Froch - What Next for the Cobra...?

[Fenster]

Calling Pascal a "journyman" is a liberty. He may not be anything special but he's got talent.

Bute was virtually KO'd last time out. If Andrade can KO him Froch has to be given that chance too.

Taylor seems to be in decline since Hopkins. Froch, being naturally bigger, and i'd bet hungrier, would have a good chance of knocking the fight out of him.

The betting would be close if Froch faced either of those two. Wins either way wouldn't be surprising.

I don't think the betting would be all that close in either of those fights.

Notice you are giving Froch a "chance" to win against Bute and Taylor. That is hardly giving him odds or making him the obvious favorite. That is what most people are questioning Froch's fans for here; why in the world they would favor him over the top fighters in the division. Yes he has a chance to win, but the odds would be against it.

And I wouldn't get too confident about Froch's size advantage over Taylor. Taylor was a big middleweight at 6'0 or 6'1", making him bigger than Pascal as well. Froch is listed at 6'0" but I think he might be closer to 6'1". Taylor unofficially weighed in at 174 lbs on the day of the fight against Lacy.

CLOSE in the betting means there would be NO obvious favourite.

[OumaFan]

I think Taylor's being underrated here, I don't even like him but he's been on a completely different level from Froch for years. Not that I think its a mismatch, Froch probably wants it a bit more, Taylor doesn't strike me as a guy that wants to be in the ring, granted they all fight for money first and foremost but some guys seem to like it more than others.

[RozzySean]

When I can tell by watching them that that's what they are, I do. Let's look back in five years and see what Jean Pascal's record looks like. It will be filled with losses to guys like Froch, Andre Dirrell, Andre Ward, etc if he sticks around the game that long.

Thus, when I see Froch matched against Pascal, though they both undefeated, I know that Pascal is nothing better than a journeyman-type, opponent-type fighter, and Froch, in spite of his pitiful opposition to date, has actual talent. The jury is still out on how high Froch will go, but time is running out on him.

You are pretty good judge of talent, Fenster. I give you credit for being able to tell the difference between a real prospect and a paper prospect by using your eyes. I know there are plenty of guys you have seen who are undefeated and young, but they are nothing more than average. Perhaps he's not a "journeyman" yet, but that's this future. If you rate Pascal any better, it's just because you love Froch and want this win to mean more than it does.

Me love Froch

On this site, ive been a critic of his from DAY ONE. Ive always predicted he would FAIL at the very top. And still do. Ive already stated Kessler will "slaughter" him and he'd start underdog against Bute, Taylor (slight) and be 50/50 with Bika and Andrade.

I give credit where it's due though. And have no problem admitting when i'm wrong.

Pascal was a decorated amatuer, unbeaten and ranked no.3 by the WBC. Considering Froch had never fought anyone above Brit/Euro level, Pascal was a leap in class for him - which he passed.

You're clearly a far harsher, more confident judge of unbeaten prospects than me. I'm more inclined to give someone the benefit of doubt.. ESPECIALLY before they've lost

We agree more than we disagree. I had no idea about Pascal amatuer pedigree. I'm going based on seeing him fight a few times and somewhat by looking at his record. When they were building him up to fight Miranda and he was calling out Miranda, I was thinking, you gotta be kidding me. Miranda will murder this guy.

Perhaps I'm being a little hard on Pascal. He was a necessary step up for him, but it was a test I full expected him to pass. I'm not sure if Froch is worse than I thought or Pascal is a little better.

I am a pretty harsh judge of prospects, actually, but I think I have a good eye, in spite of a rash of bad picks lately on the sportsbook. It takes a lot to get me on the bandwagon. Don't forget, Fenster, I was neck and neck with Bomp and probably you for first one time in the prediction contest before forgetting to put in picks for the final week due to a busy week at work

[littlerock]

Calling Pascal a "journyman" is a liberty. He may not be anything special but he's got talent.

Bute was virtually KO'd last time out. If Andrade can KO him Froch has to be given that chance too.

Taylor seems to be in decline since Hopkins. Froch, being naturally bigger, and i'd bet hungrier, would have a good chance of knocking the fight out of him.

The betting would be close if Froch faced either of those two. Wins either way wouldn't be surprising.

I don't think the betting would be all that close in either of those fights.

