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The Tarver KO was over two years after the Ruiz fight. The weight shouldn't have been that big a deal by then. Besides, I thought Jones looked pretty sharp in that fight. He was outboxing Tarver. He just got caught by a perfect punchQuote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Good post JT.
Anyone that is picking Roy in this fight will look a right mug should they start crying "Roy was shot" once Calzaghe has finished duffing him up. ;)
No way that RJJ is shot...After Tarver knocked him out he just sucked in his fight vs Johnson and the third Tarver fight,still...he came back a bit away from the limelight and not against the best opposition,but solid enough...at this stage of his career he won't get any(much) better as we have seen in his last three fights...I doubt it will be enough for Calzaghe,but who knows...
We'll find out come saturday if he is or not. I agree with JT's points, there is a cazzum of difference between slipping a little and being shot to the extent Ali was against Berbick. Roy did rely on his reflexes for his defence, which are clearly not what they used to be, but his tighter guard and joe's lack of power do give him a good chance for the upset.
Jones isn't "shot" he just getting older.
In order to keep Calzaghe away from him he's going to have to keep that kind of pace for a good amount of the fight. I hope he can do it...
I am as big a Roy Jones fan as anybody. And believe me...i would love to believe that he is still a great fighter. But Roy has slipped A LOT. Is he completely shot like lets say Eric Morales...no. But he is no where near the fighter he was BOTH mentally or physically a few years ago. For whatever the reasons...those knockouts changed him. They changed his confidence, they changed how he fights...they even changed the look in his eye. At his prime Roy had this look that just reeked of confidence. And i don't mean arrogance...but just a look of "i am simply the best athlete in this sport and i can do anything i want in the ring." That look is gone. Sure...part of it is age, the weight problems, the knockouts...or a combo of all these things...but he is no longer anywhere close to the force he was several years ago. And you can tell not only by the way he fights, but by his face and demenour. For god's sake people...he fought a SHOT and inactive Tito...and even though he won...he hardly looked spectacular. I will be rooting for him Saturday...but i know this fight should have happened years ago and Roy should have hung them up already.
Jones is still capable of literally competing but he is no where near the dynamo he once was,That is painfully obvious.His stamina wavers,he is hit and rushed much more,and in his last high caliber championship match with Tarver,his legs were sticky,getting caught and he was fighting in spurts.He has managed to climb back from the brink over three smart return fights capped off with a huge name match up with another great in Trinidad,this combined with his legacy and greatness have helped to springboard him into another big time go at the championship level and we will truly see what he has left.Personally,I'd like to see him win but do not think it will happen.I think Joe will force him to exert and work his legs/stamina a great deal.Should he turn back the clock for a win,shame on me and all credit to the man indeed.
I believe Jones was always more gifted with natural athletic instincts,lightning reflexes and timing more so than all around textbook boxing 101 fundamentals.He may not have been busted up much in career but age and ring years catch up to all fighters,specifically one with eye catching reflexes.Alot of it may be emphasized in Jone's case because of how high he actually was in the game....fairly or unfairly we have come to expect and are used to such a untouchable level of expectations he has displayed throughout the majority of a high profile career.
Yay something we agree on.Quote:
Originally Posted by kingfrnk
Certainly Jones is not at his best but he's still a fantastic fighter.
You don't go from being the best in the world to being a bum overnight, unless you get Parkinsons or something at least.
Roy is still a tough test for Joe and has a real chance of winning.
I belive my man Calzaghe will pull out win number 46 though and want him to get credit if/when he does.
Sorry dude it was 13 months. and yea losing that much muscle without natural atrophy in 8 months and it will effect you, especially if your elite level athleteQuote:
Originally Posted by CGMThe Tarver KO was over two years after the Ruiz fight. The weight shouldn't have been that big a deal by then. Besides, I thought Jones looked pretty sharp in that fight. He was outboxing Tarver. He just got caught by a perfect punchQuote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
plus Joe is 36 and I guarantee he wont be a 70 plus punch a round at light heavy... Joe is getting older too
I agree with some of what your saying JT, but my two main concern's is that RJJ doesn't have the stamina or the legs anymore. He constantly lays on the ropes and even when he had Tito, Hanshaw, badly hurt in his comeback fights.
He didn't pull the trigger and i don't know why, was it stamina issues ? or was he worried about being clocked on the chin ? i really don't know but some good points for RJJ, is that he is the bigger man. He is still faster than Joe Calzaghe, and he still has a good straight right hand lead which is Joe Calzaghe's biggest weakness.
But the point is can RJJ pull the trigger enough, and will his stamina hold up to the constant pressure of Joe Calzaghe ?
Regaining great stamina and having the ability to let your punches go...very tough at nearly 40. Not to mention his great reflexes have slipped considerably...so he gets hit more (even Tito was able to land). I just think it's near impossible for ANY fighter to be the same after brutal knockouts (especially at Roy's age). I hope i am wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by ICB
I agree, I'll give Joe credit because I believe Roy still has it, were most will say if he fought Roy around the same time Jones beat Woods than it would mean something.. Although I think it would have been more magnificent, I still believe this will be a hard competitive fight for either guy, whoever wins is worthy of all the praise and accoladesQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Well.. i don't really agree with you JT. I think Roy is past his best enough to make the win for Calzaghe almost meaningless. I'm certain that's how it will be viewed.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockI agree, I'll give Joe credit because I believe Roy still has it, were most will say if he fought Roy around the same time Jones beat Woods than it would mean something.. Although I think it would have been more magnificent, I still believe this will be a hard competitive fight for either guy, whoever wins is worthy of all the praise and accoladesQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Hopkins beating Pavlik put the Calzaghe win into perspective. Calzaghe, although past his best too, is still showing tremendous form - at the HIGHEST possible level.
I only see Roy winning by early-ish KO. And see that chance as very very slim.
BUT.. if Roy wins it will be GREAT. What a story. 39-year-old Roy beats the 45-0 supermiddle/lightheavy P4P top three ranked fighter in the world. Legend stuff. ;)
OK, My bad, yes I must have been mixed up with the third fight. OK, I still say that Jones looked OK in the 2nd fight. If the weight thing was still afecting him, it wasn't affecting him that much. The speed was there, he was moving well, landing some fast sharp punches, and he was outboxing Tarver. He just got caught. That's the reason he lost, not the weight loss. Of course Roy would probably like to have us believe the contrary.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT RockSorry dude it was 13 months. and yea losing that much muscle without natural atrophy in 8 months and it will effect you, especially if your elite level athleteQuote:
Originally Posted by CGMThe Tarver KO was over two years after the Ruiz fight. The weight shouldn't have been that big a deal by then. Besides, I thought Jones looked pretty sharp in that fight. He was outboxing Tarver. He just got caught by a perfect punchQuote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock