Would Joe Louis be too small to be successful at heavyweight today ?

[Ron Swanson]

Luckily boxing isn't soley based on statistics and you partly make the case for me why Muhammid Ali is the best heavyweight of all time. He was not the youngest, oldest, longest champion but still considered the best by the majority of people. His competition was great Joe Frazier, Liston and Foreman could have been champions longer if they lived in another period.

It is well known why Ali did not make consecutive defences

Ali was all business in the ring and did not always have that popularity that you claim he rode.

There is no federal case or attack just look with your eyes and appreciate his boxing qualities.

Notice I did not criticise Louis or Rocky.

You said Ali was ahead of Joe Louis I said otherwise. I then provided examples as to why Joe Louis was better. I know that you're misunderstanding what I'm saying because you're assuming a different tone than I wrote my post in. Ali was a great boxer and unique in that he was the champion but also a celebrity at the same time. I don't want to feel forced to bow before an Ali statue every time I mention his name. He's a great great great boxer that I don't think is the greatest of all time despite what he said about himself but don't expect me to kiss his ass. He gets the respect he gets from me what can I tell you?

I’m with you on this, people have this beautiful ideal of Ali. As a Boxer, Fighter, call it what you like, he wasn’t the greatest. As a sporting icon , we’ll thats clearly a different story.
I have to say, if he hadn’t of lost the peak 3 years of his career , it would be a very different conversation , I’m certain of that. But it is what it is and it’s not gonna change.
I know what you mean about how we’re not allowed to even very slightly criticise Ali. When Floyd pointed out about him losing his Title to a 7 fight novice when he was 34 years old , people wouldn’t see it for what it’s meant. You can’t argue against the point unfortunately.

You can argue all you want but you are intelligent enough to know that Ali was old in terms of ring years. He was at the tail end of a hard and distinguished career and still avenged the loss.

Huge Ali fan so don’t take this as a criticism of him, like you have said he was past his best. But if memory serves me the ref was forced to stop Ali’s holding an average of 15 times per round in that fight. Left right hold, left right hold, left right hold. It’s best to not point to that as an accomplishment since it should have been a disqualification. What Ali did is enough to champion him without building low points into high points.

The mans talent and will are a remarkable combination. Perhaps the greatest combination of the 2 of all time. But we can never know for sure. Comparing eras is a guessing game weighted by personal preferences. Lewis was talented but lazy, Tyson was talented but mentally fragile, Ali was talented but refused fundamentals he could have employed, Louis was talented but slow of foot. Lewis could have beaten Ali but lost to a number of Ali’s opponents, Ali could have beaten Louis but lost to a few of his opponents. The could haves could go on forever.

I, like you, think Ali is the greatest. But we can’t say we know that. And we can’t tell others that disagree that they are wrong. Well, we could, but that would point to our ignorance more than theirs.