What country has produced the best all around fighters during the past 60 years?

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

In terms of per capita world champions (and in descending order):

1. Puerto Rico
2. Panama
3. U.S.
4. Dominican Republic
5. Venezuela
6. Mexico
7. Cuba
8. England

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How about Argentina?

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Originally Posted by holmcall

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

In terms of per capita world champions (and in descending order):

1. Puerto Rico
2. Panama
3. U.S.
4. Dominican Republic
5. Venezuela
6. Mexico
7. Cuba
8. England

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How about Argentina?

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Argentina was 9th, behind England.

U.S
Mexico
Puerto Rico
Any country ever have only one Champion??

Mexico has not only produce many Champions but a few great champions. I don't use the word great very offten. USA just behide them.

Australia needs some champions.... We had Kostya.. He was a bloody good all round fighter..

But we have very few after him..

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

In terms of per capita world champions (and in descending order):

1. Puerto Rico
2. Panama
3. U.S.
4. Dominican Republic
5. Venezuela
6. Mexico
7. Cuba
8. England

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Found this video and in terms of world champions Mexico is #2 in terms of World Champions behind the US (I'm assuming as of the time the video was made and it looks pretty old.) I know you boast P.R. is #1 per capita (population) but a champion is a champion regardless, should have fought for more land for P.R.:p Just kidding.

The video is in spanish but it states that fact in the first minute or so. It's actually a good video although cut short.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rxhcz5JFS0M

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Originally Posted by holmcall

I am tying to come up with a formula based on per capita champions; that is to say, what country produced the most champions based on its population. A lot of flaws in this, but my assumption is that PR might be the one--or maybe Jamaica.

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It won't work. Too quantatative. Needs a qualatative element which is almost impossible to do. :banghead:

USA and Mexico

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Originally Posted by holmcall

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Originally Posted by JazMerkin

USA (probably at #1)
Mexico
Puerto Rico
UK
Jamaica (if you count boxers such as Lloyd Honeyghan as well)

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Wow, I forgot about Jamaica. On a per capita basis, it ranks very high, indeed.

A series of five monster upsets all by tough Jamaican fighters astounded me.

Trevor Berbick’s 1980 ambush KO of Big John Tate in Montreal set the stage for four more shockers. The welterweight champion Lloyd Honeyghan, nicknamed “Ragamuffin” due to his Jamaican roots, defeated heavily favored Donald Curry in 1986. In an equally stunning upset, welterweight Kirkland Laing (43-12-1) beat Roberto Duran in 1982.
And there was the notable amateur fighter, Michael Bentt, former WBO
Heavyweight Champ, who knocked out heavily favored Tommy Morrison in
1993 in an incredible first-round upset. The thing about Bentt was that he was very good amateur fighter, and Morrison’s camp had done a terrible
job researching his amateur record. Had he not suffered a career-ending and life-threatening injury in his fight with Herbie Hide, there is no telling how far he could have gone.


And who could forget the great Simon “Mantequilla” Brown, WBC and IBF
Welterweight Titleholder who KO’d Terry Norris in 1993 for the WBC Light
Middleweight Title in Ring magazine’s Upset of the Year? What made these fights memorable? They were all major upsets, and they were all pulled off by Jamaican fighters.

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He obviously wouldn't have gone too far considering Herbie bashed him up good and proper.

Also.. It's a bit naughty to class those guys as Jamaican. Honeyghan is British of Jamacian descent. He has lived in South London, England since he was a little kid.

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Originally Posted by holmcall

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Originally Posted by holmcall

I am tying to come up with a formula based on per capita champions; that is to say, what country produced the most champions based on its population. A lot of flaws in this, but my assumption is that PR might be the one--or maybe Jamaica.

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It won't work. Too quantatative. Needs a qualatative element which is almost impossible to do. :banghead:

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I don't see why it should be so hard. We are just dealing with numbers here. Population, number of champions. As long as you don't try to formulize why one champ might be better than another.

What aspect is messing you up?