Notice you are giving Froch a "chance" to win against Bute and Taylor. That is hardly giving him odds or making him the obvious favorite. That is what most people are questioning Froch's fans for here; why in the world they would favor him over the top fighters in the division. Yes he has a chance to win, but the odds would be against it.

And I wouldn't get too confident about Froch's size advantage over Taylor. Taylor was a big middleweight at 6'0 or 6'1", making him bigger than Pascal as well. Froch is listed at 6'0" but I think he might be closer to 6'1". Taylor unofficially weighed in at 174 lbs on the day of the fight against Lacy.

CLOSE in the betting means there would be NO obvious favourite.

LOL, obviously.

I was more making a point to the loads of folks that are all of a sudden more than eager to make Froch the favorite (heavy in some cases) over everyone in the division except for Kessler.

There seem to be a lot of people jumping from the obvious "he could KO Taylor, Bute, etc" to "He could KO Taylor & Bute so he would win."

I'm just saying, some of his fans should stay somewhat grounded and understand the difference between fantasy and reality. I just quoted you because you were a good example of someone realizing that they were describing the matchups in terms of chances instead of certainties.

[Bomp]

When I can tell by watching them that that's what they are, I do. Let's look back in five years and see what Jean Pascal's record looks like. It will be filled with losses to guys like Froch, Andre Dirrell, Andre Ward, etc if he sticks around the game that long.

Thus, when I see Froch matched against Pascal, though they both undefeated, I know that Pascal is nothing better than a journeyman-type, opponent-type fighter, and Froch, in spite of his pitiful opposition to date, has actual talent. The jury is still out on how high Froch will go, but time is running out on him.

You are pretty good judge of talent, Fenster. I give you credit for being able to tell the difference between a real prospect and a paper prospect by using your eyes. I know there are plenty of guys you have seen who are undefeated and young, but they are nothing more than average. Perhaps he's not a "journeyman" yet, but that's this future. If you rate Pascal any better, it's just because you love Froch and want this win to mean more than it does.

Me love Froch

On this site, ive been a critic of his from DAY ONE. Ive always predicted he would FAIL at the very top. And still do. Ive already stated Kessler will "slaughter" him and he'd start underdog against Bute, Taylor (slight) and be 50/50 with Bika and Andrade.

I give credit where it's due though. And have no problem admitting when i'm wrong.

Pascal was a decorated amatuer, unbeaten and ranked no.3 by the WBC. Considering Froch had never fought anyone above Brit/Euro level, Pascal was a leap in class for him - which he passed.

You're clearly a far harsher, more confident judge of unbeaten prospects than me. I'm more inclined to give someone the benefit of doubt.. ESPECIALLY before they've lost

We agree more than we disagree. I had no idea about Pascal amatuer pedigree. I'm going based on seeing him fight a few times and somewhat by looking at his record. When they were building him up to fight Miranda and he was calling out Miranda, I was thinking, you gotta be kidding me. Miranda will murder this guy.

Perhaps I'm being a little hard on Pascal. He was a necessary step up for him, but it was a test I full expected him to pass. I'm not sure if Froch is worse than I thought or Pascal is a little better.

I am a pretty harsh judge of prospects, actually, but I think I have a good eye, in spite of a rash of bad picks lately on the sportsbook. It takes a lot to get me on the bandwagon. Don't forget, Fenster, I was neck and neck with Bomp and probably you for first one time in the prediction contest before forgetting to put in picks for the final week due to a busy week at work

I remember that comp, I think Fenster won it. I WAS GUTTED
after storming through the field to first with a month to go I fucking picked Austin to KO Klitschko

[Fenster]

Me love Froch

On this site, ive been a critic of his from DAY ONE. Ive always predicted he would FAIL at the very top. And still do. Ive already stated Kessler will "slaughter" him and he'd start underdog against Bute, Taylor (slight) and be 50/50 with Bika and Andrade.

I give credit where it's due though. And have no problem admitting when i'm wrong.

Pascal was a decorated amatuer, unbeaten and ranked no.3 by the WBC. Considering Froch had never fought anyone above Brit/Euro level, Pascal was a leap in class for him - which he passed.

You're clearly a far harsher, more confident judge of unbeaten prospects than me. I'm more inclined to give someone the benefit of doubt.. ESPECIALLY before they've lost

We agree more than we disagree. I had no idea about Pascal amatuer pedigree. I'm going based on seeing him fight a few times and somewhat by looking at his record. When they were building him up to fight Miranda and he was calling out Miranda, I was thinking, you gotta be kidding me. Miranda will murder this guy.

