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Thread: Today In Biden Land

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  1. #901
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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Quote Originally Posted by palmerq View Post
    Good posting Kirkland, thanks for taking the time to try to explain it. So debt isn't ideal but as long as debt to gdp(I watched some beginner economics videos, so I I mostly know what that is :S) ratio isnt getting out of hand and gdp keeps growing everything is probably alright? So in the current environment/recession a smaller deficit or maybe even a balanced budget could make things worse because gdp could fall or grow slower so the debt to gsp ratio could get even worse or something along those lines? I assume that's what trudeau meant with his famous the budget will balance itself quote.


    My pea brain doesn't quite understand the inflation bit, I'm probably missing something very obvious so feel free to make fun of me.

    "If the government borrows a hundred dollars from you on January first this year and agrees to pay you one percent interest. Inflation runs at two percent over the year so government revenues increase by two percent without the government doing anything due to inflation. They then pay you a hundred and one dollars leaving them a dollar up and you a dollar down in real terms over the year but you're a dollar up in nominal terms."....

    Why are government incomes up, I would still be paid the same and paying the same income tax so they still get the same amount of money that way, maybe I've got what inflation is all wrong, isn't it just the cost of things going up? Where do they the get the extra quid from? VaT maybe?

    Imagine the debt clock but then imagine a GDP clock next to it. If they're both going up at the same rate you don't have a problem. Balanced budgets would absolutely make things worse in recessions.

    The classic line you get from some politicians and businesspeople is that anybody who runs a household knows that when times get tough you have to cut your spending so that you don't lose your house or whatever. This would make sense if the economy was like a household. But the economy is millions of households. In our economy your spending is my income and vice versa. If we all stop spending at once you get a recession. This is where governments step in and increase spending to ameliorate the economic effects of the recession and to get the economy going in the right direction. The fancy term for this is countercyclical fiscal policy.

    From the Great Depression onwards there is nearly a hundred years of evidence that this is the correct and effective thing to do and hundreds of years of data previous to the 1929 crash that show that cutting government spending in recessions makes things worse. So with any politician or business fucker spouting this stuff there are two options. Firstly they're idiots and shouldn't be in a position where they're affecting government policy in any way. Secondly they know they're full of shit but they're pushing their favoured agenda of lower taxes, less government and so on.

    There are hundreds of years of evidence to show that you grow your way out of recessions and debt and zero evidence to show that cutting your way out can be successful.



    The inflation bit. Imagine an economy where the GDP is $100 on January 1st. On December 31st, one year later there has been zero economic growth and the GDP is still $100. However there's been two percent inflation over the year so although the real GDP is unchanged the nominal GDP is now $102. The government collects 25% of the economy in taxes so in the previous year collected $25 but in the next zero growth/two percent inflation year collected $25.50. Luckily for the government their debt is in nominal dollars so their debt level has become two percent smaller and they have extra money to pay it off.

    When you see an article stating that GDP in creased by 3.2 percent in the previous year that's in real terms, adjusted for inflation. If inflation ran at two percent over the course of that year then the nominal GDP increase, which is real GDP plus inflation, would have been 5.2 percent. They always express GDP in real terms in articles unless stated otherwise.

    The fact debt is priced in nominal dollars means that governments can run deficits equal to economic growth plus inflation and not have their debt situation get any worse. If the US has three percent growth and two percent inflation that's a total of five percent growth in nomianl terms meaning they can run a deficit of five percent or, in a twenty plus trillion dollar economy, a one trillion plus deficit. This shouldn't be done during growth periods however. When the economy is growing the budget should be as close to balanced as possible unless you're making investments which will boost growth in the future. That gives you room to spend like a motherfucker when you hit a recession and also means your debt level in relation to your GDP melts away during growth periods. That's what I mean by growing your way out of debt.

