Thread: I guess 140 is not as good as we thought.

I now believe the 140 division is garbage.

Always half thought that anyway.

It's an exciting division because a lot of the fighters are of similar standard, but the talent depth is fairly standard. It has been for a while. There's no elite fighter in the division. A lot of good fighters, but none even remotely close to the level of even someone like Cotto imo.

I think Marquez beats any fighter at 140.

Originally Posted by ono

Always half thought that anyway.

It's an exciting division because a lot of the fighters are of similar standard, but the talent depth is fairly standard. It has been for a while. There's no elite fighter in the division. A lot of good fighters, but none even remotely close to the level of even someone like Cotto imo.

I think Marquez beats any fighter at 140.

I think its a combination of hyping some guys and also overhyping the decline of Morales. Sure he wasnt his best but really, losing a close fight to former world champ David Diaz wasnt that bad, it didnt make Morales shot, and he had won his other comeback fights. Willie Limond tested a much fresher, faster Amir Khan and Morales beat him so the idea that he was going to be blown away at the slightest challenge was probably just being overly critical of where Morales is right now.

As for Marquez beating anyone at 140 I dont agree. Id have him a live underdog against Bradley, Morales and Guerrero. Id be mildly surprised if Marquez won any of those fights.

For me Guerrero has really put himself on the map this weekend. Although I expected him to stop Katsidis inside 6 or 7 rounds and it went the distance I still thought he imposed himself on the fight more than Marquez, especially early on.

I know Guerrero is currently at 135 but he loooked much bigger than Kats and I think belongs at 140 where he suddenly becomes a major major player.

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by ono

Always half thought that anyway.

It's an exciting division because a lot of the fighters are of similar standard, but the talent depth is fairly standard. It has been for a while. There's no elite fighter in the division. A lot of good fighters, but none even remotely close to the level of even someone like Cotto imo.

I think Marquez beats any fighter at 140.

I think its a combination of hyping some guys and also overhyping the decline of Morales. Sure he wasnt his best but really, losing a close fight to former world champ David Diaz wasnt that bad, it didnt make Morales shot, and he had won his other comeback fights. Willie Limond tested a much fresher, faster Amir Khan and Morales beat him so the idea that he was going to be blown away at the slightest challenge was probably just being overly critical of where Morales is right now.

As for Marquez beating anyone at 140 I dont agree. Id have him a live underdog against Bradley, Morales and Guerrero. Id be mildly surprised if Marquez won any of those fights.

For me Guerrero has really put himself on the map this weekend. Although I expected him to stop Katsidis inside 6 or 7 rounds and it went the distance I still thought he imposed himself on the fight more than Marquez, especially early on.

I know Guerrero is currently at 135 but he loooked much bigger than Kats and I think belongs at 140 where he suddenly becomes a major major player.

Well , I still think 140 is a very good division. Styles make fights and Khan vs Morales would be an easy win for Khan . As for JMM, I think he beats Morales quite easily, has a tough win against Guerrero and another close win against Bradley

Originally Posted by gest12645

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by ono

Always half thought that anyway.

It's an exciting division because a lot of the fighters are of similar standard, but the talent depth is fairly standard. It has been for a while. There's no elite fighter in the division. A lot of good fighters, but none even remotely close to the level of even someone like Cotto imo.

I think Marquez beats any fighter at 140.

I think its a combination of hyping some guys and also overhyping the decline of Morales. Sure he wasnt his best but really, losing a close fight to former world champ David Diaz wasnt that bad, it didnt make Morales shot, and he had won his other comeback fights. Willie Limond tested a much fresher, faster Amir Khan and Morales beat him so the idea that he was going to be blown away at the slightest challenge was probably just being overly critical of where Morales is right now.

As for Marquez beating anyone at 140 I dont agree. Id have him a live underdog against Bradley, Morales and Guerrero. Id be mildly surprised if Marquez won any of those fights.

For me Guerrero has really put himself on the map this weekend. Although I expected him to stop Katsidis inside 6 or 7 rounds and it went the distance I still thought he imposed himself on the fight more than Marquez, especially early on.

I know Guerrero is currently at 135 but he loooked much bigger than Kats and I think belongs at 140 where he suddenly becomes a major major player.

Well , I still think 140 is a very good division. Styles make fights and Khan vs Morales would be an easy win for Khan . As for JMM, I think he beats Morales quite easily, has a tough win against Guerrero and another close win against Bradley

Marquez has gone life and death with Casamayor, Juan Diaz and Katsidis since moving up.

I don't see anything in his recent form that suggests to me he's performing at a level above the likes of Bradley, Guerrero and Khan.

I think he's a huge challenge for all of them, but he's getting older, slower, easier to hit and has been floored and hurt several times recently.

He's past his best now and I think the above guys have too much for him at this stage. i forsee some titanic, even Morales Maidana like struggles, but I no longer regard him as the man to beat in the weight class.

Actually, that's not quite what I mean. In terms of his legacy and status he IS the man to beat of course. But I no longer feel he is the best fighter in the weight class.

If I was Bradley, Guerrero, Khan, or even Judah, Alexander, Maidana etc I would be desperate to get in the ring with him because great fighter that he is, he is vulnerable and slowing.

I see him as a prize fish that has been washed upstream and caught in shallow waters and the first fisherman who gets there with the right bait could reel him in.

Just because Morales fought a great fight and Maidana seemingly struggled with him does not automatically mean that we can dismiss what is a fairly engrossing division. Maidana struggles with Maidana therefore 140 = crap is a silly argument to make. There are a lot of intriguing matchups that can be made and I think it's more about an old fighter selecting his type of opponent carefully and proving a few people wrong.

It's still a very decent division.

