Thread: prison systems

An interesting article in the economist this week. One of the girls from that Russian band pussy riot who got locked for three years for protesting Putin's reelection is becoming a prison reform activists. Of course the US is first in People locked up with with around 700 people per 100,000, Russia is second with almost 500 per 100,000. Nadia from pussy riot says Russia's current , vile law enforcement system still grinds people up and spits them out to their grave. She says corrupt prison officials steal money ear marked for food. Putin is also big on locking up dissidents but she says the main reason most are locked up is drugs. Aids and TB kill many prisoners each year.

The war on drugs in the US is responsible for locking up many non violent drug offenders. America has the highest population of prisoners but a large amount are situated in community based treatment programs that allow them to work etc. I have worked in our prison system, of course I've only seen a few prisons in my state but they were decent as such a place can be and the prisoners I worked with, while saying prisons sucks, said they are treated well and the food is good.

I am always perturbed at the amount of prisoners locked up in our country. A positive thing I can say about Obama is he recently visited a federal prison and is committed to prison reform. He has already pardoned at least 46 people given ridiculously long prison sentences for non violent drug offences. He has said there will be a lot of pardons before he leaves office. I've signed petitions for several.

Some people deserve to be locked up. If you seriously hurt or kill anyone you need to be separated from the population. If you prove a danger to other humans for killing, unfortunately life sentences may be warranted. In my opinion the US prison system is fucked up. First, get rid of the death penalty, too many people on death row have been exonerated after DNA evidence. I could go on but I've written enough. I know many here are not US based, I know nothing about prisons in the UK or Australia and was curious about what's going on and how you feel about your prison systems.

One of the earliest prison reformers in the US was Ed Murrow (Morrow?). Also the inspiration for Jack London's novel The Star Rover he was a fascinating individual.
Note...the correct surname is Morrell.

Originally Posted by greynotsoold

One of the earliest prison reformers in the US was Ed Murrow (Morrow?). Also the inspiration for Jack London's novel The Star Rover he was a fascinating individual.
Note...the correct surname is Morrell.

interesting Grey, I'll look him up, not familiar with him. I've read a few of London's books but not the one you mentioned. Does it have to do with the prison system.

How about financial crimes. I see a London trader was sentenced to 14 years in prison for trying to rig benchmark interest rates, it made the FrontPage of the wall street journal. I have a hard time seeing people get long sentences for financial crimes. Even Bernie Madoff. Life in jail, no parole for financial crimes. Seems intense. I just can't see taking someone's life for money. I know a lot of people disagree with me on that one.

Originally Posted by walrus

How about financial crimes. I see a London trader was sentenced to 14 years in prison for trying to rig benchmark interest rates, it made the FrontPage of the wall street journal. I have a hard time seeing people get long sentences for financial crimes. Even Bernie Madoff. Life in jail, no parole for financial crimes. Seems intense. I just can't see taking someone's life for money. I know a lot of people disagree with me on that one.

There are no punishments for financial crimes. All you get is a fall guy like in the case of this guy. The system is rigged. Mass looting of the general public is par for the course so no need to do anything about that. Prisons are for poor people who steal things like chocolate bars.

When it comes to prison I think most of the people in prison should not be there. The system is for profit and so there is a lot of money in crowded prisons. Take away the profit motive and the budgets for the war on people (poverty, drugs, etc) and you will see emptier prisons. There is a very low prison population here and a safe society. No need for prison most of the time.

Originally Posted by Gandalf

Originally Posted by walrus

How about financial crimes. I see a London trader was sentenced to 14 years in prison for trying to rig benchmark interest rates, it made the FrontPage of the wall street journal. I have a hard time seeing people get long sentences for financial crimes. Even Bernie Madoff. Life in jail, no parole for financial crimes. Seems intense. I just can't see taking someone's life for money. I know a lot of people disagree with me on that one.

There are no punishments for financial crimes. All you get is a fall guy like in the case of this guy. The system is rigged. Mass looting of the general public is par for the course so no need to do anything about that. Prisons are for poor people who steal things like chocolate bars.

When it comes to prison I think most of the people in prison should not be there. The system is for profit and so there is a lot of money in crowded prisons. Take away the profit motive and the budgets for the war on people (poverty, drugs, etc) and you will see emptier prisons. There is a very low prison population here and a safe society. No need for prison most of the time.

Well Miles, federal prisons in the US have a large population of inside traders, Linux schemers and the like. Can't speak much on your country. I think lack of immigration plays a part in South Korea's low crime but I'm sure corruption is rampant if you look close enough. How many people does south Korea have locked up

Actually I looked it up. South Korea locks up 104 per 100,000. With an inmate population that is 2.3 percent foreign. You have about 52 prisons running at 110% occupancy. So relatively low but no nirvana.

Miles, to put it in perspective the US prison population is 25 percent foreign much of those are Mexicans.

