Pre Prison vs Post Prison Mike Tyson

[imp]

How was it possible that post Prison Mike Tyson was so capable of continuing his career after 3 long years and that kind of lifestyle outside of the ring to win titles again...how talented was this guy?!

He was smaller than everyone else but his head movement, delivery and power was on point.

Tell me how you feel about Tyson in and out of his prime and if this made him much more of a legend by dealing with such a long lay off and fighting out of his prime with continued success.

Don’t listen to Teddy..he’s just bitter.

[El Kabong]

Tyson was incredible in the ring and out of it and every so often you'll get to see an athlete like that and be in total awe of them...Ali vs Cleveland Williams, Usain Bolt, Mike Trout, Bo Jackson, Wayne Gretzky, Mario Lemieux, Michael Jordan.


Mike Tyson was an incredible specimen he had his own style (fighting & look in the ring the high black trunks, the boots with no socks just in there to do business no flashy flash), he was barebones brutal, he was knowledgeable about the history of the sport.

Because of his ties to Cus, because of his minimalism of flash(in the ring) and his excess outside of it Mike Tyson seemed to be one of those archetypal boxing greats who would be at home in any era. You could put his fights in black & white and imagine Jack Dempsey or Jack Johnson or Rocky Marciano and he'd fit in. He was almost a caricature of a boxer like Mr. T as Clubber Lang. He was ruthless in the ring and an enigma outside of it.


In his prime Tyson was high energy turning offense into defense with pure pressure, lightning fast hands, and ungodly power...was he unbeatable? No, but he fought like he was.

In his years after Douglas beat him he was like a wounded lion, he could fold up and go home if the going got too tough or he could lash out or even foul out. Tyson fought with ANGER in his post prime you could see it....in his prime he wasn't angry he was focused like a laser in his post prime he was filled with hate it seemed. Maybe that was due to his pushing away or losing everyone he ever loved or maybe prison or maybe who knows but yeah he fought with a real visceral anger later in his career which I think caused him to lose focus more and I think it probably hurt his training a lot as well.

[Master]

Pre Prison Tyson was still a force, a diminishing fighter, but still dangerous even after losing to Buster, poor trainers, King taking over and failing marriage.

Post Prison Tyson was a shell with no real substance. He was muscle bound to hide his lack of boxing skills, carefully maneouvered to the title by King/corrupt WBC and surrounded by ass kissers. This Tyson was exposed by the first real fighter he faced which should have been Lennox.

[El Kabong]

Tyson was supposed to fight Ruddock before the Douglas fight but "fell ill" before that fight happened....let's say Tyson-Ruddock happens instead of Douglas....does that fight alter history as we know it? Does Ruddock become champ or does Tyson go to prison undefeated? Does Tyson-Holyfield then happen BEFORE Tyson goes to prison? Does THAT result change?

It's very interesting to think about.

[Master]

Tyson was supposed to fight Ruddock before the Douglas fight but "fell ill" before that fight happened....let's say Tyson-Ruddock happens instead of Douglas....does that fight alter history as we know it? Does Ruddock become champ or does Tyson go to prison undefeated? Does Tyson-Holyfield then happen BEFORE Tyson goes to prison? Does THAT result change?

It's very interesting to think about.

King accepted Douglas because he was cheaper than Ruddock. The Tyson that fought Douglas would probably have lost against Razzor but it is a different style.

Tyson was regressing and the prison time helped him continue his career longer than it should have.

Tyson would have lost to Holyfield, Bowe and Lennox in the 1990's as he was not the force he was when he was at his best 1986-1988.

[Ron Swanson]

Tyson’s opponents in that 86-88 timeframe

David Jaco 19-5
Mike Jameson 14-9
Jesse Ferguson 14-1(if I recall correctly Ferguson gave Mike a fight, will have to go watch after typing up this book)
Steve Zouski 25-9
James Tillis 31-8
Mitch Green 16-1-1
Reggie Gross 18-4
William Hosea 12-3
Lorenzo Boyd 15-5
Marcus Frazier 16-1
Jose Ribalta 22-3-1
Alfonzo Ratliff 21-3
Trevor Berbick 31-4-1
James Smith 19-5
Pinklon Thomas 29-1-1
Tony Tucker 34-0
Tyrell Biggs 15-0
Larry Holmes 48-2
Tony Tubbs 24-1
Michael Spinks 31-0

So crap until the end few and even then the best are old and out of retirement. That’s how you build a legend

Edit-Ferguson fight wasn’t terribly competitive but the ruling was garbage. Ferguson was DQed but the ref arbitrarily ruled it a TKO.

[Master]

Pure excitement and the later fights were as undisputed world champion.

[mikeeod]

Im a big fan of Tyson and think it is deplorable that he was exploited by King, his “friends”, Robin Givens, and railroaded into prison. I think Mike beats Ruddock the same way any time they fight, since Ruddock was a one dimensional fighter who fought in spurts. That being said, I think Evander, Bowe, Lennox, and even Foreman were all bad match ups stylistically for Mike. Tyson would look great against Moorer, Morrison...etc. If busy guys with good chins fought him though, especially if they could back him up, he has issues. Ray Mercer is another bad style match up for Mike, assuming Mercer showed up in shape and ready to fight.

[imp]

Tyson was incredible in the ring and out of it and every so often you'll get to see an athlete like that and be in total awe of them...Ali vs Cleveland Williams, Usain Bolt, Mike Trout, Bo Jackson, Wayne Gretzky, Mario Lemieux, Michael Jordan.


Mike Tyson was an incredible specimen he had his own style (fighting & look in the ring the high black trunks, the boots with no socks just in there to do business no flashy flash), he was barebones brutal, he was knowledgeable about the history of the sport.

Because of his ties to Cus, because of his minimalism of flash(in the ring) and his excess outside of it Mike Tyson seemed to be one of those archetypal boxing greats who would be at home in any era. You could put his fights in black & white and imagine Jack Dempsey or Jack Johnson or Rocky Marciano and he'd fit in. He was almost a caricature of a boxer like Mr. T as Clubber Lang. He was ruthless in the ring and an enigma outside of it.


In his prime Tyson was high energy turning offense into defense with pure pressure, lightning fast hands, and ungodly power...was he unbeatable? No, but he fought like he was.

In his years after Douglas beat him he was like a wounded lion, he could fold up and go home if the going got too tough or he could lash out or even foul out. Tyson fought with ANGER in his post prime you could see it....in his prime he wasn't angry he was focused like a laser in his post prime he was filled with hate it seemed. Maybe that was due to his pushing away or losing everyone he ever loved or maybe prison or maybe who knows but yeah he fought with a real visceral anger later in his career which I think caused him to lose focus more and I think it probably hurt his training a lot as well.

Good stuff EK

[imp]

Tyson’s opponents in that 86-88 timeframe

David Jaco 19-5
Mike Jameson 14-9
Jesse Ferguson 14-1(if I recall correctly Ferguson gave Mike a fight, will have to go watch after typing up this book)
Steve Zouski 25-9
James Tillis 31-8
Mitch Green 16-1-1
Reggie Gross 18-4
William Hosea 12-3
Lorenzo Boyd 15-5
Marcus Frazier 16-1
Jose Ribalta 22-3-1
Alfonzo Ratliff 21-3
Trevor Berbick 31-4-1
James Smith 19-5
Pinklon Thomas 29-1-1
Tony Tucker 34-0
Tyrell Biggs 15-0
Larry Holmes 48-2
Tony Tubbs 24-1
Michael Spinks 31-0

So crap until the end few and even then the best are old and out of retirement. That’s how you build a legend

Edit-Ferguson fight wasn’t terribly competitive but the ruling was garbage. Ferguson was DQed but the ref arbitrarily ruled it a TKO.

Ron,

Keep expanding..are you disputing his record or not?

What are your views on Tyson pre and post prime?

[Ron Swanson]

Tyson’s opponents in that 86-88 timeframe

David Jaco 19-5
Mike Jameson 14-9
Jesse Ferguson 14-1(if I recall correctly Ferguson gave Mike a fight, will have to go watch after typing up this book)
Steve Zouski 25-9
James Tillis 31-8
Mitch Green 16-1-1
Reggie Gross 18-4
William Hosea 12-3
Lorenzo Boyd 15-5
Marcus Frazier 16-1
Jose Ribalta 22-3-1
Alfonzo Ratliff 21-3
Trevor Berbick 31-4-1
James Smith 19-5
Pinklon Thomas 29-1-1
Tony Tucker 34-0
Tyrell Biggs 15-0
Larry Holmes 48-2
Tony Tubbs 24-1
Michael Spinks 31-0

So crap until the end few and even then the best are old and out of retirement. That’s how you build a legend

Edit-Ferguson fight wasn’t terribly competitive but the ruling was garbage. Ferguson was DQed but the ref arbitrarily ruled it a TKO.

Ron,

Keep expanding..are you disputing his record or not?

What are your views on Tyson pre and post prime?

Phenomenal talent that while intelligent was fragile of mind. Pre and post prison. Was always going to come unglued, that’s why they had him fight so often. My assessment is simple, he’s the most overrated fighter ever. And my favorite to watch.