Corbyn attacker get 28 days in prison, Robinson attacked and police do nothing.

[Master]

The 2 women allegedly “assaulted” were Tommy Robinson supporters so are not going to be independent and wholly reliable victims and witnesses.

If Robinson really believes he is being unjustly treated and his human rights are being threatened then he should write a strongly worded letter of complaint to the authorities.

The reality is the Police do not want to be wasting their time marshalling these events and if they had to arrest everyone that made a claim that they were assaulted the stations would be full. The Police did the right thing and ignored the claims and counter claims. The 2 sides should grow up and behave themselves.

Perpetuating the myth that a Muslim would be treated differently, not wanting an Islamic state, and Tommy not having human rights shows the brain washed agenda people have on here and playing the victim.

Tommy is a self-publicist who is making a lot of money and gaining a lot of power out of dividing people and perpetuating hate. Fortunately most sensible and normal people can see him for what he really is. If people want him let’s see how well he does in his new political career. He will be leeching on the Euro pension and gravy train like the rest of them.

[Gandalf]

See video with nice girl above Master. Don't be fooled by the lies and smears. He is doing it because he has no other options. Totally shut down without good reason. Where is this Facebook beheading allegation? Nowhere to be seen. Let the man speak and judge him accordingly.

If you allow censorship, you lose everything.

[Dark Lord Al]

I think everyone should work harder so we can give all our money out to migrants and the unemployed .

[Beanz]

Beanz yet again proving what a jumped up sad obnoxious arrogant little prick he is ������

By not agreeing with you? If the only way you can win an argument is to hand out a permanent ban just because people refuse to join in with your childish bullying then you are the one on shaky ground. How feeble is not being able to make an argument without having your mates backing you up?

Are you seriously pretending if someone surrounded by his muslim mates got into your face like Tommy did you would just stand there and take it. Of course you wouldn't. You need to learn how to handle people not agreeing with you if you want to offer your services as a Moderator instead of resorting to getting personal like you habitually do.

[smashup]

Beanz yet again proving what a jumped up sad obnoxious arrogant little prick he is ������

By not agreeing with you? If the only way you can win an argument is to hand out a permanent ban just because people refuse to join in with your childish bullying then you are the one on shaky ground. How feeble is not being able to make an argument without having your mates backing you up?

Are you seriously pretending if someone surrounded by his muslim mates got into your face like Tommy did you would just stand there and take it. Of course you wouldn't. You need to learn how to handle people not agreeing with you if you want to offer your services as a Moderator instead of resorting to getting personal like you habitually do.

Lie after lie to suit your pathetic agenda 😂
That young Muslim guy purposely goaded multiple times then assualted 2 women, when challenged he clearly threw a drink over him.
Only did Robinson react.
The footage clearly shows this so stop making up stories and chatting absolute bullshit yet again.
Your pathetic and clearly have mental issues 👍

[Beanz]

Beanz yet again proving what a jumped up sad obnoxious arrogant little prick he is ������

By not agreeing with you? If the only way you can win an argument is to hand out a permanent ban just because people refuse to join in with your childish bullying then you are the one on shaky ground. How feeble is not being able to make an argument without having your mates backing you up?

Are you seriously pretending if someone surrounded by his muslim mates got into your face like Tommy did you would just stand there and take it. Of course you wouldn't. You need to learn how to handle people not agreeing with you if you want to offer your services as a Moderator instead of resorting to getting personal like you habitually do.

Lie after lie to suit your pathetic agenda ������
That young Muslim guy purposely goaded multiple times then assualted 2 women, when challenged he clearly threw a drink over him.
Only did Robinson react.
The footage clearly shows this so stop making up stories and chatting absolute bullshit yet again.
Your pathetic and clearly have mental issues ������

Again with this demonize the poster rather than deal with the argument bullshit. You don't even speak English mate 'chatting absolute bullshit' ?

What are you 19?

Again you refuse to answer anything because it's one rule for you and another one for muslims, or lefties or whoever doesn't suck up to you. You would never take that crap form Tommy or anyone else, and bumping into people is not assault, neither for that matter is throwing milkshake the same as punching someone as your mates hold him there for you. That is just fucking lame.

[El Kabong]

A different debate, Al. However, I agree completely. Nobody is forcing anyone to take on things they cannot afford. However, it would be nicer for the working classes if immigration was halted. It destroys the chances of the poor to compete and drains the countries the migrants come from. Beyond the EU and it is just a complete welfare drain. It is immoral.

From my perspective of what illegal immigration (and easing of immigration laws) has done for/to America and the American working class. Folks coming from places where they make pennies on the dollar compared to American workers will come to America, get a massive pay rise (which is oftentimes lower than minimum wage) and thereby depress the wages of the working class. They also overload the supply of working class bodies needed for working class jobs thereby further diminishing the wages paid to these working class folks by the very simple law of supply and demand.


Also if you're Mexico or Honduras or Nicaragua or Panama and you're able to either offload pure criminals, ne'er-do-wells, or actual solid workers (who will funnel money back to their family in Panama thereby boosting how much they can spend in Panama or whatever) then you're benefiting your own nation and harming America.


The ONLY people who benefit from massive immigration and open borders are the super wealthy in nations immigrants come from and where they go to. Poor nations will remain poor, wealthy nations will be made poor, and soon those wealthy nations will have the very same gorgeous gated communities with security sat right next to the worst slums, barrios, and favelas imaginable.


Look at California right now it's already happening. And I imagine the same will eventually be true in the UK if not already.

[Beanz]

A different debate, Al. However, I agree completely. Nobody is forcing anyone to take on things they cannot afford. However, it would be nicer for the working classes if immigration was halted. It destroys the chances of the poor to compete and drains the countries the migrants come from. Beyond the EU and it is just a complete welfare drain. It is immoral.

From my perspective of what illegal immigration (and easing of immigration laws) has done for/to America and the American working class. Folks coming from places where they make pennies on the dollar compared to American workers will come to America, get a massive pay rise (which is oftentimes lower than minimum wage) and thereby depress the wages of the working class. They also overload the supply of working class bodies needed for working class jobs thereby further diminishing the wages paid to these working class folks by the very simple law of supply and demand.


Also if you're Mexico or Honduras or Nicaragua or Panama and you're able to either offload pure criminals, ne'er-do-wells, or actual solid workers (who will funnel money back to their family in Panama thereby boosting how much they can spend in Panama or whatever) then you're benefiting your own nation and harming America.


The ONLY people who benefit from massive immigration and open borders are the super wealthy in nations immigrants come from and where they go to. Poor nations will remain poor, wealthy nations will be made poor, and soon those wealthy nations will have the very same gorgeous gated communities with security sat right next to the worst slums, barrios, and favelas imaginable.


Look at California right now it's already happening. And I imagine the same will eventually be true int he UK if not already.

The predictable anti-immigration argument this has descended into is a clear example of the scapegoating that has come to replace facing any real search for truth or answers. It is a false argument that is not truer for being repeated again and again. immigration not only creates jobs and wealth it is what has made Britain Great. Anyone who argue oterwise knows very little about the history they pretend to value.

Immigrants, the disabled, the unemployed are all rolled out as excuses for spending cuts and the church of austerity. Look at the heart of this tread and what is alleged. It could just as easily be Titled -


White English Bloke gets 28 days in Prison, Foreign Muslim scum gets let off by the PC babies in power



The resentment is not just palpable it is blatant. People want an easy life and they think difficult questions, even competition for work is unfair whilst telling us what good little capitalist slaves they are. You could not make it up. So bitter are they that anyone suggesting that a bloke who has been in and out of prison going around the country starting fights and demonizing Muslims might be a bigot that they have to resort to calling people mentally ill or having Daddy issues or being an arrogant prick.

The anti immigration thing is a very handy fake news distraction from the real issues and the divisiveness and encouragement toward violence is very clear whenever Tommy is mentioned. It is not coincidence it is exactly what he wants because hilariously he can't be bothered to get a proper job.