Originally Posted by walrus

Originally Posted by Gandalf

Originally Posted by walrus

How about financial crimes. I see a London trader was sentenced to 14 years in prison for trying to rig benchmark interest rates, it made the FrontPage of the wall street journal. I have a hard time seeing people get long sentences for financial crimes. Even Bernie Madoff. Life in jail, no parole for financial crimes. Seems intense. I just can't see taking someone's life for money. I know a lot of people disagree with me on that one.

There are no punishments for financial crimes. All you get is a fall guy like in the case of this guy. The system is rigged. Mass looting of the general public is par for the course so no need to do anything about that. Prisons are for poor people who steal things like chocolate bars.

When it comes to prison I think most of the people in prison should not be there. The system is for profit and so there is a lot of money in crowded prisons. Take away the profit motive and the budgets for the war on people (poverty, drugs, etc) and you will see emptier prisons. There is a very low prison population here and a safe society. No need for prison most of the time.

Well Miles, federal prisons in the US have a large population of inside traders, Linux schemers and the like. Can't speak much on your country. I think lack of immigration plays a part in South Korea's low crime but I'm sure corruption is rampant if you look close enough. How many people does south Korea have locked up

Actually I looked it up. South Korea locks up 104 per 100,000. With an inmate population that is 2.3 percent foreign. You have about 52 prisons running at 110% occupancy. So relatively low but no nirvana.

So, why do you have unchecked immigration? Why are people not being deported? An illegal should really be put on a plane and banned from reentering. Haha, I guess they just re-walk through the border out there!

Originally Posted by Gandalf

Originally Posted by walrus

Originally Posted by Gandalf

Originally Posted by walrus

How about financial crimes. I see a London trader was sentenced to 14 years in prison for trying to rig benchmark interest rates, it made the FrontPage of the wall street journal. I have a hard time seeing people get long sentences for financial crimes. Even Bernie Madoff. Life in jail, no parole for financial crimes. Seems intense. I just can't see taking someone's life for money. I know a lot of people disagree with me on that one.

There are no punishments for financial crimes. All you get is a fall guy like in the case of this guy. The system is rigged. Mass looting of the general public is par for the course so no need to do anything about that. Prisons are for poor people who steal things like chocolate bars.

When it comes to prison I think most of the people in prison should not be there. The system is for profit and so there is a lot of money in crowded prisons. Take away the profit motive and the budgets for the war on people (poverty, drugs, etc) and you will see emptier prisons. There is a very low prison population here and a safe society. No need for prison most of the time.

Well Miles, federal prisons in the US have a large population of inside traders, Linux schemers and the like. Can't speak much on your country. I think lack of immigration plays a part in South Korea's low crime but I'm sure corruption is rampant if you look close enough. How many people does south Korea have locked up

Actually I looked it up. South Korea locks up 104 per 100,000. With an inmate population that is 2.3 percent foreign. You have about 52 prisons running at 110% occupancy. So relatively low but no nirvana.

So, why do you have unchecked immigration? Why are people not being deported? An illegal should really be put on a plane and banned from reentering. Haha, I guess they just re-walk through the border out there!

You hit the nail on the head. How do you think south Korea would look if the border their was as porous as the US Mexico border. I'm not saying it would be as bad, I'm saying South Korea would probably be a lot different.

Originally Posted by walrus

Originally Posted by Gandalf

Originally Posted by walrus

Originally Posted by Gandalf

Originally Posted by walrus

How about financial crimes. I see a London trader was sentenced to 14 years in prison for trying to rig benchmark interest rates, it made the FrontPage of the wall street journal. I have a hard time seeing people get long sentences for financial crimes. Even Bernie Madoff. Life in jail, no parole for financial crimes. Seems intense. I just can't see taking someone's life for money. I know a lot of people disagree with me on that one.

There are no punishments for financial crimes. All you get is a fall guy like in the case of this guy. The system is rigged. Mass looting of the general public is par for the course so no need to do anything about that. Prisons are for poor people who steal things like chocolate bars.

When it comes to prison I think most of the people in prison should not be there. The system is for profit and so there is a lot of money in crowded prisons. Take away the profit motive and the budgets for the war on people (poverty, drugs, etc) and you will see emptier prisons. There is a very low prison population here and a safe society. No need for prison most of the time.

Well Miles, federal prisons in the US have a large population of inside traders, Linux schemers and the like. Can't speak much on your country. I think lack of immigration plays a part in South Korea's low crime but I'm sure corruption is rampant if you look close enough. How many people does south Korea have locked up

Actually I looked it up. South Korea locks up 104 per 100,000. With an inmate population that is 2.3 percent foreign. You have about 52 prisons running at 110% occupancy. So relatively low but no nirvana.

So, why do you have unchecked immigration? Why are people not being deported? An illegal should really be put on a plane and banned from reentering. Haha, I guess they just re-walk through the border out there!

You hit the nail on the head. How do you think south Korea would look if the border their was as porous as the US Mexico border. I'm not saying it would be as bad, I'm saying South Korea would probably be a lot different.

