Observers" is a relative term. The observers that thought Chavez looked like 180 pounds (and of course there's no need for him to get weighed the day of the fight) are more than the casual observers off the street. But whatever. The consensus seems to be that Chavez has an unfair advantage over his opponents by rehydrating so outlandishly after the weigh-in. And then there's the spectre of doping, which Junior has not totally dispelled. There was no such outcry when Cotto fought Pac. Matter of fact, some said Pac looked even slightly bigger than Cotto on fight night. Not that I'm in agreement, but they at least looked the same size.

Ok but you are getting off point.
(You're the one who dragged Chavez into this thread).



You stated that Haye has no right to complain, if he cant take it from the heavyweights because they are that much bigger than he needs to move down, thats why they have weihg-ins right?? As far as doping is concerned well he has not tested positive yet so while you are comfortable already assuming that he id doing another shady thing you cannot use that as a defense because it hasnt been proven.

Ok... you went from Chavez to Haye to Chavez. Let's stay on one topic, ok? So now you're defending Chavez from the doping suspicions although most boxing observers feel there's something shady about the way he's avoided providing piss tests at least twice, am I correct? Well, yes..... nothing's been proven. That's an ironclad defense I guess.



I prefer the boxers who I'm a fan of, to have no suspicious behavior to have to be defending all the time. I don't expect you to understand.

As for Haye... he chooses to fight at HW. Heavyweight is open-ended. You can weigh 400 pounds, if you'd like. If he chooses to fight at HW, then his running from Wlad is disgraceful, and Fenster's defending it is just as disgraceful.

Anything else?

Ya, why do you think your shit dont stink?

Don't get your panties in a bunch, kid. We're just having another disagreement. Trying to keep it civil here, ok?

I understand what you are saying about the boxers you prefer there are alot of boxers that I support that dont have any asteriks in their careers however we are not talking about them. You saying that I switch from Haye - Chavez - Haye is a sorry excuse to avoid the point, see in an argument you use other points of reference to get a point across its not considered jumping off topic if you are still talking about the same thing. Im using your statements to prove a point.

Reread your last paragraph and translate for me, ok? You sound like you wrote angrily, which is why you get slammed by me every chance we discuss something on the forum. I don't what the hell you're talking about.


You talk about these "observers" like they are the truth in all that is boxing, hell you are an observer and trust me you dont know half as much as you think. Your argument that these observers believe he's doping is no stronger than me saying nothing has been proven on all the tests he has had.

In 2009 Chavez Jr was suspended for using a banned substance. His history of suspicious behavior regarding doping is well-documented. If you want to stick your head in the sand like a pouting little boy, ignore the facts all around you, and insult me, as you're prone to do.... go right ahead. You look like an ass doing it, though.

Haye fought a bad fight against Vlad for the entire fight, Cotto fought the same way in the last few rounds again Margarito , Pacquiao, and even an older Shane Mosley. It wasnt the same for the entire fight but he was retreating in the final rounds, that being the case would you agree the Cotto fought "like a scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs." for those final rounds??

If you're comparing the way Haye fought Wlad with the way Cotto fought Margarito, Pac, and Mosley..... you're an even bigger moron than I thought.

You see asswipe..... I try to be civil with you. But ignorance is something I don't tolerate very well.

[Onix]

What was Chavez's weight on the day of the weigh in against andy Lee? was it not the agreed upon weight?

(Got rid of the annoying nesting).

But to clarify.... Cotto and Pac were one pound apart at the weigh-in, and not very far apart in weight on fight night. Chavez and Lee also made the weight for the weigh-in... but observers put Chavez's weight on fight night at over 180 pounds, far larger than Andy Lee. Put another way.... Cotto and Pac looked pretty much the same size on fight night. Chavez was considerably bigger than Lee on fight night.

Oh and one more thing, Cotto is a warrior in the ring and gives it his all...up until the moment he is getting his ass beat, then runs around the ring "like some scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs" See Cotto VS MArgarito I, see Cotto VS Pac, hell he even was running around from Mosley in a fight he won.

Observers say I weigh like 170lbs but in reality I weigh like 200...in other words observers dont know shit so we cannot speculate on that and use it as a fact. However assuming Chavez did weigh that much, well isnt that part of the game? I mean you literally spelled out "THATS WHY THEY HAVE WEIGH-INS" well ill spell one out for you..."THATS WHY THE WEIGH-INS ARE A DAY BEFORE THE FIGHT"

I mean it cant be ok for one and not the other just because you dont like Mexican fighters....just kidding its Mexican fans you cant stand haha

"Observers" is a relative term. The observers that thought Chavez looked like 180 pounds (and of course there's no need for him to get weighed the day of the fight) are more than the casual observers off the street. But whatever. The consensus seems to be that Chavez has an unfair advantage over his opponents by rehydrating so outlandishly after the weigh-in. And then there's the spectre of doping, which Junior has not totally dispelled. There was no such outcry when Cotto fought Pac. Matter of fact, some said Pac looked even slightly bigger than Cotto on fight night. Not that I'm in agreement, but they at least looked the same size.

Ok but you are getting off point.
(You're the one who dragged Chavez into this thread).



You stated that Haye has no right to complain, if he cant take it from the heavyweights because they are that much bigger than he needs to move down, thats why they have weihg-ins right?? As far as doping is concerned well he has not tested positive yet so while you are comfortable already assuming that he id doing another shady thing you cannot use that as a defense because it hasnt been proven.

Ok... you went from Chavez to Haye to Chavez. Let's stay on one topic, ok? So now you're defending Chavez from the doping suspicions although most boxing observers feel there's something shady about the way he's avoided providing piss tests at least twice, am I correct? Well, yes..... nothing's been proven. That's an ironclad defense I guess.



I prefer the boxers who I'm a fan of, to have no suspicious behavior to have to be defending all the time. I don't expect you to understand.

As for Haye... he chooses to fight at HW. Heavyweight is open-ended. You can weigh 400 pounds, if you'd like. If he chooses to fight at HW, then his running from Wlad is disgraceful, and Fenster's defending it is just as disgraceful.

Anything else?

Ya, why do you think your shit dont stink?

Don't get your panties in a bunch, kid. We're just having another disagreement. Trying to keep it civil here, ok?

I understand what you are saying about the boxers you prefer there are alot of boxers that I support that dont have any asteriks in their careers however we are not talking about them. You saying that I switch from Haye - Chavez - Haye is a sorry excuse to avoid the point, see in an argument you use other points of reference to get a point across its not considered jumping off topic if you are still talking about the same thing. Im using your statements to prove a point.

Reread your last paragraph and translate for me, ok? You sound like you wrote angrily, which is why you get slammed by me every chance we discuss something on the forum. I don't what the hell you're talking about.


You talk about these "observers" like they are the truth in all that is boxing, hell you are an observer and trust me you dont know half as much as you think. Your argument that these observers believe he's doping is no stronger than me saying nothing has been proven on all the tests he has had.

In 2009 Chavez Jr was suspended for using a banned substance. His history of suspicious behavior regarding doping is well-documented. If you want to stick your head in the sand like a pouting little boy, ignore the facts all around you, and insult me, as you're prone to do.... go right ahead. You look like an ass doing it, though.

Haye fought a bad fight against Vlad for the entire fight, Cotto fought the same way in the last few rounds again Margarito , Pacquiao, and even an older Shane Mosley. It wasnt the same for the entire fight but he was retreating in the final rounds, that being the case would you agree the Cotto fought "like a scared shitless little girl with his tail stuck between his legs." for those final rounds??

If you're comparing the way Haye fought Wlad with the way Cotto fought Margarito, Pac, and Mosley..... you're an even bigger moron than I thought.

You see asswipe..... I try to be civil with you. But ignorance is something I don't tolerate very well.

F.U. see now I see through you. I honestly had way more respect for you in the beginning because I though you made sense but you just jump around topics and points of view until it fits your purpose, which we all do, however you try to come off like a some boxing elitist and you do throw alot more insults.

What facts are all around?? Only the facts from the observers that you are so fond of. It is not an insult to say that your "facts" are just as meaningful as my "facts" because neither of them are facts they are only opinions.

I am comparing the way Cotto fought in those last rounds against the way Haye fought his fight, I know you think you are funny talking shit but you only show your limited amount of intelligence, especially when you dont answer questions and give us one liners like this gem "If you're comparing the way Haye fought Wlad with the way Cotto fought Margarito, Pac, and Mosley..... you're an even bigger moron than I thought."
What did you prove in that statement? What masterful boxing argument was proven here?

And lastly, just because you dont understand my statements doesnt mean they are off base or that Im mad or whatever. It just means you need to read slower.

[TitoFan]

Onix, here's the way our "conversations" go:

1. You seek out a thread where I'm discussing something with someone, and bring out a totally unrelated subject, usually having to do with a Mexican fighter.

2. You pass yourself off as my "friend", and we begin the discussion.

3. You then morph into a sarcastic, fanatical idiot... and begin insulting me every chance you get.

4. I hand you your ass, and you disappear for awhile... only to resurface later.



Don't you get tired of the same routine?