Not much talk on this fight, just looking at the odds and I think 4/6 on Pavlik is a steal personally.
I think Martinez is a decent boxer with alot of skills but for me he aint a Middleweight, I fancy Pavlik to chop him down within 9.
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Not much talk on this fight, just looking at the odds and I think 4/6 on Pavlik is a steal personally.
I think Martinez is a decent boxer with alot of skills but for me he aint a Middleweight, I fancy Pavlik to chop him down within 9.
Definately understand the argument, but Martinez is one of the hardest guys to hit in pro boxing. Pavlik has one gear, Martinez knows that and makes an easy night of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by skel1983
Martinez wide UD in reality, but loses a SD on the cards.
Pavlik is going to win by tko. From what I've seen, Martinez isn't that hard to hit and Pavlik can bang. Like Williams, he's going to throw a shit-ton of punches and I think he'll land regularly, hurt Martinez and eventually stop him.
Martinez is very hard to hit, he just doesn't flail around like most defense first fighters. He just moves ever so slightly, just enough the way it should be done.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
Pavlik is a beast at 160, and I'd fancy him to stop Martinez in 7. I really hope I'm wrong though.
He got tagged a lot (and hurt) against Williams, who is somewhat similar to Pavlik in the sense that he has impressive reach and throws a ton of punches. I know they're totally different fighters in pretty much every other way, but that fight convinced me that Pavlik would beat MartinezQuote:
Originally Posted by killersheepMartinez is very hard to hit, he just doesn't flail around like most defense first fighters. He just moves ever so slightly, just enough the way it should be done.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
Would you care for a sigi bet?Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHHe got tagged a lot (and hurt) against Williams, who is somewhat similar to Pavlik in the sense that he has impressive reach and throws a ton of punches. I know they're totally different fighters in pretty much every other way, but that fight convinced me that Pavlik would beat MartinezQuote:
Originally Posted by killersheepMartinez is very hard to hit, he just doesn't flail around like most defense first fighters. He just moves ever so slightly, just enough the way it should be done.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
I don't remember him being hurt, but I remember him being off-balance and getting put down. He hurt Williams a few times and that was Williams at Middleweight.
I have never sig. bet anyone before, though I've often fantasized about beating Lyle and making him sport a Jimmy Carter sig, but I digress. If you really want to we can I guess, though I don't really see the point. I can't stand Kelly Pavlik and I'd love to watch Martinez (who I really like) beat him, but I guess I'm just not as impressed with Martinez as everyone else is. He's a very good fighter, but he has his flaws and I think Pavlik will exploit them and overwhelm him.Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheepWould you care for a sigi bet?Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHHe got tagged a lot (and hurt) against Williams, who is somewhat similar to Pavlik in the sense that he has impressive reach and throws a ton of punches. I know they're totally different fighters in pretty much every other way, but that fight convinced me that Pavlik would beat MartinezQuote:
Originally Posted by killersheep
I don't remember him being hurt, but I remember him being off-balance and getting put down. He hurt Williams a few times and that was Williams at Middleweight.
Pavlik scores a big KO;D
I think the fight could really go either way, but whichever it does I don't expect it to be terribly close, if that makes sense. It's a very interesting clash of styles, and both guys will probably throw and land a lot in spots, but I feel it will be one or the other who is largely much more effective.
If Pavlik can figure him out and find a home for the right hand I don't see Martinez taking many good shots, but if he(Pavlik) can't get into a rythym Martinez could run away with it and outbox him by a wide margin. I don't think Martinez is strong enough at 160 to really get the better of Pavlik in a fight like he had with Williams, Kelly should be to strong for him if they are going to wind up trading shots. I want to say Martinez will outbox him but like CFH said I don't see him being as slick or elusive as some seem to think. That said, Pavlik fights very upright and doesn't move laterally, nothing would really surprise me in this fight. Great matchup imo.
Who about we don't make it horrible, but if you lose you just put up the losers face in your sigi. I look forward to seeing you sigi with Pavlik all cut up and puffy eyed.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHI have never sig. bet anyone before, though I've often fantasized about beating Lyle and making him sport a Jimmy Carter sig, but I digress. If you really want to we can I guess, though I don't really see the point. I can't stand Kelly Pavlik and I'd love to watch Martinez (who I really like) beat him, but I guess I'm just not as impressed with Martinez as everyone else is. He's a very good fighter, but he has his flaws and I think Pavlik will exploit them and overwhelm him.Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheepWould you care for a sigi bet?Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
I don't remember him being hurt, but I remember him being off-balance and getting put down. He hurt Williams a few times and that was Williams at Middleweight.
This highlight vid has some good examples of his defensive prowess. I recommend watchin it on mute.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7t1M3...eature=related
;DQuote:
Originally Posted by killersheepWho about we don't make it horrible, but if you lose you just put up the losers face in your sigi. I look forward to seeing you sigi with Pavlik all cut up and puffy eyed.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHI have never sig. bet anyone before, though I've often fantasized about beating Lyle and making him sport a Jimmy Carter sig, but I digress. If you really want to we can I guess, though I don't really see the point. I can't stand Kelly Pavlik and I'd love to watch Martinez (who I really like) beat him, but I guess I'm just not as impressed with Martinez as everyone else is. He's a very good fighter, but he has his flaws and I think Pavlik will exploit them and overwhelm him.Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheep
I'd enjoy that. I'd almost feel bad making you put up one of Martinez though, I really like him as a fighter. We'll have to include some kind of writing to let everyone know the the loser lost a bet to the winner.
I'll take that bet Killer, but you'll probably have to remind me closer to the fight itself as I'm likely to forget.
I like both these guys, and it should be a hell of a fight. Assuming Pavlik took away some lessons from his fight with Professor Hopkins, he's gonna be that much better than before. Based on his size and punching power, I'd have to bet on Pavlik by late stoppage, although I have nothing but respect for Martinez's skills.
I was very impressed with Martinez' elusiveness when he fought Bunema and Cintron, but it seemed to me that Williams workrate overwhelmed his defenses and I think Pavlik will do that same. The only difference is that Pavlik's shots are going to do much more damage than Willaims'.Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheep
martinez isn't that hard to hit. but he's good enough to beat pavlik.
I fancy Martinez over Pavlik - Well, at least I hope he beats Pavlik and I can see him doing it too.
I think Martinez will have taken home some lessons on Pavlik after watching his fight with Hopkins. Don't allow Pavlik to set himself and get into a rhythm and you'll be fine. The way Martinez fights and counters awkwardly, I think he'll be Pavliks achilles heel!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Althugz
Yeah, stylistically I think Martinez has an dge, but Hopkins didn't just outbox Pavlik, he really beat him up and was much stronger. Martinez isn't nearly as good an infighter, and really doesn't do much of anything as well as Hopkins does, I think Pavlik has a pretty good chance to turn it into a more physical fight, but hope I'm wrong about that, I don't like Pavlik much at all as a boxer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by skel1983
Martinez by UD12...:cool:
Another great fight featuring Martinez and a Pavlik win.
It should be a fun fight, but I think Pavliks output and power will gradually break down Martinez. The Hopkins fight was a one off and Pavlik is ready to bounce back.
I'm favoring Martinez. I think he's elusive enough that'll give Pavlik trouble, and I think being southpaw is also an advantage for him here.
116-112 Martinez
I would tend to favor Martinez by UD there for the upset though I would like if Pavlik could win because HBO is trying to make a Bute-Pavlik down the road :)
I pick Martinez. Too much lateral movement. Pavlik will connect, but not often enough to win.
Let's not forget Martinez fought Williams at 160 and in my opinion won that fight although it wasn't a robbery. Williams took that fight at 160 to have at least one advantage over Martinez. Has anyone else noticed how Williams is not referred to as the "most feared man in boxing" ever since the Martinez fight? It is safe to say Martinez took away some of the mystique surrounding Paul Williams. The same Paul Williams that people felt Pavlik ducked and dodged. Thus, the mental edge goes to Martinez.
I love Martinez as a boxer. He reminds me of the Flamingo guy in Mike Tyson's punchout (do I have the name right?). He brings class and style to the ring. Pavlik has yet to beat anyone like Martinez and I could see Martinez blowing him out. Pavlik's advantages in height and power keep him in this one. It's a very tough call. The result could be like the Williams fight in that many will feel Martinez won, but that the fight was close, and could have gone either way with Pavlik getting the official W.
At the moment you can get 9/4 for a Pavlik KO. I think that may get better as more bookies release their prices on the fight but even still its worth a bet for me.
Pavlik KO.
I think if Pavlik believes his own hype that he is a "one punch knockouter" kind of guy he will be in trouble. But if the old Kelly shows up throwing over 100 punches a round or close to that.It will be a good night for Kelly. I think Martinez is slick and has great skill at 154 but at 160 Kelly is a different animal than Martinez has ever faced.Even if the punches are blocked they physically will move Martinez around the ring. I say TKO in 10 for Kelly. Martinez could win this if he is on his bicycle all night but I think he will have too much pride and try to trade with Kelly at some point and get hurt.
I know Sergio Martinez has had some good performances, but im still not sold on him. And i think his ability is overrated, and i remember him getting spanked around by Antonio Margarito.
And i don't think he's improved that much since that fight, and if Antonio Margarito can beat him. Who is a similar pressure fighter to Kelly Pavlik. Due to the fact there big guys for the weightclass, who throw a ton of punches.
Then i don't see why Kelly Pavlik can't win, and i think he's being forgotten. Just because he moved up two weightclass, and looked stale vs Bernard Hopkins. When he didn't even belong at that weightclass.
Im not saying Kelly Pavlik is some great fighter, he isn't. But he's exciting as they come, and he has a good reach. Along with good power, and he's very good at setting things up off the jab.
And im going with Kelly Pavlik because i've been a fan of his, for quite a few years now. And even though i do like Sergio Martinez, i do think he has been overrated somewhat. Or maybe im just being too harsh on him i don't know really, but whatever im going with my boy Kelly Pavlik.
You going to the fight? It's in AC...Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
You say that even though Martinez fought Paul Williams at 160, a guy who is as long as Pavlik and throws as many punches as Pavlik although without the power. Yet, Williams has better movement than Pavlik and is faster. See the whole 160 thing is correct in a sense in that Martinez is probably more dominant at 154 and that's where he belongs. I favor him in fights with most guys out there at 154. But, that doesn't mean he can't move up in weight and beat guys at 160 because he did it for all intents and purposes against Williams.
Why is there no poll on this thread :mad:
I've become a fan of Martinez and would like to see him beat Pavlik and get a well deserved win. Size advantages for aside, i think his lifestyle outsidethe ring has put some mileage on him and wouldn't be surprised if he came back looking like half his old self.
At the same time Martinez took a few shots over his career and you have to wonder if that accumulates over time. The guys all class though and has the ability to shock people and trump the odds, even if they do screw him on the decision. I'll agree with those that say Martinez wins the fight and Pavlik wins he popularity contest. Poor Martinez has been jobbed more times than emmanuel agustus.
I here you in a way. Paul Williams doesn't have any pop from what I seen at 160 that is why I had Pavlik easily beating him if they had met. Williams still has good range and good movement but Kelly's mechanics a simply better. A much stiffer jab,a solid right hand and if you look at Pavlik he is very well taught. Never finishes combinations off balance, never is out of position to not throw any punch he is simply well taught. Were if you look at Williams he was constantly leaning in with his left hand against Martinez and Quintana and getting clocked by the counter left. Williams is a very rythymic fighter( I like to call him) Once he is out of his rythym he can be beaten. Hence Quintana and in my mind the Martinez defeats . We also do have to remember this was both of there first fight's at middleweight. So either of them didn't get a true feel for a natural middleweight.Quote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratYou going to the fight? It's in AC...Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
You say that even though Martinez fought Paul Williams at 160, a guy who is as long as Pavlik and throws as many punches as Pavlik although without the power. Yet, Williams has better movement than Pavlik and is faster. See the whole 160 thing is correct in a sense in that Martinez is probably more dominant at 154 and that's where he belongs. I favor him in fights with most guys out there at 154. But, that doesn't mean he can't move up in weight and beat guys at 160 because he did it for all intents and purposes against Williams.