    And don't worry about not understanding this stuff either. Loads of billionaires and centimillionaires don't understand it at all. And my front office friend says you can't explain it to them either. In almost every case when he's dealing with clients if you tell them something they don't want to hear, that tax cuts for them don't grow the economy for instance, they get upset and move their business to some firm who will tell them what they want to hear which just perpetuates all the negative economic knowledge out there. There are tons of nine and ten figure guys and girls out there who have a massive negative level of economic and financial knowledge.

  2. #902
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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Some random stuff:

    Never-before-heard audio, obtained exclusively by CNN, shows how former President Donald Trump's longtime adviser Rudy Giuliani relentlessly pressured and coaxed the Ukrainian government in 2019 to investigate baseless conspiracies about then-candidate Joe Biden.

    [...]

    During the roughly 40-minute call, Giuliani repeatedly told Yermak that Zelensky should publicly announce investigations into possible corruption by Biden in Ukraine, and into claims that Ukraine meddled in the 2016 election to hurt Trump. (These separate claims are both untrue.)

    "All we need from the President [Zelensky] is to say, I'm gonna put an honest prosecutor in charge, he's gonna investigate and dig up the evidence, that presently exists and is there any other evidence about involvement of the 2016 election, and then the Biden thing has to be run out," Giuliani said, according to the audio. "... Somebody in Ukraine's gotta take that seriously."
    The new audio demonstrates how Giuliani aggressively cajoled the Ukrainians to do Trump's bidding. And it undermines Trump's oft-repeated assertion that "there was no quid pro quo" where Zelensky could secure US government support if he did political favors for Trump.




    https://edition.cnn.com/2021/06/07/p...den/index.html



    Looks like more of this will come out. That Trump will throw Rudy under the bus is guaranteed but does Rudy have something on Trump to prove he was acting on orders? Rudy of all people, the former head prosecutor at SDNY must know how Trump works and the legal jeopardy he was in.


    Like I was saying about the ocean of money at the top of the tree not having anything to invest in:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...from-the-top-1


    Also, relatedly, if your income is around the fifty thousand dollar mark you're being pickpocketed for forty plus thousand dollars a year relative to the pre Reagan era. This article dates the beginning of this upward redistribution at 1975 but that's a statistical artifact from twin recessions and adverse economic conditions in the mid seventies brought about by two huge oil price spikes at a time the US economy was far more geared to the price of oil than it is now. In reality this redistribution started under Reagan and they admit as much later in the article:


    There are some who blame the current plight of working Americans on structural changes in the underlying economy—on automation, and especially on globalization. According to this popular narrative, the lower wages of the past 40 years were the unfortunate but necessary price of keeping American businesses competitive in an increasingly cutthroat global market. But in fact, the $50 trillion transfer of wealth the RAND report documents has occurred entirely within the American economy, not between it and its trading partners. No, this upward redistribution of income, wealth, and power wasn’t inevitable; it was a choice—a direct result of the trickle-down policies we chose to implement since 1975.
    We chose to cut taxes on billionaires and to deregulate the financial industry. We chose to allow CEOs to manipulate share prices through stock buybacks, and to lavishly reward themselves with the proceeds. We chose to permit giant corporations, through mergers and acquisitions, to accumulate the vast monopoly power necessary to dictate both prices charged and wages paid. We chose to erode the minimum wage and the overtime threshold and the bargaining power of labor. For four decades, we chose to elect political leaders who put the material interests of the rich and powerful above those of the American people.


    https://time.com/5888024/50-trillion...ality-america/

    It's easier to get wide circulation and coverage of an article like this if you're not explicitly bashing one political party which is why they did the 1975 thing.

    Incidentally somebody managing to save a thousand dollars a month from 1985 to now out of the forty thousand a year they should have earned would have a retirement fund of four million dollars if they'd invested it in the stock market. Now of course the market wouldn't have gone up so much if the redistribution hadn't have occurred and the top one percent having pumped so much of that fifty trillion into it but back of the envelope says still over three so six million plus for a couple. Half of Americans have zero retirement savings right now.



    https://twitter.com/BenzionSanders/s...41476769730568

    Israel are now about to be run by a guy who explicitly sets out why they'll never stop their ongoing slow motion ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians. Here's one of his election adverts:




    And this is going to keep on affecting US coverage of Israel which has altered fractionally since the latest load of bombing. Coverage is now very very fractionally less pro Israel. This is making Israel very angry:

    https://twitter.com/JacobMagid/statu...20975692877830




    I should have put this in the previous post:

    https://www.piie.com/research/piie-c...-it-has-fallen



    Hell in a handbasket latest:

    https://www.mediaite.com/tv/evangeli...n-in-churches/



    and various stuff:

    https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/sta...20912945287181


    https://twitter.com/matthews_p/statu...09322766368771


    https://twitter.com/clairecmc/status...98154261811201



    https://twitter.com/JeffreyGoldberg/...47145967288322



    https://twitter.com/Popehat/status/1399814975854551041

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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing View Post
    [
    And don't worry about not understanding this stuff either.
    Yes I agree, I'm not trying to be an expert on such things, I understand people will study this stuff for years and then work with it and so on... But I think we(as in the general public) should try to gain a slight understanding of what these gits on the news and YouTube channels are rambling about so we can spot a charlatan at least. And it is interesting stuff.

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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Quote Originally Posted by palmerq View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing View Post
    [
    And don't worry about not understanding this stuff either.
    Yes I agree, I'm not trying to be an expert on such things, I understand people will study this stuff for years and then work with it and so on... But I think we(as in the general public) should try to gain a slight understanding of what these gits on the news and YouTube channels are rambling about so we can spot a charlatan at least. And it is interesting stuff.

    All of the basic stuff you need to know to work out how governments, economies and the world works is very simple indeed. The only complicated issue is international trade which is ridiculously complex with all the related issues but luckily there's a simple solution for western people that takes about five minutes to understand.

    The biggest disappointment is the total failure of the media to inform the public about these things. The problem is nobody gives a shit about facts, getting some dusty professor on the telly to explain these things doesn't get ratings and ratings is what it's all about. So news and current affairs programmes go for idiots screaming at each other or outrage merchants or corporate droids mouthing garbage. If the public spent whatever little or big amount of time they spend watching/listening to news and current affairs watching and listening to just simple easy to understand easy to broadcast factual stuff the average citizen would be ten thousand times more informed than they actually are.

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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    This is the biggest story in a while or at least should havebeen. Not sure how much coverage this got in non elite outlets but here you go:

    https://www.seattletimes.com/busines...-income-taxes/



    Originally published in the Jeff Bezos owned Washington Post.

    Here is the story in a picture:

    https://twitter.com/BCAppelbaum/stat...28009910816771


    Related:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/08/o...lionaires.html


    and assorted stuff:

    https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog...n/rxvdOPdr5uot



    https://twitter.com/gtconway3d/statu...43889952284672

  6. #906
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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    That should be a scandal and not allowed that these billionaires pay less tax than most people. Instead it is legal.
    Do not let success go to your head and do not let failure get to your heart.

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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Hey... say what anyone says about some of the U.S. lawmakers nowadays. At least they are inventive...


    https://currently.att.yahoo.com/att/...161922057.html

    ‘We’re not sending our best’: Republican ridiculed for asking whether US forest service can change Earth’s rotation



    Doesn't it give everyone a warm and fuzzy feeling to know that the nation's elected officials always strive to come up with these great ideas?

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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    They keep churning out delirious shat like that and former Potus praising Nigeria Government bans suddenly the senility of Biden looks the sharpest of the lot. And who didn’t know Rudy was a Russian boot licking kook. VP Harris had a bit of a melt down though.

  9. #909
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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Spicoli View Post
    They keep churning out delirious shat like that and former Potus praising Nigeria Government bans suddenly the senility of Biden looks the sharpest of the lot. And who didn’t know Rudy was a Russian boot licking kook. VP Harris had a bit of a melt down though.