Perhaps I'm being a little hard on Pascal. He was a necessary step up for him, but it was a test I full expected him to pass. I'm not sure if Froch is worse than I thought or Pascal is a little better.

I am a pretty harsh judge of prospects, actually, but I think I have a good eye, in spite of a rash of bad picks lately on the sportsbook. It takes a lot to get me on the bandwagon. Don't forget, Fenster, I was neck and neck with Bomp and probably you for first one time in the prediction contest before forgetting to put in picks for the final week due to a busy week at work

I remember that comp, I think Fenster won it. I WAS GUTTED
after storming through the field to first with a month to go I fucking picked Austin to KO Klitschko

Ha! I don't remember either of you ever being a challenge to my superior prediction skills. Cretins.

[Tam Seddon]

I don't see Taylor taking a fully fit Froch's power and Froch is a great finisher when he's got his man wobbled.
Gonna be interesting to see just how far he can go and i agree with Vienna that he could easily make the jump up in weight if he chose too as he's a big super middle.
Great times again for the UK scene

You and Tam need to calm down on Froch, his power looked meicocre on Saturday, he landed alot of his big shots on Pascal and Pascal fought wreckless and very open for someone with a poor chin against a supposed power puncher.

Also I dont see him being anywhere near the threat that Dawson is for Joe, in and around Joes weight, at least Dawson can fight at a pace with speed and accuracy, something Froch lacks.

I dont see Taylor as a threat to any of the top super middles, hes not strong enough, Cory spinks and Kasim Ouma both gave him a tough fight and both are light hitting welters

If Froch wants to make a statement he should fight kessler.

If he was nevous fighting the untested at world level with a shaky chin and open defence Pascal, hed be shiitting a brick V Kessler

If Joe had fought Pascal and looked like Froch did, wed all be saying its deffinitly time for Joe to retire but this is the best that Frcoh can hope for at 31 I spose

ill tell you this ross, I admit that carl needs to do some work on his defence, but in my opinion he was in firm command of that fight. He never took a backwards step and JT doesnt like constant pressure. Pascal was very tough to nail sometimes, if you look at the fight his head was virtually by his waist and for any fighter it would be difficult to land a clean one. Kessler-Froch would be an awesome fight and nobody can deny that, Froch needs another fight before he gets in with Kessler but I would pick Carl to beat Bute too at this stage. Chicken Inkin will NEVER step up to the plate so i guess hes out of the picture. I think Carl put on a really good performance at the weekend.

[Bomp]

We agree more than we disagree. I had no idea about Pascal amatuer pedigree. I'm going based on seeing him fight a few times and somewhat by looking at his record. When they were building him up to fight Miranda and he was calling out Miranda, I was thinking, you gotta be kidding me. Miranda will murder this guy.

Perhaps I'm being a little hard on Pascal. He was a necessary step up for him, but it was a test I full expected him to pass. I'm not sure if Froch is worse than I thought or Pascal is a little better.

I am a pretty harsh judge of prospects, actually, but I think I have a good eye, in spite of a rash of bad picks lately on the sportsbook. It takes a lot to get me on the bandwagon. Don't forget, Fenster, I was neck and neck with Bomp and probably you for first one time in the prediction contest before forgetting to put in picks for the final week due to a busy week at work

I remember that comp, I think Fenster won it. I WAS GUTTED
after storming through the field to first with a month to go I fucking picked Austin to KO Klitschko

Ha! I don't remember either of you ever being a challenge to my superior prediction skills. Cretins.

I'm not sure, but someone who was going well went awol in the competition I entered, It may have been you but am not sure.

Klitchko-Austin was one of the picks i made after i lost my (brief) lead, as a try to catch up putting joker on it as well (fucking apt name).

[Bomp]

I don't see Taylor taking a fully fit Froch's power and Froch is a great finisher when he's got his man wobbled.
Gonna be interesting to see just how far he can go and i agree with Vienna that he could easily make the jump up in weight if he chose too as he's a big super middle.
Great times again for the UK scene

You and Tam need to calm down on Froch, his power looked meicocre on Saturday, he landed alot of his big shots on Pascal and Pascal fought wreckless and very open for someone with a poor chin against a supposed power puncher.

