What’s the Greatest Win in Boxing History?

[Master]

Great boxing knowledge The Six Four.

The greatest win in English boxing history is not Turpin beating Sugar Ray Robinson but Lloyd Honeyghan destroying the undefeated undisputed welterweight champion Don Curry in the USA. The Cobra was considered the best p4p fighter at the time and huge favourite. The Ragamuffin Man was unknown and had some big wins including ripping the European title away in Italy against Gianfranco Rosi. Honeyghan was a beast that night.

[Primo Carnera]

Great boxing knowledge The Six Four.

The greatest win in English boxing history is not Turpin beating Sugar Ray Robinson but Lloyd Honeyghan destroying the undefeated undisputed welterweight champion Don Curry in the USA. The Cobra was considered the best p4p fighter at the time and huge favourite. The Ragamuffin Man was unknown and had some big wins including ripping the European title away in Italy against Gianfranco Rosi. Honeyghan was a beast that night.

I was literally just about to throw Honeyghan v Curry into the mix . Curry was also p4p #1 at the time and very slick. Honeyghan showed he had immense talent but clearly not professional enough to be an ATG.

[The Six Four]

Master & Primo Carnera, Honeyghan’s win over Curry may have been the bigger upset (debatable), but Turpin’s victory over Robinson stands as the greater win for me. Robinson was a global icon, riding an 89-fight unbeaten streak (55 KOs) with a record of 129-1-2-1 (84 KOs). Many consider him the greatest fighter of all time.

[Master]

Master & Primo Carnera, Honeyghan’s win over Curry may have been the bigger upset (debatable), but Turpin’s victory over Robinson stands as the greater win for me. Robinson was a global icon, riding an 89-fight unbeaten streak (55 KOs) with a record of 129-1-2-1 (84 KOs). Many consider him the greatest fighter of all time.

Agreed Sugar Ray Robinson is considered the greatest p4p boxer of all time but as you said he was on a tour of Europe and that was very tiring for him. He avenged that loss in dramatic fashion which shows that he may not have lost if it was not for the travel.

It is a great win for Turpin, no doubt about that.

[Primo Carnera]

Master & Primo Carnera, Honeyghan’s win over Curry may have been the bigger upset (debatable), but Turpin’s victory over Robinson stands as the greater win for me. Robinson was a global icon, riding an 89-fight unbeaten streak (55 KOs) with a record of 129-1-2-1 (84 KOs). Many consider him the greatest fighter of all time.

I wouldn’t argue with that , although I wasn’t around at the time . But it all depends how you define “greatest win”?
Greatest win and biggest upset don’t necessarily equate to the same thing.
For example you could say something like Ali v Foreman was the greatest win because many people just couldn’t see how he could beat Foreman after what Foreman had done to Frazier and Norton, who had both beaten Ali.
Other examples are Benn v McLennan and Calzaghe v Lacy.
They weren’t the biggest upsets odds wise because they were World class fighters, but they had to do something very special to win.

[The Six Four]

Exactly, Primo Carnera—that’s why I made the distinction between an upset and a greater win. Reports had Robinson as a 4-1 favorite against Turpin, while Honeyghan was listed as a 6-1 underdog against Curry. But betting odds don’t always reflect where the fighters actually stand going into a fight.

Robinson’s bout with Turpin was the last of his European tour, and it’s said he barely trained. He even admitted, “I left my legs in Paris,” referencing his partying. As for Curry, some believe he struggled with weight and overlooked Honeyghan.

For me, Ali over Foreman remains the greatest win due to how feared George was at the time and how close he was to his prime. Duran over Leonard is a close second—Leonard was about as perfectly rounded a fighter as you could get and already a superstar. Leonard over Hearns and Frazier over Ali follow closely, with Duran over Barkley also deserving mention.

I also think Usyk’s win over Fury has already been written into boxing history. There are so many legendary victories, and it’s always fun to look back and compare them. Benn over McClellan was a brutally magnificent fight with tragic consequences, though I suspect Benn was juiced. As for Lacy, I never bought into the hype, and I still don’t understand how so many pundits had him as the favorite. After two rounds, it was clear he wasn’t on the same level.

Great suggestions—this discussion could go on forever!

[TitoFan]

What makes a great win (IMO) is a combination of factors. Obviously, upsets are in as of themselves great wins by definition.

But for me, it involves things like the skill level of both involved. Clashes between undefeated fighters are special, because one of them is going to suffer his first defeat. Along with the record itself, resumes have to be taken into consideration. It's not the same thing to have a 40-0 record fattened by taxi cab drivers, than a 20-0 record against increasingly tough opposition. Also I like all things to be equal. No weight draining... no (or few) special concessions to either fighter... and basically fighters at their peak.

I love fights with ebb and flow. That's why to me Leonard-Hearns I and Ali-Frazier III are in a category of their own. Back and forth and back and forth. With each fighter taking turns dominating the fight. Fighters changing strategy or game plan mid-fight in order to adjust.

Rivalry fights are special to me. Close to home, the PR-Mexico rivalry (in my obviously biased opinion ) is one of the best. But there's others as well.