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by ono

Always half thought that anyway.

It's an exciting division because a lot of the fighters are of similar standard, but the talent depth is fairly standard. It has been for a while. There's no elite fighter in the division. A lot of good fighters, but none even remotely close to the level of even someone like Cotto imo.

I think Marquez beats any fighter at 140.

I think its a combination of hyping some guys and also overhyping the decline of Morales. Sure he wasnt his best but really, losing a close fight to former world champ David Diaz wasnt that bad, it didnt make Morales shot, and he had won his other comeback fights. Willie Limond tested a much fresher, faster Amir Khan and Morales beat him so the idea that he was going to be blown away at the slightest challenge was probably just being overly critical of where Morales is right now.

As for Marquez beating anyone at 140 I dont agree. Id have him a live underdog against Bradley, Morales and Guerrero. Id be mildly surprised if Marquez won any of those fights.

For me Guerrero has really put himself on the map this weekend. Although I expected him to stop Katsidis inside 6 or 7 rounds and it went the distance I still thought he imposed himself on the fight more than Marquez, especially early on.

I know Guerrero is currently at 135 but he loooked much bigger than Kats and I think belongs at 140 where he suddenly becomes a major major player.

You called it correctly on the Katsidis fight.

Although you must admit Katsidis fought his heart out and hurt Guerrero to the body.

Also got absolutely screwed outta a knockdown and lost two points which was outrageous. 1 point maybe, but not two.

Still Guerrero was in great shape and dominated almost every round.

Originally Posted by Hulk

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Originally Posted by ono

Always half thought that anyway.

It's an exciting division because a lot of the fighters are of similar standard, but the talent depth is fairly standard. It has been for a while. There's no elite fighter in the division. A lot of good fighters, but none even remotely close to the level of even someone like Cotto imo.

I think Marquez beats any fighter at 140.

I think its a combination of hyping some guys and also overhyping the decline of Morales. Sure he wasnt his best but really, losing a close fight to former world champ David Diaz wasnt that bad, it didnt make Morales shot, and he had won his other comeback fights. Willie Limond tested a much fresher, faster Amir Khan and Morales beat him so the idea that he was going to be blown away at the slightest challenge was probably just being overly critical of where Morales is right now.

As for Marquez beating anyone at 140 I dont agree. Id have him a live underdog against Bradley, Morales and Guerrero. Id be mildly surprised if Marquez won any of those fights.

For me Guerrero has really put himself on the map this weekend. Although I expected him to stop Katsidis inside 6 or 7 rounds and it went the distance I still thought he imposed himself on the fight more than Marquez, especially early on.

I know Guerrero is currently at 135 but he loooked much bigger than Kats and I think belongs at 140 where he suddenly becomes a major major player.

You called it correctly on the Katsidis fight.

Although you must admit Katsidis fought his heart out and hurt Guerrero to the body.

Also got absolutely screwed outta a knockdown and lost two points which was outrageous. 1 point maybe, but not two.

Still Guerrero was in great shape and dominated almost every round.

Yeah the knockdown call was bizarre. I can only assume he felt that Gurrero tripped over Katsidis' feet or something.

The fight did go exactly how I thought, except I felt that Katsidis would fold around the 6th. He almost did but then Guerrero seemed to decide it was safer to coast to a UD rather than take a risk of outpunching himself or exposing himself.

Still it was a very impressive win and he looked huge at the weight. I think he could easily fight at 140 and maybe even 147 eventually.

I like him a lot and think he's a real test to Marquez. I think he beats him although obviously that's not going to be an easy win to get.

With Marquez lately it has seemed to me that early on he doesn't have the power at this weight to impose himself fully and has to rely on his greater endurance and skills which allow him to take over later in the fights.

He really went life and death with Casa, Juan Diaz and Katsidis over the first half of those fights and then his superior abilities and sheer tenaciousness meant they faded and he got them out of there.

I don't think Guerrero will slow down or wilt. Plus he has more tools than those other guys and doesn't just have to go to war. His height and reach will be a factor, as will his freshness and relative youth.

I think he's going to become one to watch over the next couple years.

I actually wish he was 140 now. Guerrero vs Maidana, Alexander or Judah are all very appetising.

140 is a live division.
Khan vs Bradley
Judah vs JMM
Alexander vs MM
Guerrero vs Matthysse
and maybe Brandon Rios if he can't get a major fight at 135

After the way Erik Morales fought against Marcos Maidana, that fight he was going to have vs JMM sounds good to me now.

It is garbage. They need Pac and JMM there to spice it up. And I believe it will happen late this year.

Originally Posted by :::PSL:::

It is garbage. They need Pac and JMM there to spice it up. And I believe it will happen late this year.

funny thing though, 140 is a hell of a lot better and packed now than when Manny won the lineal title from Hatton haha, either way if 140 is garbage what does that say about Roach's new prodigy in Khan

Originally Posted by ICB

After the way Erik Morales fought against Marcos Maidana, that fight he was going to have vs JMM sounds good to me now.

Agreed.

The only thing is, i'm not sure what this says about Marquez' decline... I think he'd loose to any fresh faced boxer between 135 & 140.

Originally Posted by Jimanuel Boogustus

Originally Posted by ICB

After the way Erik Morales fought against Marcos Maidana, that fight he was going to have vs JMM sounds good to me now.

Agreed.

The only thing is, i'm not sure what this says about Marquez' decline... I think he'd loose to any fresh faced boxer between 135 & 140.

Its a shame they never fought eachother in there prime, but there still fresh enough now to create a FOTY candidate. Both men are very skillful but like to get stuck in and exchange punches, it would be a cracking fight between two legends. It would be hard for me though because i like both fighters equally so i don't know who to root for.