    We should form the "I Call 'Em Like I See 'Em" group. I'll bet the total membership wouldn't even fill my living room. It's so refreshing and liberating to see things with clear glasses, instead of MAGA-tinted or "Trump is the devil" colored glasses.

    Back to the jaw-dropping exploits of some of these elected officials..... it's enough to make one go on permanent facepalm mode.

  10. #910
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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Quote Originally Posted by TitoFan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spicoli View Post
    They keep churning out delirious shat like that and former Potus praising Nigeria Government bans suddenly the senility of Biden looks the sharpest of the lot. And who didn’t know Rudy was a Russian boot licking kook. VP Harris had a bit of a melt down though.

    We should form the "I Call 'Em Like I See 'Em" group. I'll bet the total membership wouldn't even fill my living room. It's so refreshing and liberating to see things with clear glasses, instead of MAGA-tinted or "Trump is the devil" colored glasses.

    Back to the jaw-dropping exploits of some of these elected officials..... it's enough to make one go on permanent facepalm mode.
    🤭

    😒

    😧

    You are just such a superior soft lad.

  11. #911
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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Quote Originally Posted by TitoFan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spicoli View Post
    They keep churning out delirious shat like that and former Potus praising Nigeria Government bans suddenly the senility of Biden looks the sharpest of the lot. And who didn’t know Rudy was a Russian boot licking kook. VP Harris had a bit of a melt down though.

    We should form the "I Call 'Em Like I See 'Em" group. I'll bet the total membership wouldn't even fill my living room. It's so refreshing and liberating to see things with clear glasses, instead of MAGA-tinted or "Trump is the devil" colored glasses.

    Back to the jaw-dropping exploits of some of these elected officials..... it's enough to make one go on permanent facepalm mode.
    Everyone should take a shot at calling it exactly how they see it regardless of the tribal feathers it ruffles. Great way to piss off all ‘sides’ too . Biden and Harris def weren’t my first choice by a long shot. Also helps when a candidate isn’t a feckless anti democratic grifter either.

  12. #912
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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Quote Originally Posted by zoley View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by TitoFan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spicoli View Post
    They keep churning out delirious shat like that and former Potus praising Nigeria Government bans suddenly the senility of Biden looks the sharpest of the lot. And who didn’t know Rudy was a Russian boot licking kook. VP Harris had a bit of a melt down though.

    We should form the "I Call 'Em Like I See 'Em" group. I'll bet the total membership wouldn't even fill my living room. It's so refreshing and liberating to see things with clear glasses, instead of MAGA-tinted or "Trump is the devil" colored glasses.

    Back to the jaw-dropping exploits of some of these elected officials..... it's enough to make one go on permanent facepalm mode.


    You are just superior.


    On that we can agree on.

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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Biden is the greatest president ever. I follow the MSM now for everything and he is great and has good taste in ice cream. Like the media said Trump was evil and now we have a breath of fresh air and a true president and great speaker. Dude nails every speech. The guy who wrote his speech called it one of the best presidential speeches ever. The media new the guy wrote it and and still asked him what he thought of the speech which proves there was no bias. Kamilika is a great Vice President, doing a great job at the border, she hasn’t been there but she hasn’t been to Europe either and everything is fine in Europe thus everything should be fine at the border. I’m glad Biden shut down the pipelines and I’m happy to be paying more for gas. Gas is evil. Pollutes us. The biggest threat facing the US is global warming, no we don’t call it that, climate change, because the climate shouldn’t change it should stay the same like everything else. Nothing else changes and the environment has always been the same until now. This is posing in immediate threat we need to throw all kinds of money at it. We need a gender neutral America and joe is the guy to take us there. I kept an open mind refused to pass judgement for a while and this is where I know am. Thank god all those bad Trump lovers are gone and we can now sit peacefully in one living room, together, as one. Agreeing over snd over that Joe and president Kamilika are the best. Frig those Trump lovers those racist pricks put up a graph show how bad they were CNN has it daily. Joe had done great things and the country has come together as one. No more problems. Joe and his president kamilka are great. I like this living room. It is a nice place. Are those pills on the coffee table? Could I have some please. Joe is doing a great job. Go Joe Go. GI know Joe, bunker joe. Biden is doing wonderful. How come everyone doesn’t love the US know, oh yeah Joe needs more time. Joe is right on target saying all the same things and backing all the same policies he has all along those wonderful fifty years in politics. Joe is doing good. A plus for joe. Ok where do you put the bad words about Trumpeter he spoke recently didn’t he I’m sure it was bad I was triggered could someone take me from the pro joe living room to the hate Trump room. And in closing Joe is doing real good the CPI is just transitory stuff and a chart will prove Joe has nothing to due with that let’s raise taxes and capital gains that will help then we take that money and stop climate change cause I’m sick of the four seasons not the band they are a good band I mean how the climate changes and you get four seasons Trump started that shit we need to stop it. Thank you, stay well and remember Joe and president Kamilika are the best. I forget I’m president sometimes he said but it was a joke of course but true but a joke. YK should talk to Kamilika the other president also doing well.