I guess I would add historical significance, as it is a factor that cannot be overlooked. Some have already been mentioned. Along that vein, I would add those fights where records (meaningful ones) are set.

Finally... I just like fights where pride is at stake. Whether it's a rivalry, a personal thing... or whatever. I abhor fights that only represent efforts to achieve meaningless or stained trinkets.

[ykdadamaja]

When Arturo Gatti beat Micky Ward in their second fight. It was nothing short of heroic.

[Primo Carnera]

I just wrote a post on another thread about Ali’s best win. And it brought me back to this thread.
In the scheme of what we’ve been talking about, Ali beating Foreman has to be the one .
Foreman was seen as a killer and unbeatable after what he’d done, but what made the Victory so remarkable was the tactics he used.
He really had to dig deep mentally as much as physically.

[The Six Four]

Excellent post, TitoFan. You're right—it’s a mix of factors. Was the winner the underdog? How were the fighters perceived going in? Were they among the best in their division or the sport as a whole? Your pick of Leonard over Hearns is one that comes closest to my choice of Ali over Foreman (as does Duran over Leonard). Hearns was in his prime, a devastating puncher, and considered one of the sport’s best at the time. Ali vs. Frazier III remains my all-time favorite fight. Great posting.


ykdadamaja, the second Gatti vs. Ward fight was brilliant, as was the entire trilogy. But for me, it doesn't quite make the cut for greatest wins since neither was viewed as the best in their division or among the P4P elite. That said, from the moment the first fight was signed, everyone knew it was going to be a war.


Primo Carnera, I agree—Ali over Foreman is my pick, but this thread has surfaced many fights worthy of consideration. My closest runners-up are Duran over Leonard and Leonard over Hearns.

[The Six Four]

One fight worth mentioning—and I'd love to hear the forum's thoughts on—is Whitaker vs. Chavez. While not an official win, it was a clear statement. At the time, they were seen as the two best P4P fighters, with Chavez at 87-0 and Whitaker at 32-1. Chavez was above his best weight and slightly past his prime, but a fight at 135 or 140 a few years earlier could have played out differently. What do you all think?

[Master]

Chavez was my favourite boxer, instantly fell in love with him when he came to France and defended his title battering Barrios.

Sweet Pea was a genius boxer who no one could figure out and beat. He was cheated out of victories and at his best no one could beat him. Whitaker was one of the greatest lightweights ever and think he could beat Duran, that is how high I rate him. He genuinely was too good for his own good.

My bias view was that Pernell won 7-5 but the contest was the biggest p4p matchup as both were near their primes and close at their best weights.

[Denilson3.0]

How do you judge it ? Is it judged by what the fight means on world terms ? Or is it judged by how the fight win was achieved ?

If you judge it on world terms it's difficult to look past Duran-Leonard I. Two all-time greats at their respective best weights, but one guy was naturally bigger, faster and younger - yet it was the smaller, slower and older guy who won it.

People have said Douglas - Tyson, Honeyghan Vs Curry and Turpin Vs Robinson. But my question is were they at their best ? Robinson lost to Turpin in his last fight of his European tour were he had 7 fights in 3 months in 6 different European countries. Tyson was banging Asian hookers the night before Douglas and didn't train 100%. Don Curry kinda fell away after the Honeyghan loss. You could say Ali - Foreman and it's close but again Foreman kinda fell away after the fight only to come bk and infamously win the title in his forties.

The reason why I rate the Duran's win over Leonard so high is because you have to factor in that Leonard was unbeaten beforehand and the fight was sandwiched between Leonard stopping two unbeaten greats in Benitez and Hearns, and Leonard went on to beat another HOF (Hall of Famer) in Hagler and win the world title in 3 different weights (Welter, Middle, LHW) so to me ? There really isn't any angle from which Duran's win in Montreal looks anything less than stunning.

But if you judge it on how it was achieved.

Then Danny Williams vs Mark potter in a British and commonwealth title fight

Danny Williams in round 3 completely dislocated his right shoulder. The dislocation was as bad as you will see his right shoulder 3 inches below his left shoulder with Williams in visible pain. Anyone who has ever dislocated there shoulder will know its worse than virtually any break you can have and I have broken /toes/ankle/ribs/nose/arm/wrist/fingers

But biggest pain I ever had was a dislocated shoulder/ it brings tears to your eyes. It's a combination of this sensation of ripping and shock and horror at you being, well, assembled wrong and unable to do fuckall about it. Thank God for the Dilaudid drip they gave me before they reset it. You have 32 muscles attached to your shoulder and yet Williams fought totally one handed taken blow after blow refusing to quit desperate to win the title and in the 6th he lured potter in close and let rip with a huge left uppercut and kod potter and won the fight

[The Six Four]

Denilson3.0, I did mention to Master earlier that I was referring to wins over opponents at their absolute peak—at the top of their division or among the sport’s best. That’s why Ali over Foreman stands out for me, given how Foreman was viewed after dismantling Frazier and Norton. Duran over Leonard and Leonard over Hearns are right up there too. What Danny Williams did against Mark Potter was incredible, but it wasn’t at the elite level. Still, it absolutely belongs on a list of amazing performances.