It is too late for Joe to be considered a great, his heart and hands are not up to equalling Louis and Marciano's records, let him make big money with big names fighters who pose less risk like Hopkins and Jones.
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It is too late for Joe to be considered a great, his heart and hands are not up to equalling Louis and Marciano's records, let him make big money with big names fighters who pose less risk like Hopkins and Jones.
Pavlik would be great. Miranda, ok. Jones I don't really care. Tarver not impressed.
Tarver is too much mouth, not enough action. I would rather he fight Glen Johnson. He doesn't just need the big names. He could fight a lower name that's risky. Also he needs a few more in U.S. and he could finish with a soft one at home, get a ko and hang em up. Storybook career.
He never beat the great middle weights os the 1990's in their primes. No Jones Jr. No Toney's. He needs to beat Taylor, Pavlik, Miranda and Roy Jones now before he will be etched withQuote:
Originally Posted by trampie
that Babe Ruth like immortality that you claim.
ok its no secret i'm not a fan of calzaghes as is seen with all the things i've said about him on here.
i think he should retire soon, he's not lost which has always been his main goal, he's not built as record full of great names but has held a title for more then 10 years, at this point he seems only interested in fighting 40 year olds which won't give him the respect he wants. he could have been a much bigger name years ago had he just done things different. he has been great for british boxing, he's given us some decent fights in the last 2 years, has been a great role model as far as his image is concerned i dont ever remember him being in the headlines for any bad behavier.
best thing i feel is for him to have his one last fight and call it a day, the old saying goes once a fighter talks about retirement........ he's already retired in his mind, pushing it and you'll most prob come unstuck
Exactly what i was thinking, who is Joe Calzaghe anyway? That's what boxing fans world wide were saying up until about two years ago, his achievements are exceptional but nobody knew about it for a long, long, time. JC needed to come to America years ago to be fully recognised as a true PFP World Champion and whether us non USA residents like it or not, it is the big apple and it is the home of boxing. I would like to see him fight Jones Jr on the big stage then rematch Kessler then fight Pavlik. That would take him to the middle of 2009, achievable IMO. He wins all 3 and you get big recognition and all time status.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doot
Well I guess that's remain to be seen. But I for sure imo, Calzaghe is difinitely not an all-time great (yet).Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammerQuote:
Originally Posted by Pacstraightleft
jones jr??
someone who hasnt K0`d an opponent for 6 years. has a record of 3-3 since then and is now nothing more than a showhorse needing to be taken to stud.
Hopkins had the potential to beat JC, Jones jr wouldnt even have a fighting chance of getting anything other than a very big points loss.
I for one would not be ordering that on PPV as i would if it were pavlik/dawson/miranda!!
Who did Marciano beat that were better than Lacy, Kessler and Hopkins?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Marciano's record is no better than Joe's if you actually know boxing history.
He only defended his title six times for fucks sake. He won it against the 50's equivilant of Frank Bruno, an old guy who won the world title finally in his 4 or 5th attempt only to lose it in his second defense. And he was beating him on all the judges cards before Rocky put him away.
He only actually defended his title against 5 men and one of them was a rematch with Woolcott.
You have a myopic view of boxing history in that you can see weaknesses in a modern boxer's record but not in the past.
Calzaghe has already done as much as Marciano.
Bilbo if you dont consider Rocky a great then thats fine , but it doesnt make a guy who fought in a joke division and beat 3 good fighters a great either.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboWho did Marciano beat that were better than Lacy, Kessler and Hopkins?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Marciano's record is no better than Joe's if you actually know boxing history.
He only defended his title six times for fucks sake. He won it against the 50's equivilant of Frank Bruno, an old guy who won the world title finally in his 4 or 5th attempt only to lose it in his second defense. And he was beating him on all the judges cards before Rocky put him away.
He only actually defended his title against 5 men and one of them was a rematch with Woolcott.
You have a myopic view of boxing history in that you can see weaknesses in a modern boxer's record but not in the past.
Calzaghe has already done as much as Marciano.
Bilbo Relax! I never said Rocky was a great.
what more does he have to do? Kessler= Dominated well there went the "Next Big Thing". Then comes B-HOP(those of you that remember me know my love for B-HOP) and he beats him. Joe C has done what many criticised him for over the past few years, Including myself. I have nothing but respect for him and IMO he will be an all time great.
He should eventually be an ATG regardless... There are a lot of other guys didn't do all that much with their careers, certainly not as much as Calzaghe who are in the Hall of fame and people who are listed on the top 100 best fighters. If I have Hopkins in the top 50 p4p best fighters ever, I would have Calzaghe maybe 10 to 20 spots below him. I however I don't think breaking records really matter. I mean Calzaghe has foughten 3 legitimate opponents IMO in Eubanks, Kessler, and Hopkins, and two of those fights he won, and the other won is up to debate so he needs the Pavliks of the world and the Jones of the world for people to look back on him with fondness... People always look much more favorably on fighters in hindsight.
Perhaps i was wrong with my title thread as Joe Calzaghe is hinting that he may carry on, as he is not giving up his WBO super-middleweight title!!!
Joe is less than a year away from being the longest reigning champion ever {Joe Louis 11 years and 252 days}, 4 defenses away from equalling the most defences by a champion {Joe Louis 25} if he manages 4 more defences at super-middleweight plus beats Roy Jones jr at Light -Heavyweight he would be 50 wins 0 defeats beating Rocky Marciano career record.
It is easy for me to say sat in my armchair, but surely Joe needs to pull out all the stops and fight for 5 more fights, if he retires 46 or 47 and 0 he will go down as a great boxer if he retires 50 and 0 smashing every record in the book he will be perceived as a top 10 boxer of all time, i say perceived because you may not think he would be an all time top tenner but people in years to come would think rightly or wrongly that Calzaghe is a boxing immortal.
DONT YOU HAVE TO HAVE GREATNESS TO THROW IT AWAY ????Quote:
Originally Posted by trampie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Lord AlBilbo if you dont consider Rocky a great then thats fine , but it doesnt make a guy who fought in a joke division and beat 3 good fighters a great either.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboWho did Marciano beat that were better than Lacy, Kessler and Hopkins?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Marciano's record is no better than Joe's if you actually know boxing history.
He only defended his title six times for fucks sake. He won it against the 50's equivilant of Frank Bruno, an old guy who won the world title finally in his 4 or 5th attempt only to lose it in his second defense. And he was beating him on all the judges cards before Rocky put him away.
He only actually defended his title against 5 men and one of them was a rematch with Woolcott.
You have a myopic view of boxing history in that you can see weaknesses in a modern boxer's record but not in the past.
Calzaghe has already done as much as Marciano.
Was Rockys run in the Heavyweight division better than Calzaghes at 168?
Its fanboyism, the guy can punch ergo yay hes great.
Calzaghe and greatness in same sentance don't make me laugh.