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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by palmerq View Post
    Good posting Kirkland, thanks for taking the time to try to explain it. So debt isn't ideal but as long as debt to gdp(I watched some beginner economics videos, so I I mostly know what that is :S) ratio isnt getting out of hand and gdp keeps growing everything is probably alright? So in the current environment/recession a smaller deficit or maybe even a balanced budget could make things worse because gdp could fall or grow slower so the debt to gsp ratio could get even worse or something along those lines? I assume that's what trudeau meant with his famous the budget will balance itself quote.


    My pea brain doesn't quite understand the inflation bit, I'm probably missing something very obvious so feel free to make fun of me.

    "If the government borrows a hundred dollars from you on January first this year and agrees to pay you one percent interest. Inflation runs at two percent over the year so government revenues increase by two percent without the government doing anything due to inflation. They then pay you a hundred and one dollars leaving them a dollar up and you a dollar down in real terms over the year but you're a dollar up in nominal terms."....

    Why are government incomes up, I would still be paid the same and paying the same income tax so they still get the same amount of money that way, maybe I've got what inflation is all wrong, isn't it just the cost of things going up? Where do they the get the extra quid from? VaT maybe?

    Imagine the debt clock but then imagine a GDP clock next to it. If they're both going up at the same rate you don't have a problem. Balanced budgets would absolutely make things worse in recessions.

    The classic line you get from some politicians and businesspeople is that anybody who runs a household knows that when times get tough you have to cut your spending so that you don't lose your house or whatever. This would make sense if the economy was like a household. But the economy is millions of households. In our economy your spending is my income and vice versa. If we all stop spending at once you get a recession. This is where governments step in and increase spending to ameliorate the economic effects of the recession and to get the economy going in the right direction. The fancy term for this is countercyclical fiscal policy.

    From the Great Depression onwards there is nearly a hundred years of evidence that this is the correct and effective thing to do and hundreds of years of data previous to the 1929 crash that show that cutting government spending in recessions makes things worse. So with any politician or business fucker spouting this stuff there are two options. Firstly they're idiots and shouldn't be in a position where they're affecting government policy in any way. Secondly they know they're full of shit but they're pushing their favoured agenda of lower taxes, less government and so on.

    There are hundreds of years of evidence to show that you grow your way out of recessions and debt and zero evidence to show that cutting your way out can be successful.



    The inflation bit. Imagine an economy where the GDP is $100 on January 1st. On December 31st, one year later there has been zero economic growth and the GDP is still $100. However there's been two percent inflation over the year so although the real GDP is unchanged the nominal GDP is now $102. The government collects 25% of the economy in taxes so in the previous year collected $25 but in the next zero growth/two percent inflation year collected $25.50. Luckily for the government their debt is in nominal dollars so their debt level has become two percent smaller and they have extra money to pay it off.