I still don't know if I will be going down there. I have a pregnant wife and she is a bit unpredictable at this state. She just may want to sleep the whole weekend.
I have Martinez putting on a BOXING CLINIC for a few reasons
#1 Sergio is a very active slick southpaw. Who likes fighting those guys? NOBODY
#2 Kelly Pavlik has been no where to be found and rumors abound about what the hell he has been doing recently. They range from him being seriously injured (his hand or something) which could affect his game to him having a serious drinking problem and anger issues which could also lead to his demise in the ring.
#3 Sergio Martinez fought toe to toe with someone that's as big, awkward, and active as they come in Paul Williams. Sure PW buzzed Martinez and they fought pretty evenly and we can't compare the power of PW to the power of Pavlik. But PW throws over 100 punches a round and it's hard to be slick vs that type of fighter whereas it's far easier to be slick vs Kelly Pavlik's 1-2 shots at a time.
#4 Pavlik isn't tuned up. Kelly's last fights were vs Miguel Espino and Marco Antonio Rubio, not exactly top competition.
#5 Pavlik has had trouble with the top competition he has fought. So Kelly blitzed Edison Miranda, so what. Bernard Hopkins made Swiss Cheese out of Kelly and Jermain Taylor should have gotten the nod in their rematch. Meanwhile Sergio Martinez has recently been on the shit end of the stick vs Paul Williams (whom most thought he beat) and vs Kermit Cintron (whom everyone knows he beat). Say what you will about what a b*tch Cintron is but the power he carries is comparable to Pavlik's and I think Cintron boxes a bit better than Kelly and Sergio just straight up outclassed the guy.
I just think right now Sergio Martinez is poised to beat the shit out of Kelly Pavlik, I mean just box the kids ears off all night long. But I hope this time Sergio gets the decision he has earned
I like both guys this will be a good one. If i had to bet the house i'd say martinez beats him, his speed and that he won't try and slug but instead hit and move will bother pavlik. Martinez when he wants to plant himself hits harder than a lot of guys think. Hell he made cintron think he hit him with his damn head.
I thought I was the only one who felt that way...Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
Martinez will do wat Hopkinz did to Pavlik...but FASTER!
No, apparently so does Lyle.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHI thought I was the only one who felt that way...Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
Other than reason #5, Lyle's opinion could very well carry the day. As to reason #5, Sergio also has had trouble with top competition too - see Margarito, Williams, and Cintron. I personally believe that he has an argument for a win in each of those fights, but either way, he didn't get the W's. And this fight isn't in Argentina, it's in AC, Pavlik country.
I guess the only rebuttal is that Pavlik is much bigger than Sergio and although Bernard dominated Pavlik for 12 rounds (fight was at 170), I have yet to see a smaller fighter give Pavlik any kind of problems. Eventually, Pavlik cuts off the ring and drops bombs. Sure, Martinez fought Williams at 160, and did fine, but Williams isn't a middleweight in the same way Pavlik is. Check the size difference in the pics below:
Photos: Kelly Pavlik, Sergio Martinez Meet Face To Face - Boxing News
On the other hand, Sergio may be the slickest fighter Kelly has ever faced and in many ways, a horrible style match up. The way I look at this is that because of Pavlik's power and because Sergio is moving up to Pavlik's weight, Kelly will always be one punch away from knocking Sergio out. At this point, I'm undecided. Great fight and great clash of styles. It's one of the fights I'm most looking forward to watching.
Either way, the winner makes a big statement.
I'm going with Pavlik, I backed him against Miranda & Taylor x2, thought he'd lose to Hopkins all of which happened... here I think he defeats Martinez!
I think either Pavlik overpowers Martinez or gets slaughtered on points. But then gets the robbery decision (was that said earlier? if so, well said)