[El Kabong]

The predictable anti-immigration argument this has descended into is a clear example of the scapegoating that has come to replace facing any real search for truth or answers. It is a false argument that is not truer for being repeated again and again. immigration not only creates jobs and wealth it is what has made Britain Great. Anyone who argue oterwise knows very little about the history they pretend to value.

Immigrants, the disabled, the unemployed are all rolled out as excuses for spending cuts and the church of austerity. Look at the heart of this tread and what is alleged. It could just as easily be Titled -


White English Bloke gets 28 days in Prison, Foreign Muslim scum gets let off by the PC babies in power



The resentment is not just palpable it is blatant. People want an easy life and they think difficult questions, even competition for work is unfair whilst telling us what good little capitalist slaves they are. You could not make it up. So bitter are they that anyone suggesting that a bloke who has been in and out of prison going around the country starting fights and demonizing Muslims might be a bigot that they have to resort to calling people mentally ill or having Daddy issues or being an arrogant prick.

The anti immigration thing is a very handy fake news distraction from the real issues and the divisiveness and encouragement toward violence is very clear whenever Tommy is mentioned. It is not coincidence it is exactly what he wants because hilariously he can't be bothered to get a proper job.

Well I'm very much against ILLEGAL immigration, but if you'd like to stretch that to immigration as a whole fine, paint me with that brush as well. As long as America has homeless citizens let alone 1 single solitary homeless veteran, then yeah I'll be happy to stand by "Fuck all immigrants" 100%. I always state that America already has certain issues which we need to fix before we should attempt to fix the world's problems. We don't need to import more killers or rapists or welfare leeches. That's obviously not to say that 100% of ALL immigrants are those things, but I AM saying we don't need any more of those, we're full we've got enough. We'll take the best doctors, we'll take the best scientists, we'll take the best engineers, but let the blue collars catch up a bit, let the average worker see a pay rise, let the average person boost their income before we start trying to save every single NON American the world can throw at us. What of assimilation? What makes Americans or Brits American or British? What binds their people together as citizens of America or England/UK?

I'm sorry you are put off by my caring about my fellow countrymen, I would have assumed you'd care more about your neighbor than some person from way far away. Are there BAD American and British citizens? Yes as sure as there are BAD immigrants! To not admit that is to deny reality.

Diversity for the sake of diversity is not a strength and if it is, please show your work on that. I liked when Americans loved their country and didn't think it brave or admirable to burn the flag or wish death to the President or chant "No USA at all"....which they're certainly free to do but when they act on such a thing the consequences should be swift and severe. America has diversity we don't need to import more, the UK has diversity perhaps so much that one can no longer tell the UK is the UK and not Riyadh unless you take the weather into account.

Well the last time Tommy was in prison A#1 he was railroaded by your court system and is likely to be railroaded again...what better way to FOSTER resentment than by having the government treat a citizen in such a manner while at the very same time that very same government has ALLOWED (and some participated) from 20-30 years of grooming gangs!!! Resentment is an issue? take it up with your government as they're the origin of it! And #2 Last time Tommy was in jail he lost 40 pounds of weight because he ate 1 tin of tuna a day as he figured the other inmates who made his food (guess who, since he was PURPOSELY moved to a prison with a high population of ______) may have poisoned/tampered with it. But I suppose "he asked for it" will be the response, it's as if he was a young girl in Rotherham....they asked for it too don't you know.

I know of NOBODY who says "Tommy Robinson is the perfect man" that isn't even on my radar in the discussion about immigration.

Capitalism works, that simply cannot be denied! This bastardization of Capitalism called Corporatism is a totalitarian version of it in which the Corporation now makes the laws and governs the people....and I don't like that I think it's just as bad as Communism and this Immigration push, Globalization push, it'll help the powers that be (the Political and Economic) take your rights away and if you don't see that coming then I don't know what to tell you.

[Dark Lord Al]

A different debate, Al. However, I agree completely. Nobody is forcing anyone to take on things they cannot afford. However, it would be nicer for the working classes if immigration was halted. It destroys the chances of the poor to compete and drains the countries the migrants come from. Beyond the EU and it is just a complete welfare drain. It is immoral.

From my perspective of what illegal immigration (and easing of immigration laws) has done for/to America and the American working class. Folks coming from places where they make pennies on the dollar compared to American workers will come to America, get a massive pay rise (which is oftentimes lower than minimum wage) and thereby depress the wages of the working class. They also overload the supply of working class bodies needed for working class jobs thereby further diminishing the wages paid to these working class folks by the very simple law of supply and demand.


Also if you're Mexico or Honduras or Nicaragua or Panama and you're able to either offload pure criminals, ne'er-do-wells, or actual solid workers (who will funnel money back to their family in Panama thereby boosting how much they can spend in Panama or whatever) then you're benefiting your own nation and harming America.


The ONLY people who benefit from massive immigration and open borders are the super wealthy in nations immigrants come from and where they go to. Poor nations will remain poor, wealthy nations will be made poor, and soon those wealthy nations will have the very same gorgeous gated communities with security sat right next to the worst slums, barrios, and favelas imaginable.


Look at California right now it's already happening. And I imagine the same will eventually be true int he UK if not already.

The predictable anti-immigration argument this has descended into is a clear example of the scapegoating that has come to replace facing any real search for truth or answers. It is a false argument that is not truer for being repeated again and again. immigration not only creates jobs and wealth it is what has made Britain Great. Anyone who argue oterwise knows very little about the history they pretend to value.

Immigrants, the disabled, the unemployed are all rolled out as excuses for spending cuts and the church of austerity. Look at the heart of this tread and what is alleged. It could just as easily be Titled -


White English Bloke gets 28 days in Prison, Foreign Muslim scum gets let off by the PC babies in power



The resentment is not just palpable it is blatant. People want an easy life and they think difficult questions, even competition for work is unfair whilst telling us what good little capitalist slaves they are. You could not make it up. So bitter are they that anyone suggesting that a bloke who has been in and out of prison going around the country starting fights and demonizing Muslims might be a bigot that they have to resort to calling people mentally ill or having Daddy issues or being an arrogant prick.

The anti immigration thing is a very handy fake news distraction from the real issues and the divisiveness and encouragement toward violence is very clear whenever Tommy is mentioned. It is not coincidence it is exactly what he wants because hilariously he can't be bothered to get a proper job.

The white English bloke attacked Corbyn a white male , so no race issue there.
Asian guy attacks white male Robinson , so was it a race issue ? did the police take it as a hate crime ?
Did they fuck , I personally wouldn't have charge either person , but I'm sick of the pc brigade treading on eggshells when it comes to the muslim and ethnic groups.
Lets just have one rule for all with same punishment.

[Beanz]

The predictable anti-immigration argument this has descended into is a clear example of the scapegoating that has come to replace facing any real search for truth or answers. It is a false argument that is not truer for being repeated again and again. immigration not only creates jobs and wealth it is what has made Britain Great. Anyone who argue oterwise knows very little about the history they pretend to value.

Immigrants, the disabled, the unemployed are all rolled out as excuses for spending cuts and the church of austerity. Look at the heart of this tread and what is alleged. It could just as easily be Titled -


White English Bloke gets 28 days in Prison, Foreign Muslim scum gets let off by the PC babies in power



The resentment is not just palpable it is blatant. People want an easy life and they think difficult questions, even competition for work is unfair whilst telling us what good little capitalist slaves they are. You could not make it up. So bitter are they that anyone suggesting that a bloke who has been in and out of prison going around the country starting fights and demonizing Muslims might be a bigot that they have to resort to calling people mentally ill or having Daddy issues or being an arrogant prick.

The anti immigration thing is a very handy fake news distraction from the real issues and the divisiveness and encouragement toward violence is very clear whenever Tommy is mentioned. It is not coincidence it is exactly what he wants because hilariously he can't be bothered to get a proper job.

Well I'm very much against ILLEGAL immigration, but if you'd like to stretch that to immigration as a whole fine, paint me with that brush as well. As long as America has homeless citizens let alone 1 single solitary homeless veteran, then yeah I'll be happy to stand by "Fuck all immigrants" 100%. I always state that America already has certain issues which we need to fix before we should attempt to fix the world's problems. We don't need to import more killers or rapists or welfare leeches. That's obviously not to say that 100% of ALL immigrants are those things, but I AM saying we don't need any more of those, we're full we've got enough. We'll take the best doctors, we'll take the best scientists, we'll take the best engineers, but let the blue collars catch up a bit, let the average worker see a pay rise, let the average person boost their income before we start trying to save every single NON American the world can throw at us. What of assimilation? What makes Americans or Brits American or British? What binds their people together as citizens of America or England/UK?

I'm sorry you are put off by my caring about my fellow countrymen, I would have assumed you'd care more about your neighbor than some person from way far away. Are there BAD American and British citizens? Yes as sure as there are BAD immigrants! To not admit that is to deny reality.

Diversity for the sake of diversity is not a strength and if it is, please show your work on that. I liked when Americans loved their country and didn't think it brave or admirable to burn the flag or wish death to the President or chant "No USA at all"....which they're certainly free to do but when they act on such a thing the consequences should be swift and severe. America has diversity we don't need to import more, the UK has diversity perhaps so much that one can no longer tell the UK is the UK and not Riyadh unless you take the weather into account.

Well the last time Tommy was in prison A#1 he was railroaded by your court system and is likely to be railroaded again...what better way to FOSTER resentment than by having the government treat a citizen in such a manner while at the very same time that very same government has ALLOWED (and some participated) from 20-30 years of grooming gangs!!! Resentment is an issue? take it up with your government as they're the origin of it! And #2 Last time Tommy was in jail he lost 40 pounds of weight because he ate 1 tin of tuna a day as he figured the other inmates who made his food (guess who, since he was PURPOSELY moved to a prison with a high population of ______) may have poisoned/tampered with it. But I suppose "he asked for it" will be the response, it's as if he was a young girl in Rotherham....they asked for it too don't you know.

I know of NOBODY who says "Tommy Robinson is the perfect man" that isn't even on my radar in the discussion about immigration.

Capitalism works, that simply cannot be denied! This bastardization of Capitalism called Corporatism is a totalitarian version of it in which the Corporation now makes the laws and governs the people....and I don't like that I think it's just as bad as Communism and this Immigration push, Globalization push, it'll help the powers that be (the Political and Economic) take your rights away and if you don't see that coming then I don't know what to tell you.

Miles whom you quoted never makes the distinction between legal and illegal immigration. It is all bad to him and if the guy is victim of western bombing with no legs, it is all the more hilarious for him to scapegoat. So you see I am not painting anyone with a brush at all. If the first thing you type when talking about immigrants is 'Killers, rapists and welfare leeches' though, one would have to assume you are no more immune to Fake News than those you claim to be so different from. Don't forget i never started this thread I am in no way obligated to fall over myself to reinforce this ridiculous idea you have been sold of Tommy as a freedom fighter he is the complete opposite.

Of course I do not care more about my neighbour than someone form far away. That is literally the opposite of Christianity. Anyone can look after their own that is why Jesus talked explicitly about not crossing the road because the person in need was not like you. It is why the hollow excuse of protecting what makes the British Brits or Americans American or Even protecting the values of a Judeo/Christian nation are just excuses for bigotry. Most people don't even begin to understand let alone value, cherish and preserve that they pretend to give a shit about. It's about looking after number one just like Tommy.

