What to do about boxing judges?

[Rantcatrat]

One thing that should be addressed are the conflicts of interest. In championship fights, judges are paid for by the state boxing commission out of the commission's fees from the championship fight. If a promoter is paying a judge $5000 to score a championship fight, providing accomodation and travel expenses to the judge, a judge may feel inclined to give close rounds to the promoter's fighter in order to put them in a good position to be hired in the future by that promoter. It's an inherent conflict of interest. Now, there may be less of a problem if the judge's expenses are being paid for by the state's commission with no relationship to a promoter or the fight. Does anyone know if state's commissions pay for judges or if promoters do?

But at least officially, promoters do not have any say what judges are hired, even if the money they're paid with theoretically passes through the promoter at one point in the chain: (a) commission picks judges, (b) fans pay for fight, (c) some tiny fraction of the money that fans paid for fight gets diverted to the judges.

Unless you are alleging outright corruption/ a break from how it's set up to work, I don't see any conflict of interest. Plus, the money we're talking about is peanuts. I'm pretty sure the great majority of these guys have day jobs.

I'm not alleging outright corruption. I wasn't sure whether promoters pay the judges or if the commission hires them. Can promoters veto judges? How are judges picked? Is it a lottery?

Judges are paid somwhere around $5000 for a title fight, and $3000 for the average televised fight + travel and accomodation expenses. It's not a bad living on the top level.

[Slim the BoxingManiac]

There has to be some sort of corruption. Something isn't right when a guy like Mr. Robertson is working on a world title fight as a judge and screws it up that bad.

[TitoFan]

Open scoring (or some fascimile) has been tried in one of the organizations (forget which), and doesn't work too well. They announce the score after the 4th round, I think. In any case, I think judges scores should be turned in after EVERY round. And if that's already being done, why on Earth do some fights take forever to add up the cards and announce the decision? It just feeds the suspicion everyone has that the scores can be tinkered with. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to collect cards from 3 judges at the end of each round and have them added up. That way, after the final round, you only have to add the scores from that last round. No complicated math here.

What this would do also is keep the judges attention on the CURRENT round. No going back and looking at how they scored the previous rounds. That is water under the bridge. A fight should be scored round-by-round, each round under its own merits. I wouldn't be surprised to find that some judges take a long time at the end, because they're reviewing their own scoring throughout the fight, and maybe trying to force a certain outcome. That should not be allowed.

And if paper is a problem, have the judges punch in the end-of-round score electronically. Again... maybe they already do this, I don't know. All I know is that boxing should do everything possible to keep the judges' focus strictly on the round happening in front of them. And announcing of the final score at the end of even the closest and most controversial fights should be a matter of seconds.... not long, drawn-out minutes. Again... it's not calculus or trigonometry. It's simple arithmetic.

[Master]

Judges should have their scores monitored and if there are consistant scores that are against the actual fight then they should go through a disciplinary and work improvement process. If they are found to be not fit to work then they should be sacked.

[killersheep]

Judges should have their scores monitored and if there are consistant scores that are against the actual fight then they should go through a disciplinary and work improvement process. If they are found to be not fit to work then they should be sacked.

The big problem here is who is responsible for this? Same problem with my pro/rel idea. If it's a sanctioning bodies responsibility or an athletic commission how do they enforce it to other groups?

[Master]

Judges should have their scores monitored and if there are consistant scores that are against the actual fight then they should go through a disciplinary and work improvement process. If they are found to be not fit to work then they should be sacked.

The big problem here is who is responsible for this? Same problem with my pro/rel idea. If it's a sanctioning bodies responsibility or an athletic commission how do they enforce it to other groups?

The state boxing fights are held at.

[Spicoli]

Judges should have their scores monitored and if there are consistent scores that are against the actual fight then they should go through a disciplinary and work improvement process. If they are found to be not fit to work then they should be sacked.

The big problem here is who is responsible for this? Same problem with my pro/rel idea. If it's a sanctioning bodies responsibility or an athletic commission how do they enforce it to other groups?

The state boxing fights are held at.

The kicker is we have a hand full of states that don't even have commissions and or have to "borrow" a neighbors or have no boxing at all. We've seen just recently that even some of the larger commissions cannot...or will not even enforce their own contracted specifications and requirements and overlook pre and post fight procedures.

There is no accountability for judges. I do think we are seeing certain cases of more reviews etc but on a large scale the judging process is all very helter skelter if not made up as the go. Judges should have zero interactions with promoters let alone having them seated 2,3 seats ringside in some cases. Its a drop in the bucket but all judges should be officially introduced on camera, before and after as scores are read. I don't want to put scarlet letters on them just a starting step to take away some of the anonymity. I don't see anything changing at all until we see some type of unified commission who will clean up its own house. Just far too many localized ties and influences.

[killersheep]

Judges should have their scores monitored and if there are consistant scores that are against the actual fight then they should go through a disciplinary and work improvement process. If they are found to be not fit to work then they should be sacked.

The big problem here is who is responsible for this? Same problem with my pro/rel idea. If it's a sanctioning bodies responsibility or an athletic commission how do they enforce it to other groups?

The state boxing fights are held at.

So if a judge is banned in New Jersey what's to stop them from judging in New York?

[Beanz]

There is probably nothing stopping ex boxers applying to be judges now. Why would they want to do it though? A lot of lower level boxers seem to become referees, but not judges. Is it a money issue?

[Master]

Same thing with ex-footballers, they do not earn enough and have too much aggro to deal with being a judge or referee.

[Hulk]

There is probably nothing stopping ex boxers applying to be judges now. Why would they want to do it though? A lot of lower level boxers seem to become referees, but not judges. Is it a money issue?

Top level judges like Jerry Roth, Melvina Lathan, Duane Ford, Chuck Giampa, all make very good money.

Ex-fighters should replace them as top level judges, because all of the aforementioned judges have screwed over countless fighters, altering and ruining careers due to corruption and ignorance.

Mostly corruption.

[Spicoli]

There is probably nothing stopping ex boxers applying to be judges now. Why would they want to do it though? A lot of lower level boxers seem to become referees, but not judges. Is it a money issue?

Top level judges like Jerry Roth, Melvina Lathan, Duane Ford, Chuck Giampa, all make very good money.

Ex-fighters should replace them as top level judges, because all of the aforementioned judges have screwed over countless fighters, altering and ruining careers due to corruption and ignorance.

Mostly corruption.

I think there have been more than a few, I remember Harold Gomes was a judge for a number of years. While it may bring a more honest respect or perspective for what they are judging I dont think it would do away with the ever present influence of the promoter and governing body. I believe they ultimately decide if an official gets work...it almost seems similar to jury selection?!

One thing I've never been big on was how many judges serve as refs as well, even on same nights. You'd think it has to sway focus big time.