Korea is very harsh on illegals and a good thing too. I think it would be very bad to have open borders as it would destroy national cohesion which is very important. I like life where immigration is controlled. It means local people are not threatened by foreigners stealing jobs which they do in the West and it means the local economy is stable for local people meaning a peaceful environment. I would probably get annoyed if foreigners started serving me in restaurants and supermarkets. I think this place has it about right.

Originally Posted by Gandalf

Originally Posted by walrus

Originally Posted by Gandalf

Originally Posted by walrus

Originally Posted by Gandalf

Originally Posted by walrus

How about financial crimes. I see a London trader was sentenced to 14 years in prison for trying to rig benchmark interest rates, it made the FrontPage of the wall street journal. I have a hard time seeing people get long sentences for financial crimes. Even Bernie Madoff. Life in jail, no parole for financial crimes. Seems intense. I just can't see taking someone's life for money. I know a lot of people disagree with me on that one.

There are no punishments for financial crimes. All you get is a fall guy like in the case of this guy. The system is rigged. Mass looting of the general public is par for the course so no need to do anything about that. Prisons are for poor people who steal things like chocolate bars.

When it comes to prison I think most of the people in prison should not be there. The system is for profit and so there is a lot of money in crowded prisons. Take away the profit motive and the budgets for the war on people (poverty, drugs, etc) and you will see emptier prisons. There is a very low prison population here and a safe society. No need for prison most of the time.

Well Miles, federal prisons in the US have a large population of inside traders, Linux schemers and the like. Can't speak much on your country. I think lack of immigration plays a part in South Korea's low crime but I'm sure corruption is rampant if you look close enough. How many people does south Korea have locked up

Actually I looked it up. South Korea locks up 104 per 100,000. With an inmate population that is 2.3 percent foreign. You have about 52 prisons running at 110% occupancy. So relatively low but no nirvana.

So, why do you have unchecked immigration? Why are people not being deported? An illegal should really be put on a plane and banned from reentering. Haha, I guess they just re-walk through the border out there!

You hit the nail on the head. How do you think south Korea would look if the border their was as porous as the US Mexico border. I'm not saying it would be as bad, I'm saying South Korea would probably be a lot different.

Korea is very harsh on illegals and a good thing too. I think it would be very bad to have open borders as it would destroy national cohesion which is very important. I like life where immigration is controlled. It means local people are not threatened by foreigners stealing jobs which they do in the West and it means the local economy is stable for local people meaning a peaceful environment. I would probably get annoyed if foreigners started serving me in restaurants and supermarkets. I think this place has it about right.

On the other hand I think a diversity brings a lot of positives to a country. We have millions of hard working immigrants in the US who get about just fine. Of course we are a nation of immigrants. It's always strange to me traveling around Asia. Everyone looks the same. We are not familiar with that in the US. Honestly I prefer diversity, white people are boring. By the way @Gandalf I don't know if I ever asked you. What is your residency status. Are you a south Korean citizen or are you still under the monarchy.

I have permanent residency here, which means I do not need to do anything at immigration ever again which is nice. Not that I mind immigration, but it's not fun going in there every year for extensions. I just obey laws and change jobs and work like anyone else does. I shall serve the Queen until the end of my days.

Originally Posted by Gandalf

I have permanent residency here, which means I do not need to do anything at immigration ever again which is nice. Not that I mind immigration, but it's not fun going in there every year for extensions. I just obey laws and change jobs and work like anyone else does. I shall serve the Queen until the end of my days.

Ok, my mother in law has permanent residency here. She's been staying with us but I'm actually taking her to the airport Thursday. I read that south Korea has a dangerously low birth rate, women don't want to get married and there is not enough women for all the men in the country due to the high abortion rates of females so families to get the ever valued male. Tragic. I think the young male south Koreans may revolt out of sexual frustration.

Originally Posted by walrus

Originally Posted by Gandalf

I have permanent residency here, which means I do not need to do anything at immigration ever again which is nice. Not that I mind immigration, but it's not fun going in there every year for extensions. I just obey laws and change jobs and work like anyone else does. I shall serve the Queen until the end of my days.

Ok, my mother in law has permanent residency here. She's been staying with us but I'm actually taking her to the airport Thursday. I read that south Korea has a dangerously low birth rate, women don't want to get married and there is not enough women for all the men in the country due to the high abortion rates of females so families to get the ever valued male. Tragic. I think the young male south Koreans may revolt out of sexual frustration.

The abortion of females was far more common in the past, much less so these days when women can find decent jobs and the eldest son is not so important. It was a problem as parents knew they were likely to be poor later on and a daughter would be unable to provide for them. It is less common these days, but those eldest sons are expected to play their part. It's not easy for many though as they have families of their own. That's where I get serious about a child not being a commodity for your investment. It's unreasonable and unfair. Interestingly, some men who cannot find a wife simply import one from overseas. Anyways, there are plenty of females out there. The ratios in class are fairly even.

An inmate serving a double life sentence in Rahway state prison in Rahway New Jersey knocked up three different prison guards all three of them are pregnant with his kids and none of them want to get an abortion