Justice!!! Naz goes into Hall of Fame. Fact.

[Fenster]

Naz had skills, drawing power, and personality. But the way he ended his career leaves a lot to be desired. The first time he's owned, he folds up his tent and goes home. Love him or hate him, those are undeniable..... what would you call them...... facts?

Whether or not this warrants entry into the HOF, is all a matter of opinion. Certainly there are guys in there that are not deserving... just like there's probably omissions that are deserving. Not a perfect process by any stretch.

I agree. Regardless of the numerous reasons, ultimately he slipped off with his tail between his legs, which is what distances him from genuine great fighters.

[Master]

Naz had skills, drawing power, and personality. But the way he ended his career leaves a lot to be desired. The first time he's owned, he folds up his tent and goes home. Love him or hate him, those are undeniable..... what would you call them...... facts?

Whether or not this warrants entry into the HOF, is all a matter of opinion. Certainly there are guys in there that are not deserving... just like there's probably omissions that are deserving. Not a perfect process by any stretch.

I agree. Regardless of the numerous reasons, ultimately he slipped off with his tail between his legs, which is what distances him from genuine great fighters.

At his peak he was the dogs bollocks. No one could touch him.

[Fenster]

Naz had skills, drawing power, and personality. But the way he ended his career leaves a lot to be desired. The first time he's owned, he folds up his tent and goes home. Love him or hate him, those are undeniable..... what would you call them...... facts?

Whether or not this warrants entry into the HOF, is all a matter of opinion. Certainly there are guys in there that are not deserving... just like there's probably omissions that are deserving. Not a perfect process by any stretch.

I agree. Regardless of the numerous reasons, ultimately he slipped off with his tail between his legs, which is what distances him from genuine great fighters.

At his peak he was the dogs bollocks. No one could touch him.

(well played)

[AdamGB]

If you're going to claim a fighter from a certain era was more hype than substance then you at least need to back that up by having some knowledge about his opponents. If you claim the fighter wasn't much cop then what does that say about his opponents? And his opponents opponents? And the "great" fighters from that era that have shared common opponents.

You can be the greatest of your era without beating a "great" fighter. Wlad hasn't beat a single man that will go close to being regarded as "great" (HOF bound) but he himself will be regarded as an all-time great. The best heavyweight of his era (one of numerous examples).

Kirkland Laing was beat a dozen times (KO'd eight), never won a "world" title. Who was his best win? Roberto Duran - a man that is regarded by every credible boxing sage on the planet as one the greatest that ever lived. Does that make Laing an all-time great? No.

(although I personally thought he was the bollocks back in the day )

I agree again Fenster, you can't just say 'he beat Duran' and leave it at that... You have to look at the circumstances - where was Duran at that point in his career etc.

The same goes for any fighter - Alfonso Gomez even beat Gatti, but so what?
The same can be said of lineal belts, you have guys like Carlos Baldomor hold them.

I'd rather not discuss the ins and outs of Kevin Kelley's career if that's ok.

Your point about Wlad is moot, Wlad has fought no greats, yes... But he's fought everybody of this era... That's why he's indisputably the best of this era. It's just not a great era.

Hamed fought in a better era for his weight than Wlad, but he only fought and lost to one of the top echelon of his era.

He still goes down as one of the best of his era, just not the best.
And the entertainment and hype that he brought cement him in the HOF fairly, let alone his title success. I think that's fair enough, he doesn't have to be utter shite in my eyes just because I don't believe he was the greatest of his era!

The fact that some people still think so long after the hype should have died is testement to the buzz he created I guess.

[Ron Swanson]

Good on him for getting in,had fun watching him,he got away with some outrageous moves.

Whats the implication on who was the best fighter he fought? It was Mab.

Soto was no bum. There are others who were gifted fighters with long careers,loosened a fair few peoples bolts for good, ruined some fighters on the spot.

People seem to take offense when a fighter does it not sticking to traditional boxing, aside from the big mouth,disrespect of other fighters and the religious stuff.

Wish JMM had fought him back in the day,think he wanted to be the king of Mexico instead though and didnt want to be derailed on his aim at pulling the crowns off Mab and Morrales back then by some hard hitting outsider from Britain. Could of ended everything before it begun .

Umm, Naz's own trainer admitted they wanted no part of JMM. On video, on several occasions. It was no secret they avoided JMM not the other way around.

[AdamGB]

Oh god, you've really opened pandora's box there!

[Violent Demise]

I never for once ever thought that Naz would not be let into the HOF. Perhaps a second ballot, but sure way to get in.

Naz retired too early. jmo.... should have rematches MAB.

And get embarrassed again? Hell no. After the Barrera humiliation Hamed knew himself he wasn't an elite fighter

[Dark Lord Al]

I never for once ever thought that Naz would not be let into the HOF. Perhaps a second ballot, but sure way to get in.

Naz retired too early. jmo.... should have rematches MAB.

And get embarrassed again? Hell no. After the Barrera humiliation Hamed knew himself he wasn't an elite fighter

I agree Hamed was great until he met an elite fighter , then he lost. = not great.
Hard punching limbo dancer.

[Fenster]

If you're going to claim a fighter from a certain era was more hype than substance then you at least need to back that up by having some knowledge about his opponents. If you claim the fighter wasn't much cop then what does that say about his opponents? And his opponents opponents? And the "great" fighters from that era that have shared common opponents.

You can be the greatest of your era without beating a "great" fighter. Wlad hasn't beat a single man that will go close to being regarded as "great" (HOF bound) but he himself will be regarded as an all-time great. The best heavyweight of his era (one of numerous examples).

Kirkland Laing was beat a dozen times (KO'd eight), never won a "world" title. Who was his best win? Roberto Duran - a man that is regarded by every credible boxing sage on the planet as one the greatest that ever lived. Does that make Laing an all-time great? No.

(although I personally thought he was the bollocks back in the day )

Your point about Wlad is moot, Wlad has fought no greats, yes... But he's fought everybody of this era... That's why he's indisputably the best of this era. It's just not a great era.

Hamed fought in a better era for his weight than Wlad, but he only fought and lost to one of the top echelon of his era.

He still goes down as one of the best of his era, just not the best.
And the entertainment and hype that he brought cement him in the HOF fairly, let alone his title success. I think that's fair enough, he doesn't have to be utter shite in my eyes just because I don't believe he was the greatest of his era!

The fact that some people still think so long after the hype should have died is testement to the buzz he created I guess.

Featherweight. He was the no.1 featherweight in the world during his reign - 1995/6-2001. If he wasn't the best during this period then who was? It was Barrera's first fight at the weight.

I agree again Fenster, you can't just say 'he beat Duran' and leave it at that... You have to look at the circumstances - where was Duran at that point in his career etc.

Well that goes for Naz too. As Memphis (and many other good judges say the same) alluded to - Naz was already way past his pomp by time he fought Barrera.

((on a side note - Duran went on to win lightmiddle and middlweight titles and was in some of his most memorable fights after losing to Laing. That was great win regardless of circumstances. ))