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by holmcall

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Originally Posted by JazMerkin

USA (probably at #1)
Mexico
Puerto Rico
UK
Jamaica (if you count boxers such as Lloyd Honeyghan as well)

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Wow, I forgot about Jamaica. On a per capita basis, it ranks very high, indeed.

A series of five monster upsets all by tough Jamaican fighters astounded me.

Trevor Berbick’s 1980 ambush KO of Big John Tate in Montreal set the stage for four more shockers. The welterweight champion Lloyd Honeyghan, nicknamed “Ragamuffin” due to his Jamaican roots, defeated heavily favored Donald Curry in 1986. In an equally stunning upset, welterweight Kirkland Laing (43-12-1) beat Roberto Duran in 1982.
And there was the notable amateur fighter, Michael Bentt, former WBO
Heavyweight Champ, who knocked out heavily favored Tommy Morrison in
1993 in an incredible first-round upset. The thing about Bentt was that he was very good amateur fighter, and Morrison’s camp had done a terrible
job researching his amateur record. Had he not suffered a career-ending and life-threatening injury in his fight with Herbie Hide, there is no telling how far he could have gone.


And who could forget the great Simon “Mantequilla” Brown, WBC and IBF
Welterweight Titleholder who KO’d Terry Norris in 1993 for the WBC Light
Middleweight Title in Ring magazine’s Upset of the Year? What made these fights memorable? They were all major upsets, and they were all pulled off by Jamaican fighters.

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He obviously wouldn't have gone too far considering Herbie bashed him up good and proper.

Also.. It's a bit naughty to class those guys as Jamaican. Honeyghan is British of Jamacian descent. He has lived in South London, England since he was a little kid.

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No, Honeyghan was born in Jamaica, and grew up in Britain. A Brit of Jamaican descent would be someone like Chris Eubank who was 2nd generation. You will also find that guys from the Caribbean who grew up here will class themselves as Jamaican/Trinidadian/St. Lucian rather than British, particularly man like Honeyghan who grew up in South-East London in the 70's. My uncles & most the people where I live are the same, even some 2nd gen or 3rd gen guys my age don't see themselves as British now.

The US
Under the initial question,this would go back to 1948. If we look strictly at Olympic victories,the US has a clear lead,with Cuba and Russia close behind,and even then it gets skewed because many of the Russian victories are under the old USSR,which counts neighboring areas that are no longer considered Russia,and Cuban fighters rarely have pro careers, so the international games ARE their Pro career.
If you extrapolate those numbers to pro careers(and except for the former USSR and Cuba,that would translate normally) most Olympians end up with one title or another,so the US would still be in the lead.

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Originally Posted by JazMerkin

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by holmcall

Wow, I forgot about Jamaica. On a per capita basis, it ranks very high, indeed.

A series of five monster upsets all by tough Jamaican fighters astounded me.

Trevor Berbick’s 1980 ambush KO of Big John Tate in Montreal set the stage for four more shockers. The welterweight champion Lloyd Honeyghan, nicknamed “Ragamuffin” due to his Jamaican roots, defeated heavily favored Donald Curry in 1986. In an equally stunning upset, welterweight Kirkland Laing (43-12-1) beat Roberto Duran in 1982.
And there was the notable amateur fighter, Michael Bentt, former WBO
Heavyweight Champ, who knocked out heavily favored Tommy Morrison in
1993 in an incredible first-round upset. The thing about Bentt was that he was very good amateur fighter, and Morrison’s camp had done a terrible
job researching his amateur record. Had he not suffered a career-ending and life-threatening injury in his fight with Herbie Hide, there is no telling how far he could have gone.


And who could forget the great Simon “Mantequilla” Brown, WBC and IBF
Welterweight Titleholder who KO’d Terry Norris in 1993 for the WBC Light
Middleweight Title in Ring magazine’s Upset of the Year? What made these fights memorable? They were all major upsets, and they were all pulled off by Jamaican fighters.

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He obviously wouldn't have gone too far considering Herbie bashed him up good and proper.

Also.. It's a bit naughty to class those guys as Jamaican. Honeyghan is British of Jamacian descent. He has lived in South London, England since he was a little kid.

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No, Honeyghan was born in Jamaica, and grew up in Britain. A Brit of Jamaican descent would be someone like Chris Eubank who was 2nd generation. You will also find that guys from the Caribbean who grew up here will class themselves as Jamaican/Trinidadian/St. Lucian rather than British, particularly man like Honeyghan who grew up in South-East London in the 70's. My uncles & most the people where I live are the same, even some 2nd gen or 3rd gen guys my age don't see themselves as British now.

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Oh right.

I too have lots of friends that class themselves as British (Born here) but acknowledge their Caribbean roots.

That's different from someone born here but claims they're Jamaican/Trinidadian/St. Lucian rather than British, right?

What does Honeyghan class himself as then?

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Originally Posted by JazMerkin

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by holmcall

Wow, I forgot about Jamaica. On a per capita basis, it ranks very high, indeed.

A series of five monster upsets all by tough Jamaican fighters astounded me.

Trevor Berbick’s 1980 ambush KO of Big John Tate in Montreal set the stage for four more shockers. The welterweight champion Lloyd Honeyghan, nicknamed “Ragamuffin” due to his Jamaican roots, defeated heavily favored Donald Curry in 1986. In an equally stunning upset, welterweight Kirkland Laing (43-12-1) beat Roberto Duran in 1982.
And there was the notable amateur fighter, Michael Bentt, former WBO
Heavyweight Champ, who knocked out heavily favored Tommy Morrison in
1993 in an incredible first-round upset. The thing about Bentt was that he was very good amateur fighter, and Morrison’s camp had done a terrible
job researching his amateur record. Had he not suffered a career-ending and life-threatening injury in his fight with Herbie Hide, there is no telling how far he could have gone.


And who could forget the great Simon “Mantequilla” Brown, WBC and IBF
Welterweight Titleholder who KO’d Terry Norris in 1993 for the WBC Light
Middleweight Title in Ring magazine’s Upset of the Year? What made these fights memorable? They were all major upsets, and they were all pulled off by Jamaican fighters.

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He obviously wouldn't have gone too far considering Herbie bashed him up good and proper.

Also.. It's a bit naughty to class those guys as Jamaican. Honeyghan is British of Jamacian descent. He has lived in South London, England since he was a little kid.

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No, Honeyghan was born in Jamaica, and grew up in Britain. A Brit of Jamaican descent would be someone like Chris Eubank who was 2nd generation. You will also find that guys from the Caribbean who grew up here will class themselves as Jamaican/Trinidadian/St. Lucian rather than British, particularly man like Honeyghan who grew up in South-East London in the 70's. My uncles & most the people where I live are the same, even some 2nd gen or 3rd gen guys my age don't see themselves as British now.

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Ha, what about Lennox? When he is in Canada, he is Canadian. When he is in the UK, he is a Brit--and when he is in Jamaica, well, who knows what he claims to be. I bet his mother says he is a Jamaican. :banghead:

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Originally Posted by CGM

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Originally Posted by holmcall

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Originally Posted by holmcall

I am tying to come up with a formula based on per capita champions; that is to say, what country produced the most champions based on its population. A lot of flaws in this, but my assumption is that PR might be the one--or maybe Jamaica.

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It won't work. Too quantatative. Needs a qualatative element which is almost impossible to do. :banghead:

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I don't see why it should be so hard. We are just dealing with numbers here. Population, number of champions. As long as you don't try to formulize why one champ might be better than another.

What aspect is messing you up?

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A small country could have an inordinate amount of mediocre champs, while a larger one could have fewer (but clearly better) ones. That is too quantatative for me. If you want a fromula that says what counrty pruduced the moost champions per capita. that says nothing about how good they were. It's just numbers which, of course, is one measure. But to get what country produced the BEST, you need something else in my humble opinion. :lolololol: