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Thread: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

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  1. #31
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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Quote Originally Posted by jehoshaphat View Post
    Who do you want Ward to fight and under what conditions?
    He should fight Golovkin at 160 (after all, Dawson had to move down, and he said he'd fight Mayweather at 160), fight Froch at 168 in the UK (since Ward had all his Super Six fights in his home country and all but one in California), or fight Adonis Stevenson in Montreal at 175 (Adonis is the Ring champion at 175).

    But he won't. He'll want Golovkin to move up to 168, and Stevenson to move down to 168. Either fight would need to be in California.

    Conditions should be 1) a neutral referee (not a California Boxing Commission ref like Jack Reiss) for a change 2) random PED testing. But Ward would never fight with a Canadian, UK or mainland European ref, and he'll never agree to random PED testing.

    I'll never respect Ward until he agrees to neutral referees and PED testing - why should anyone respect someone who cheats with head butts and steroids?

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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by jehoshaphat View Post
    Who do you want Ward to fight and under what conditions?
    He should fight Golovkin at 160 (after all, Dawson had to move down, and he said he'd fight Mayweather at 160), fight Froch at 168 in the UK (since Ward had all his Super Six fights in his home country and all but one in California), or fight Adonis Stevenson in Montreal at 175 (Adonis is the Ring champion at 175).

    But he won't. He'll want Golovkin to move up to 168, and Stevenson to move down to 168. Either fight would need to be in California.

    Conditions should be 1) a neutral referee (not a California Boxing Commission ref like Jack Reiss) for a change 2) random PED testing. But Ward would never fight with a Canadian, UK or mainland European ref, and he'll never agree to random PED testing.

    I'll never respect Ward until he agrees to neutral referees and PED testing - why should anyone respect someone who cheats with head butts and steroids?
    I thought you were going to be sensible so I was going to keep this dialogue going but you showed your cards. Do you have proof Ward is on steroids? If not, your agenda is clear and I can no longer take your posts about Ward serious.

  3. #33
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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by jehoshaphat View Post
    Who do you want Ward to fight and under what conditions?
    He should fight Golovkin at 160 (after all, Dawson had to move down, and he said he'd fight Mayweather at 160), fight Froch at 168 in the UK (since Ward had all his Super Six fights in his home country and all but one in California), or fight Adonis Stevenson in Montreal at 175 (Adonis is the Ring champion at 175).

    But he won't. He'll want Golovkin to move up to 168, and Stevenson to move down to 168. Either fight would need to be in California.

    Conditions should be 1) a neutral referee (not a California Boxing Commission ref like Jack Reiss) for a change 2) random PED testing. But Ward would never fight with a Canadian, UK or mainland European ref, and he'll never agree to random PED testing.

    I'll never respect Ward until he agrees to neutral referees and PED testing - why should anyone respect someone who cheats with head butts and steroids?
    Ward last fought at 160 back in 2006. It's moronic for him to try. I'm sure he'll sell out and try and do it for the 10 million plus he would get for fighting Mayweather. But Golovkin ain't Mayweather. He don't bring the payday Floyd does. Not only that Ward knows Mayweather calls the shots in a fight between them. Against Golovkin, Ward would be the one calling the shots. Fighting him at 160 wouldn't even be an option

    He already dominated Froch once already. What would be the point of fighting him again? It would be an even more lopsided fight

    Steve Smoger is a east coast referee. Luis Pabon is a Puerto Rican referee. Those were the referees for Ward last 3 fights (Smoger twice). So I don't know where this he needs a California ref to fight nonsense comes from

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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Quote Originally Posted by IamInuit View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom View Post
    Why will he not?

    And he shouldn't demand light heavyweights drain down to 168. It would be the same as Ward draining down to 160 to fight Golovkin.

    And he shouldn't always demand his own way. When Kessler was the champion, he went to Ward's hometown, and despite it being written into the Super Six contract that referees be from neutral countries, Ward had his home ref Jack Reiss (Sauerland protested to no avail). This is what happened:
    In fairness it was not in negotiations
    Yes it was. Use of a neutral referee was written into the Super Six contract. Here's one of several sources:

    Mikkel Kessler's camp is unhappy with the officials for the Andre Ward bout - ESPN

    Quote Originally Posted by Violent Demise View Post
    Steve Smoger is a east coast referee. Luis Pabon is a Puerto Rican referee. Those were the referees for Ward last 3 fights (Smoger twice). So I don't know where this he needs a California ref to fight nonsense comes from
    Smoger is a US referee used for the Froch fight (there was no PED testing for that fight). We saw how nationalistic Smoger was during Hopkins-Murat recently.

    Smoger was approved by the California Commission for Ward's last fight in Oakland, but for that fight the ref didn't matter because Chad was badly weight-drained anyway.

    California referee Dan Snell helped Ward during his fight with Sakio Bika. Ward was allowed to foul - headbutt and hit off the break - but Snell was on Bika's back for it all night. At one point, Ward hit Bika off the break, and Snell admonished Bika for it!

    Ward had California ref Raul Caiz Sr for his Super Six fight against Allan Green. Ward was permitted to hit while holding throughout the fight, but was too feather-fisted to stop Green.

    Yes, Ward used Luis Pabon for his California fight against Abraham. But Puerto Rico is basically part of the USA isn't it? And Pabon had no objections to Ward using deliberate head butts in that fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by jehoshaphat View Post
    Do you have proof Ward is on steroids?
    No definite proof. But isn't a boxer refusing PED testing several times (for the Kessler, Abraham and Rodriguez fights) is a reason to SUSPECT he's on something? Why won't Ward take the test?

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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Ward gets away with that because he's leveraging the championship against opponents. The minute he loses in the ring, on the scales or due to inactivity, he'll sing a different tune because he's not exciting enough to make demands on his ring performances alone. When Froch and Kessler could fight for a third time and sell out an arena, when ward couldn't sell out a venue outside of his own town despite owning the division... that says all you need to know about the man's draw. (not to mention HBO giving him the klitchsko treatment, along with rigo) I think Ward would be hard pressed to fight Froch (in England) this time. Someone would say he needs Froch for the payday he wants, but he'll say Froch needs to make concessions if he wants a chance at redemption. Just the opinion of a humble American, but fighting Froch in the UK represents risk because British fight fans/ judges don't like stinkers of a fight. Direll already found that out thinking he could stink his way to a victory against Froch on English soil. As for testing, i dont think wards a dirty fighter. When you fight the style he fights, you dont need drugs to win fights. However i wouldn't be surprised to find out he's afraid of his shoulder related therapy, marring his reputation by turning up a dirty test and being stripped (see "title leverage" above). It could happen. Ask Berto and James toney. All in all if Ward was this generations roy jones, mike tyson, de la hoya... he could demand what he wanted and noone would say anything, but he's not. He's got the personality of a sack of grain and the fighting style of a octopus. (hes all arms and head) and that has people calling for him to continuously prove his mettle with a spectacular feat which he doesn't feel should be demanded of him. When people stop watching, he'll either step it up or look for some other way to get paid for what he does (endorsements). just my opinion, I could be wrong.
    They want your @$$ beat because upsets make news. News brings about excitement, excitement brings about ratings. The objective is to bring you up to the tower and tear your @$$ down. And if you don't believe that, you're crazy.

    Roy Jones, Jr. "What I've Learned," Esquire 2003

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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    freedom is probably the best poster on this message board

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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Quote Originally Posted by J_Undisputed View Post
    Ward gets away with that because he's leveraging the championship against opponents. The minute he loses in the ring, on the scales or due to inactivity, he'll sing a different tune because he's not exciting enough to make demands on his ring performances alone. When Froch and Kessler could fight for a third time and sell out an arena, when ward couldn't sell out a venue outside of his own town despite owning the division... that says all you need to know about the man's draw. (not to mention HBO giving him the klitchsko treatment, along with rigo) I think Ward would be hard pressed to fight Froch (in England) this time. Someone would say he needs Froch for the payday he wants, but he'll say Froch needs to make concessions if he wants a chance at redemption. Just the opinion of a humble American, but fighting Froch in the UK represents risk because British fight fans/ judges don't like stinkers of a fight. Direll already found that out thinking he could stink his way to a victory against Froch on English soil. As for testing, i dont think wards a dirty fighter. When you fight the style he fights, you dont need drugs to win fights. However i wouldn't be surprised to find out he's afraid of his shoulder related therapy, marring his reputation by turning up a dirty test and being stripped (see "title leverage" above). It could happen. Ask Berto and James toney. All in all if Ward was this generations roy jones, mike tyson, de la hoya... he could demand what he wanted and noone would say anything, but he's not. He's got the personality of a sack of grain and the fighting style of a octopus. (hes all arms and head) and that has people calling for him to continuously prove his mettle with a spectacular feat which he doesn't feel should be demanded of him. When people stop watching, he'll either step it up or look for some other way to get paid for what he does (endorsements). just my opinion, I could be wrong.
    I find irony in the fact that @Freedom likes this post and is a big fan of Wladimir Klitschko.

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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Quote Originally Posted by ninjaspy3 View Post
    I find irony in the fact that @Freedom likes this post and is a big fan of Wladimir Klitschko.
    Differences:

    1) Wlad has never refused to take PED test (for example, he agreed to WADA testing for Povetkin in 2010)
    2) Wlad doesn't deliberately headbutt
    3) Wlad isn't feather-fisted, he has had a lot of brutal KOs
    4) Wlad has had only one fight in his hometown of Kiev
    5) Wlad is a big draw, his fights have filled stadiums. His last fight was watched by many millions of people (Poland, Germany, Ukraine, Russia, etc).
    6) Wlad isn't afraid to cross the ocean - he was hoping Mitchell turned out better, and Jennings/Wilder/Arreola do well, because he WANTS to fight in the USA again
    7) Wlad doesn't deliberately hit off the break
    8) Wlad isn't arrogant and doesn't call himself the "Son of God"
    9) Wlad wouldn't insist an opponent be weight-drained (if he fought Valuev, he wouldn't insist the fight be at 250 )

    Similarity:

    1) Both hold too much. Wlad never used to, but his last fight against Povetkin he was as bad as Ward for clinching

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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by IamInuit View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom View Post
    Why will he not?

    And he shouldn't demand light heavyweights drain down to 168. It would be the same as Ward draining down to 160 to fight Golovkin.

    And he shouldn't always demand his own way. When Kessler was the champion, he went to Ward's hometown, and despite it being written into the Super Six contract that referees be from neutral countries, Ward had his home ref Jack Reiss (Sauerland protested to no avail). This is what happened:
    In fairness it was not in negotiations
    Yes it was. Use of a neutral referee was written into the Super Six contract. Here's one of several sources:
    I was referring to the drug testing not the fact that he got his way through the S-6. Anyone who thinks he didn't have his way is an idiot but you cant blame Ward for that.

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    Default

    I like ward.
    But if its true that hes avoiding ped testing then thats not a good look.
    Both he and his opponent gets tested for drugs, why shouldnt he agree to that. Must be more to this.

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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Freedom has such a blatant double standard, it's ridiculous. Ward's headbutting isn't NEARLY as bad as Wlad clinching, elbowing, and throwing Povetkin to the ground.

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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Jack Reiss from Valencia, California will be the third man in the ring on Saturday in Ontario, California for Andre Ward vs. Edwin Rodríguez (24-0, 16 KOs).

    The three judges are Max Deluca from Tustin, California; Jerry Cantu from Westminster, California; and Steve Morrow, from Hollister, California.

    Prediction: lots of deliberate fouling by Andre Ward which will be permitted by the shady Jack Reiss, the same ref who worked the Kessler-Ward fight.

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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom View Post
    Jack Reiss from Valencia, California will be the third man in the ring on Saturday in Ontario, California for Andre Ward vs. Edwin Rodríguez (24-0, 16 KOs).

    The three judges are Max Deluca from Tustin, California; Jerry Cantu from Westminster, California; and Steve Morrow, from Hollister, California.

    Prediction: lots of deliberate fouling by Andre Ward which will be permitted by the shady Jack Reiss, the same ref who worked the Kessler-Ward fight.
    Kessler's skank of a sister could of reffed the fight. He still wasn't winning it

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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward


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    Default Re: Requirements for a fight with Andre Ward

    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom View Post
    Jack Reiss from Valencia, California will be the third man in the ring on Saturday in Ontario, California for Andre Ward vs. Edwin Rodríguez (24-0, 16 KOs).

    The three judges are Max Deluca from Tustin, California; Jerry Cantu from Westminster, California; and Steve Morrow, from Hollister, California.

    Prediction: lots of deliberate fouling by Andre Ward which will be permitted by the shady Jack Reiss, the same ref who worked the Kessler-Ward fight.
    if you think that ward fouls a lot then most fighters foul a lot which makes it fair. just like any sport, everybody rides the line on how far you can go before its called a foul. ward is nowhere near people like holyfield or bradley who love to headbutt you.

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