    When you see an article stating that GDP in creased by 3.2 percent in the previous year that's in real terms, adjusted for inflation. If inflation ran at two percent over the course of that year then the nominal GDP increase, which is real GDP plus inflation, would have been 5.2 percent. They always express GDP in real terms in articles unless stated otherwise.

    The fact debt is priced in nominal dollars means that governments can run deficits equal to economic growth plus inflation and not have their debt situation get any worse. If the US has three percent growth and two percent inflation that's a total of five percent growth in nomianl terms meaning they can run a deficit of five percent or, in a twenty plus trillion dollar economy, a one trillion plus deficit. This shouldn't be done during growth periods however. When the economy is growing the budget should be as close to balanced as possible unless you're making investments which will boost growth in the future. That gives you room to spend like a motherfucker when you hit a recession and also means your debt level in relation to your GDP melts away during growth periods. That's what I mean by growing your way out of debt.

    And don't worry about not understanding this stuff either. Loads of billionaires and centimillionaires don't understand it at all. And my front office friend says you can't explain it to them either. In almost every case when he's dealing with clients if you tell them something they don't want to hear, that tax cuts for them don't grow the economy for instance, they get upset and move their business to some firm who will tell them what they want to hear which just perpetuates all the negative economic knowledge out there. There are tons of nine and ten figure guys and girls out there who have a massive negative level of economic and financial knowledge.
    Ha ha ha ha ha look Kirk as full as shit as ever ha ha ha ha ha look how his tune changes ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

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    Default Re: Today In Biden Land

    Quote Originally Posted by walrus View Post
    Biden is the greatest president ever. I follow the MSM now for everything and he is great and has good taste in ice cream. Like the media said Trump was evil and now we have a breath of fresh air and a true president and great speaker. Dude nails every speech. The guy who wrote his speech called it one of the best presidential speeches ever. The media new the guy wrote it and and still asked him what he thought of the speech which proves there was no bias. Kamilika is a great Vice President, doing a great job at the border, she hasn’t been there but she hasn’t been to Europe either and everything is fine in Europe thus everything should be fine at the border. I’m glad Biden shut down the pipelines and I’m happy to be paying more for gas. Gas is evil. Pollutes us. The biggest threat facing the US is global warming, no we don’t call it that, climate change, because the climate shouldn’t change it should stay the same like everything else. Nothing else changes and the environment has always been the same until now. This is posing in immediate threat we need to throw all kinds of money at it. We need a gender neutral America and joe is the guy to take us there. I kept an open mind refused to pass judgement for a while and this is where I know am. Thank god all those bad Trump lovers are gone and we can now sit peacefully in one living room, together, as one. Agreeing over snd over that Joe and president Kamilika are the best. Frig those Trump lovers those racist pricks put up a graph show how bad they were CNN has it daily. Joe had done great things and the country has come together as one. No more problems. Joe and his president kamilka are great. I like this living room. It is a nice place. Are those pills on the coffee table? Could I have some please. Joe is doing a great job. Go Joe Go. GI know Joe, bunker joe. Biden is doing wonderful. How come everyone doesn’t love the US know, oh yeah Joe needs more time. Joe is right on target saying all the same things and backing all the same policies he has all along those wonderful fifty years in politics. Joe is doing good. A plus for joe. Ok where do you put the bad words about Trumpeter he spoke recently didn’t he I’m sure it was bad I was triggered could someone take me from the pro joe living room to the hate Trump room. And in closing Joe is doing real good the CPI is just transitory stuff and a chart will prove Joe has nothing to due with that let’s raise taxes and capital gains that will help then we take that money and stop climate change cause I’m sick of the four seasons not the band they are a good band I mean how the climate changes and you get four seasons Trump started that shit we need to stop it. Thank you, stay well and remember Joe and president Kamilika are the best. I forget I’m president sometimes he said but it was a joke of course but true but a joke. YK should talk to Kamilika the other president also doing well.


    You do realize you have no audience here, right? But we'll try and dredge up a "rah-rah" Biden-Harris guy for you to ramble at.

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