Can you not see how daft you telling a British person in Britain when you have never even visited here that 'you can not tell the UK is the UK anymore' is? Not just daft but arrogant. You can buy into the rubbish weirdos like Gnarl of Tarragon and little Tommy like to spin or you can ask people who actually have no axe to grind and live here. It's not about Tommy being the perfect man it's about him showing no respect for the rule of law you keep telling us is paramount. He came to your country with a false passport and you choose to ignore that and then expect people to believe it's about illegal immigration. He risked collapsing a series of linked trials in which the perps were given 200 years and still you want to portray him as the victim? Come on man, move on and learn something. Tommy is an opportunist.

And capitalism absolutely does not work, like every other system it has a shelf life . You are correct in that the bastardization of it that is corporatism is a totalitarian version of it, but it was always it's logical conclusion. People will have to learn to co-operate and share responsibilities, there is no going back. We can't pretend that the world is not what it is and go back to the feudal idea of borders and boundaries that put the majority of land and resources into the hand of a privileged few. Peoples heads were cutt off and the blood filled the streets to get the capitalism that for many has become a secular version of religion. Look at the fervour and superiority that Al and Miles display when they talk about religion as some primitive thing that idiots believe as though they can exist without the natural world that inspired those beliefs. It is a replacement with pilgrimages to Michelin restaurants for one and the elevation of pompous arses like Morrisey,Wilde and Burroughs into Gods for the other.

Don't forget Tommy never exposed one pedo, never helped convict one (quite the opposite) and cannot even bring himself to follow the laws of the country that he does no favours in lying about to the rest of the world. People are quite correct about there being an agenda but it is Robinson and his crowd that are pushing it. The exact same agenda Murdoch and all the other corporate foreign owners of the British and American MSM are pushing and have been for years.

Don't look at us blame your brothers.

[Beanz]

This is a German U boat prisoner being brought ashore in the city I call home in 1943. Look how his hair is brushed and he is treated with respect despite being an enemy combatant. We do not even have that respect for fellow British citizens now in 2019. My Grandfather lived with what was called shellshock for the rest of his life after coming to fight for this country and to fight for the Jews being slaughtered in Europe. My mothers father fought too and his family go back for hundreds of years in the westcountry. Neither of them were Anglo Saxons and 95% of Brits are not and never were. You have been sold a lot of bullshit in order to pretend that this country is something it never was and Robinson is not part of that proud tradition he is part of a tradition that even housewives stood up against in Cable street in 1936.

You can consider me to be what you like but don't pretend that supporting Robinson has anything whatsoever to do with being proud to be English. The guy is even ashamed to be named after a Beatle for fucks sake.

[El Kabong]

According to the United Nations Department of Economic and Social Affairs (so take it for what it's worth) report titled 'Trends in International Migrant Stock: The 2015 Revision' The United States has a foreign born population of 46,627,102 which is 14.3% of our total population now just think what that means if that almost 47 million doesn't include the ILLEGAL immigrant population in the United States which is anywhere from 11 million to 40 million. If you couple that with this insane idea that assimilation is bad then GIANT problems will arise and we're seeing that. From 1924 to 1965 legal immigration to America was damn near fully stopped and oddly enough the big American economic boom happened inside that window and wage stagnation began shortly thereafter....are the two perhaps linked? Just a question worth pondering.

When I make mention of "killers, rapists, and welfare leeches" I'm saying a couple things #1 America already has those in large enough numbers and #2 There's 0 denying that the per capita crime of illegal immigrants far exceeds that of the average American. There ARE killers and rapists and bums coming to America legally and illegally in great numbers. As a US citizen Nancy Pelosi has told me and everyone else that MS13 GANG MEMBERS have "A spark of the divine"....that's who the elite want to run cover for over our veterans over our citizens whom we have a social safety net for?!?!?

Of course I do not care more about my neighbour than someone form far away. That is literally the opposite of Christianity. Anyone can look after their own that is why Jesus talked explicitly about not crossing the road because the person in need was not like you.

I understand the sentiment completely, but we have a social safety net for our citizens. That net disappears by inviting people in who take but do not give. You cannot serve from an empty vessel. When the Titanic sank there weren't enough lifeboats to save 100% of the passengers, should those passengers all been allowed onto lifeboats overloading and capsizing them thereby dooming 100% of the passengers? This is what is happening right now, and yes our culture is a special one and deserves preserving for future generations and that's not going to happen without assimilation.

Also am I not being thoughtful? There was a 3 year old used like a disposable commodity for some jackass to cross the border and the child was left alone in the middle of a desert when the "immigrants" made it across without being caught. I'm sorry I think such a heinous act should be punishable by death. People die trying to get here and they get here and what is it they bring? Diseases from the 19th century? They ruin our schools and hospitals! Is it wrong to think that perhaps their nations should care for THEIR citizens? We send aid in the BILLIONS to nations where these migrant caravans start and I'm sorry it's one or the other not both either the aid stops or the people stop, I'd rather have both stop to be honest and it's not because I'm hateful or want ill feelings. I want to teach them how to fish instead of give them fish.


Capitalism is trading via free will. You have the right of refusal of service, you WILLINGLY enter into deals on your own...what's better than that? Certainly not communism! And nowhere in Capitalist America is it said that communities may not practice Socialism. If that is your choice as a community you're certainly free to make that choice and operate in such a manner. In Socialist nations Capitalism is verboten.

Now as for your family history, you've every right to be proud of that. I wouldn't want to shame anything about it, it should be celebrated....in America we're taking down murals of George Washington now apparently. We're removing statues of causes my ancestors fought for the Revolution and poorly named Civil War. Why? Oh it's to make people of other backgrounds FEEL better. Well I for one wouldn't move to another nation and then demand statues be taken down, but hey that's just me and my ancestors fought to build this nation so I take great issue with erasing their legacy as it is one that deserves to persevere regardless of "FEELINGS"...is no part of true British history worth preserving? Should no legacy remain of Shakespeare of Darwin of Drake of Raleigh of Cornwallis of of Rhodes of Churchill?

Slavery, racism, colonialism...they were ills of an era. Should we all feel shame and sorrow and overturn the victory in WW2 because nuclear bombs were used? Life is bloody and ugly and unfair and the victors write the history. Is our history to be handed over to the aggrieved to write? To what end?

[Gandalf]

There are so many distortions here that I do not even know where to begin. When it comes to migration, I am against illegal immigration AND excessive migration. I do not think a country the size of the UK has a need for any more than a small stream of temporary labor to be hired on a yearly renewable visa. Currently 300,000 a year flood in legally. Now, I have nothing against them personally and even Legless Alan might be a nice person to joke around with, but I do not think illegal immigration should be rewarded at all.

The idea that legal migration is a boost to the economy is propaganda. I gave the numbers a page or two back and have them here in my book. The cost is tremendous. Then there is the cost of translation services, the health care system, the prison system, and of course the welfare system. It serves no greater good to encourage this. Lyle is right in that it depresses wages for those working and for those not working it raises the welfare bill by tens of billions of pounds.

There is no common sense to it. I won't
respond to Beanz posts in detail here as he seems to be running on emotion going by the things he is saying and I have no interest in a discussion like that. If those are the 'rules of debate' then they are not for me. If I see someone being racist then I will point it out. But I will also point out facts like Indians performing very well in the UK but it being illegal for foreigners to buy property in India. I will point out that foreigners have similar problems in other countries like Vietnam and Thailand too. The world does not operate like we do. Are they all racist for having limits? Or are they sensibly controlling their countries in the interests of their own population?

You can claim to care just as much about the guy from far away as the person close. However, in the real world it is not so simple. I challenge you to go around the world Beanz and find yourself treated in that way. You will always be an outsider because the system is not designed to give you the same rights and protection as a citizen. I don't think you really understand the world at large so well.

You are totally at odds with the view of ordinary people and this is why it is making people upset. It has been 20 years of non stop migration in the millions and you lie when you say this is historically normal. It isn't. Show me when in UK history 8 million people moved in regardless of culture and settled in a 20 year span. It has never happened.

[Gandalf]

I listed only 3 countries there, but I can list dozens more if asked. It is something I have of course looked into a fair bit.