Also I dont see him being anywhere near the threat that Dawson is for Joe, in and around Joes weight, at least Dawson can fight at a pace with speed and accuracy, something Froch lacks.

I dont see Taylor as a threat to any of the top super middles, hes not strong enough, Cory spinks and Kasim Ouma both gave him a tough fight and both are light hitting welters

If Froch wants to make a statement he should fight kessler.

If he was nevous fighting the untested at world level with a shaky chin and open defence Pascal, hed be shiitting a brick V Kessler

If Joe had fought Pascal and looked like Froch did, wed all be saying its deffinitly time for Joe to retire but this is the best that Frcoh can hope for at 31 I spose

ill tell you this ross, I admit that carl needs to do some work on his defence, but in my opinion he was in firm command of that fight. He never took a backwards step and JT doesnt like constant pressure. Pascal was very tough to nail sometimes, if you look at the fight his head was virtually by his waist and for any fighter it would be difficult to land a clean one. Kessler-Froch would be an awesome fight and nobody can deny that, Froch needs another fight before he gets in with Kessler but I would pick Carl to beat Bute too at this stage. Chicken Inkin will NEVER step up to the plate so i guess hes out of the picture. I think Carl put on a really good performance at the weekend.

Carl and Pascal were well evenly matched, with awful defences. Pascal was up atfer 5, but you could tell from the fourth that Froch could take a better punch. Late on Pascal would only initiate an attack AFTER being hit as he was hesitant.

He showed a lot of grit, but other than that I wouldn't really call it a really good performance as a similar performance against many of the top guys simply wouldn't be enough.

[Tam Seddon]

Jermain Taylor Wants a Piece of Carl Froch in 2009 - Boxing News

Taylor MIGHT be interested in this one according to this source. I think it would be an awesome fight and carl would be able to show the US what hes made of.

[Tam Seddon]

You and Tam need to calm down on Froch, his power looked meicocre on Saturday, he landed alot of his big shots on Pascal and Pascal fought wreckless and very open for someone with a poor chin against a supposed power puncher.

Also I dont see him being anywhere near the threat that Dawson is for Joe, in and around Joes weight, at least Dawson can fight at a pace with speed and accuracy, something Froch lacks.

I dont see Taylor as a threat to any of the top super middles, hes not strong enough, Cory spinks and Kasim Ouma both gave him a tough fight and both are light hitting welters

If Froch wants to make a statement he should fight kessler.

If he was nevous fighting the untested at world level with a shaky chin and open defence Pascal, hed be shiitting a brick V Kessler

If Joe had fought Pascal and looked like Froch did, wed all be saying its deffinitly time for Joe to retire but this is the best that Frcoh can hope for at 31 I spose

ill tell you this ross, I admit that carl needs to do some work on his defence, but in my opinion he was in firm command of that fight. He never took a backwards step and JT doesnt like constant pressure. Pascal was very tough to nail sometimes, if you look at the fight his head was virtually by his waist and for any fighter it would be difficult to land a clean one. Kessler-Froch would be an awesome fight and nobody can deny that, Froch needs another fight before he gets in with Kessler but I would pick Carl to beat Bute too at this stage. Chicken Inkin will NEVER step up to the plate so i guess hes out of the picture. I think Carl put on a really good performance at the weekend.

Carl and Pascal were well evenly matched, with awful defences. Pascal was up atfer 5, but you could tell from the fourth that Froch could take a better punch. Late on Pascal would only initiate an attack AFTER being hit as he was hesitant.

He showed a lot of grit, but other than that I wouldn't really call it a really good performance as a similar performance against many of the top guys simply wouldn't be enough.

But Pascal did well with some snappy counters but I think many people are overrating some of the punches he hit Carl with. I think Carl was firmly in command of the fight IMO. Carl usually does start slower and works out whats in front of him and he showed he can go 12 rounds in doing that. I just want him to fight Taylor.

Taylor will try and outbox carl but I cant see him taking that much pressure for 12 rounds and he will get stopped.

[Rantcatrat]

Mr. Seddon,

Because I think Taylor wins a fight with Froch and you think Froch would win, it may be fitting for us to wager something on this fight if it actually comes off.

What say you kind sir?

[Tam Seddon]

for sure, im really up for that one. Lets hope it happens early 09!